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The Pub For General Automotive Related Talk |
View Poll Results: Should these things be allowed in built up areas, such as cities & suburbs? | |||
Yes. | 57 | 32.95% | |
No. | 68 | 39.31% | |
If prime movers, tractors, etc. are allowed, so can these. | 25 | 14.45% | |
Suburbs only. | 3 | 1.73% | |
Who cares. | 20 | 11.56% | |
Voters: 173. You may not vote on this poll |
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21-12-2005, 01:45 PM | #1 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Jan 2005
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Should these things be allowed in built up areas, such as cities & suburbs?
Imagine the damage of hitting or being hit by something that high, a side impact would be deadly. Driving it feels like driving a cloud, it floats with the wind & road bumps; not dangerously so, but enough to make relaxed driving difficult. At 60km/h it feels like your doing 80, it has all the right type of gear underneath.
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The true danger only occurs when you take a potentially dangerous piece of machinery and place it in the hands of the most unpredictable species on the planet. Human behaviour, as history has catalogued, cannot account for what any persons actions may be, especially concerning their love of the motor vehicle. http://www.fireservicecollege.ac.uk |
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21-12-2005, 01:48 PM | #2 | ||
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Yes, but should require a special licence like any vehicle over 2ton and over a certain height need to take extra training to learn how to control such a pig
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21-12-2005, 01:55 PM | #3 | |||
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But i do believe you should complete a test to allow you to tow though (many people are hopeless when it coems to towing something of substantial size.) I agree ... an advanced driving course or 2 in knowing how to handle your vehicle is money well spent for everyone.
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The Current Stable 2016 SZII TS Territory RWD Petrol The Evolution of the EGA54D utes AU Workshop Build thread of EGA54D B-Series Workshop Build thread of EGA54D 2004 SX TX Territory AWD - Gone but not forgotten 2010 FG XT "The ex-rental" - Moved onto a new home Mechan1k's Flickr Page |
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21-12-2005, 02:33 PM | #4 | |||||
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21-12-2005, 03:55 PM | #5 | |||
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What I'm getting at is roll-over potential of the vehicle and the height of a frontal colision point ie if the front bar is in the window/head region should determine whether a special licence is needed. A truck like in the image shown is pretty tall and the colision point is pretty much head height, or the chest of a pedestrian. Also if one was to wrench the steering wheel of that Toyota to avoid a rear ender, it would roll. The driver should need a special licence. Whereas a Territory has a lower front bar, making it more safer to pedestrians and in the instance of a T bone accident would have a bit of protection from the side impact bars and side airbags. Also the territory is a more nimble car and is less likely to roll over. |
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21-12-2005, 02:46 PM | #6 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
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If we start using weight as an issue for special licences, it wouldn't be long before small car owners start saying the same thing about large cars like Falcon, Fairlane & LTD's. After all there are more small cars sold than large.
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The true danger only occurs when you take a potentially dangerous piece of machinery and place it in the hands of the most unpredictable species on the planet. Human behaviour, as history has catalogued, cannot account for what any persons actions may be, especially concerning their love of the motor vehicle. http://www.fireservicecollege.ac.uk |
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21-12-2005, 01:52 PM | #7 | ||
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Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 388
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think about it for a second......why would u need a car that high in a city......do they feel that the streets of say melbourne are that bad that they need a big bad A$$ 4x4 to be safe..... not to mention that it prolly has illegal suspension hieghts.
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21-12-2005, 02:38 PM | #8 | |||
Has Blue Blood
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 1,551
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I think you can have your car how you like and if you like it extreme , beware the law ! If I owned a 4X4 and did extreme 4wheel drive driving with it , does that mean I should have not be allowed inside the city limits! Its like the old west , where the Sheriff would take your smokewagon off you and return it as you left town again ! out:
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Real cars dont wear bowties I'm not arrogent , Just superior
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21-12-2005, 02:46 PM | #9 | |||
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21-12-2005, 02:53 PM | #10 | |||
Has Blue Blood
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Location: Brisbane
Posts: 1,551
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While they might not need a 4X4 in town, why do some people feel the need to have a car sound system that can be heard in the next suburb , when they sit 3 feet from the speakers while driving said doof doof ? People will spend the money they have on what they like , it will never change . I love drinking Bundy , but everyone tells me beer will do the job ! :baby bott
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Real cars dont wear bowties I'm not arrogent , Just superior
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21-12-2005, 03:17 PM | #11 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
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This is possibly another argument altogether but...
