Perth Ford Dealers

[DoreSlamR]

In the vein of the Brisbane thread.

Any dealer worth talking to over another or are they all the same?

I’m wanting to put a deposit down on a new Raptor. Anyone done that in Perth yet?

[Crazy Dazz]

Problem is most of them are owned by AHG, and they just seem to shuffle their muppets around.
McInerney Ford used to Independent, not sure if it still is.

The John Hughes organisation is excellent to deal with. Very high standard of service and integrity. But they simply won't give you the best deal on a New Car. For some reason they believe that the same premium they charge for 2nd-hand, should also attach to their new car sales.

The Best Ford dealer used to be Lane Ford in Mandurah. Honest, good prices, straight-shooters. But pretty sure the old guy retired, and I don't know who owns them now.

[prktkljokr]

My Nephew used a broker, I think they saved him about $3000 on what he could get on a Prado.

Depending on how you intend to purchase, Cash, Loan, Lease whatever a good broker will get you a better deal than you ever would, just look up New car Broker on google, there are a few.

A good friend of mine bought his Ranger through Narrogin Ford, way better deal than the city dealers

[Crazy Dazz]

Originally Posted by prktkljokr

broker will get you a better deal than you ever would,

only if you are an utter nong
brokers never get you the best deal, that would be literally impossible, and that's not their purpose.

the role of a broker, any broker, is to make life simpler, not cheaper. Just like anything in life, they provide a service, and the don't work for free. It's the same as anything else. Paying somebody to paint your gutters will never be as cheap as doing it yourself. Question is whether you have the tools, skills, time, and effort to DIY

[Crazy Dazz]

Originally Posted by prktkljokr

A good friend of mine bought his Ranger through Narrogin Ford, way better deal than the city dealers

Good to know, sounds similar to Lane Ford.
Country dealers (and those on the outskirts like Midland) can be a really good option. Many are hungry for sales, and actively target metropolitan deals.

Not all though. Some are very happy charging their local clients a premium, and have no interest in chasing price-driven deals.

And here's a tip to get the best deal from a dealer, if working by email. Do your homework and target the Sales Manager, not a rep. That's one less mouth to feed, and Managers are more driven by volume, and have less time to waste on BS.

BUT, don't contact them unless you are 100% ready to buy. Don't waste their time, and don't try stupid low-ball tactics.

[prktkljokr]

Originally Posted by Crazy Dazz

only if you are an utter nong
brokers never get you the best deal, that would be literally impossible, and that's not their purpose.

the role of a broker, any broker, is to make life simpler, not cheaper. Just like anything in life, they provide a service, and the don't work for free. It's the same as anything else. Paying somebody to paint your gutters will never be as cheap as doing it yourself. Question is whether you have the tools, skills, time, and effort to DIY

Nephew must of jagged a good one then, he tried 4 different dealers and they were all around the same new price, then this guy saved him $3000, if he charged my nephew fees it was included in the new car price as he saved $3000.

When I "had" a mortgage the mortgage broker got me a deal 1.5% lower than most banks were offering, I didnt borrow any extra money or pay him for getting me the deal, the bank paid him his commission for bringing them a new client, and I paid the loan out early with no fees so he saved me money in the long term.

If a broker cost's you money why are they around, seems a bit stupid to get someone involved to broker a deal if they are not going to get you the best deal and cost you more than you already can get?

[Crazy Dazz]

Originally Posted by prktkljokr

If a broker cost's you money why are they around, seems a bit stupid to get someone involved to broker a deal if they are not going to get you the best deal and cost you more than you already can get?

So you think they work for free? ROFL
By definition, a broker will never get you the "cheapest" deal, because you have to pay them.
But as I said, it's like any service. Brain Surgery aint cheap either, but I really don't recommend DIY.

Some"middle-man" scenarios are a little different, because the supplier won't deal with you directly. (Effectively every Car Dealer is a middle-man, because the manufacturer won't sell to you directly)
You'll often find with Mortgage Brokers that they interact with a higher-level in the banks, so it's only a question of whether they pay the commission to a broker, or to one of their in-house teams. Some financiers have no retail presence of their own, and you can only access them through a broker. But that's also why you'll find they can't access ALL the deals in the market, because some smaller lenders such as some credit unions won't deal with brokers. RAMS is an interesting one, because they are franchised brokers tied to a single lender (Westpac.)

