Commodore sportwagon at Ford's proving ground

[Road_Warrior]

http://www.caradvice.com.au/23698/fo...tv-a-sure-bet/

Caradvice reckon these photos were taken at the You Yangs proving ground. They also reckon that they spied an FG RTV ute mule being tested but I think that has been debunked as twaddle (facilities management ute apparently). There is another thread for that particular item I believe.

However a Commodore Sportwagon was also photographed at the site:



The question is - why would Ford need or want a Commodore wagon at the proving ground? If you look closely, it has an inventory number on the tailgate which suggests to me that it isn't an employee's car - it's for evaluation.

So what gives?

[Poidevin]

Doing some testing so Ford can make its own better sportswagon?

[ImpGonads]

Well I think the Holden Sportswagon is a brilliant vehicle, very well thought out in its practicality and target market. Hopefully Ford are taking some notes and developing their own model.

[uranium_death]

Originally Posted by ImpGonads

Well I think the Holden Sportswagon is a brilliant vehicle, very well thought out in its practicality and target market. Hopefully Ford are taking some notes and developing their own model.

No way!
Firstly, there isn't the money to develop a new model. Ford's future here or in the US is still not safe.

Secondly, Ford has the Territory, which covers the family market well enough and as stated by many on here, is a fantastic all-round car. Why steal sales from it with two vehicles that are similar in dimensions, interior space, performance, as well as targeted demographic?

Thirdly, there is already a wagon, and it cost next to nothing to update from BFII to BFIII, and has its own niche market. It may not be pretty, but it gets the job done. Holden had to have a wagon, since the Captiva was not the success Holden had hoped it would be.

As nice and rosey as the VE may be, I am not convinced that it's making a massive difference to Holden sales.

When they have to take the price down several thousand only months after release, that is probably a sign that it isn't selling like hotcakes and therefore difficult to recoup the costs.

Ford is playing it smart.

If Ford released a similar wagon, would you buy it? Many people who say, "I want Ford to make a sportswagon" will never buy one. It's just eye-candy and a case of "monkey-see, monkey-do" between Holden and Ford.

Right now, Ford should keep the current line-up.

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by uranium_death

No way!
Firstly, there isn't the money to develop a new model. Ford's future here or in the US is still not safe.

Secondly, Ford has the Territory, which covers the family market well enough and as stated by many on here, is a fantastic all-round car. Why steal sales from it with two vehicles that are similar in dimensions, interior space, performance, as well as targeted demographic?

Thirdly, there is already a wagon, and it cost next to nothing to update from BFII to BFIII, and has its own niche market. It may not be pretty, but it gets the job done. Holden had to have a wagon, since the Captiva was not the success Holden had hoped it would be.

As nice and rosey as the VE may be, I am not convinced that it's making a massive difference to Holden sales.

When they have to take the price down several thousand only months after release, that is probably a sign that it isn't selling like hotcakes and therefore difficult to recoup the costs.

Ford is playing it smart.

If Ford released a similar wagon, would you buy it? Many people who say, "I want Ford to make a sportswagon" will never buy one. It's just eye-candy and a case of "monkey-see, monkey-do" between Holden and Ford.

Right now, Ford should keep the current line-up.

Spot on on all counts.

The VE Hatch is so similar to the sedan you could argue it could easily make the sedan redundant if holden needed to consolidate its range. The hatch has not given holden any extra sales, all its done is give sedan buyers the option of a bigger boot.

[uranium_death]

Originally Posted by 4Vman

Spot on on all counts.

The VE Hatch is so similar to the sedan you could argue it could easily make the sedan redundant if holden needed to consolidate its range. The hatch has not given holden any extra sales, all its done is give sedan buyers the option of a bigger boot.

Even then, I wouldn't call it the difference that I would expect from a car that carries the "wagon" tag.

Australian wagons to me are practical vehicles.
We had an XF for 13 years and it was not a pleasure to drive compared to almost anything you throw up today, but in those 13 years, we drove to Queensland, Halls Gap about 5-6 times, Inverloch, Echuca and Swan Hill twice, Eildon countless times, Mansfield...many trips. With three kids in the back (I was in the middle) and a lot of luggage that EASILY fit in the boot, it was ideal for the family.

Also, with a second property in the West (grandparent's old place) and the heavy maintenance that comes with two units, we could carry tools, the lawnmower, tree loppers easily, especially with the back seat down.

For practicality, the XF wagon was among the best.