Why would you need to increase the ride hieght that much?? 1) approach/departure angles: Surely the approach/departure angles aren't that bad on this 4wd from factory? (know nothing about toyotas). In my experience (Jackaroo, Pajero, range rover, defender etc) the factory approach and departure angles were suffiecent however this is obviously a piontless argument as it depends on the condition of the track you are on! 2) clearance: At the end of the day aren't the diffs and axles etc still the same height off the deck as before the mods? Also the probability of rollover would be hugely increased after the mods. I think that unless I am missing something these huge height increases overall are more for look at me purposes than anything else (Happy to hear thoughts on this!)! It would be interesting to hear some serious 4wd peoples (don't know how we qualify this lol!!) oppinion on this - I'M SURE I WILL!!!! |
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22-12-2005, 10:39 PM | #12 | |||
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18-01-2006, 08:40 PM | #13 | |||
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Think about it. Why do you need a veicle that do speeds of 170KMPh in a city. Next your vehicle will be banned and we we all be driving scooters. |
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21-12-2005, 01:53 PM | #14 | ||
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Depends how it is setup and used I guess.
Also depends where you live and where you work (Need to travel). Also comes down to using it for a hobby as well. Like most people lower cars and put bodykits on them ... and larger wheels, etc. Both types of vehicles can be as equally as dangerous as each other ... it coems down to if the modification sare done properly/safely ... and then it comes down to the driver of the vehicle (moreso than anything else). Quite a few friends of mine have "high-rise vehicles" (mucho money spent too) ... and they get used for their intended purposes ... but also get used in suburbia too. But they all know their vehicles aren't built for speed and cornering ... and their drive accordingly to be safe. They can't afrd to drive like idiots in them ... cos of the amount of money that is spent on thier vehicles.
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The Current Stable 2016 SZII TS Territory RWD Petrol The Evolution of the EGA54D utes AU Workshop Build thread of EGA54D B-Series Workshop Build thread of EGA54D 2004 SX TX Territory AWD - Gone but not forgotten 2010 FG XT "The ex-rental" - Moved onto a new home Mechan1k's Flickr Page |
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21-12-2005, 01:59 PM | #15 | |||
Its yellow, NOT green!
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21-12-2005, 03:06 PM | #16 | |||
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The Current Stable 2016 SZII TS Territory RWD Petrol The Evolution of the EGA54D utes AU Workshop Build thread of EGA54D B-Series Workshop Build thread of EGA54D 2004 SX TX Territory AWD - Gone but not forgotten 2010 FG XT "The ex-rental" - Moved onto a new home Mechan1k's Flickr Page |
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21-12-2005, 06:24 PM | #17 | |||||
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Perth
Posts: 501
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This is exactly true. I had a patrol that was jacked up 9 inches over standard with a high COG and i adjusted accordingly and never came close to crashing or causing damage to another car... Quote:
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22-12-2005, 11:45 AM | #18 | |||
Boss power
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21-12-2005, 02:00 PM | #19 | ||
Its yellow, NOT green!
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Location: Hunter Valley
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Big 4WDs like that are just ugly pigs that should be taxed out of existence.
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EL XR8 sedan - low & loud FG XR6 Turbo ute - Auto & Lux pack |
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22-12-2005, 08:36 AM | #20 | ||||
Force Fed Fords
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Had a mate who was T boned by one of these troglodite morons who went through a red light. There was a reason I said HAD a mate, as he is no longer with us thanks to some foll with an inferiority complex and a 2 inch pecker - requiring such an oversized vehicle. Problems are not just with the size of the vehicle, but the insular effect it offers the drivers which unfortunately turn to arrogance and plain stupidity. As the roads get busier this is the last thing we need, and the fact that in a side impact these vehicles are basically crushing one of the weakest points on a cars' chassis means that they do tremendous damage to the safety cell, alarmingly seriously injuring or killing occupants of any vehicle not of similar dimensions.
