Exporting the falcon

[babyf6]

Do you think the falcon would live past 2016 if it were exported. I personally think it should replace the oversized taurus in the U.S. as it would give them a taste of aussie manufacturing from the blue oval

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by babyf6

Do you think the falcon would live past 2016 if it were exported. I personally think it should replace the oversized taurus in the U.S. as it would give them a taste of aussie manufacturing from the blue oval

Its not made in the USA so its automatically crap and off the list.

Plus I don't think we'd be exporting with the way our dollar is.

[Moby Vic]

Originally Posted by Big Damo

Its not made in the USA so its automatically crap and off the list.

Plus I don't think we'd be exporting with the way our dollar is.

I'd love to see it in the US! Police would, too.

Americans have no aversion to imports—since the '80s they've been more sour on US-built cars. The average American is proud to buy anything but a US-built car. I've never understood it.

I bet there'd be a niche market for a ute here as well.

I think the Falcon would probably cost too much here, though. The Monaro-based Pontiac GTO and Commodore-based Pontiac G8 didn't sell very well here.

[aussie muscle]

Originally Posted by Moby Vic

I'd love to see it in the US! Police would, too.

i thought the police said it'd be too small? that's why instead of the commodore, they imported the Caprice LWB for police duties.

Originally Posted by Big Damo

Its not made in the USA so its automatically crap and off the list.

Exactly

Originally Posted by meatbag

It's not just the aussie dollaer that makes it unviable, it's the cost of our workforce.

You obviously didn't read the thread on here which showed the hourly rate of workers around the world, with Canada on top and Australia near the bottom of the 'First World'.

[Gobes32]

Originally Posted by aussie muscle

You obviously didn't read the thread on here which showed the hourly rate of workers around the world, with Canada on top and Australia near the bottom of the 'First World'.

You don't happen to remember what thread that was in by chance? Sick of the wages debate. A Ford worker is paid the same as any other bloody factory worker. In fact, for three years they had a pay freeze to keep Ford going. So when people say that Ford should close down because of high wages, you are wrong, it's because they keep building a car (Falcon) the market is pointedly telling them it doesn't want.............

I am sure if Ranger was built here in the 100,000 range like they are expected to sell worldwide, the wages wouldn't even be a issue because they would be producing a highly profitable car in high numbers.

[FPV GTHO]

Nobody says the workers get paid a lot for the country. The argument has been they get paid a lot for the automotive sector, particularly within the Asia-Pacific region.

[FalconXV]

If they were smart, they'd adopt a similar strategy to GM and import it as a niche product. Would be just the thing to re-invigorate Lincoln. Rather than just spend $1bn on re-skinning Fords...Not as thorough as Cadillac, let alone Germans, or even Infiniti, Lexus...
If Lincoln is a premium product, then the strength of currency shouldn't determine its success. Pontiac G8 was killed by GFC, not product or relative currencies. I would have thought One Ford would have meant the prejudice of 'Not made here' is left behind...apparently not when it comes to ours.

Despite all that, I am satisfied with Falcon's future after the recent announcement ( to 2016) . Couldn't ask for much more, and anyone still milking doom and gloom from that is clutching at straws, and being unrealistic.

[falconnut]

Why not export it to RHD countries?

[2011G6E]

Originally Posted by falconnut

Why not export it to RHD countries?

Not enough of them...but then again, all the other countries that are LHD have no problem with people being allowed to drive cars with the steering wheel on the wrong side, unlike the abject terror the authorities here have with the idea of letting people have access to new LHD cars and freely driving them on our otherwise RHD roads...

If the Falcon was to be sold in the USA, it would have to seriously upgrade it's standard equipment...I have some brochures from a Ford dealership over there and the standard equipment in even the lower models is amazing...the Yanks are used to big bang for a small number of bucks...so what if the car only lasts three or four years before starting to fall apart?

[CFOUR]

we export them to new Zealand already.

[meatbag]

It's not just the aussie dollaer that makes it unviable, it's the cost of our workforce.

What we call minimum wage, americans struggle to earn working 3 jobs. Car builders earn around $8 an hour in the US. try paying an aussie that and see how far you get. Hell, try paying a dish pig at mcdonalds that much and see how many applicants you get.

Same with the rest of the world. We simply aren't in the position to be exporting.

[Moby Vic]

Originally Posted by meatbag

Car builders earn around $8 an hour in the US. try paying an aussie that and see how far you get.

Uh, that's nowhere near correct, especially for union workers.

