OK, now the Police are losing me

tweeked · 21-02-2011, 05:02 PM

I have always been one of the good guys, obeyed all the laws except for a couple of speeding fines, never had an at fault accident, so why do I feel like a bad guy?

Attended a Dyno day for a charity organisation on Saturday, great day reasonably well organised and all for a good cause. Now during the course of the morning we had a few, armmmmmm i think they are refered to as hoons here in Victoria driving past, see the crowd and decide to try to leave some marks on the road, only 1 actually acheived this. Now from what I saw not one of those cars was actually attending the event. So around mid morning not 1, not two but 3 Police cars with 3-4 officers in each arrives and calls a halt to everything. See they have had some complaints and their increadible police work has led them to believe it must be this event.

Now I dont have an issue with them arriving and stressing that we behave, as we were. I dont have a problem with them stressing that if we misbehave when leaving we will be caught.I dont have a problem with them saying they will be all over the area all day.

What do I have a problem with? They get hold of the Nice Lady who arranges the event and explain to her that she is legally responsible for any issues in the area. How can they hold her responsible even for the actions of people who are not attending the event? Not only that they said they would then come back to the event and defect every car. Seriously, this State is out of control and heading down a path that is scary.

Poor woman was put in a position of cancelling the event and the kids in need missing out, or possibly getting charged due to the actions of people she had no control over. She had the courage to go on.

I should be in the target market for the sort of person who backs the police to the hilt, but because I like cars, I am in a targeted group of likely offenders. As I said, they are losing me.

charles_wif_xf · 21-02-2011, 05:07 PM

The whole system is a shambles tweeked. Your example is but one of many. I shall refrain from unleashing due to the fact that I'll be banned for eleventy billion years should I launch into my tirade lol.

tweeked · 21-02-2011, 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by charles_wif_xf

The whole system is a shambles tweeked. Your example is but one of many. I shall refrain from unleashing due to the fact that I'll be banned for eleventy billion years should I launch into my tirade lol.

Yeah I just had to vent, but somewhere not only the innocent till proven guilty has been lost, but also innocent until you have actually done something is taking a beating.

**GasoLane** · 21-02-2011, 10:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tweeked

Yeah I just had to vent, but somewhere not only the innocent till proven guilty has been lost, but also innocent until you have actually done something is taking a beating.

Read my sig

bigsta · 21-02-2011, 05:25 PM

Actually innocent until proven guilty is an American thing, in Australia we have no "bill of rights" to speak of and the commo labour party are still taking away what freedom we have one law at a time and lining their own pockets at the same time.

The latest thing in NSW is if they suspect someone is a criminal they can take possession of all that persons assets and it is than up to that individual to take the government to court and prove they obtained that property legally through inheritance a job which paid X and led to him affording Y. I have not heard of this new law being abused yet and I do see where is could be applied with some good results but the fact that it is law and and a tool of the NSW police like all tools can be abused especially in the corrupt environment we have here in NSW and i doubt the new liberal will have the ticker to do what kennet did and turn over corrupt deals and sack corrupt people and even those who have just a whiff of dodgeness.

Anyway mate i feel for you ive been there and although most coppers are alright there some real douchebags who just make things worse for everyone.

Keepleft · 21-02-2011, 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigsta

Actually innocent until proven guilty is an American thing, in Australia we have no "bill of rights" to speak of and the commo labour party are still taking away what freedom we have one law at a time and lining their own pockets at the same time.

You are innocent, it is the state that must prove guilt under criminal law. You have a right to know your accuser.

The Magna Carta is still referenced here and the 1688 Bill Of Rights is where we derive "Parliamentary Privilege", it was preambled under a couple of State Constitutions.

Bolshie/Fabian politician "reformers" have over the decades sought to sideline the old inherited freedoms and common law, and in many examples have succeeded.

The old saying; "Freedom is not hereditary" rings true.

Old man was a QC and national court judge, in NSW alone between 1980-1985 he tallied some five thousand items of reformist legislation that effectively made it easier for 'the state' to jail you. Couldn't fathom why people just accepted it all. Apathy.

The latest thing in NSW is if they suspect someone is a criminal they can take possession of all that persons assets and it is than up to that individual to take the government to court and prove they obtained that property legally through inheritance a job which paid X and led to him affording Y. I have not heard of this new law being abused yet and I do see where is could be applied with some good results but the fact that it is law and and a tool of the NSW police like all tools can be abused especially in the corrupt environment we have here in NSW and i doubt the new liberal will have the ticker to do what kennet did and turn over corrupt deals and sack corrupt people and even those who have just a whiff of dodgeness.