The VE combines European good looks with European size.
It's like comparing our old oven to our current one (1.5 years ago). Old one was an Australian oven - Westbrook Everhot. EASILY fit the largest turkey and two trays. Our new one is the most expensive Miele you can get, and it can't fit jack in comparison.

So while the European tag may give some people a fuzzy feeling inside, Australian practicality cannot be beat, and that is where Ford has played it superbly with the BFIII wagon.

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by uranium_death

Even then, I wouldn't call it the difference that I would expect from a car that carries the "wagon" tag.

Australian wagons to me are practical vehicles.
We had an XF for 13 years and it was not a pleasure to drive compared to almost anything you throw up today, but in those 13 years, we drove to Queensland, Halls Gap about 5-6 times, Inverloch, Echuca and Swan Hill twice, Eildon countless times, Mansfield...many trips. With three kids in the back (I was in the middle) and a lot of luggage that EASILY fit in the boot, it was ideal for the family.

Also, with a second property in the West (grandparent's old place) and the heavy maintenance that comes with two units, we could carry tools, the lawnmower, tree loppers easily, especially with the back seat down.

For practicality, the XF wagon was among the best.

The VE combines European good looks with European size.
It's like comparing our old oven to our current one (1.5 years ago). Old one was an Australian oven - Westbrook Everhot. EASILY fit the largest turkey and two trays. Our new one is the most expensive Miele you can get, and it can't fit jack in comparison.

So while the European tag may give some people a fuzzy feeling inside, Australian practicality cannot be beat, and that is where Ford has played it superbly with the BFIII wagon.

Yes and that's my point, by Australian standards and traditions its not a wagon, its an impostor as a wagon, in reality its a hatch.
Ive got no doubt it ticks allot of box's for families who think: "Hey, why not, its just like a sedan but with a bit more carry height" "lets buy one instead of a sedan".. which in reality is all that's happening... Its not creating the incremental sales holden thought it would.

[SSVPom]

Don't know if anyone can shed any light on this, but did anyone elso notice a lot of the VE development road cars had the rego starting with 'UAM' ? Mainly we saw them in '06 prior to the launch, but also a good deal of the press cars were the same. Also, more recently the Chevvy Impala badged Statesmans and Pontiac G8's wore the same plates.

Anyway, the point of this is on Hoddle Street (Melbourne) last week during 5.30pm rush hour, saw a dirty, ratty looking black VE SS with 'UAM' rego, 'VE' serial number stickers on the rear passenger door windows and a laptop computer mounted facing the driver in the front centre console.

What I couldn't work out were two sockets mounted in the slightly damaged lower rear bumper, they looked almost like lpg filling thingos, but were down low and looked important.

Some sort of chassis development mule ?

[prydey]

in the latest issue ot topgear australia (missus bought it), they have a R8 tourer in the 'lifers' section at the back. in that little write up they say, and i quote,'with the seats laid flat, you've got a long lowish space that'll take prams...etc'. now forgive me if i'm wrong here but if you want it to put a pram in the back, aren't you also going to want the rear seats in the UP position.

since when does carrying capacity in a wagon get measured with seats down.

[Paxton]

Originally Posted by FairmontPom

Don't know if anyone can shed any light on this, but did anyone elso notice a lot of the VE development road cars had the rego starting with 'UAM' ? Mainly we saw them in '06 prior to the launch, but also a good deal of the press cars were the same. Also, more recently the Chevvy Impala badged Statesmans and Pontiac G8's wore the same plates.

Anyway, the point of this is on Hoddle Street (Melbourne) last week during 5.30pm rush hour, saw a dirty, ratty looking black VE SS with 'UAM' rego, 'VE' serial number stickers on the rear passenger door windows and a laptop computer mounted facing the driver in the front centre console.

What I couldn't work out were two sockets mounted in the slightly damaged lower rear bumper, they looked almost like lpg filling thingos, but were down low and looked important.

Some sort of chassis development mule ?

The new VF Commodore is just around the corner, so I'm guessing these are the first of the mules. VF won't be a great deal different to VE under the skin, it will be cosmetic and mechanical changes.

There is a Rumoured 3.2 Litre Direct Injetion V6 in base models.

[Polyal]

Cars are evaluated all the time so no surprise there; id be worried if they didn't have other makes floating about.

[Road_Warrior]

Originally Posted by Polyal

Cars are evaluated all the time so no surprise there; id be worried if they didn't have other makes floating about.

