ESS and Tiptronic??

[InfernoSR]

Can someone explain what ESS and Tiptronic are? and is Tiptronic the one with the steering wheel buttons? I have a plan with a shiftkit and override system, but need further details of these as to what they do, how they work etc. Can anyone help?

[xrtonv]

isnt tiptronic the system thye have on BA's where u are able to change gear like an manual ( to a point)
dimi

[InfernoSR]

Originally Posted by DiMisEA3.9MP

isnt tiptronic the system thye have on BA's where u are able to change gear like an manual ( to a point)
dimi

No idea... i'm confused as whats what in them these days... :P

[Fireblade]

Tiptronic is the BA type manual shift auto, as to ESS have no idea...

[InfernoSR]

Originally Posted by GR8WITE

Tiptronic is the BA type manual shift auto, as to ESS have no idea...

Ah... ok... so Tiptronic uses the sequential shift? why cant they just use the one name!

[Whitey-AMG]

ESS - ( Electronic Sports Shift (ESS) ) is best known as the steering wheel shift buttons ( Tickford T series )
Allows you to shift up or shift down by using the buttons on the steering wheel - Not quite shift paddles, but you get the idea. ( you do not use the shifter to change gears )

Tiptronic is what you see in the BA - BF auto shifters. You push the Auto Shift lever over to Performance mode and then you tap the T Bar shifter up or down to change gears.

[FGII-XR6]

electrically there is no difference between the 2 they just use a different method to change gears the shifter or steering wheel buttons

[InfernoSR]

So the ESS gives it a full manual over-ride? or a partial like the std auto boxes?

[Whitey-AMG]

Originally Posted by BLUEPRINT

So the ESS gives it a full manual over-ride? or a partial like the std auto boxes?

It gives you a degree of manual control but the box can still sometimes disobey your command if it thinks it will hurt itself by changing too high a gear to a low gear at the wrong speeds.............although in saying that the FPV ZF 6 speed auto is damned close to obeying your every command in full manual mode. But it is calibrated differently and also has extra clutch packs to handle more abuse.

[InfernoSR]

Originally Posted by ESP

It gives you a degree of manual control but the box can still sometimes disobey your command if it thinks it will hurt itself by changing too high a gear to a low gear at the wrong speeds.............although in saying that the FPV ZF 6 speed auto is damned close to obeying your every command in full manual mode. But it is calibrated differently and also has extra clutch packs to handle more abuse.

Thanks, but i cant see me being able to afford a 6sp anytime soon...

So the next question lies with using the ESS with a shift kit... what i wanted is to have an adjustable se so the ESS is more "obeyable" with a firmer setting from the shift kit.

[InfernoSR]

Another question... Can i have both Adaptive shift and ESS at the same time? or just stick with the initial thought of ESS with a custom shift kit?

[CAT600]

Originally Posted by BLUEPRINT

Another question... Can i have both Adaptive shift and ESS at the same time? or just stick with the initial thought of ESS with a custom shift kit?

ESS is a switched program via the console mounted button (next to shifter on AU) The default mode for these T-series IS adaptive shift, but it's a 5 stage program as opposed to the 200 point system used on the ZF.

BTW, ESS stage 1 in the T1's had no safeguards, the T1 TE50 I drove in 1999 would hold first to the limiter, but my T2 TE50 that I bought would upshift at around 5800 when held in "1" in ESS, that was with a ~ 6200 limiter

Daniel

[DJM83]

Originally Posted by ESP

It gives you a degree of manual control but the box can still sometimes disobey your command if it thinks it will hurt itself by changing too high a gear to a low gear at the wrong speeds.............although in saying that the FPV ZF 6 speed auto is damned close to obeying your every command in full manual mode. But it is calibrated differently and also has extra clutch packs to handle more abuse.

Correct the ESS wont change at RPM that is dangerous to engine/driveline must will happily rev to the hardcut

[InfernoSR]

Ah... Cat600... so if i just go for the ESS conversion, i'll have adaptive shift anyway ... now... anyone got any documents and such on how to do it?

[dreadly]

Jump on the T-series forum and have a chat to someone with a ees auto set up.
From what ive heard EES absolutely kicks *** hey ford discontinued it cause when it goes wrong its pretty expensive to fix?
But the idea is essentially a tip tronic style on the steering wheel- either side of the wheel has up and down shifts kinda like a sony ps2 controller up and down directionals/ or a kinda light switch.
If i was buying a T3 id get ees as the windey roads or just round abouts would be fantastic!

