Materialism? Consumerism?

[bindi]

Hi all,

I don't know what it is with me tonight... feeling a little tired perhaps.

But I just saw a movie called In Good Company with Dennis Quaid and Topher Grace. And also today I finished the book "Affluence". Both were really great, both spoke volumes about our society today.

I am feeling jaded by the world of materialism. Does it really matter what you own or how much money you make or how your BA is better than the neighbour's Excel? Is anyone here like me, and thinking there is more to life?

Are we a slave to our possessions? Why is it that when we get that renovated kitchen/surround sound system/latest mobile phone etc, we're happy for a little while... but then want something bigger and better? Are we listening when being told by advertisers that to feel better we should buy something else? Or take this prescribed medication that the drug companies have paid your doctor to endorse?

What does it mean to have a Porsche and all the money you could need, but nobody who gives a rats about whether you live or die, in your life?

Don't we all realise that we are one living unit, everyone on this planet is connected, and what we do to ourselves, we do to another?

Gee I am a hippie... : :

[iCat]

Well said Bindi. I second all of the above. In the big scheme of things, do material assets really mean anything? I'd rather have those I love around me than the latest and greatest of goods.

9/11 and Hurricane Katrina are massive wake up calls .....

[b2tf]

Interesting, but yes you are a hippie. Not sure how this will go being posted on a Ford site either :P.

Along similar lines, I was thinking about this whole New Orleans thing - it really does highlight the divide between the rich and (predominately black) poor over there. It's amazing to think that in a place like that, especially in modern, 21st century America, there can still exist such a divide, even if it is only evident in situations like these.

Personally I feel that the way of the world dictates that there will always be an imbalance - communism was one of those stupid attempts to change it but the way it was orchestrated (and the people who tried to do it) meant that it was doomed to fail from. But regardless of how much aid goes in etc etc, there will always be the nations and demographics who are excessively poor compared to others. Its something that will never change, it may get better but not by much.

I dont think we're so much a slave to our posessions - I think we do enjoy our creature comforts and our top of the line models etc etc more now though because they do exist. But the reason they do exist is because there is the deamnd and the drive to create them.

[parawolf]

Yeah - you're a hippy py:

Nah look i've grown up being competitive to my sister (who's older) and striving to make my parents as proud as possible. And I want to do that as well as possible. That includes all this sort of 'self promoting' and 'self gratifing' work which is easy for others to quantify. However I donate monthly amounts (straight out of my salary) to various charities and organisations that I personally believe in.

Things like salvo's, very special kids, and my favourite, Lort Smith Animal Hospital. I also regularly donate blood (i'm O negative, universial donor, individual receiver), I find this is important as if I _EVER_ needed blood I need O Neg - figure if only 8% or so of the population is O neg, and only 2% donate, i'm helping out.

I do these things to help others that might not be as well off as others.

[M14A-Mclaren]

Lol @ Hippie calls! I have to agree

[NAK302]

Originally Posted by bindi

What does it mean to have a Porsche and all the money you could need, but nobody who gives a rats about whether you live or die, in your life?

to me, this would mean you have been successful in what ever field you have chosen. the people who don't give a rats whether you live or die were not an important part of your life in the first place.
the important ones are the people who are proud of what you have achieved no matter how small this achievement may be.

[gtfpv]

Originally Posted by bindi

Hi all,

I don't know what it is with me tonight... feeling a little tired perhaps.

But I just saw a movie called In Good Company with Dennis Quaid and Topher Grace. And also today I finished the book "Affluence". Both were really great, both spoke volumes about our society today.

I am feeling jaded by the world of materialism. Does it really matter what you own or how much money you make or how your BA is better than the neighbour's Excel? Is anyone here like me, and thinking there is more to life?

Are we a slave to our possessions? Why is it that when we get that renovated kitchen/surround sound system/latest mobile phone etc, we're happy for a little while... but then want something bigger and better? Are we listening when being told by advertisers that to feel better we should buy something else? Or take this prescribed medication that the drug companies have paid your doctor to endorse?

What does it mean to have a Porsche and all the money you could need, but nobody who gives a rats about whether you live or die, in your life?