Anyway mate i feel for you ive been there and although most coppers are alright there some real douchebags who just make things worse for everyone.[/QUOTE]

XCwillo · 21-02-2011, 05:27 PM

god damn thats just sad.
The police are just bored and the easiest people to take it out on are car enthusiast.
We're the easiest targets, easiest to get angry and easiest to find.

**DJM83** · 21-02-2011, 05:31 PM

Sad world we live in...

dylancox · 21-02-2011, 05:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJM83

Sad world we live in...

Err.. you mean Sad country we live in.

2011G6E · 21-02-2011, 06:06 PM

That sort of thing goes on a lot.

If anyone has an old Street Machine magazine, and has a look at a VHT engine paints advert, they will see a very famous supercharged black HK Monaro coupe. I was in a street machine club back in the late eighties-early nineties, and we went to a show down in Maryborough (QLD). To our surprise, this very Monaro turned up on a trailer to be part of the show at the Woolworths underground carpark. People were gathered everywhere, and a few cops who had been walking around came for a look. They asked a couple of questions about the car, and the guy was getting it ready to come off the trailer. he hopped in and was about to fire it up, and one of the cops said "If you start that car and drive it off the trailer, we'll slap half a dozen defect notices on it".
They had to push it off and push it under the carpark to put it on display.

Police public relations took a big hit that day...

dave289 · 21-02-2011, 07:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dylancox

Err.. you mean Sad country we live in.

No I think he means sad world and australia is now catching up.

Mr Hardware · 21-02-2011, 05:35 PM

You expect cops to give the benefit of the doubt to people with the types of cars that they spend most of their day pulling over?

**buggerlugs** · 21-02-2011, 06:38 PM

Wow, fancy that, another Police bashing thread on here...............

Venomous1 · 21-02-2011, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by buggerlugs

Wow, fancy that, another Police bashing thread on here...............

Huh? bashing really?

Jim Goose · 21-02-2011, 07:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by buggerlugs

Wow, fancy that, another Police bashing thread on here...............

Yea two in two days....

Ben73 · 21-02-2011, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Goose

Yea two in two days....

This is hardly a police bashing thread.

I think the police were too lazy to actually find out who was hooning, so they just went for the easiest route.
i
If police went about the matter the right way, nobody would of had a problem and no "police bashing" would of happened.
But it's not a perfect world and some people are lazy, on a power trip or just nasty. And people should have a right to complain about that.

Basically if some police didn't pick on people unnecessarily people wouldn't complain. The bad ones always stand out and bring it on themselves.

2011G6E · 21-02-2011, 07:37 PM

My nephew is in the dog squad, and even he admits there are guys on power trips, like in any workplace in the world.

bungarra · 21-02-2011, 07:47 PM

Easy way to deal with the system. There is more than 500 car enthusiasts in each state. You only need 500 registered members to create a political party. Every state should have a state based enthusiast political party with multiple nominees ineach electorate. Every member of the states also joins the new federal Motor Vehicle Enthusiast Party. Same again, field multiple candidates in each federal seat for both levels of parliament. You may get some in, none in, but you would get enough votes to make governments realise, car enthusiasts and in genreal motorists are sick of being screwed.

I tried bringing this up years ago with other car enthusiasts and no one was willing apart from myself to have a go. Bit hard to have a political party with clout to relook at road safety and vehicle safety without the support!!

tweeked · 21-02-2011, 08:00 PM

Definately not bashing police. As I said, i dont have any issue with fair policing, all that was needed was for them to make sure that everything was being handled correctly. All of the paperwork was in order for the event, they could have sent 1 car over smiled and said g'day, but they didn't. They could have sat up the end of the street and watched for 15 minutes and realised that we were not burning up the suburb, but they didn't. It isn't too hard treat the public the right way.

Anyway, I got it off my chest, it was more of an observation of the fact that they could have handled the situation a whole lot better. And threatening a good person was just out of line.

Just imagine if they got clearance to throw one of the undercover cars on the dyno, had a laugh with the people and said keep behaving yourself? They would have won fans and ensured everyone got the message. Now get back into the real world Jon!!

FalconXR6 · 21-02-2011, 07:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by buggerlugs

Wow, fancy that, another Police bashing thread on here...............

I would say the complaint was fair, rather than a bashing...

