Blitz on hoons

[TE50 027]

Just found this. I like the last paragraph about using their cars in crash tests. Only problem I see is that it may encourage them to try harder to get away.

http://news.ninemsn.com.au/article.aspx?id=384972

[fmc351]

Yeah, model citizens.

"Get a good picture, put this on a front paper, ya dog", one yelled.

There are other problems, like racing in beat up unsafe buckets of crap if they really want to race and avoid losing their pride and joy.

They have to do something though using the examples in the article as a reason for that need. Not giving them a media voice to air their "coolness" wouldnt hurt either. The quote above will be met with "good one Bro" from his fully sic mates, and he has a wider audience via the media now. Its hard to shame tools when their peers think what should be a source of shame is "cool".


Eidt: lol, fully sic with a k is a banned word.

[TwistedEL]

The hoon laws are a good thing, but the way I can forsee police abusing them is not. What constitutes hooning? Chirping tyres? Accelerating too quickly? How quick is too quick? At how many K's over the limit are you hooning?

[james22]

Originally Posted by TwistedEL

The hoon laws are a good thing, but the way I can forsee police abusing them is not. What constitutes hooning? Chirping tyres? Accelerating too quickly? How quick is too quick? At how many K's over the limit are you hooning?

Plain Black & White right here....

Legislation Here

[sleekism]

Originally Posted by james22

Plain Black & White right here....

Legislation Here

How the hell is that plain black and white????????????

Did you read section 4BB 1) ????????????????

They don't need evidence to impound your vehicle. If a police "reasonably believes" that you have undertaken an illegal activity then they can impound your vehicle.

To me that smells like a big GREY! The cop only has to not like the look of your vehicle: "Why do you have a modified V8 sir? Street racing?" and your done.

[nugget378]

Originally Posted by sleekism

How the hell is that plain black and white????????????

Did you read section 4BB 1) ????????????????

They don't need evidence to impound your vehicle. If a police "reasonably believes" that you have undertaken an illegal activity then they can impound your vehicle.

To me that smells like a big GREY! The cop only has to not like the look of your vehicle: "Why do you have a modified V8 sir? Street racing?" and your done.

I find any law where there is a large grey area (IE: up to interpretation by anyone other than a court) like this very worrying..

[fmc351]

Originally Posted by sleekism

How the hell is that plain black and white????????????

Did you read section 4BB 1) ????????????????

They don't need evidence to impound your vehicle. If a police "reasonably believes" that you have undertaken an illegal activity then they can impound your vehicle.

To me that smells like a big GREY! The cop only has to not like the look of your vehicle: "Why do you have a modified V8 sir? Street racing?" and your done.

"Reasonable" will be defined by case law over time, if it hasnt been already. All laws are grey enough to enable the spirit of the law to be fulfilled. It will not be as you claim.

4BA (1) "Sustained loss of traction" is not an accidental chirp. Gee, revs, exhaust noise will be an indicator of intent. Read 4BA(3)

If youre racing another car, even if only upto the speed limit, you are breaking the law, the fact you dont speed does not defeat the law as its not a speeding offence, its another offence.

None of this is at Police discretion any more so than any other law. The Police charge you courts do not which is the same for any event, you get your day in court if you wish to challenge it. This is being handled in the same manner as any traffic offence currently is.


Yes its true the young get targeted, and for many that is unfair. You only have your peers to blame though, not the police. Police are trained to target likely suspects, more over, they are accustomed to being proven right in those situations more often than not, and your peers tar you with their brush.

Originally Posted by KBBossedXR

I did the wrong thing and it wasnt even on the road and my XR8 Ute got impounded last year and i didnt get along well with the Female officer,

...apart from one brain fade in my local Ford Dealership last year and if the Female officer got her way i would have been on the verge of loosing my BA XR8 Ute.

I assume this brain fade is the offence mentioned?

Its not private property, its a place that is frequented by the public. You deserved to be charged if you committed an offence, get over it and if impounding is the penalty, suck it up. If you acted the tool because they wouldnt do something for you that they are not obligated to do, no wonder the judge was unimpressed with you. Again, you got what you deserved in both issues.