And as I said, that's one reason to target the Sales Manager, one less mouth to feed.

Originally Posted by prktkljokr

he tried 4 different dealers and they were all around the same new price, then this guy saved him $3000,

And?
I didn't say that brokers don't exist.
Once again, sigh, just like any service, if you're unable to do it yourself, then paying somebody else to do it for you, is the normal alternative.

Keep in mind that one of the key things you're paying for in a service is knowledge.
The OP is doing exactly that, seeking knowledge. He may get some benefit from our replies, or he may have to resort to sounding out all the dealers himself. A broker not only provides that service, but is also able to use his existing knowledge. A broker would presumably know which dealers are price competitive, and which aren't. A broker presumably also has the ability to get a "best price" very quickly, so he can probably get there with a couple of (semi-automated) emails, whereas it takes you or I dozens to get the same result.

[IanC]

Originally Posted by Crazy Dazz

Good to know, sounds similar to Lane Ford.
Country dealers (and those on the outskirts like Midland) can be a really good option. Many are hungry for sales, and actively target metropolitan deals.

Valley Ford in Northam are good to deal with. A family business.

[prktkljokr]

Originally Posted by Crazy Dazz

So you think they work for free? ROFL
By definition, a broker will never get you the "cheapest" deal, because you have to pay them.
But as I said, it's like any service. Brain Surgery aint cheap either, but I really don't recommend DIY.

Don't think am having a go at you, or that I'm aggravated by your posts, as I see we are having a discussion, and you are entitled to you opinion as am I.

I did not say they work for free, I'm not stupid, I know they get paid, I know no one works for free, it was a rhetorical question that you are referring to.

If you save $5000 and the broker makes $2000, you are in front $3000 who really cares who gets you the money off the deal and if they get paid for it, no different than the salesman at the dealership getting his commission on the sale, then the sales manager getting his bonus at month end.

Originally Posted by Crazy Dazz

Some"middle-man" scenarios are a little different, because the supplier won't deal with you directly. (Effectively every Car Dealer is a middle-man, because the manufacturer won't sell to you directly)

Sorry, don't get me wrong, may be informative to some people, but I do know this from being in the Automotive industry for 40 years.

Originally Posted by Crazy Dazz

You'll often find with Mortgage Brokers that they interact with a higher-level in the banks, so it's only a question of whether they pay the commission to a broker, or to one of their in-house teams. Some financiers have no retail presence of their own, and you can only access them through a broker. But that's also why you'll find they can't access ALL the deals in the market, because some smaller lenders such as some credit unions won't deal with brokers. RAMS is an interesting one, because they are franchised brokers tied to a single lender (Westpac.)

Not really relevant to this thread and we are possibly muddying the OP's thread, but I did comment on this at the bottom of this post as I did bring my Mortgage broker story to the thread only for a example of where a broker saved Myself money.

Originally Posted by Crazy Dazz

And as I said, that's one reason to target the Sales Manager, one less mouth to feed.

The Sales Manager will just palm you off to a salesman first to seal the deal who will only think of his own commission first, Managers dont care about Joe public until the deal is done.

Originally Posted by Crazy Dazz

And?
I didn't say that brokers don't exist.
Once again, sigh, just like any service, if you're unable to do it yourself, then paying somebody else to do it for you, is the normal alternative.

I also did not imply that you had said that brokers dont exist, even if you are able to do the deal in person a broker can still get you some extra money off the deal, maybe at another dealers, but who cares where the new car comes from if you save money.

Originally Posted by Crazy Dazz

Keep in mind that one of the key things you're paying for in a service is knowledge.
The OP is doing exactly that, seeking knowledge. He may get some benefit from our replies, or he may have to resort to sounding out all the dealers himself. A broker not only provides that service, but is also able to use his existing knowledge. A broker would presumably know which dealers are price competitive, and which aren't. A broker presumably also has the ability to get a "best price" very quickly, so he can probably get there with a couple of (semi-automated) emails, whereas it takes you or I dozens to get the same result.

