Should the Australian flag be changed?

[kyro_02]

Originally Posted by XCPWSF

I will, but whats one vote in the whole scheme of things?

I find myself walking in blindly ticking off boxes which mean nothing to me, all future PM's are the same, almost have the same agenda and are liars

also i think the aus flag is good as it is, and shouldn't be changed

[gtxb67]

Originally Posted by Falcon Coupe

All good until a Kookaburra belts the Cobra against the ground then has it for lunch.

that isn't a fair fight though. the cobra has heard the song and knows the kookaburra leads a gay life. so while he is protecting his tail area, the kookaburra grabs him behind the neck - and then laughs at him for good measure


maybe though "kookaburra sits in the old gum tree" could become our national anthem. a tough bird, can kill cobras, is always happy and it seems has no phobias

[fnd]

The discussion so far, reflects the difficulty that would be associated with selecting a new design. There would be a thousand different designs in the 'short list', and representing (or trying to) all of the cultural groups you can think of. The winning design would no doubt be selected by some "arty" type with no concept of reality, and have no significance to the majority of the population.

Some points I would like to make regarding the current ANF:

1. The Union flag in the corner represents our heritage. Like it or not, our history cannot be changed - even though politicians like to rewrite it to suit their own agendas.

2. We cannot, and should not change our flag to represent "modern Australia".
I am sick of the constant white-anting of our way of life to satisfy the supposed needs of migrants to this country. They wanted to come here for a better way of life. Why should we lower our way of life to eventually finish up with what they came from. Look at the plight Great Britain is in, and we are stupidly following suit. Multiculturalism Ha! Bastardisation is a more apt term.

3. "The flag does not represent/acknowledge the aboriginal links of our country". This is incorrect, as the southern cross features strongly in a lot of aboriginal mythology.

This flag has been ours for a very long time. If we change it, that historic link will be broken, and we finish up with a piece of rag - no matter how pretty it is - and it will be all the easier to change in a few years time when Kevin Rudd, or his successors get a sudden whim.

My two bob's worth.

fnd

[vik351]

Wanna get rid of the flag...???

Check this out...

http://media01.couriermail.com.au/mu...x.html?id=1411

vik... On ya Thorpie...RIP...

[scoupedy]

Originally Posted by Raptor

Yes, get rid of that other nations flag taking up the top corner.

no i don't think so, The Union Jack is where we came from and what has helped shape us, the Australia flag is what we are use to and is very reconisable as Australian

[Peuty]

Originally Posted by XCPWSF

I don't vote, Dad doesn't vote, my sister doesn't vote, her boyfriends parents don't vote.

And I bet you all get together and have a whinge when the Centerlink money isn't paid on time.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by flappist

By how many votes did Bush win in 2000?

No idea but the rumour goes one or both of his elections were rigged.

Originally Posted by Peuty

And I bet you all get together and have a whinge when the Centerlink money isn't paid on time.

Funny, Dad works at Centrelink, my sister is in her 5th year on her double degree in law and commerce at deakin and my sisters boyfriend's parents own an accounting firm. Its probably you who goes to Dad about super annuation or bitches they paid their taxes all their life and demands the pension and cry's poor with $800,000 worth of assets.

[Peuty]

Originally Posted by XCPWSF

Its probably you who goes to him about super annuation or bitches they paid their taxes all their life and demands the pension and cry's poor with $800,000 worth of assets.

Yeah that's me. Is your Dad's name Steve? He's a good listener.

[Peter B - CV8]

Originally Posted by XCPWSF

I didn't tell anyone anything, I merely said my opinion then backed it up when someone questioned me on parts.

I don't vote, Dad doesn't vote, my sister doesn't vote, her boyfriends parents don't vote. Why not give us a choice in voting? I'm sure it'd stop a lot of 0, 0, 0, 0 votes or 1, 2, 3, 4 ones.

Is there any particular reason why you & your (extended) family choose not to vote ????? Not trying to be a smart **** or anything - just trying to understand the reasoning behind your decision.

[vik351]

Originally Posted by vik351

Wanna get rid of the flag...???

Check this out...

http://media01.couriermail.com.au/mu...x.html?id=1411

vik... On ya Thorpie...RIP...

bump...

[Peuty]

Yep, heard that a while ago vik, good song. Thorpie is a legend.

And no, not that gay swimmer.

[russellw]

It's nice to see some debate over the topic even if it is unlikely to change for all the reasons outlines above - that and the fact that even our voting is 3:1 against a change.

The National Anthem does irk me somewhat - I understand it has great, patriotic lyrics but as there is only one person in the country who know them without a cue card (that being Julie Anthony), they are largely wasted. Since the education system determined that it was politically incorrect to make it mandatory at school and we usually only have one verse played at events (the one most people actually know) I guess we can take comfort in the fact that it is at least short.