Originally Posted by KBBossedXR

All the Judge talked about in Court was my behaviour in the Police Station he didnt even mention the Accident. So if she didnt try and lay rediculous chargers i wouldnt have had to go to the police station therefore i wouldnt have ended up in a fight and got arrested.

Yeah, its all her fault, she started it. You sound like youre 5.

You stuffed up, paid the price. You admit to not getting on with the officer, then expect a favour from them, yes it was a favour, they are not obligated to throw a blankie on your seat. Funny about that, Im an a-hole to anyone who gets in my face too. Like youre any different.

[TwistedEL]

Originally Posted by james22

Plain Black & White right here....

Legislation Here

Thanks for the link, but I didn't see a single hard number.

[XR06T]

Originally Posted by james22

Plain Black & White right here....

Legislation Here

bahahaha plain black and white?

so where in there does it say how fast i am alowed to get to the speed limit with a car in the lane next to me? 5 seconds? 10 seconds? Speed Competition? What speed? Sustained loss of traction? 1 second? 1 minute? Reasonably believes? dont get me started..

looks pretty grey to me....

[LTDHO]

Originally Posted by TwistedEL

The hoon laws are a good thing, but the way I can forsee police abusing them is not. What constitutes hooning? Chirping tyres? Accelerating too quickly? How quick is too quick? At how many K's over the limit are you hooning?

Chirping tires? Yes
Acceleration too quickly? Yes
How quick is to quick? Up to the descression of the officer = Yes
At how many K's over the limit is hooning? exceeding = exceeding = Yes

Originally Posted by sleekism

They don't need evidence to impound your vehicle. If a police "reasonably believes" that you have undertaken an illegal activity then they can impound your vehicle.

To me that smells like a big GREY! The cop only has to not like the look of your vehicle: "Why do you have a modified V8 sir? Street racing?" and your done.

In Victoria, the policy don't need to prove anything to defect or impound, just reasonably believe and 'car-ching' yellow sticker.

Originally Posted by KBBossedXR

The bottom line is if you dont do anything wrong you wont get in trouble..

You obviously didn't read the "reasonably believes" bit. You don't have to do anything wrong to be done.

[Road Games]

Originally Posted by TwistedEL

The hoon laws are a good thing, but the way I can forsee police abusing them is not. What constitutes hooning? Chirping tyres? Accelerating too quickly? How quick is too quick? At how many K's over the limit are you hooning?

Not gunna read through all the rubbish even though i,m sure there are some valid points on offer ???
I,d rather just add my 2c worth :
Three weeks ago i had a race with an BF Turbo 6 speed falcon , now what we got up too could of got both our cars impounded !
We were lucky , i took my friend for a drive in mine and gave it the stick but i never spun the wheels from a standstill - just up through the gears (still hit a speed i wont mention here ) Next it was his turn , out on the road full revs smoke everywhere ,sideways big push no chirp in second but a HUUUUUGGE top end rush - uh oh party lights , cops saw the whole thing. Took a kilometre easy before we stopped ?!!
They step out of their undercover F6 Typhoon and say " Gimme one good reason in 5 seconds why i shouldn,t have this car impounded" ?
What do you do ???? Admit your a retard/ just showing off/ there was no one else on the road ???????
We did all of the above , and it cost him a fair few dollars - and he will lose his licence because he was on probation......... Point is I didnt make him do what he did , boys will be boys whether they are actually men or not !
If you get caught out , accept it for what it is , be polite be humble and think twice before you do it again .... And you will , but dont blame others for your choices , we all make mistakes ...
If we didnt we wouldnt be on here , sharing our stories :

[Boosh Brus]

Maybe he means plain black and white text not content

[james22]

It simply doesn't bother me.

I have no reason to get my car impounded....... Full stop.....

Don't be a dipshit, don't lose your car. Plain black & white.

In fact, I've had nothing but compliments about my "Modified V8" from members of the boys in blue. They appreciate a nice car as much as us.... just not the tools that drive them at times.

[RG]

Originally Posted by james22

It simply doesn't bother me.

I have no reason to get my car impounded....... Full stop.....

Don't be a dipshit, don't lose your car. Plain black & white.

In fact, I've had nothing but compliments about my "Modified V8" from members of the boys in blue. They appreciate a nice car as much as us.... just not the tools that drive them at times.