Don't we all realise that we are one living unit, everyone on this planet is connected, and what we do to ourselves, we do to another?

Gee I am a hippie... : :

bindi we all have a spot that is void that we are trying to fill . AND YOU'VE JUST MADE MINE A LITTLE BIGGER . NOW WHERE ARE THOSE DAMN PILLS THAT THE COMPANIES PAY DOCTORS TO PRESCRIBE (the ones that make you feel better) after reading this thread i NEED SOME :(

[The MaDDeSTMaN]

Originally Posted by bindi

Hi all,

I don't know what it is with me tonight... feeling a little tired perhaps.

But I just saw a movie called In Good Company with Dennis Quaid and Topher Grace. And also today I finished the book "Affluence". Both were really great, both spoke volumes about our society today.

I am feeling jaded by the world of materialism. Does it really matter what you own or how much money you make or how your BA is better than the neighbour's Excel? Is anyone here like me, and thinking there is more to life?

...

What does it mean to have a Porsche and all the money you could need, but nobody who gives a rats about whether you live or die, in your life?

Don't worry, it's not just you

As long as we've got a roof over our head, food in our stomach and we're healthy, everything else is just icing on the cake really, yet it's so easy to lose sight of that fact I think.

My 2c worth, GST included

[RED_EL_XR8]

All those the want to go back to the tree's form an orderly queue and head out quietly.

The rest of us will keep working hard to achieve safety and security for ourselves and our families.
I've worked hard for the things I have and see both the possessions and the conquests as achievements. The most worthless things in life are those that are received without work to achieve them.

Hippies, meh, move to Mimben, after all its government sponsored. Help save the earth with the countries largest per capita usage of petrol generators!

Just another opinion.

[Racecraft]

Originally Posted by RED_EL_XR8

Hippies, meh, move to Mimben, after all its government sponsored.

Hahaha Red it is actually Nimbin and as odd as it may sound, Nimbin and Byron Bay are the new Noosa and NorthCoast Hinterland of Australia.. Property values are sending the hippies inland away from the beautiful coastline

Not that it has squat to do with the thread, just some worthless trivia I thought I'd post

[Bluehoon]

Todays Life is rather materialistic.

Its not what is on the outside, its what is on the inside. Thats what counts.

If humanity doesn't lose sight of that, we should be ok.

But the way governments behave, it seems we have lost sight of who and what we are.

Governments only care about what makes thier livelihood.

New orleans....
America is too busy fighting on Iraq, to even so much as consider its own people.

Rich are ok, and the not so well off, well die. Very sad modern society, very sad indeed.

[RED_EL_XR8]

Originally Posted by Racecraft

Hahaha Red it is actually Nimbin and as odd as it may sound, Nimbin and Byron Bay are the new Noosa and NorthCoast Hinterland of Australia.. Property values are sending the hippies inland away from the beautiful coastline

Not that it has squat to do with the thread, just some worthless trivia I thought I'd post

Typo - still a waste of perfectly good productive rural land.

[gtfpv]

Originally Posted by The MaDDeSTMaN

Don't worry, it's not just you

As long as we've got a roof over our head, food in our stomach and we're healthy, everything else is just icing on the cake really, yet it's so easy to lose sight of that fact I think.

My 2c worth, GST included

SO TRUE . some of us work 2 jobs 6 days a week for that . and some just get it . and a pension or benifit. which one of these 2 are better off .

[RED_EL_XR8]

I'll take the 2 jobs, and know I've done it on my own. Some have no choice but to take assistance. Those lucky enough to have the choice and then copping out are the truly sad ones.

[One Drone]

Read "The Millionaire next Door". Basically a survey of millionaires (and when I say millionaire I mean people with real net worth/wealth), how they got there and what they believe in.

Would many of you be surprised if I told you that the majority of people that drive flash cars and own big homes aren't millionaires? Why? It depends on your definition of millionaire.. It should be the net sum of ones assets. Those that drive such cars typically were subject to consumerism and the need to "display high wealth", they fell victim to (what pretty much is) free credit and therefore work to pay off their high standards of living.

