Would legal venues stop hoons?

[xisled]

Reading another thread. I started to think. Do people think legal venue's would decrease the amount of hoon's on public roads.

The reason I ask is in the last few year's in the west and northern suburbs of Melbourne there was a huge hoon problem. On any given week night in the industrial area's, you would find at least 50 plus cars. Some night's would see 200 odd cars attending these illegal meet's. Now the police did do a few raids and it has slowed down the number of hoon's in the area for these illegal meet's.

Now the question I put to people, if these people had somewhere to go that was cheap, local and safe would this get people off the streets and would this reduce the amount of hoon's on public roads?

[Fordman]

I dont think so, the whole fun of it is the illegality in most peoples minds.

[P6LTD351]

I don't think so. Most hoons act on the spur of the moment.

[mik]

Originally Posted by Fordman

I dont think so, the whole fun of it is the illegality in most peoples minds.

spot on Fordman, anyway the legal thing its been tried before and did`nt work, there`s to many testosterone charged young blokes that want to do it their way.

[mrghia]

Might help here in SA as we have nothing here

[fmc351]

Are apples red? Too hard to answer as yes or no, depends if its a red one or a green one.

I recall people being booked for hooning leaving drag strips. I know people who are on their best behaviour at such times as they understand how they make it hard for the facility to stay open if they mess it up.

Stop, nope. Help to reduce it, very likely. How much by?, thats anyones guess.

What gets me is that its a nice by-product of building the facilities but Im not sure its a smart idea to associate anti-hooning with drag strips for example. As then the 'wowsers' see hooning as a reason to shut them down, or refuse planning for them. They should be built for the law abiding citizens who enjoy the activity, and just appreciate the reduction in problems on the roads, however many that may or may not be.

[MexicanBatman]

get rid of the stupid hoon laws

then there wont be any more hoons.

[TheZHLANE]

For the majority i would say yes, but you always have occasions when people might do a little skid.

[sudszy]

Originally Posted by xisled

Reading another thread. I started to think. Do people think legal venue's would decrease the amount of hoon's on public roads.

The reason I ask is in the last few year's in the west and northern suburbs of Melbourne there was a huge hoon problem. On any given week night in the industrial area's, you would find at least 50 plus cars. Some night's would see 200 odd cars attending these illegal meet's. Now the police did do a few raids and it has slowed down the number of hoon's in the area for these illegal meet's.

Now the question I put to people, if these people had somewhere to go that was cheap, local and safe would this get people off the streets and would this reduce the amount of hoon's on public roads?

So lets put up your street we'll close it every night for five hours and limit its use to just hoons, you and your neighbours can pay for the standby ambulance team and fire team and pay to get the road surface repaired every few days, oh and you'll need to up your public liability just incase they lose control and injure themselves crashing into your place(you provided the venue)........still thinks its a good idea?

Hoons need somewhere to release all there built up fustrations etc, oh please......get off their fat ***** and go ride a bmx around the local garbage tip will achieve the same.

[The Outsider]

Originally Posted by sudszy

drivel

why are you still here?

yes thats a serious question.



stop no, reduce, yes.

simple really.

[Ben73]

Originally Posted by sudszy

So lets put up your street we'll close it every night for five hours and limit its use to just hoons, you and your neighbours can pay for the standby ambulance team and fire team and pay to get the road surface repaired every few days, oh and you'll need to up your public liability just incase they lose control and injure themselves crashing into your place(you provided the venue)........still thinks its a good idea?

Hoons need somewhere to release all there built up fustrations etc, oh please......get off their fat ***** and go ride a bmx around the local garbage tip will achieve the same.

Your posts are full of so much crap there is no point for anyone to argue with you. They would win the argument before it started.

Proper punctuation wouldn't hurt either.

On topic, it wouldn't stop it completely, but it would cut it down.
Idiots who go flat out during peak hour swerving between traffic would still be on the roads though.

[sudszy]

Originally Posted by Ben73

Your posts are full of so much crap there is no point for anyone to argue with you. They would win the argument before it started.
.

Ben, everything I write is going to be ..... in your eyes, Im afraid our backgrounds, education and values are just poles apart.

Your idea that if the hoon isnt speeding then it isnt a problem is just part of your problem:
http://www.fordforums.com.au/showpos...0&postcount=20
Seriously, if anyone who wrote nonsense like ^ this or http://www.fordforums.com.au/showpos...0&postcount=32 or
http://www.fordforums.com.au/showpos...4&postcount=36
and agreed with anything I said, Id be very disappointed.