So I take it that you have NEVER put the foot down in yours on a public road then? Technically that can be considered "hooning" and for that you would lose the car.

[james22]

Originally Posted by Russell

So I take it that you have NEVER put the foot down in yours on a public road then? Technically that can be considered "hooning" and for that you would lose the car.

Did I say that. No. My point being you play, you get caught, you pay. Stop whining about Hoon laws if they don't apply to you. Which unless you drive like a knob REPEATEDLY you have no problem. Its not like they crush your car, tear up your license, and butt f#$k you, the first time you decide to play.

If you don't learn the first couple of times, you don't deserve to have a license, car, etc. Thats the way the government sees it, and they have already warned you, booked you before they take drastic measures.

[RG]

Originally Posted by james22

Did I say that. No. My point being you play, you get caught, you pay. Stop whining about Hoon laws if they don't apply to you. Which unless you drive like a knob REPEATEDLY you have no problem. Its not like they crush your car, tear up your license, and butt f#$k you, the first time you decide to play.

If you don't learn the first couple of times, you don't deserve to have a license, car, etc. Thats the way the government sees it, and they have already warned you, booked you before they take drastic measures.

That is unless you live in Victoria

[sprjenkins]

Originally Posted by james22

Did I say that. No. My point being you play, you get caught, you pay. Stop whining about Hoon laws if they don't apply to you. Which unless you drive like a knob REPEATEDLY you have no problem. Its not like they crush your car, tear up your license, and butt f#$k you, the first time you decide to play.

If you don't learn the first couple of times, you don't deserve to have a license, car, etc. Thats the way the government sees it, and they have already warned you, booked you before they take drastic measures.

Yeah, you play you pay. Well what's definded as playing and who defines it. As it has been stated that is very very far from black and white. The only thing black and white about that is black text on a white background.

Tell me a P plater driving away spiritidly but not excessively fast from the lights isn't going to get done by a highway patrol officer who has to fill his quota.

It's an absolutely crap law because it sets a precedent that a law can be enforced without nesscesarily having to prove anything in evidence. People are guilty until proven innocent and it evens says so in there.

In a murder case a policeman has to collect a reasonable amount of solid evidence that the public prosecuter believes would lead to a conviction before they can arrest anyone.

It's completely different in this case as the policeman only needs to say he had a gut feeling about it. There's no need to produce any evidence whatsoever.

[Laminge]

James

Dont bite back.

If they have to have a go at you for posting a link then its they that I pity.

[KBBossedXR]

The bottom line is if you dont do anything wrong you wont get in trouble.
Well this is fine but when you leave things open for Police interpretation this is not good at all.
What the Police officer says is Hooning and what isnt will be up to the individual officer at the time and we all know how many different officers are out there.
I did the wrong thing and it wasnt even on the road and my XR8 Ute got impounded last year and i didnt get along well with the Female officer, later on in the year i had an accident and guess what i got the same female officer and she tried to throw the book at me big time. She had my Ute impounded for it to be inspected (not hooning) for mechanical defects or illegal performance enhancements this was a waist of time, She then charged me with driving in a dangerous manner.
This was absolutely ridiculous and i ended up locked up because i spat chips and things got a bit out of hand.
What she wanted was to have me charged with Dangerous Driving then she could impound my Ute again for Hooning and i would have 2 strikes that would leave me 1 more and they would keep my Ute.
I have been driving for 18 years and have only had a couple of speeding tickets and this is after owning a RGV 250, CBR 600, YZF 750, Ducati 748, Ducati 916 SPS, Aprilia RSV 1000R, 67 XR Falcon 11.5 1/4 mile, XR GT, BA GT, AU XR8 Ute, BA XR8 Ute, so i have had plenty of vehicles that could/can go alot faster than your allowed to on the road but i was always sensible apart from one brain fade in my local Ford Dealership last year and if the Female officer got her way i would have been on the verge of loosing my BA XR8 Ute.
All the Judge talked about in Court was my behaviour in the Police Station he didnt even mention the Accident. So if she didnt try and lay rediculous chargers i wouldnt have had to go to the police station therefore i wouldnt have ended up in a fight and got arrested.