Society today encourages people to consume, as a result people tend to work to consume and little to no money is left over for investing. Saving usually suffers due to inflation.. I'd rather invest knowing that in the future I will be better off then, than if I had bought a good or service that is a one-off and/or depreciates in value.

bindi: I give you credit for having realised this, but the question is, will you continue what you do daily or will you start to change as a result. Change is always risky, but the gains tends to outweigh the disadvantages.

I would be a fool if I said that money doesn't bring happiness. But the fact is, there are some things that money can't buy (mastercard nailed that one) such as watching your children grow or play sport that (I think) make up some of the happiest times in your life.

[gtfpv]

Originally Posted by One Drone

Read "The Millionaire next Door". Basically a survey of millionaires (and when I say millionaire I mean people with real net worth/wealth), how they got there and what they believe in.

Would many of you be surprised if I told you that the majority of people that drive flash cars and own big homes aren't millionaires? Why? It depends on your definition of millionaire.. It should be the net sum of ones assets. Those that drive such cars typically were subject to consumerism and the need to "display high wealth", they fell victim to (what pretty much is) free credit and therefore work to pay off their high standards of living.

Society today encourages people to consume, as a result people tend to work to consume and little to no money is left over for investing. Saving usually suffers due to inflation.. I'd rather invest knowing that in the future I will be better off then, than if I had bought a good or service that is a one-off and/or depreciates in value.

bindi: I give you credit for having realised this, but the question is, will you continue what you do daily or will you start to change as a result. Change is always risky, but the gains tends to outweigh the disadvantages.

I would be a fool if I said that money doesn't bring happiness. But the fact is, there are some things that money can't buy (mastercard nailed that one) such as watching your children grow or play sport that (I think) make up some of the happiest times in your life.

so true i know some of those millionaires totally consumed with investing and saving . driving HQ holdens waiting till X'BOX games are 12 months old so you can get them for 24.99 and bringing sandwiches to work . and doing everybit of overtime offered. who of these 2 people are better off the one that has wealth . or the one that has a mortgage is paying off a gt and goes on a nice luxury holiday once a year and then comes back and pays the credit card off . seriosly . who is the fool.

[eb_5litre]

Why cant we have both?

[gtfpv]

Originally Posted by eb_5litre

Why cant we have both?

ahhhh . i wish we could . but how many do you know that do . the only ones that have this in my opinion are the true rich. the kerry packers .and the like . these are the only ones that have thier cake and eat it too. but that still does not gaurantee happiness., insome cases this would create boredome .

[DOC]

May as well throw in my 2c worth

Yesterday, 10:18 PM #1
bindi
Does it really matter what you own or how much money you make or how your BA is better than the neighbour's Excel?

No

Why is it that when we get that renovated kitchen/surround sound system/latest mobile phone etc, we're happy for a little while... but then want something bigger and better?

There are in general 2 types of people, 1. the real deal 2. impersonators, people who try to impersonate wealth and success, the second group feel as you have described.

Yesterday, 10:23 PM #2
211
Well said Bindi. I second all of the above. In the big scheme of things, do material assets really mean anything? I'd rather have those I love around me than the latest and greatest of goods.
9/11 and Hurricane Katrina are massive wake up calls .....

You would have to agree with that in general but you cant help the people of these tradegeties with out cash and lots of it. just the way the wourld is, so as you say you would rather have your family than any trappings, probably a little on the trappings side doesnt hurt, even it is just used to help your family out.

Yesterday, 10:26 PM #3
back2thefutura
it really does highlight the divide between the rich and (predominately black) poor over there. It's amazing to think that in a place like that, especially in modern, 21st century America, there can still exist such a divide

? This already exists here and the gap will only continue to widen.

Yesterday, 10:33 PM #4
parawolf
However I donate monthly amounts (straight out of my salary) to various charities and organisations that I personally believe in.

A darn good example of how your success can help out, it is a little known fact that most wealthy people donate a lot of money to hospitals etc to help the community as a whole but they make it public they just quietly do what they can.

Yesterday, 11:02 PM #6
nak351
the important ones are the people who are proud of what you have achieved no matter how small this achievement may be.

Intersting reply, but i would say the most important person is yourself, the things we do and achieve must not be based on what expectations others place on you but the ones we impose on ourselves, if in ourselves we feel confortable in what we achieve , have self confidence etc. it is then we can then pass some of that confidence/ experiaence to others around us.