From http://www.autoobserver.com/2011/08/...act-talks.html

The groundbreaking two-tier wage structure agreed to in the 2007 UAW-Detroit Three contract has been the subject of endless discussion, but few organized-labor experts expect whatever accord comes this year to backtrack on that historic point. Newly-hired UAW workers are paid about $15-17 per hour, while more seasoned workers make about $28 per hour or more before benefits, but there are specific and complex limitations on the ratio of new, lowered-paid workers each automaker’s assembly plants can employ – and currently, only a small portion of the UAW’s rank and file are paid at the lower wage level. Nonetheless, hourly labor costs in 2010 were $20 to $29 lower than in 2006, said Kristin Dzicezek, CAR’s labor and industry group director, a substantial figure that still could not keep GM and Chrysler from bankruptcy court in 2009.

In a presentation at the CAR conference, Dzicezek’s figures indicate 2010 labor compensation at Ford to be highest of the Detroit Three, at a total of $58 per hour; GM paid UAW workers an average of $56 per hour and Chrysler paid $49 per hour. Dzicezek said about 37 percent of the difference between Ford’s average hourly wage and Chrysler’s was attributable to the number of newer workers paid the entry-level wage under the two-tier system and 27 percent of the difference was due to the rate of pay itself.

The workers mentioned in the last paragraph quoted make better money than I do, and I have two bachelor's degrees!

[CFOUR]

The hardest I've ever worked was for $5.50p/h. 8 years later I get paid 1000% of my first job. My dad likes to mention that 40 years after he started working he was getting more per hour than he earned per month as a apprentice mechanic.

[babyf6]

obviously there are a few problems with exporting the falcon. would it be better if they made a diesel version of the falcon to make it past 2016

[Unco]

Originally Posted by babyf6

obviously there are a few problems with exporting the falcon. would it be better if they made a diesel version of the falcon to make it past 2016

Sure, however, the main hurdle is:

Point 1: AUD $1.00 buys USD $1.06 today

This trend doesn't look like it's going to change any time soon.

No matter what bright ideas are thrown at the local falcon, you need to go back to point 1.

[jpd80]

While Taurus will probably become an out crop developemt off the CD4 Fusion,
I have a hunch that evolving E8 is going to work out cheaper for Ford Australia...


Let's not forget the reason why Ford reversed the decision on I-6 cancellation.
Importing the V6 made sense when the Aussie dollar was 70 cents US but at parity, the I-6 wins..

[FalconXV]

A 2.0 on LPG would serve as a great taxi replacement to Toyota Comfort and Nissan whatever you call it in Japan, south east Asia. More modern than those dinosaurs and should be trialled, like the AU taxis were in HK at the start of last decade.
If not made here, protectionism is such a problem, what about CKD's?

Also other things, Thailand like their utes, an RTV style FG could enjoy mild success, its an encouraging sign to see that photo of the Territory there, but some fresh thinking could revive the prospects of exporting. Thats one thing Holden has certainly capitalised on for a long time now, and more credit to them.

G6E with Ecoboost and that diesel would serve as a highly successful flagship in the UK, mainland Europe. A budget 5-series from the convict land.
Only prohibitive factor there is lack of voice control, etc ( shouldn't be too hard to tack these on, like they have with Mondeo...) If they are gonig to remain conservative and not investigate options like this, then yes our car industry is doomed by 2020. If you always do what you've always done~...

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by FalconXV

A 2.0 on LPG would serve as a great taxi replacement to Toyota Comfort and Nissan whatever you call it in Japan, south east Asia. More modern than those dinosaurs and should be trialled, like the AU taxis were in HK at the start of last decade.
If not made here, protectionism is such a problem, what about CKD's?

G6E with Ecoboost and that diesel would serve as a highly successful flagship in the UK, mainland Europe. A budget 5-series from the convict land.
Only prohibitive factor there is lack of voice control, etc ( shouldn't be too hard to tack these on, like they have with Mondeo...) If they are gonig to remain conservative and not investigate options like this, then yes our car industry is doomed by 2020. If you always do what you've always done~...

I'm afraid that exchange rates would kill the proposed cars. In the UK, Focus Titanium sells for approximately AUS$35,000 on the road,
I think our G6E with Ecoboost and V6 diesel would have a tough time justifying a near £40,000, that's genuine luxury car pricing.

Falcon exports have been looked at no fewer than three times in the last decade, each time the figures come back saying no.
Best chance is exports to nearby RHD markets in FAPA region, Territory and Ecoboost Falcon might pick up some volume...

[Moby Vic]

It'd be nice if they'd just build a left-hand-drive version of the Falcon in the US. With Ford divesting from Mazda, the Romeo plant that builds the Mustang may no longer build the Mazda6. If they merged the Mustang and Falcon chassis (certain symmetry in that) in a few years, they could keep building in Australia and start building in the US.

But unfortunately I don't think Ford North America Operations is keen on rear-wheel drive anymore.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by Moby Vic

It'd be nice if they'd just build a left-hand-drive version of the Falcon in the US. With Ford divesting from Mazda, the Romeo plant that builds the Mustang may no longer build the Mazda6. If they merged the Mustang and Falcon chassis (certain symmetry in that) in a few years, they could keep building in Australia and start building in the US.