[dom_105]

Originally Posted by KBBossedXR

The bottom line is if you dont do anything wrong you wont get in trouble.
Well this is fine but when you leave things open for Police interpretation this is not good at all.
What the Police officer says is Hooning and what isnt will be up to the individual officer at the time and we all know how many different officers are out there.
I did the wrong thing and it wasnt even on the road and my XR8 Ute got impounded last year and i didnt get along well with the Female officer, later on in the year i had an accident and guess what i got the same female officer and she tried to throw the book at me big time. She had my Ute impounded for it to be inspected (not hooning) for mechanical defects or illegal performance enhancements this was a waist of time, She then charged me with driving in a dangerous manner.
This was absolutely ridiculous and i ended up locked up because i spat chips and things got a bit out of hand.
What she wanted was to have me charged with Dangerous Driving then she could impound my Ute again for Hooning and i would have 2 strikes that would leave me 1 more and they would keep my Ute.
I have been driving for 18 years and have only had a couple of speeding tickets and this is after owning a RGV 250, CBR 600, YZF 750, Ducati 748, Ducati 916 SPS, Aprilia RSV 1000R, 67 XR Falcon 11.5 1/4 mile, XR GT, BA GT, AU XR8 Ute, BA XR8 Ute, so i have had plenty of vehicles that could/can go alot faster than your allowed to on the road but i was always sensible apart from one brain fade in my local Ford Dealership last year and if the Female officer got her way i would have been on the verge of loosing my BA XR8 Ute.
All the Judge talked about in Court was my behaviour in the Police Station he didnt even mention the Accident. So if she didnt try and lay rediculous chargers i wouldnt have had to go to the police station therefore i wouldnt have ended up in a fight and got arrested.

And there you go.

It is these types of situations that should and need to be eliminated before authorioties even think of destroying cars.

[Tony xa]

The other problem is what sort of car you are driving same affences different cars could see you land different charge's speeding in a fiesta speeding ticket speeding at the same over in a modified car hooning .This would also apply for chripping the tyres and leaving the lights quickly .
This is where the law fails for me and the fact that it forces some to run that would have previously pulled over and taken the fine .
I understand why the laws are here sort off but on a whole we are nowhere as bad as drink drivers but yet they can be repeat affenders into the tens before they start to face serious trouble .

[4Vman]

I love the way people blame their anti social and aggressive behaviour on the Police, "because if they didn't try to charge me i wouldn't have had to <insert violent act here> " ....

[KBBossedXR]

Originally Posted by 4Vman

I love the way people blame their anti social and aggressive behaviour on the Police, "because if they didn't try to charge me i wouldn't have had to <insert violent act here> " ....

Hey mate i except full responsability for my actions and always do, my comment was aimed towards if she had Conducted herself properly and didnt hold a grudge from before there wouldnt have been the need for me to go to the police station

Maybe it had something to do with them crashing my ute whilst they had it impounded from my incident at the Ford Dealership
1 officer said they had to move it to take photos of it, another officer said they had to get something out of the shed and they reversed into the shed door putting it back in.
I have a feeling that the Female officer was driving it as she was rather short and my seat had been moved forward.

They paid for a new rear bumper, but wouldnt tell me who was driving or why it was moved.

My last gripe and this is how pathetic "SOME" of the police became, I have replaced the XR8 interior in the Ute with a Pursuit Leather interior. So when they inspected my Ute for mechanical defects & illegal modifications i went down to the police station with a bed sheet to put on my Leather Seat in case there mechanic sits in it with dirty overalls.
I was told i was not allowed to as my ute was seized as evidence and i wasnt allowed to touch it, i then asked if they could do it but i wanted to watch them do it right but no wasnt allowed to.
I didnt give in and eventually a senior officer came out to break up all the noise and i was allowed to put the sheet on under extreme supervision.

Having worked in the Security industry for 5 years dealing with some very violent people and also very calm people, There are ways in which you deal with situations and unfortunately i think and there are alot of other people out there think the same that "SOME" of our police force shouldnt be there.
Take a look at the Female officer at the Australian Tennis Open with her Pepper Spray that was just out right ridiculous, thank god she didnt have a gun

[Abacus]

I don't see how you can get away from the "reasonably believes"' aspect. At the end of the day any action in respect of hooning is going to be a subjective decision, and it's pretty obvious the copper on the scene is going to have to make that decision.