Yesterday, 11:17 PM #8
The MaDDeSTMaN
As long as we've got a roof over our head, food in our stomach and we're healthy, everything else is just icing on the cake really, yet it's so easy to lose sight of that fact I think.

Yes correct they are the basics, but i challenge you ( anyone ) go out and ice your cake.

Yesterday, 11:51 PM #9
RED_EL_XR8

agree, but would replace the word hard work with smart work

Today, 12:07 AM #13
gtfpv
so true i know some of those millionaires totally consumed with investing and saving . driving HQ holdens waiting till X'BOX games are 12 months old so you can get them for 24.99 and bringing sandwiches to work . and doing everybit of overtime offered

You will find these people have really learnt from way back the true meaning of the value of the dollar ( an early lesson i learnt from my pop, he had xyz$ but drove a second hand old car and never bothered him, i remember back then thinking to myself why not buy a brand new one? i knew he could afford any car he wanted ten times over, but instead he would buy an antique and would pay into the $1000's for the good ones without a problem )

and as other have mentioned allready a percentage of what you earn must be used ( work smart ) to create more income, the long shot of my pop was he owned an old large house with over 30 rooms, all filled to the floor to cielings and cubords full of priceless antiques but he still had his old second hand car which didnt loose any value as such but his investments tripled plus some.

My 2c is almost up but for thise interested read" the richest man in babylon" as a good starting point and as One Drone has said it tough to make changes sometimes but worth it if you wish to ice your cake, allowing you to help your family and others around you.

Pete

[KEV EB XR8]

my 2 bob's worth
social acceptance = the willingness to belong be accepted and change your own personality to suit the betterment of society , pier pressure .how did most of us start smoking = want to be with the big boys they all smoke so must you ?

Do you notice when somebody who has won a large sum of money , with no experience at investing/b commerce usually ends up in debt or losing all of the dough . "quote" ah well didnt have it before , no loss i suppose !

Takes a big hearted person to bring to light this subject bindi in a large viewing area . i know of two people so depressed that they took thier own life , all because of materialism and pier pressure . if this thread helps one person change thier path , you have done well .

[bindi]

Originally Posted by KEV EB XR8

Takes a big hearted person to bring to light this subject bindi in a large viewing area . i know of two people so depressed that they took thier own life , all because of materialism and pier pressure . if this thread helps one person change thier path , you have done well .

Hey thanks mate... I suppose it's cos I am considering doing what's called Downshifting.

We are now almost completely debt free, but the kids and I have been missing dad/hubby as he's been working his ring off. And we've been asking ourselves which is more important, money or being happy? Because even though we had money, we weren't happier by a long shot. Sure, we could buy more things, but deep down we were all quite miserable. We missed laughing with each other, playing games, being stupid, watching Scrubs/Black Books etc and laughing till our sides hurt... basically sharing our lives.

Downshifting means that my hubby and I will find part time work and share the household tasks/raising of kids etc (instead of me doing it all plus try and get my own business happening, while he does nothing but work) and actually have a life. Time to see friends. Time to enjoy life. Sure, we will have to go without the Nikes, the IPods, the PSPs, but we'll be better off without them.

Kids are really being targetted in the materialistic push to have more, consume more, work longer/harder/till they start having chest pains - as if it is a measure of success. Kids in turn nag and harrass their parents into buying them these things, and the parents (who may have gone without in their childhoods) want to give their children everything they never had and give in.

Who the hell determines who is successful by what they OWN? Does anyone else think this is f#$ked up?

Anyway, that's just what I think

[Bluehoon]

Originally Posted by bindi

Hey thanks mate... I suppose it's cos I am considering doing what's called Downshifting.

We are now almost completely debt free, but the kids and I have been missing dad/hubby as he's been working his ring off. And we've been asking ourselves which is more important, money or being happy? Because even though we had money, we weren't happier by a long shot. Sure, we could buy more things, but deep down we were all quite miserable. We missed laughing with each other, playing games, being stupid, watching Scrubs/Black Books etc and laughing till our sides hurt... basically sharing our lives.