But unfortunately I don't think Ford North America Operations is keen on rear-wheel drive anymore.

I think you're talking about the AAI Flat Rock plant, Ford has already announce that
Fusion and MKZ will be built there in the near future as the Mexican plant has been running flat out for a while.

Ford NA will not be building a LHD Falcon in the foreseeable future, it's considered duplicate product
and would probably take sales away for either their Fusion or Taurus...

[aussie muscle]

Originally Posted by Moby Vic

But unfortunately I don't think Ford North America Operations is keen on rear-wheel drive anymore.

i'm sure there's a few enthusiasts that would prefer rwd. I wonder if there's any grey market imports stateside?


i dont' think the falcon is a duplicate of the taurus, it's small enough to fit between taurus and mondeo.

[krypto71]

Originally Posted by aussie muscle

i'm sure there's a few enthusiasts that would prefer rwd. I wonder if there's any grey market imports stateside?


i dont' think the falcon is a duplicate of the taurus, it's small enough to fit between taurus and mondeo.

As a Falcon owner, who recently spent a bit of time driving a 2011 Taurus in the states, the Taurus felt very similar to drive. I don't see any place for Falcon to sell alongside Taurus, it would be one or the other IMO. btw, I love my Falcon, but came away from the states taking notice of how nice the taurus is.

Cheers
Steve

[Moby Vic]

Yeah, I am. Damn Guinness! I've actually been in the parking lot there.

Oh, I know they won't be building a Falcon here anytime soon. But I can dream.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by Moby Vic

Yeah, I am. Damn Guinness! I've actually been in the parking lot there.

Oh, I know they won't be building a Falcon here anytime soon. But I can dream.

Sure can,
Imagining: RWD master plan involving Mustang, Falcon and Territory... maybe Thunderbird and next Edge...mmmmmm

[2011G6E]

The basic problem isn't the car itself, (or even that it's RHD, a steering wheel on "the wrong side" isn't a problem anywhere but here in Oz) it's pricing and equipment.

Yes, the dollar doesn't help, but our G6E in the driveway had a retail cost of $54,000 with the extras (of course no one pays the "list price" they first quote you), and even disregarding the costs of exporting it, as good a car as the G6E is, you would be laughed at in England or the USA if you plonked it down there at that cost. As I said, Yanks in particular are used to high levels of equipment for a very cheap price, and in Europe you have the fact that at that price, there would be plenty of quality vehicles like BMW and Mercedes priced below it.

If you tried to send them a basic Falcon, then people would demand better anyway and the price would have to rise.

[Buntz]

Originally Posted by jpd80

Sure can,
Imagining: RWD master plan involving Mustang, Falcon and Territory... maybe Thunderbird and next Edge...mmmmmm

Falcon, Mustang, Territory, Edge, Lincoln Saloon, Lincoln Coupe, Lincoln SUV. That's seven vehicles right there from one platform

[z80]

$54000 buys you a fantastic car in the US.

Here are some Ford prices.

http://www.airportmarinaford.com/

Somehow me thinks there is no chance of selling a Falcon in the US.

Not even the basest model that FA could conjure up.

[Buntz]

Originally Posted by z80

$54000 buys you a fantastic car in the US.

Here are some Ford prices.

http://www.airportmarinaford.com/

Somehow me thinks there is no chance of selling a Falcon in the US.

Not even the basest model that FA could conjure up.

$54k in the states gets you one Shelby GT500 and heaps of enormous trucks and cavernous SUV's you could walk around in and make a cup of tea.

You don't however get a performance luxury saloon from Ford. Now with 8" colour touch screen and optional satnav.

[z80]

Originally Posted by Buntz93ED

$54k in the states gets you one Shelby GT500 and heaps of enormous trucks and cavernous SUV's you could walk around in and make a cup of tea.

You don't however get a performance luxury saloon from Ford. Now with 8" colour touch screen and optional satnav.

Hmmm..$54k for a new Ford or $50k for a new E-class Mercedes?

How long would you need to decide?

http://www.mbzla.com/showroom/2012/M...lass/Sedan.htm

Like I said cars are pretty cheap in the US, an aussie built export would stand no chance whatsoever of competing, simply because a $54k Falcon would weigh in at about $57k with today's exchange rate.

So this is probably a more direct comparison?
http://www.mbzla.com/new/Mercedes-Be...0e358f1f1d.htm


Above car is available in wagon form and is rear wheel drive 7 speed auto.

We definitely pay way too much in Australia.

[Luke Plaizier]

I wonder what the wages are in German and British plans?

India is a huge RHD market.


Lukeyson