Cheers
Russ

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by Peter B - CV8

Is there any particular reason why you & your (extended) family choose not to vote ????? Not trying to be a smart **** or anything - just trying to understand the reasoning behind your decision.

We pretty much come to the conclusion they're all the same and make empty promises to get elected.

[Peter B - CV8]

Originally Posted by XCPWSF

We pretty much come to the conclusion they're all the same and make empty promises to get elected.

Fair enough (and quite true !!).
If we do have a referendum re the flag/republic, what will you all do then ???? I believe you have to be enrolled to have your voice heard......
Or are you all enrolled - but just cast donkey votes ????

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by Peter B - CV8

Fair enough (and quite true !!).
If we do have a referendum re the flag/republic, what will you all do then ???? I believe you have to be enrolled to have your voice heard......
Or are you all enrolled - but just cast donkey votes ????

The others are enrolled but they all donkey vote, I'm not though.

[bingoTE50]

The only thing I find is strange is that we always speak of green and gold with our sporting teams , but it does not relate to our flag unlike most all other countries.
In saying this,I am quite comfortable with our flag,and although I do not feel inspired by the National Anthem , my kids do , and thats great.
I grew up singing God Save The Queen initially .

[Franco Cozzo]

Last time I sang the national anthem would be 7 years ago now, grade 6. They used to make us sing the national anthem every monday at school assembly in primary school.

[castellan]

Originally Posted by fnd

The discussion so far, reflects the difficulty that would be associated with selecting a new design. There would be a thousand different designs in the 'short list', and representing (or trying to) all of the cultural groups you can think of. The winning design would no doubt be selected by some "arty" type with no concept of reality, and have no significance to the majority of the population.

Some points I would like to make regarding the current ANF:

1. The Union flag in the corner represents our heritage. Like it or not, our history cannot be changed - even though politicians like to rewrite it to suit their own agendas.

2. We cannot, and should not change our flag to represent "modern Australia".
I am sick of the constant white-anting of our way of life to satisfy the supposed needs of migrants to this country. They wanted to come here for a better way of life. Why should we lower our way of life to eventually finish up with what they came from. Look at the plight Great Britain is in, and we are stupidly following suit. Multiculturalism Ha! Bastardisation is a more apt term.

3. "The flag does not represent/acknowledge the aboriginal links of our country". This is incorrect, as the southern cross features strongly in a lot of aboriginal mythology.

This flag has been ours for a very long time. If we change it, that historic link will be broken, and we finish up with a piece of rag - no matter how pretty it is - and it will be all the easier to change in a few years time when Kevin Rudd, or his successors get a sudden whim.

My two bob's worth.

fnd

True !
This country is going to the dogs and a flag change will only prove it more so.

What other country do these poor pommy haters believe would of done a better job of the creation of our nation. come on!

[Keepleft]

Originally Posted by castellan

True !
This country is going to the dogs and a flag change will only prove it more so.

What other country do these poor pommy haters believe would of done a better job of the creation of our nation. come on!

You are, sadly ,- quite right I personally believe, and thats not an anti-AUS statement, I put this post at LS1 on the subject:-
http://www.ls1.com.au/forum/showpost...2&postcount=65

I wont copy and quote it - hope the link works.

[GasoLane]

Originally Posted by bingoTE50

although I do not feel inspired by the National Anthem , my kids do , and thats great.

Try singing Barnsey's 'Working Class Man' to the Advance Oz Fair tune.

It fits and sounds better.

[gossy]

Originally Posted by ltd

If it aint broken don't try to fix it.
I love our flag, I love its proud history, and no inner suburbs yuppie poof with a 3 series and a proclivity for mens company at the tradesmans entance is going to tell me that it's "old, and boring". We should love our flag the same way the americans love theirs. Keep it, or get stuffed.

Too right mate.

[Scott]

Originally Posted by Geez Louise

You all go on about the flag...how many of you know the Full Lyrics to Advance Australia Fair?....Here they are!

I didn't know there were that many verses, I think we kept the wrong ones!

Whilst I sang Advance Australia Fair and God save the Queen at school, I don't really hold either to close to my heart (maybe the latter moreso??).

Waltzing Matilda (odd as it truly is), I still call Australia Home or maybe True Blue (though too colloquial) would all be far better representative songs of who we are or what we hold dear.

I love to look at our flag, I love seeing Aussies embracing our flag but I really think there must be a far more emotive song for us to get behind.

[Dave_Obsession]

OK so here's my $0.02:

Stop hating on our flag & anthem, get into it......try singing the national anthem next time you hear it!!! You might actually get this strange feeling....you may even feel proud of your country!!!