[Matty4]

Originally Posted by sudszy

Ben, everything I write is going to be ..... in your eyes, Im afraid our backgrounds, education and values are just poles apart.

Your idea that if the hoon isnt speeding then it isnt a problem is just part of your problem:
http://www.fordforums.com.au/showpos...0&postcount=20
Seriously, if anyone who wrote nonsense like ^ this or http://www.fordforums.com.au/showpos...0&postcount=32 or
http://www.fordforums.com.au/showpos...4&postcount=36
and agreed with anything I said, Id be very disappointed.

OMG......elitist much????
I bet your shiite doesn't stink either!!!!

[Fireblade]

Originally Posted by sudszy

blah blah hoon this blah blah hoon that blah blah

Mike Rann is that you?

Stop feeding this Government Troll or should that be Hypocrite

[nasss92]

a cheap legal option would definately ease the problem.... i think thers a big difference in the definition of hoon, which goes a long way to achieve the desired outcomes of keeping wrecklessness (controlled and uncontrolled) off of the streets..

ther are the overly excited car enthusiasts , people that would include the majority on this forum who look after their vehicle and maintain them to a high degree and are quiet respectful to the ways of the road but can have a heavy foot sometimes or get a bit carried away (which is very understandable and easy to do)

then you have ignorant/ foolish/ degenerate people , which the general public considers as hoons and menaces on the road that shouldnt be let near a steering wheel.

now in respect to keeping all who want to partake in coined "hoon" type activity, for a major part of it this road character does arise as a result of ther isnt any other options! so, effectively many people seek to achieve their thrill in as many controlled environments as they can find (or roadways which they deem have a limited chance of accidents to occur).

these usually can be found in industrial areas which are vacant at night, carparks, large arterial roadways or motorways 3-4 lanes wide, or deserted national park road at hours were traffic is minimal.... basically any strip of bitumen which has a nice camber, strip of road which has multiple lanes, corner with a safe viewing distance and nice angle, or open paved area for attempted controlled aggressive driving...

for those in the sydney region for example, the only available place is the likes of eastern creek for a legal ability to really test ur car out or have some "hooning" fun... BUT for that privilige, its a few hundred dollar exercise per event..... i can almost assure 100% that if a safer appropriate and affordably option was existent, hooning would decrease significantly ... ther is even studies done by the rta equivalent in germany to support such fact.. in their case they stated the autobarn acted as a means to channel the driving enthusiasm for speeding (which is a major thrill for hoons) out of the drivers system, and subsequently these people refraimed from doing so on the external public roads networks....

if people had an option, they would utilize their own self restraint as they had the knowledge they could do what they wanted to do in a safe environment risk free..... if the government or police force wanted to be smart about it, they could host/promote such an event and offer/encourage driver education courses and advanced driving courses etc .. THAT would promote a healthy automotive culture, and also develop respect for authority figures who care for safety initiatives

yes there would still be some who over do it and still hoon around on public roads.. but, if ther was an option to do so in a controlled environment that is actually affordable for the general public (in particular the youths - p platers ) , then a significant amount would not take the risk when they shouldnt

[sudszy]

Originally Posted by nasss92

now in respect to keeping all who want to partake in coined "hoon" type activity, for a major part of it this road character does arise as a result of ther isnt any other options! so, effectively many people seek to achieve their thrill in as many controlled environments as they can find (or roadways which they deem have a limited chance of accidents to occur).

these usually can be found in industrial areas which are vacant at night, carparks, large arterial roadways or motorways 3-4 lanes wide, or deserted national park road at hours were traffic is minimal....

Right near my suburb is a huge industrial area where any community minded person who felt they just "have to" spin the wheels on their pos to release their anger/ get their thrills(whatever mindless justification people can come up with) could go to and be out of sight and out of mind for most of us.

No, even that's too much trouble for these dimwits, they prefer to make a plume right of a suburban street at any time of the day, or have the thing going sideways through a roundabout etc

sorry folks not going for the extortion suggested here: "subsidise us with a drag strip and we'll behave ourselves"?

is that how people bring up their kids? take us to macca's and we'll do our homework?