Downshifting means that my hubby and I will find part time work and share the household tasks/raising of kids etc (instead of me doing it all plus try and get my own business happening, while he does nothing but work) and actually have a life. Time to see friends. Time to enjoy life. Sure, we will have to go without the Nikes, the IPods, the PSPs, but we'll be better off without them.

Kids are really being targetted in the materialistic push to have more, consume more, work longer/harder/till they start having chest pains - as if it is a measure of success. Kids in turn nag and harrass their parents into buying them these things, and the parents (who may have gone without in their childhoods) want to give their children everything they never had and give in.

Who the hell determines who is successful by what they OWN? Does anyone else think this is f#$ked up?

Anyway, that's just what I think

:

Bindi, well said!

Materials don't matter.

You are right, this sh1t is f^$ked up...

Agree

[RSgerry]

Originally Posted by bindi

Hey thanks mate... I suppose it's cos I am considering doing what's called Downshifting.

We are now almost completely debt free, but the kids and I have been missing dad/hubby as he's been working his ring off. And we've been asking ourselves which is more important, money or being happy? Because even though we had money, we weren't happier by a long shot. Sure, we could buy more things, but deep down we were all quite miserable. We missed laughing with each other, playing games, being stupid, watching Scrubs/Black Books etc and laughing till our sides hurt... basically sharing our lives.

bindi...you must have been reading my mind. for the last few weeks i have been thinking these exact same thoughts. i am financially secure and have been wondering about how to make a difference. my work pays well enough but is quite boring and i have been feeling more and more dissatisfied because i realised that i am not making a difference to anybody elses life (besides mrs RSgerry who is obviously deliriously happy). it has left me feeling like there is something missing. sadly, i am not allowed to give blood due to having lived in the UK and have been considering helping people with financial counselling. sadly, i am housebound for now as i cant drive due to an operation on my ankle, but it is something i would like to do.

you are right about the materialism. you get to a point where enough is enough. i think we still need our toys...playstations, fun cars, big tvs etc, but i have reached a point where i am happy in that respect. the XR6 is now 3 1/2 years old, but i still love driving it. i used to be very materialistic, but feel that i have reached saturation point.

i recently met someone who just helps others and it has left me feeling that there is more to life than just accumulating wealth. you know what they say "he who dies with the most toys still dies". or, in the immortal words of the monty python team "you start with nothing, you go back to nothing, so what have you lost? nothing"

Originally Posted by bindi

Hey thanks mate... I suppose it's cos I am considering doing what's called Downshifting.

We are now almost completely debt free, but the kids and I have been missing dad/hubby as he's been working his ring off. And we've been asking ourselves which is more important, money or being happy? Because even though we had money, we weren't happier by a long shot. Sure, we could buy more things, but deep down we were all quite miserable. We missed laughing with each other, playing games, being stupid, watching Scrubs/Black Books etc and laughing till our sides hurt... basically sharing our lives.

Downshifting means that my hubby and I will find part time work and share the household tasks/raising of kids etc (instead of me doing it all plus try and get my own business happening, while he does nothing but work) and actually have a life. Time to see friends. Time to enjoy life. Sure, we will have to go without the Nikes, the IPods, the PSPs, but we'll be better off without them.

Kids are really being targetted in the materialistic push to have more, consume more, work longer/harder/till they start having chest pains - as if it is a measure of success. Kids in turn nag and harrass their parents into buying them these things, and the parents (who may have gone without in their childhoods) want to give their children everything they never had and give in.

Who the hell determines who is successful by what they OWN? Does anyone else think this is [messed] up?

Anyway, that's just what I think

Yes, we have it all wrong. Companies produce stuff we don't need and overpaid advertising executives try to make us buy it using fancy commercials during boring TV shows. We then buy them, get bored with them and add them to the pile of other toys we've got bored with.

My wife and I used to really enjoy watching motorsport together but there's nothing interesting to watch any more. The V8 supercars is just a boring procession of antiquated machinery driven by louts (just like on the road to work), the non-V8 supercar Bathurst allows cheating just so an "Australian" car can win, the F1 Grand Prix is a boring procession of high-tech machinery driven by louts and the list goes on. All because it's big business and seen as a way make money.