This is true, I'd imagine that Ford (and Holden) would have a dirty great big fleet of other makes and models to evaluate. But what makes this different is that it is a wagon, and Ford have said that the Falcon wagon is dead. Apart from the BFIII of course.

Apart from being a wagon, it is no different to any other VE, so why not just use one of the VE's you already have? I smell a rat...

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by Polyal

Cars are evaluated all the time so no surprise there; id be worried if they didn't have other makes floating about.

When I was on the proving ground there were a few different other makes there that Ford will evaluate and the decide to match or better then their competitors.

[SM1DY]

Any sportswagon that Ford built would still look like a hearse.

[xr6turboford]

Originally Posted by SM1DY

Any sportswagon that Ford built would still look like a hearse.

Your point is ? Maybe your next home

[KITBAG]

So what gives?[/QUOTE]


SIMPLE ANSWER..............
FORD WERE HAVING A
SMASH AND BASH DAY (DEMOLITION DERBY)
WHY NOT USE A DUNNYDOOR WAGON

: :

[Daymoe]

I found this comment funny in that article:

Tyrannosaurus Rex just checking out Diplodocus in dino land , soon be both extinct.

.

Funny thing is it relates to Ford and Holden (maybe just Holden who knows).

[b2tf]

It's common for manufacturers to test out their rivals products, I've seen a group of early build VE HSV's with some BF FPV's on a run before.

[4Vman]

Hate to tell you all but all the car companies have an agreement to swap models on a regular basis. In the past they all bought cars for evaluation, they all knew they did it so a gentleman's agreement was reached between them all to swap cars for free to save the "smoke and mirrors" and costs....
There may be no particular reason for Ford to have the wagon other than it was part of a shipment of "swap" cars, and to be honest they'd be crazy not to test it...

[BENT_8]

In late 01 early 02 the Toyota Hilux was updated, i worked for a Toyota dealership and was asked to prepare a Lux for assesment at the Elizabeth Holdens Plant.
From memory they wanted to leak test it which i presume would relate testing weather seals around doors etc.

[EgoFG]

I would love to see a falcon wagon based on the territory

[Allen]

I remember reading somewhere ages ago, that Holden bought an XR or XT GT Falcon to test against its latest Monaro...

During testing they discovered and fixed a fuel surge problem in the then new Falcon GT. They then passed the information onto Ford so they could rectify the problem on the production line.


The stereotype that Ford and Holded passionatly hate each other and refuse to work together is getting a bit old now.
They are all in the same boat! :P

[Paxton]

There is a reason behind this.

Benchmarking. What major Ford supplier went down during the week? How many cogs does the Calais Auto have? How many does the base Petrol Falcon Auto have? See a similarity?

[nugget378]

Originally Posted by Paxton

There is a reason behind this.

Benchmarking. What major Ford supplier went down during the week? How many cogs does the Calais Auto have? How many does the base Petrol Falcon Auto have? See a similarity?

One test was to see how many litre bottles of milk you can fit into the sportswagon?
The answer after testing was 2, and a dozen eggs if you pack everything just right..

[seduced_xr]

Originally Posted by nugget378

One test was to see how many litre bottles of milk you can fit into the sportswagon?
The answer after testing was 2, and a dozen eggs if you pack everything just right..

this is so true. the xr had some repairs done on it and we got a dunnydore VE wagon. i could have sworn more fit into the BF boot. the VE wagon term is a load of rubbish. theres no room in the back at all

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by seduced_xr

this is so true. the xr had some repairs done on it and we got a dunnydore VE wagon. i could have sworn more fit into the BF boot. the VE wagon term is a load of rubbish. theres no room in the back at all

That's why its more accurately known as the Commodore Hatch.....

[NC1183]

I read the Wheels magazine on the Car Of The Year, yeah i know, but they use the Ford You Yangs testing ground for there car testing

[Trendseeker]

Originally Posted by nugget378

One test was to see how many litre bottles of milk you can fit into the sportswagon?
The answer after testing was 2, and a dozen eggs if you pack everything just right..

Absolutely correct. But the eggs will break on the way home due to the clunks when the transmission changes gears.

[Stattic]

wow apparently ford have been spotted using this
http://tinyurl.com/349ygu

[Daymoe]

Originally Posted by Stattic

wow apparently ford have been spotted using this
http://tinyurl.com/349ygu

Woah, that'll hit the media pretty soon!