No Dyno Sheet after dyno tune?

[ILLaViTaR]

Hey guys just got my car dyno tuned (lpg tuned in this too) at the local place (good reputation) and my father picked the car up earlier today but the bloke only gave him a receipt and no dyno chart (i asked for the chart beforehand). My main concern is whether my dyno run was recorded and can be printed off at a later date like he says or if it needed to be done when the car was on the dyno. He said the printer had no ink so hopefully should be sorted out over the next few days I'm just a tiny bit concerned.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated!

[b0son]

Get him to email it, pretty trivial to print to a PDF

[superfly]

Tuners will always save the chart.

[Legit290]

Like they said.
My tuner mailed it to me later

[2011G6E]

Although, usually unless you specifically ask for it, they usually don't bother handing them out...or even printing them out for that matter. 90% of people getting a "dyno tune" won't want, or understand, the chart anyway so why bother? They just want their car "dyno tuned", and that's that.

However, if you're dealing with a place that is heavily into engine modifications, and most of the clientele are performance oriented people, then they'll whip the chart out and show it to you straight away.

Different shops, different ways of doing things depending on the clients they usually get.

[fanboi]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

Although, usually unless you specifically ask for it, they usually don't bother handing them out...or even printing them out for that matter. 90% of people getting a "dyno tune" won't want, or understand, the chart anyway so why bother? They just want their car "dyno tuned", and that's that.

However, if you're dealing with a place that is heavily into engine modifications, and most of the clientele are performance oriented people, then they'll whip the chart out and show it to you straight away.

Different shops, different ways of doing things depending on the clients they usually get.

I have never had a car tuned and not recieved a print out

[zilo]

You need a before and after, not just the final dyno sheet.

Else how do you know it's tuned?

[ILLaViTaR]

cheers guys that's a relief haha I'll ask him to email them out tomorrow he said it was only putting out around 80rwkw so I'm keen to see them.

I just took it for a test drive and the lpg tuning is waaaay out to the point of stalling and spluttering, jerking back and forth, not sure what the go is here exactly but I'll know more tomorrow. I've pinpointed the car's leans out with the accelerator BARELY depressed while under load (ie. assuming 800rpm idle, accelerating at 900RPM up a hill and it will just choke out), it's the exact same feeling a car gets when the fuel pumps dying and I definitely don't want to lean out the motor I've recently half rebuilt! I figured all the afr ratios would come up on the dyno avoiding such an issue but I'll know more tomorrow hopefully!

[2011G6E]

You just got it dyno tuned and it's running like that...?

I thought the idea of dyno tuning was to be able to run the car and set everything up to run the most efficiently while being able to have it sit there were you can adjust things "on the run" as it were? I thought they would have caught all that bad running behaviour...

[ILLaViTaR]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

You just got it dyno tuned and it's running like that...?

I thought the idea of dyno tuning was to be able to run the car and set everything up to run the most efficiently while being able to have it sit there were you can adjust things "on the run" as it were? I thought they would have caught all that bad running behaviour...

That's what I thought, it's like missing an elephant under a microscope haha or a better analogy. The dyno shows AFR's, vacuum pressure and a million other things to gauge off. Frankly I don't see how my car can come back in this state unless it's been tuned by ear.

I paid $220 and requested the sheets beforehand, I originally called for a $120 lambda tune (omvl r90e so dyno unnecessary) and was convinced to go with the dyno as I was told it would be far more comprehensive and will give the perfect result.. and even then still couldn't really justify the extra $100 but went ahead anyway out of curiosity to see what power the car is currently putting out before I fit my 977B cam. Reason aside I was told the car would be tuned pedantically, and cutting corners wasn't even in the equation. I didn't think it was even a possibility to get the car back in such a crude state as the dyno would've had to of indefinitely shown this, hence all the confusion.

I called the shop today and he was very surprised to hear how it was running (something must've happened somehow) and told me to bring it back to take a look I'll know more tomorrow if I have time to take it in.. The dyno results were meant to be emailed to me today but that didn't happen hopefully I'll get to see them tomorrow, for tonight I still remain in confusion. I'm hoping the sheets can shed some light as to how it's even possible for this to happen. Would they show if any corners were cut?

The shop speaks for itself you walk in and you can see the professionalism, the staff are excellent and very happy to help, my outcome seems baffling if anything I'm more frustrated about having to drive my half rebuilt motor back there while leaning out because of this, in the shops defense I brought it in on a day they were fully booked and busy so that must've had an impact but that still frustrates me as I stressed I wanted the picture perfect tune (I even went as far as writing some helpful notes and showed how much pride i have in the car to obtain this perfect tune and handed them too him when I dropped the car off). There's no excuse for it to come back like this, if it's something faulty/broken it should've shown up, if it's something out of tune it should've shown up. I'm confident once they see how bad it is they'll attend to it immediately. It'll then hopefully be very clear on both ends this is not what I paid for. Even the best make mistakes, the real mistake is failing to correct the mistake!

[ratter]

the problem is some shops will offer to do things very cheap, so corners have to be cut, it shouldn't be this way but is happens all the time whether trying to undercut another quoted price or because that's all the customer wants to pay for, they may have just done some WOT tuning but it should really have been discussed with the shop before posting on forums

[Alan D Segal]

Originally Posted by ratter

but it should really have been discussed with the shop before posting on forums

Yes, I'm sure they would've said "For that price we'll dyno your car, won't print you out a dyno chart because our printer is out of ink, and it will run like a dog on part-throttle" and the OP would've still gone ahead with it.