It's not as though the Act can include a list of proscribed events (eg spinning tyres for 0.75 seconds, or 1.5 metres, or accelarating at a certain rate. Its pretty obvious if someone is driving like a pr1ck, and if they get done I have no sympathy whatsoever for them.

[TwistedEL]

Yes it is a subjective decision but how can you adhere to a law that does not actually tell you where the line is drawn? And for that matter, how can police be expected to enforce it?

What one police officer considers hooning another may not.

If I take off from a set of lights and it takes me 3 seconds to reach the posted speed limit of 60 km/h am I hooning? What if it takes me 5 seconds? And what if the car next to me takes 5.1 seconds? Are we now street racing? Did I just win a race I didn't even know I was involved in?

I should go on the record here as saying I've never had any trouble from the police I've never been accused of any "hoon" activities. I'm simply saying that both police and the public should be told exactly what a "hoon" is.

[bangm001]

Guys, we have all been on our P's, how many times did each of us get pulled over for doing absolutely nothing wrong, just myself in the car- I have lost count! I was in my mums jacked up stock as a rock EF Falcon, I have a perfect history, never even involved in an accident, but coz there were P plates there, they check over the car, tyres, seatbelts etc etc. I am sure if I was driving a WRX or skyline or something, which are targeted cars, then I would have been defected over something stupid on my stock car just because I was young. I have even heard of friends being threatened of being defected if they didnt move on parked at the beach here in Adelaide.. There are many grey areas in these anti hoon laws, some I have no problems with, like the basic trying to take care of the safety of our roads, some I dont like accelerating too fast at the polices descretion.. Seriously now.. Anyways, I can live with the you play you pay motto, but for accerating to 100 in say a reasonably quick take off-PROVIDING THE ROAD IS CLEAR AND IT IS SAFE TO DO SO- I dont see a problem with this..

[Airmon]

Originally Posted by bangm001

Guys, we have all been on our P's, how many times did each of us get pulled over for doing absolutely nothing wrong, just myself in the car- I have lost count! I was in my mums jacked up stock as a rock EF Falcon, I have a perfect history, never even involved in an accident, but coz there were P plates there, they check over the car, tyres, seatbelts etc etc. I am sure if I was driving a WRX or skyline or something, which are targeted cars, then I would have been defected over something stupid on my stock car just because I was young. I have even heard of friends being threatened of being defected if they didnt move on parked at the beach here in Adelaide.. There are many grey areas in these anti hoon laws, some I have no problems with, like the basic trying to take care of the safety of our roads, some I dont like accelerating too fast at the polices descretion.. Seriously now.. Anyways, I can live with the you play you pay motto, but for accerating to 100 in say a reasonably quick take off-PROVIDING THE ROAD IS CLEAR AND IT IS SAFE TO DO SO- I dont see a problem with this..

Yeah too right mate, yeah sure okay, I've done things wrong, and done things I've regretted and learnt from that, but to be pulled over and have someone treat you as if you just spat in his face after beating him mother half to death and going over your car with a fine tooth comb for no reason other then that fact you have P plates doesn't give P platers (the main people who this is usually targetted at) a good impression of the Police force.

One night springs to mind, driving to the movies with a mate,
pulled over, after looking at my licence - "Eff-off back to Macquarie fields and be their problem, catch you here again tonight and we'll tow the car, Got it?"

So do forgive me if these Grey area's worry me slightly.

[mitch_302]

it's been said here i know but this is all going to come down to which police officer happens to pull u over. i'm from the country and our little town doesn't have a cop but there is a fairly decent police presence. the cop a little way south down the calder is a notorious a@#hole, doesn't like my old man doesn't like my big brother so im basically out of luck when i hit the roads in a nice ute.

but it just so happens that the cop from a little way north drove me and a mate one night from an 18th at a pub to another party bout 50km apart after midnight just coz we asked ...and did the the job in excess of 150km/h mind u. so it's never gonna b a level playing feild

[bangm001]

Dont get me wrong, there are some fantastic police who i have also been pulled over by also, these were all just randon stops for breath testing etc. One in particular (again on my Ps and driving my old ladies EF) pulled me up, I said hello officer, why have you pulled me over? HE replied coz you have a Prince style beard!! We both laughed, me not knowing what the hel to say! But joked around hows your day etc etc, didnt look at me as a hooning young guy and all was sweet as! A great experience getting pulled up by them for all of the right reasons.. I have always been spoiled by nice company vehicles of my own and my old man and have respected them totally, a now I have my own pride and joy F6 and it never sees over 3000rpm! Well not very often anyway! So im vertainly no hoon, but I do alot of hway driving, love the ease of this esp when overtaking, ability to be able to tow the boat, and plenty of power around town. Anyways, just my 2c.