We've been trying to reduce our expenditure and simplify our lives too, but it's difficult in our "modern" world. So the Falcon gets used until it wears out, with nothing being spent on it except necessary maintenance items. We'll be happy with our single toilet and shelve plans to build an en-suite and ours won't be the most manicured garden in the street. We've been trying to spend more time doing what's important rather than pursuing "toys".

Anyway enough of my rambling...

[MO]

Bindi;yes we are a materialistic society the advertising companies and the manufacturers need our money however they only get most of it from the ppl who believe that they must have this or that companies product.

As for me am quite content with a roof over the family heads,the AU ute,food on the table and health.

An old quote "What good is it to own all the wealth in the world,only to lose your soul"
Not verbatim but close enough.

[jmc-007]

Originally Posted by bindi

Are we a slave to our possessions? Why is it that when we get that renovated kitchen/surround sound system/latest mobile phone etc, we're happy for a little while... but then want something bigger and better? Are we listening when being told by advertisers that to feel better we should buy something else? Or take this prescribed medication that the drug companies have paid your doctor to endorse?


Don't we all realise that we are one living unit, everyone on this planet is connected, and what we do to ourselves, we do to another?

Originally Posted by 211

do material assets really mean anything? I'd rather have those I love around me than the latest and greatest of goods.

9/11 and Hurricane Katrina are massive wake up calls .....

That is the big question isnt it?? But society today is fixated on Money, You are taught at School and by your parents (mostly) that you need to goto school get a good education so you can have lots of money and buy a house.

How many Credit Card offers, cheap mobile plans and interest free deals to suck people into debit. Its crasy.

If you have every one in Debit and you have people thinking they are enjoying Fast Cars, Big Screen TVs and Overpriced houses then the banks have one and we are slaves. to the Govt and the Banks.



But i keep trying to tell my GF to calm down and stop worrying about money, (we are not poor by any means, but what does it mean to be rich or poor) and to focus on her uni degree. But she is so fixated on Cash and she thinks it will make her happy. I told her once she looses her friends and the people that love her then she will see what has happend.


But i just think we should look where we have come from (as a society) and look at how we are destroying our wellbeing and being sucked down into darkness.


You have to Wonder about things like 9/11 dont you ??

[cogdoc]

My ego has to have a say. Perhaps the trouble is people spend too much time looking outwards at the material world, instead of looking inwards where all the real answers lie. It is so much easier to assign blame on externals, rather than being critical of ourselves. I know I struggle with this, but I am glad I am now aware.

How is earning your way, putting a roof over your head, food on the table, raising kids, day in and day out any different to an animal in the wild finding food shelter rearing young? It's not, it's merely survival. Obviously it is an esential part of life, but we humans have the ability to do more. You can't take it with you when you go, so why not give it away? You don't have to be rich to give, put $5 on the footpath, go sit in your car and watch someone pick it up. It's powerful watching something so small make someones day. Compliment the next checkout chick. Smile before you make a phonecall. Let someone cut in front of you. Giving doesn't have to be monetary.

Someone once said "When you seek happiness for yourself it will always elude you. When you seek happiness for others you will find it yourself."

Anyone, in any situation, in any employment can strive to make a little difference to others, and it's amazing how much comes back. I know that when I get caught up in the "small stuff" and get down and out, I go into pure survival mode, and have a miserable time. But if you get above it all, give out that positive feeling, you have the most awesome day, and the most amazing things happen. You've all experienced it, yet it's so easy to slip into the basal survival mode. I do it.

Where is the peace in more is better?

Bindi the best thing I have yet done was to write my own orbituary. What you would like others to read out at your funeral. Personally in that I had nothing about being loaded, lots of toys, reaching "powerful" positions. I read once a quote by a nurse on the terminally ill ward that people on their death bed never once said they wished they had spent more time at the office. They all mentioned giving more love, being with loved ones etc etc. Hmmmmmm.

The world is full of joy and woe. What's changed since day one? I can look back at failed businesses, relationships, jobs, bad luck etc etc, or I can think well if it wasn't for all of that, I wouldn't be where I am now. And I mean where I am now "inside". Hopefully a little wiser.

