Ford ECOLpi & FG Mark II ?

krzysiek · 15-06-2011, 11:14 AM

Hi guys,

I'm looking to get myself a new car. Being quite young (and this going to be my second car & first brand new car) I guess I can feel a bit impatient at times.

I have seen the figures (of what we know) of the ECOLpi system and needless to say, I AM looking forward to it and hopefully getting an XR6 falcon.

However, I have heard talk of the FG2 or Mark II, and this kind of makes me thing that I should wait for an ECOLpi FG Mark II XR6 before considering the current one (if I am going to get a brand new car I don't want it to lose all that value right away).

Do you think the ECOLpi systems will ship with the new FG Mark II's ? It would only make sense to have them all released together, or maybe my sense is illogical !

Road_Warrior · 15-06-2011, 11:19 AM

July release for EcoLPi, the updated FG (or whatever it will be called) possibly September/October.

Smoke Pursuit · 15-06-2011, 11:21 AM

Yeh it doesnt make much sense does it..

Release new LPG then MK2 it after 3 months... Lol :S

Gobes32 · 15-06-2011, 12:01 PM

Fords main issue is they can't wait another three months to release LPI. The factory needed LPG 12 months ago!!!!!!

Road_Warrior · 15-06-2011, 05:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gobes32

Fords main issue is they can't wait another three months to release LPI. The factory needed LPG 12 months ago!!!!!!

Exactly. A lot is riding on LPi and it can't wait for a facelift.

krzysiek · 15-06-2011, 05:21 PM

Yes, but by people knowing the mkII is around the cirner, it might actually decrease the amoubt of sales they would have otherwise gotten immediately, as i would want to wait for the mkII :(

vztrt · 15-06-2011, 10:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by krzysiek

Yes, but by people knowing the mkII is around the cirner, it might actually decrease the amoubt of sales they would have otherwise gotten immediately, as i would want to wait for the mkII :(

Fleets are the ones that will be most interested.

Besides if FG2 isn't to your liking then the FG model might be a goer.

GASWAGON · 15-06-2011, 11:12 PM

The LPG system itself won't be much different as it's already 'state of the art'.
I can almost garauntee ther will be NO difference or very minimal power and torque wise if any at all... FG2 will be only cosmetic updates..

mik · 16-06-2011, 12:53 AM

i think i`d be waiting for the main release, it not much further down the track.

krzysiek · 16-06-2011, 01:38 AM

Same as me, probably!

michael_ozzie · 16-06-2011, 07:37 AM

I have seen a G6 with the EcoLPi badge already, so they must be raring to go, come July 1.

krzysiek · 16-06-2011, 08:28 AM

Speaking of which, does anyone know what the price difference in the G6 and XR6 is? At least with the current petrol models? I want to buy myself a new one but don't actually know how much the G6 would run me (the XR6 seems to be around $35K).

And also, the main difference in the G6?

Reason is, I want to get a new car possibly sometime soon, but I don't actually know what the differences are other than interior on the G6 meant to be a bit more lux, is that right?

kennyboy · 16-06-2011, 06:07 PM

main diferences seem to be wheels, - xr 245/45 r15, g6 235/50 r17 aoto only on g6, alloy pedal covers on xr, try this link:

http://www.ford.com.au/servlet/Satel...apper&site=FOA

you might have to copy & paste to browser, it should take you to a page on the ford of aust web site where you can compare the diferent models.

Paxton · 16-06-2011, 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kennyboy

main diferences seem to be wheels, - xr 245/45 r15, g6 235/50 r17 aoto only on g6, alloy pedal covers on xr, try this link:

http://www.ford.com.au/servlet/Satel...apper&site=FOA

you might have to copy & paste to browser, it should take you to a page on the ford of aust web site where you can compare the diferent models.

XR has 17 inch rims, not 15. My EF has 15 inch rims.

krzysiek · 16-06-2011, 06:30 PM

Thanks for the link, very helpful. Did not find it previously!