Not having a go at you personally, but I read regularly of people whinging about workshops and 'is this normal' questions on here, communication is a two-way thing and the workshops need to participate in it too - openly and honestly.

EDIT: kable posted a reasonable example of this as well before I finished typing.

[ratter]

Originally Posted by Alan D Segal

Yes, I'm sure they would've said "For that price we'll dyno your car, won't print you out a dyno chart because our printer is out of ink, and it will run like a dog on part-throttle" and the OP would've still gone ahead with it.

you would think so, but it doesn't happen like that at all in some places or some trades, the dyno printer may have run out of ink on the previous car, who knows what really went on

[Kable72]

Originally Posted by ratter

you would think so, but it doesn't happen like that at all in some places or some trades, the dyno printer may have run out of ink on the previous car, who knows what really went on

Dunno about those places but the place I work at keeps spare printer cartridges in the cupboard just in case.

Not having a go at you just there are places out there that don't care once they have their money. After sales service is needed everywhere.

[Kable72]

When I got mine tuned, no one came out and explained what was done, what the chart means, what gains I got etc.

Was pretty much, here is the chart, swipe your card here's your receipt gtfo my shop

[Kable72]

Would anyone like to read my graph and tell me what it means? Lol, more specifically the numbers in this little grid thing?

[Alan D Segal]

What does 'dyno' mean? I just brought my car in because all my mates had been here.

[Kable72]

Originally Posted by Alan D Segal

What does 'dyno' mean?

What's a chart?

[cs123]

Originally Posted by Alan D Segal

What does 'dyno' mean? I just brought my car in because all my mates had been here.

Dynamometer but I suspect I am missing something in your question.

[Kable72]

Originally Posted by cs123

Dynamometer but I suspect I am missing something in your question.

Yep you're missing the sarcasm

Don't worry, Sarcasm is hard to read on the internet.

[Alan D Segal]

Originally Posted by Kable72

Yep you're missing the sarcasm

Correcto-mundo Anyway, I'll leave well enough alone now. Enough sillyness out of me for the day. But my comment about communication with workshops still stands.

Cheers.

[FPV GTHO]

Originally Posted by Kable72

Would anyone like to read my graph and tell me what it means? Lol, more specifically the numbers in this little grid thing?

http://fordforums.com.au/showpost.ph...ostcount=14434
From what i can tell the numbers in the box on your graph are:

BP - Barometric pressure
RH - Relative humidity?
AT - Ambient temperature
IT - Intake temperature
RR - Ramp rate

not sure what the next 3 are

CF - not sure but theyve set shootout 6 which is related to the ramp rate i think

Tyre press and gear are self explanatory.

I cant explain what all the numbers themselves mean, other than its all put into the computer to either load up the dyno differently or used to calculate power. Somebody experienced on a dyno could help you out on explaining the numbers. One thing i have been told is you can trick the dyno running higher pressure. They've entered 50psi on yours which i doubt is what you were running. The last dyno run i did was the same and i only had 34psi on the tyres.

[ratter]

I keep spares ones as well, but as I said, different business operate differently and some only care about the money, customer satisfaction does not even rate on their radars

[Kable72]

Originally Posted by ratter

I keep spares ones as well, but as I said, different business operate differently and some only care about the money, customer satisfaction does not even rate on their radars

I know what you mean there.

[ratter]

tyre pressure does not trick the dyno reading at all, tyre pressures are normally increased to stop tyre deformation and help stop overheating the tyre, we usually use 40 psi in all case to remain consistent, the operator may do the same but chose to use 50 psi

[FPV GTHO]

I was told that by somebody who managed to do it, they increased the psi and the power went up

[ratter]

power can be down on a tyre that is too soft due to deformation if it is strapped too tight, but it can overheat and then give incorrect readings

[Alan D Segal]

Originally Posted by ratter

power can be down on a tyre that is too soft due to deformation if it is strapped too tight, but it can overheat and then give incorrect readings

Would a tyre with 50psi be less likely to deform and overheat than a tyre with 40psi in it, if they were both strapped in the same way? Would it be more likely to achieve a higher power reading under these conditions? Why did you choose exactly 40psi as your 'benchmark' tyre pressure? Are strap tensions measured and reported, or consistent across dynos?

Just interested in this discussion in general EDIT: because valuable contributors like you are raising interesting points /EDIT. Don't feel like I'm targeting you specifically for answers, I'd be interested in hearing from any workshop/dyno operator on this. These dyno threads really are interesting, since so many people put so much stock into dyno sheets and what they say. It seems to be a forum mainstay for some people to cry 'happy dyno' and so I'm just interested in how operators work to achieve uniformity and comparability in dyno readings. Thanks again.

[noosacuda]

Last place i had my car on a dyno don't even strap 'em down. Scary seeing tyre smoke on the rollers!

[ratter]

I was told 40 psi when I purchased my dyno and was trained so use that every car to remain as consistent as possible. 40 to 50 psi possibly would not show a difference in power at all but 50 may be too much for some tyres, the info on the sidewall should clarify that, running them too low can cause the tyre to deform as it get pushed into the roller and the flex may create too much heat, many tyres loose their performance when they get too hot. There is no magic number, but the main thing is the same operator retest the same way every time.

Strapping methods can vary quite a bit also, I have found that too loose a strap actually loses power on the strapping set up on my dyno, but can see on some dynos that pull the car backwards away from the front roller, how power can vary with how tight the straps are applied.

But I think we are getting off topic a little now from the op's original questions