[Ford Falcon XR6]

Originally Posted by nasss92

ther are the overly excited car enthusiasts , people that would include the majority on this forum who look after their vehicle and maintain them to a high degree and are quiet respectful to the ways of the road but can have a heavy foot sometimes or get a bit carried away (which is very understandable and easy to do)

then you have ignorant/ foolish/ degenerate people , which the general public considers as hoons and menaces on the road that shouldnt be let near a steering wheel.

I strongly agree with this i belive the have a place for the "hoons" to go and be silly is a good idea. But i belive if they do open such place the penaltys for people who get caught hooning out of these areas should be greatly increased

[93EB_SXR6]

Why does everybody think that they're a race-car driver?

Hoons are just ego-driven 'tards that reckon they have more ability than everybody else on the roads.

I am often overtaken/tail-gated by idiots in fully hektik Commodores, Jap cars and (yes) Falcons.
I'm young myself and I've never felt the need to "rip a sick skid" on the roads.
I am saving to get myself a track car and (hopefully) race in the Improved Production category here in S.A.

Most hoons I know are dole bludgers/drug dealers or centrelink frauds who don't understand the value of a dollar.

/Rant over and flame shield engaged.

[FgNewbie]

The hoons I know would not be welcome in any reputable club nor organised event. Give them a legal venue and I have no doubt they would abuse it and lose it.

Originally Posted by Fordman

I dont think so, the whole fun of it is the illegality in most peoples minds.

A law unto thyself, holy be thy reign. I remember years ago 2 female cops foolishly tried to move on a group of hoons and got attacked for their effort. The aholes must of felt real tough attacking women.

There is definitely an element in society today that has no respect for the law or those that enforce it. I know of one case where the son was sent back to his birth country to avoid prosecution. I often wonder how many of his mates are on this forum.

[Trevor 57]

Originally Posted by xisled

Do people think legal venue's would decrease the amount of hoon's on public roads.

No

[rancidpunx]

Another No here.

Anyone who takes owning a car seriously or has a slight interest in it other than a method of A to B is a hoon. If you own an XR your a hoon and the cops will give you a second glance just incase.
Thats the opinion of the general public now as well with all the bad publicity enthusiasts get. That general public will take no interest in a drag srtip etc and will still think every shiny car out there is a hoon waiting to light the rears up. The damage has been done in the media with the government jumping on the bandwagon to impress potential voters with their hard line.
The actions of a few have spoiled it for the rest of us, not just the P platers in old beat white commodores with stockies up back and chromies out front but also the idiots who set the interpretations.
In my opinion someone going sideways through a roundabout or doing twice the speed limit through a housing estate is a hoon, not someone with a beautiful classic who lights up the rears once leaving a car show or somebody who chirps gears between changes. The line between enthusiast and hoon is blurred forever and not amount of facilities will change that for us but it also wont stop idiots doing donuts for free in a woolies car park.

[Rodp]

No. Huge 'hoon' problem where I live - 15 minutes away from a legal drag strip and skid pan that's open every week.

[SEZ213]

I will repeat my comments from another thread...

There is a big difference between hoon and car enthusiast, the 'hoon' will never go to Eastern Creek, the car enthusiast will...the car enthusiast (for the most part) appreciates the rules of the road. Unfortunately Joe Public doesn't see that distinction...and they really should.

Given that according to one of the other threads on here (http://www.fordforums.com.au/showthread.php?t=11331321), that hoons don't account for that big of a percentage of the population.

whereas hoon-related accidents account for a smaller number of the overall road toll.

Given this, it's highly unlikely that a legal venue would stop a 'hoon'. It would, however, allow the car enthusiasts to enjoy their sport in the way that it should be enjoyed.

Originally Posted by sudszy

So lets put up your street we'll close it every night for five hours and limit its use to just hoons, you and your neighbours can pay for the standby ambulance team and fire team and pay to get the road surface repaired every few days, oh and you'll need to up your public liability just incase they lose control and injure themselves crashing into your place(you provided the venue)........still thinks its a good idea?

Hoons need somewhere to release all there built up fustrations etc, oh please......get off their fat ***** and go ride a bmx around the local garbage tip will achieve the same.

There are designated places for these kinds of things that are being closed...why?

Public liability..? Or because the loud minority don't want a race track near their house...? I know which one my pick would be, you sign a waiver when you enter a track...the nonce that decided to build near a race track...not my problem or anyone elses...so why close perfectly good venues?