GASWAGON · 16-06-2011, 09:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by krzysiek

Thanks for the link, very helpful. Did not find it previously!

As i recommended to someone else last week... Go buy a currently 'overstocked' FG XR (any colour you like) for a bargain outgoing price and get aftermarket JTG or Orbital LPG system fitted... PLUS you'll get the government rebate back too .... And at the same time help remove some stock from the overflowing lot at Broadmeadows. Win times 3!

krzysiek · 16-06-2011, 10:01 PM

Hi EF_6, not a bad idea but I believe the EcoLPI will be a few thousand more than the petrol is right now (and I think the LPG rebate can still be refunded as well apparently according to dealer) so for a few K more i'd rather get the brand new EcoLPI.

However, on the same note you have mentioned: I Was thinking of possibly getting a FG XR6 ZF auto second hand (good condition) for around 22-23K and then apply the aftermarket LPG to that (and get the rebate) and this would produce a fairly cost effective new car for me. So this is my other option (as I really don't want to buy a brand new XR6 only to fit it with aftermarket LPG when I could have straight LPG straight from the factory).

Do the Orbital or JTG match the performance of the EcoLPI though? If there was an after market system which matched / retained the power/torque figures to a reasonable level (compared to LPI) then that would be great (I dont want to sacrifice power).

Thanks for all of your help!

PoweredByCNG · 16-06-2011, 11:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by krzysiek

Do the Orbital or JTG match the performance of the EcoLPI though? If there was an after market system which matched / retained the power/torque figures to a reasonable level (compared to LPI) then that would be great (I dont want to sacrifice power).

The Orbital system *IS* the system that Ford are using for the EcoLPi Falcon. The only differences between the aftermarket and OEM systems is the tank placement and capacity, the fact that you retain the existing petrol system (petrol start etc.) and the installation of a dedicated fuel gauge and fuel selection switch.

krzysiek · 17-06-2011, 12:25 AM

PoweredbyCNG, thank you for your post.

In fear of asking the question in the wrong place (I guess if it is in the public everyone who wanted to know the answer gets to see it):

- How much would the Orbital system set me back?
- Since Ford is using the same system, is it silly of me to expect gas to perform just as well on the Orbital system as the Fords factory gas models which are coming out soon? IE - Will I have the same (approx.) power output of 198KW@5000rpm and same amount of torque?

Sorry for the tedious questions. When I bought my XT, it was my first ever car and I bought it because I liked it, and also because it was a bit of an impulse buy. This time around, I want to make the right choice. I know I want an FG XR6, I know I want LPG (will refuse to pay petrol prices, coming from a XT e-Gas I guess that is just how I am going to be) so the real problem for me is, 1) wait for the LPI or 2) buy a more affordable used car and fit it with the same system as ford uses.

To be honest, the "boot space" is not much of an issue for me. I am a P plater, I don't have kids and do not often use the boot. The boot would probably be used up by an amp/sub combo anyway. I would probably care more about the added weight of the extra tank than the boot space. A concern is the performance (as you guys have probably noted).

Also, EF_6, again in fear of asking a silly question, you refer back to the XR6 FG's at Ford. I am about 10 minutes drive away from the Ford plant on Sydney Rd/Hume Highway, so going there is no problem. But from what I have seen on their website, it is something like 33K drive away I believe (and some cash back if I am eligible). This hardly seems like a good deal if I can wait a month or two and for a few extra K get the whole integrated system fitted.

So I guess that I am missing the point you're trying to make, and that I can probably attain a brand new XR6 for cheaper than the price they're being listed for on the main ford website? If so, then I think I would be interested! But otherwise, it doesn't seem to actually be justifiable to save a few K (literally, only a few K is what the savings would be in the end, I think) to buy old stock and manually get the LPG fitted.

Sorry for the long post!