What I was trying to get across in my first post, who cares what the broker charges if you walk away with more cash in your pocket than you would of by trying yourself, isn't that what we are looking for.

If the broker cant find you a good deal you don't have to pay them as you have purchased nothing, it is just like them giving you a quote, just like if your painter gives you a quote but does not paint your gutters, you dont pay him, what does the OP have to lose by just asking one?.

If you hate brokers that much you can put your fingers in your ears and sing la la la la la, but the truth is a broker has saved my nephew $3000 on what he had already been quoted on a $80,000 + cash deal, so it shows that the broker did his job, $3000 might not seem much but it was the price of his new ARB bull bar.
I don't know how my friend ended up buying his Ranger from Narrogin Ford, as he lives 1 street from me, might have used a broker, dunno?, I will ask him at this Wednesday night dinner though.

Now this has nothing to do with this thread and nothing to the OP, but I do have some knowledge in this department, not first hand but my Wife worked for a mortgage broker for 10 years and it is common knowledge to them that your home loan is sold to investment companies once it is set up, the bank does the deal, sells it to a investment company then just collects the payments, takes a small cut and passes on the payment to the investor so they are a form of broker themselves.

With brokered loans they just dealt with the manager and loan staff of the local branches of each bank that they got to know quite well over the years, some were even miles from where the customer was buying their property, the bank paid the brokerage fees to them for bringing the customer in only if the loan was taken out, there were no fees for the customer if it did not go ahead.

Also when she first started some banks paid more fees to the broker than others so it lead to some brokers steering more toward these banks, after she was there 4 years the government stepped in and capped the fees that could be paid to the broker so it made the broker shop around more for the best deal for the customer rather than getting the best brokerage fee, this was over 20 years ago.

Neighbour currently works in loans at a major bank, they don't get any extra kick backs for doing their job, they are on a fixed monthly salary and just do the loan as per Bank policy, no kick backs for sealing a deal, so they just sell you the standard rate loan if you don't ask for a better deal.

[rare ss]

We used to deal with Midway Ford through work, as far as car dealers go they seemed to be OK, I've never bought a car from a car yard but they were the closest one to tempt me with my business

[DoreSlamR]

Originally Posted by rare ss

We used to deal with Midway Ford through work, as far as car dealers go they seemed to be OK, I've never bought a car from a car yard but they were the closest one to tempt me with my business

I bought my Raptor there in 2019.

I’ve contacted the sales rep I dealt with there, who now works for Range Ford. He seems to be a good sort.

[oldel]

Originally Posted by prktkljokr

Don't think am having a go at you, or that I'm aggravated by your posts, as I see we are having a discussion, and you are entitled to you opinion as am I.

I did not say they work for free, I'm not stupid, I know they get paid, I know no one works for free, it was a rhetorical question that you are referring to.

If you save $5000 and the broker makes $2000, you are in front $3000 who really cares who gets you the money off the deal and if they get paid for it, no different than the salesman at the dealership getting his commission on the sale, then the sales manager getting his bonus at month end.

I got my brother to buy via a broker recently. Fact is car salespeople barely budge on price these days, the trick was the broker got access to fleet pricing, huge discount and the fleet salesperson at the dealer was accomodating and said in future just refer people straight to him and cut out the middleman/broker. Anyway, that's what dealing with a broker gets you, gets you past the regular dealer sales staff, mingmoles etc working on comm/principle and access to the fleet sales people (and pricing).

Before I suggested a broker he was hitting a brick wall, RRP and that's it. Using a broker he got 6k knocked off the price and gained a contact with the fleet salesman.

[bungarra]

Originally Posted by Crazy Dazz

McInerney Ford used to Independent, not sure if it still is.

Denis still owns and runs McInerney Ford.

Originally Posted by Crazy Dazz

The John Hughes organisation is excellent to deal with. Very high standard of service and integrity. But they simply won't give you the best deal on a New Car. For some reason they believe that the same premium they charge for 2nd-hand, should also attach to their new car sales.

Sells on his name, puts all New and Used sales guys through the Dale Carnegie Sales Course.