[Luke Plaizier]

Yes. ABsoutely. If it's cheap enough.

There is nothing at all in Newcastle - the closest drag strip or race circuit other than go-karting is in Sydney. The cars all seem to line up at a big wide vacant road on Kooragang Island to race each other.

If there was a legal outlet for guys to score bragging rights, whether it be a circuit or/and a drag strip, as well as a 'cruising' area for the cars to park and the boys and girls to get out and socialise, then I think that would work really well.

The same thing could be said of Skate Parks - look how successfuly they have been now that there's a legitimate outlet for young board riders.

I subscribe to the idea that the vast majority of people are pleasant, law abiding and socially considerate when given the chance.


Lukeyson

[Ben73]

Originally Posted by Luke Plaizier

Yes. ABsoutely. If it's cheap enough.

There is nothing at all in Newcastle - the closest drag strip or race circuit other than go-karting is in Sydney. The cars all seem to line up at a big wide vacant road on Kooragang Island to race each other.

If there was a legal outlet for guys to score bragging rights, whether it be a circuit or/and a drag strip, as well as a 'cruising' area for the cars to park and the boys and girls to get out and socialise, then I think that would work really well.

The same thing could be said of Skate Parks - look how successfuly they have been now that there's a legitimate outlet for young board riders.

I subscribe to the idea that the vast majority of people are pleasant, law abiding and socially considerate when given the chance.


Lukeyson

Do they still do that at kooragang? I don't think they have for a while.

I bet that 99% of those people who used to hang around there and race would go to a drag strip or burnout pad if one was available.

There is always going to be idiots who use the public roads as a race track, but having more legal venues will help reduce people doing it on the road because there is no where else.

That's true about skaters. I know because I used to skate.
We use to skate around the streets because there was barely any skate parks around Newcastle. The ones that did exist were all cheap pieces of crap that most people avoided. Now that there are lots of Good skate parks around Newcastle they are always packed and you don't see people street skating as much anymore.

[Yellow_Festiva]

What venues are we talking about? A circuit? A 1/4 venue?

Most people are within cooee of an airport of sorts? Perhaps allowing them to have a car night every fortnight for drags / skidpan stuff to get it out of the system.

You would need to arrange seating, security, lighting and safety aspects. But the tarmac is there and that's half the job done.

Prob never happen, but I'm a dreamer and like thinking outside the square.

[flappist]

Originally Posted by Yellow_Festiva

What venues are we talking about? A circuit? A 1/4 venue?

Most people are within cooee of an airport of sorts? Perhaps allowing them to have a car night every fortnight for drags / skidpan stuff to get it out of the system.

You would need to arrange seating, security, lighting and safety aspects. But the tarmac is there and that's half the job done.

Prob never happen, but I'm a dreamer and like thinking outside the square.

Using an airport is a VERY expensive exercise.

After use, before it can be used for aviation it will need to be checked for damage to lights, surface and for bits of car or fluids left there.

Also before each event every single pilot in Australia has to be informed that the strip will be not available during that period so as there will not be any operation planned to use it and it will not be available as an alternate during weather or an emergency.

And the last problem is that if there is damage to the strip, who pays to fix it? You want to put up a $100,000 bond?

Nice in theory and some big budget groups do use them on occasion but not really practical.

On huge problem with tracks is that many of the hoons are not performance car enthusiasts they are just posers and if no one can see the act like idiots they are not interested in doing it. Why else do you think this stuff tends to happen in the main street?

[LTDHO]

Yes and no.

The two probablems I see are distance and price.

A hoon is smart enough to work out that they can hoon anywhere for free, which outweighs having to drive to a location to hoon.

A venue needs to me attractive to a hoon.

We are lead to believe that hoons kill road users.
In Victoria, road deathas are up 10 more than this time last year (Which was higher than the year before). This leads to two things.
1. Hoons/speeders aren't doing the killing.
2. Government would rather waste life with the speed campagne than actually spend money.

[Whoosha]

Bendigo is the "Hoon" capital of Vic. yet is 10 mins. from Heathcote, The problem is the Clowns that make the problems for the car enthusiast wont spend a cent for what the can do for free, that and the chance in a controlled environment they will be shown up to look as stupid as they are

[Yellow_Festiva]

Yeah, I was thinking the costs and other safety implications would outweigh the benefits...

Cheers.