Marcus Arelius, Roman Emperor once said to his son "It's not the events of the world that disturb men's minds, but their opinions of these events. If you find something grievous to be born, change your opinion"

Seems we have been struggling to find "the reason" since day dot.

And amazingly even the new GT sitting downstairs is making me question my own path....might be a short lived thing...I too read with interest the recent article in the paper on downsizing.....funny how you spend the first half of your life achieving it, only to see it's not really worth it and then the last half getting rid of it.

It inspires me to see people on here questioning.

[bindi]

Originally Posted by cogdoc

Bindi the best thing I have yet done was to write my own orbituary. What you would like others to read out at your funeral. Personally in that I had nothing about being loaded, lots of toys, reaching "powerful" positions. I read once a quote by a nurse on the terminally ill ward that people on their death bed never once said they wished they had spent more time at the office. They all mentioned giving more love, being with loved ones etc etc. Hmmmmmm.

Marcus Arelius, Roman Emperor once said to his son "It's not the events of the world that disturb men's minds, but their opinions of these events. If you find something grievous to be born, change your opinion"

Wow, writing your obituary? What an amazing concept. That's pure perspective. It would be good to hang it on a wall somewhere. I would rather be known for laughing alot (and have a good lot of laugh lines on my face), being loving, cheerful, content and HAPPY than "She owned a house and a big shiny fast car"

Marcus Aurelius, he had alot to say. I saw a book of his quotes once, plus he wrote a few didn't he? I should go looksie.

Yet again, I will say to all of you: Now go forth and read Conversations With God (no it's not Christian or religious in any way)... this is my inspiration to a better inner world.

[4.9 EF Futura]

I dont think its right to make blanket statements about materialism and the need for possession. I'll run with your porsche example. I'd love one. Why? It looks beautiful and i imagine it would be a delight to drive. It just so happens that i need a couple of hundred thousand dollars to own one, but dont mistake a high priced item with pure greed or materialism. There is a certain pleasure which is derived from such a product which instrinsic to the product itself, not the image/preception associated with it.

Of course, there are plenty of exceptions. Someone who buys a ferrari yet never takes it past 25% throttle. In such a case it is an obvious status symbol. If i were ever in a position to afford one - i'd buy one. But not to stand around and show off - to get out there and strap the t!ts off the poor thing! It would be fun, no?

Look at the life 90% of us live. Look at the corner we have painted ourselves into - we go to work, to put a roof over our head and to put food in our stomach. We need somewhere to sleep and something to eat, so that we can go to work the next day. Now, i dont hate my job - but it still a pretty crap life if you ask me. Work, sleep, work, sleep.

So what do we do? We try to enjoy ourselves - bring a little endorphin release in to our dismal lives. The good stuff: Friends, family, relationships. And of course, the bad stuff: Cars, kitchens, boats, holiday homes, toys, etc etc.

It just happens that some people need a little more (i.e. the porsche driver) than others to make themselves happy. I dont think its right to hold that against them.

Can you blame people for wanting to 'buy' a little happiness in their lives? Just remember - there's plenty of people out there with no family, very few friends and little chance of finding a partner.

I think the problem of materialism is a spec in the dust compared to our society's lack of responsibility. It's always someone elses fault/problem - the government, banks (who are always in cahoots with the government, right?), advertising companies, oil companies, police, parking inspectors. People are always blaming someone else for the situation they are in.

"Wah wah wah - the bank made me borrow money to pay for something the advertising companies made me buy now i cant afford to service the debt and it's all the government's fault". Bullsh!t. Take responsibility for your own actions and the rest will look after itself.

Apologies for the essay - but its a great topic bindi

[XWGT]

Your correct, materials do not matter

However, I smile a lot more when I drive my Porsche than I probably would without it...........go figure......

The equalitarian model has a lot of good factors, unfortunately it forgets that without competition and consumerism, then is no progress (good and bad). I want to stand on the moon one day. That wont happen unless space flight becomes cheaper. That wont happen unless its a commodity. Neither will the technology that makes it possible.

Its ok to all have the same values and possession. But what inspired the medical team to create the bionic heart? Money, provided by research companies, who will turn it into a commodity.

Peace love and rock n roll