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22-12-2005, 06:16 PM | #21 | |||
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Mate, get a clue. First off, your post is so full of stereotyping dribble it's not funny. If I ranted about saying you were obviously a hoon because you're on a Ford site and you only own a performance car to make up for a small dick and erection problems you'd tell me to **** off, and rightly so. Secondly, the fact it was a 4WD had nothing to do with it. Sure they can be more dangerous in a side impact, but are you going to tell me a Falcon has never killed someone in a side impact? Mini Mokes are dangerous to motorbike riders, let's ban those. And third, the guy RAN A RED LIGHT! Last time I checked, that's illegal. How can you possibly blame the 4WD for that? The driver was clearly to blame, what he was driving had nothing to do with it. If he flew through the red in an Excel would you be calling for a ban on them? Didn't think so. Ban low performace drivers, not high performance cars. That phrase gets thrown around a lot here when ACA or Today Tonight kick up a fuss. Yet everyone is quick to bash 4WDs, stereotype the owners and ignore the real cause of the problems. You're all no better than the 80 year old Volvo driving whingers who call Neil Mitchell up every morning to about hoons. |
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22-12-2005, 06:48 PM | #22 | |||
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(I do agree with u by the way !)
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22-12-2005, 07:25 PM | #23 | |||
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22-12-2005, 08:09 PM | #24 | ||||
Force Fed Fords
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Thirdly, if you naively believe that 4wd vehicles are no more dangerous than a normal sedan then you have typified the very problems that the rest of us motorists face. Your arguement about how vehicles perform in an impact is so flawed that quite frankly everyone who has read your post is now dumber for having done so. It is this type of unadulterated ignorance that has made the 4wd issue such a big problem in the first place. As for getting a clue mate, I put it to you that I have a clue and in fact you don't; by the fact that you obviously have no concept of different types of vehicle construction and the resultant concentration of forces, let alone the actual metallurgy of the materials used and their respective tensile strength. If you would like a clue, perhaps you could spend a night with the local fire brigade and attend some accidents involving 4wd. Or better yet, perhaps you can check with the bureau of statistics and check what average percentage of either sedans or 4wd's have caused the most fatalities. Simply burying ones head in the sand does not make the problem go away, and denial that a problem exists is just fanciful.
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22-12-2005, 10:40 PM | #25 | |||
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Also never said 4WDs aren't more dangerous than family sedans. Because I know that's not true. Never made a comment about how any vehicle performs in an accident, let alone 4WDs. I have a fair idea of the different types of vehicle construction, but I fail to see how you conclude I don't, because I never said anything about it. Yes 4WDs are more dangerous than family sedans. I'm not even going to try to dispute that, I know they are. I just fail to see how you can claim that 4WDs are to blame for your mate's accident (even though it may come across differently, I'm sorry to hear about). Yes the 4WD may of played a role in it, however if the driver had stuck to the law it wouldn't of happened, plain and simple. Sorry if I came across as harsh, but I just get sick to death of knee jerk reactions to problems. Yes 4WDs are dangerous. Yes they take a bit more skill to drive. But that doesn't mean they should be taken off the road. There is clearly a problem with the licencing system, which is constantly avoided in favour of banning something. Sadly, banning things that are unpopular with the majority always wins votes over long term solutions. |
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22-12-2005, 10:45 PM | #26 | |||
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Last edited by jabba; 22-12-2005 at 10:53 PM. |
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18-01-2006, 04:21 PM | #27 | |||
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I agree with much of what you have said, but to attempt to "baffle with bulls**T" doesn't give you credability. For the record, I agree with many here in that all enthusiast motorists should stick together and present a united front to the Harrold Scrubbys of the world. |
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21-12-2005, 02:14 PM | #28 | ||
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Simple Answer No!
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23-12-2005, 02:26 PM | #29 | |||
Starter Motor
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Location: Newcastle
Posts: 24
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Just Kidding In all seriousness.........I think they're Ok but it is the drivers that need to be better informed. I guess it's just because 4x4's are seen as nothing more than a big car when in fact, they are a small truck. (and) yes there IS a difference. Fourbies have poor visiblility, poor braking charachteristics, top heavy, understeering and underbraking just like a small truck. Cheers |
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23-12-2005, 03:40 PM | #30 | |||
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