[260 XR8]

Hang on a second here. What we need to consider is why these laws were introduced. They were supposed to stop accidents, because as we all know modified cars cause all the accidents. LETS GET REAL its all about MONEY revenue raising, it stands to reason that if you have a modified car then you must have more money to waste, so they know that they can make a killing by making the law so vague that if their quoter for the night or week or month is down then the copper can charge you for nothing and you can't fight it because it is left to his disgretion.
When did we become such a nazi country, its like the kgb a simple example of how this could go so wrong is this,
A BA GT and a 66 mini 850 sitting at the lights, they take of the GT having heaps more power than the mini gets away alot quicker, and chances are that the guy in the GT has more money so the coppers pull him up and deem him to have accelerated to quickly away from the lights how does he fight this decision, he can't.
As for taking peoples cars and crushing them and maybe leaving them in financial ruin where are there basic civil rights, Australia is fast becoming a dictatorship.
I would much rather my tax paying dollars were spent on the police finding, stopping and solving actual crimes like murders and rapes than this bunch of crap that they call tring to save lives, more accidents happen in family cars than modified cars so how do they justify it, they don't they don't have to.
I was driving with my wife one day in her AU2 I6 now the car does have an exhaust but its not loud when your cruising or when you back off, we came up behind this R33 skyline now I caught him because I was doing the speed limit and at times slightly all be it 5k's over the speed limit. We came to a set of lights where I pulled up behind him at a red light, while sitting at the lights a cop car pulled up in the right hand turning lane, we sat for about another 5-10 seconds after they pulled up the lights changed and we started to move off, I watched the cop car in my rear view mirror as you do to see if he was going to turn as this was his original intention( and because of the noise of the car on acceleration ) much to my gut dropping feeling he pulled out into the straight ahead lane to follow our line of traffic he was about 4-5 cars back, we pulled up a the next set of lights the R33 was first car of the rank and I was second, the cop car came up the inside of us into a turn left or go straight lane, we sat there for all of about 5-10 seconds as we started of the cops put their lights on and pulled in front of me to pull the R33 over. This guy had done nothing wrong his car was not even modified and to make matters worse the guy was about 50-60 years old, I pulled up got out went back to the gentleman in his car to here the cop saying to him that if he didn't want to get pulled over he should have chosen a more elderly friendly car, I then had this same copper ask me what I wanted to which I answered none of his business which then he told me to go then, My answer to that was that I was under the assumtion that this was a free country and that so long as I had pulled over safely( in front of him) then why should I have to go, I then asked the older gentlemen in the car if he was okay, the copper told me to shut up and leave, to which I responded I'm not talking to you and you can't stop me from talking to him , I told the guy that I was a witness to the police harassment that he was being subjected to and would have no problem in going to court if I had to, and gave him my card,the police officer then said haressment how do you get that , my answer, why did you pull him over then, the guy in the car said because of the car that I am driving thats what they told me, and thats exactly what I had heard, the copper then tells me that I heard nothing of the sought and to" off " his words not mine, The guy in the car is looking at my card and starts to read it out loud
My name followed by attorney at law and my phone no.
Well was the copper a bit nicer then.
The point is we cant let our rights be taken away from us so easily, this is haressment, loud exhaust, do you see them booking all the guys on the harley's, they are way louder than any car, no they don't , don't need to be a rocket scientist to know why, don't want to bite of more than they can chew.
Make no mistake this is haressment this is a gross injustice and a direct attack at your civil rights.
I don't condone street racing or burn outs but the law as it stands leaves you with no rights at all and you don't need to be doing the above to get booked ( think the car looks good or racey impound it, no prove needed GASTAPO).