Depends on whether or not your feeling guilty or need to justify your questionable actions as a police officer...

buggo · 21-02-2011, 07:18 PM

I don't think it's bashing, just peoples observstions of what they have witnessed. If it's true, how is it bashing?

I think this issue, like alot of other things, p-platers, car salesmen, for example, is a case of a few bad ones giving a bad rep to all involved.

Smoke Pursuit · 21-02-2011, 07:18 PM

Ohh and i thought they were so tough....

Power trippers..

charles_wif_xf · 21-02-2011, 08:02 PM

Short of a total paradigm shift in the mindset of the populace, nothing will change. The whole system is rotten to the core, the system needs to go the way of the dinosaurs.

Forming a political party whilst on the surface appears like a good idea, is playing within the system. To elicit any form of meaningful change, what ever action taken needs to be outside of the system.

flappist · 21-02-2011, 08:14 PM

I was going to post a warning that the "ve haff vays oft making you OBEY" brigade might spot this from way up there on their high horses and post a "police bashing" comment but I was too late... sorry guys...

Throughout history all oppressive actions have had their apologists but fortunately they are almost always the first ones up against the wall.

After all, no laws are ever WRONG and no group is ever unjustly vilified....

Now I am off to shoot some Aborigines, bash my wife with a stick no thinker than my thumb, drive at 300km/h, cut down some national forest, eat a platypus and drill for oil on the great barrier reef while my Kanaka slave rolls me a cannabis cigarette.

All these things were legal once. Well before there were complaints about unfair and unjust laws.

Lucky our resident apparatchiks were not alive a while ago of all this stuff would STILL be the law and therefore obviously the right thing to do.

bingoTE50 · 21-02-2011, 08:27 PM

TheInterceptor · 21-02-2011, 08:43 PM

Guilty until proven innocent...

Rockape · 21-02-2011, 08:52 PM

I lost all respect for the cops years ago.

FPV8U · 21-02-2011, 09:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tweeked

I have always been one of the good guys, obeyed all the laws except for a couple of speeding fines, never had an at fault accident, so why do I feel like a bad guy?

Attended a Dyno day for a charity organisation on Saturday, great day reasonably well organised and all for a good cause. Now during the course of the morning we had a few, armmmmmm i think they are refered to as hoons here in Victoria driving past, see the crowd and decide to try to leave some marks on the road, only 1 actually acheived this. Now from what I saw not one of those cars was actually attending the event. So around mid morning not 1, not two but 3 Police cars with 3-4 officers in each arrives and calls a halt to everything. See they have had some complaints and their increadible police work has led them to believe it must be this event.

Now I dont have an issue with them arriving and stressing that we behave, as we were. I dont have a problem with them stressing that if we misbehave when leaving we will be caught.I dont have a problem with them saying they will be all over the area all day.

What do I have a problem with? They get hold of the Nice Lady who arranges the event and explain to her that she is legally responsible for any issues in the area. How can they hold her responsible even for the actions of people who are not attending the event? Not only that they said they would then come back to the event and defect every car. Seriously, this State is out of control and heading down a path that is scary.

Poor woman was put in a position of cancelling the event and the kids in need missing out, or possibly getting charged due to the actions of people she had no control over. She had the courage to go on.

I should be in the target market for the sort of person who backs the police to the hilt, but because I like cars, I am in a targeted group of likely offenders. As I said, they are losing me.

Not the first time i have seen or heard of this, much like their great idea at the FPV open day a few years back to list the plates of modified cars for EPA notices..

Bobman · 21-02-2011, 09:14 PM

They lost me when trying to pin a radar reading on my car that came from the last guy he booked.

Challenged in court and it was found that his radar's reading was not from my vehicle.

It's like a lot of things these days. No-one in power or some in public have respect for anything (especially from top down).

Redrum · 21-02-2011, 09:24 PM

"From what you saw" none of those cars were attending the event. They just happened to do burn outs in the street where a dyno event with vehicles was under way. I have passed many a dyno event and many a workshop and the common theme is cars going hard and doing burn outs. For the police to attend someone would have phoned them and that someone would have expected action. From what I have read from one perspective I do not see anything wrong with the action of the police at all. Perhaps the organizer could have alerted local police to the event, kept a good eye on who and who wasn't attending the event and kept police informed if there was any trouble and asked them to patrol past. Then maybe the outcome would have been different. I personally am sick to death of people having a big cry on this forum because police are actually doing their job.