[DJM83]

ESS isnt as good as most people make it out to be, on a track it can be quite confusing with the steering wheel location. I barely ever use mine, except when im chasing Peuty over the mountains to somerset :

[V3RSAC3]

Originally Posted by 51RTE

ESS isnt as good as most people make it out to be, on a track it can be quite confusing with the steering wheel location. I barely ever use mine, except when im chasing Peuty over the mountains to somerset :

Here, Here!

I barley use it, only really on high way driving ... but try and over take whilst she is in 5th n she will barely move :( :(

[DJM83]

Originally Posted by V3RSAC3

Here, Here!

I barley use it, only really on high way driving ... but try and over take whilst she is in 5th n she will barely move :( :(

Fairmonts dont have ESS do they?
IMO highway driving is where i use it the least, if im having a punt somewhere on a twisty road i might use it but vary rarely

[BIGJB]

Originally Posted by 51RTE

Fairmonts dont have ESS do they?

This could explain why my box behaves like it does.
I went to drop it back to 2nd the other night and
accidentally went back to 1st doin a lot more speed
than was favourable. What got me was the fact that it
went back into 1st. Thought it would have not allowed
it to go back if it was goin to possibly damage anything.

[V3RSAC3]

Originally Posted by 51RTE

Fairmonts dont have ESS do they?
IMO highway driving is where i use it the least, if im having a punt somewhere on a twisty road i might use it but vary rarely

Hell no, but the TL does? haha

[HLC]

Originally Posted by V3RSAC3

Hell no, but the TL does? haha

yeah but the TL doesnt have a 5th gear either. :togo:

FOUR SPEED AUTOMATIC

[Peuty]

Originally Posted by 51RTE

except when im chasing Peuty over the mountains to somerset :

Hehe and what a chase it was too!

[bodes-sh]

the only problem with normal au boxes it they won't hold 1st electronically, it will drop itself into neutral at about 60km/h, this is because of the solenoid setup in them. apparently all e series 4sp autos will hold 1st, as will ba's obviously. just something to consider...oh btw, it's not as easy as just slapping a control unit together to do it. it does take a lot of configuring

[InfernoSR]

Originally Posted by bodes-sh

the only problem with normal au boxes it they won't hold 1st electronically, it will drop itself into neutral at about 60km/h, this is because of the solenoid setup in them. apparently all e series 4sp autos will hold 1st, as will ba's obviously. just something to consider...oh btw, it's not as easy as just slapping a control unit together to do it. it does take a lot of configuring

I know it takes a bit to setup, hence why i am willing to learn what to do and how to do it.

Interesting point about the AU box though... makes you wonder if a custom shift kit could help hold it...

[superroo]

Originally Posted by BLUEPRINT

Interesting point about the AU box though... makes you wonder if a custom shift kit could help hold it...

The electronic won't hold the box alone. To get them to hold first, you need to change a solenoid and some linkages maybe. Solenoid is a deffinate though.

A long time ago, before you were around, JC played around with this setup, and tried to get a BA shifter working in an AU, on the cheap. Thats when he found the solenoid issue. And at $500 or so for the solenoid, it wasn't the cheap he was looking for.

Cheers

[Fireblade]

I don't understand this AU won't hold first gear, I use my auto like a manual nearly all the time I drive (for the last 5.5 years and the box is still going) and I can hold mine to the limiter in first which now its been tuned is around the 6k mark and about 65 - 70 kph speed mark. So can someone please explain what they mean?

[bodes-sh]

Originally Posted by GR8WITE

I don't understand this AU won't hold first gear, I use my auto like a manual nearly all the time I drive (for the last 5.5 years and the box is still going) and I can hold mine to the limiter in first which now its been tuned is around the 6k mark and about 65 - 70 kph speed mark. So can someone please explain what they mean?

because physically the shifter is holding the solenoid open, the issue was that at about 60km/h the box dropped pressure and then dropped into neutral, before having to upshift yourself to keep going. when it's done electronically, there is no shifter in position to keep the solenoid open, therefore losing pressure.

as for the op, it requires 2 seperate controllers, because, as muzza has discovered in trying to develop the first one, the shifting from the steering wheel has "noise" in the ground circuit, so it doesn't work properly....

you are best off pming him for more info

[CAT600]

I actually found it amazing that Tickford would give you the option to put it into "5" on the move like they do. I would have thought that after 100,000 hard kms of ESS use, that a modded T3 would have killed the lockup clutch in the converter, they are not exactly robust.

Still, it is a nice (read: gimmicky) feature to play with, being able to lock it into 4th with converter lockup and climb moderate grades without annoying kickdowns.

Daniel

[InfernoSR]

Ok... what do i need in order to setup ESS in my AU1 Forte'?

[bodes-sh]

pm muzza and he will set you on the right track