4.0i_SiX · 17-06-2011, 07:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PoweredByCNG

The Orbital system *IS* the system that Ford are using for the EcoLPi Falcon. The only differences between the aftermarket and OEM systems is the tank placement and capacity, the fact that you retain the existing petrol system (petrol start etc.) and the installation of a dedicated fuel gauge and fuel selection switch.

I was under the impression that the dedicated engines will run a higher compression ratio?

PoweredByCNG · 17-06-2011, 07:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4.0i_SiX

I was under the impression that the dedicated engines will run a higher compression ratio?

That's to do with the engine and not the fuel system. The EcoLPi engine was redesigned to take advantage of the higher research octane rating of LPG fuel, however the FG petrol engine also has an adaptive fuel system and will ramp up ignition timing and alter the fuel injection strategy so that on LPG, you will make more power with the Orbital LPI system than the petrol system running 91RON. What is different though is that the petrol engine will produce peak power at 1000rpm higher than the dedicated LPI engine.

GASWAGON · 16-06-2011, 10:39 PM

Mate the numbers are so close it won't matter... Save yourself some dosh and even wait a month for some sellout deals at your local dealer... They got LOTS of petrols sitting in the lot.... Select a colour and go to site sponser (JTG) and ask for nearest fitment shop.... Done deal I'm in a new LPG FG... And saved some dollars too!!!!!!

GASWAGON · 17-06-2011, 12:33 AM

How much money have you got ffs! Your appparently young AND have the cash to buy a NEW car..... You are extreemly lucky....Go buy a discounted FG1 ffs!

krzysiek · 17-06-2011, 01:01 AM

Hmm, not sure if that was more of a joke around or being serious :/ Hope I did not come across in a rude/disrespectful way!

I am young but I don't think I'd call myself 'lucky'. None of my money has been inherited or whatever from parents. Since around 15 I don't think I've ever relied on my parents to pay anything for me and have been working to earn money. By work I mean non-conventional means of work (selling items on eBay, etc) and not an hourly job. I have been able to buy most of my stuff (car, orthodontic treatment, etc etc) from this and have saved up a fair bit (through a lot of hard work with many many hours spent) so it's not really lucky!

I feel like I should treat myself as I (opinion only) believe that I owe it to myself to get treated for the work I've been doing! At the same time, I don't think I should be *wasting* money if there is some better, cheaper alternative

When you say buy a discounted FG1, do you mean at the normal price as on the Ford site?

Bobman · 17-06-2011, 03:59 AM

Tell us your secrets, you've done well!

As for LPI. If I was you, I'd probably wait and get an EcoLPi G6 as they have nicer seats (in my opinion) and no spoiler either. They look classier too (again my opinion).

If you got an FG and then put it on gas, you'd still have to run it on petrol sometimes and have some fuel in the tank at all times. That's the part I hate about dual fuels.

prydey · 17-06-2011, 05:02 AM

i don't think you'll get much change from $40k for a fg xr6 lpg (ecolpi) drive away.

Joe5619 · 17-06-2011, 08:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

i don't think you'll get much change from $40k for a fg xr6 lpg (ecolpi) drive away.

If they price this at 40K drive away to the private sector, it will be a MASSIVE fail..

Smoke Pursuit · 17-06-2011, 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe5619

If they price this at 40K drive away to the private sector, it will be a MASSIVE fail..

Well a standard xr6 retail books up at at about 42 kay???

Joe5619 · 17-06-2011, 12:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DASH GT

Well a standard xr6 retail books up at at about 42 kay???

Who in there right mind would pay 42K for an XR6??

prydey · 17-06-2011, 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe5619

If they price this at 40K drive away to the private sector, it will be a MASSIVE fail..

currently pre april xr6's are at 35k drive away. i assume if you want a post april build, you would pay more than 35k. i'm also assuming the ecolpi option will attract another couple grand premium. that'd put it close to 37k.

just my view. they may price it the same, but i doubt it. do new cars still get the govt rebate for lpg?