The anthem, the flag......both the same for me - If it ain't broke, don't fix it - there's nothing wrong with what we've got.....all you lefties who don't like it....people fought and died for that flag, how's about showing a modicum of respect for every digger & police officer that has perished defending that flag and / or its values.....

I'm only 25, and I'm quite ambivalent towards the whole republic issue (makes no difference to me who our head of state is, because it doesn't really matter and won't actually change anything in reality), but I can't believe people can actually seriously say we should change the flag? Might as well start a mutiny...

That flag was designed by Australians for Australians, and yes it's important to recognise that this land was settled by the British, without their input we wouldn't be what we are today....so what if the Union Jack is on the flag - do you actually look at the flag and think 'there's a bloody union jack on there?' When I see the flag, I associate it with AUSTRALIA and nothing else. And so it should stay that way for the rest of time.

All these loonies who pop up at the same time every year saying the same thing.....sit down and be quiet, you're offending everybody with your miserable and inane drivel. Our flag is our flag, no we don't get a choice in what it looks like, we didn't create this country, but by God we will love it and protect it and everything it stands for.

And no I don't care what Canada did, or if any other country has changed their flag, that doesn't justify it one bit.

If you don't like what the Australian flag looks like, go and start your own country where you can choose whatever bloody flag you like - that's fine.

I'm of Greek Cypriot (mother's side) and English/Welsh (father) decent, but I was born here, and I have an Australian flag proudly hanging on the wall in my bedroom. I have several family members and friends who are members of our armed forces, who wake up every day and salute the same flag with honour and pride every single morning, whilst others are actually championing that it should be replaced! What blasphemy!

Originally Posted by GTP006

I really think there must be a far more emotive song for us to get behind.

Originally Posted by Wikipedia

The term anthem means either a specific form of Anglican church music (in music theory and religious contexts), or more generally, a song (or composition) of celebration, usually acting as a symbol for a distinct group of people, as in the term "national anthem" or "sports anthem".

Why does the anthem have to be any more emotive than it already is?? Do you guys not think that Advance Australia Fair suits this desciption??? Yes it's a bit old fashioned, and we don't even use some of the words anymore, but it's our anthem! You don't get a choice!!

Same as the flag - if listening to our anthem makes you sick, then you don't deserve to be an Australian - go somewhere else, start your own country and have whatever bloody anthem you like!

When done properly, the anthem can be quite emotive.....it also helps when the person leading the singing does a good job.....some people have absolutely massacred it over the years....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K4fOtbKUme0
Fast forward to the Austrlian anthem and hear the crowd screaming it out....gives you goosebumps...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=57ZGnOjLeWM
The Wallabies give it a go......

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVezM...eature=related
1986 AFL Grand Final...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYvZW...eature=related
Delta Goodrem gives it a softer touch at the Melbourne Cup

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U_AacQPKBI8
World Cup 2006

Rant over

Like I said, my $0.02....don't mean to offend or antagonise anybody.

[Scott]

Originally Posted by dave93761

Why does the anthem have to be any more emotive than it already is?? Do you guys not think that Advance Australia Fair suits this desciption??? Yes it's a bit old fashioned, and we don't even use some of the words anymore, but it's our anthem! You don't get a choice!!

Did you wear a hat today?

Originally Posted by dave93761

Same as the flag - if listening to our anthem makes you sick, then you don't deserve to be an Australian - go somewhere else, start your own country and have whatever bloody anthem you like!

No-one said it makes them sick, calm down a little bud.

[XBROO]

All I can say is look at the poll and though it's not all of Australia it still gives a good indication on what Australians want. So the rest of you deal with it as you are a minority and majority rules. I love this country.lol

[MAD]

Originally Posted by dave93761

OK so here's my $0.02:

Stop hating on our flag & anthem, get into it......try singing the national anthem next time you hear it!!! You might actually get this strange feeling....you may even feel proud of your country!!!

The anthem, the flag......both the same for me - If it ain't broke, don't fix it - there's nothing wrong with what we've got.....all you lefties who don't like it....people fought and died for that flag, how's about showing a modicum of respect for every digger & police officer that has perished defending that flag and / or its values.....

I'm only 25, and I'm quite ambivalent towards the whole republic issue (makes no difference to me who our head of state is, because it doesn't really matter and won't actually change anything in reality), but I can't believe people can actually seriously say we should change the flag? Might as well start a mutiny...

That flag was designed by Australians for Australians, and yes it's important to recognise that this land was settled by the British, without their input we wouldn't be what we are today....so what if the Union Jack is on the flag - do you actually look at the flag and think 'there's a bloody union jack on there?' When I see the flag, I associate it with AUSTRALIA and nothing else. And so it should stay that way for the rest of time.

All these loonies who pop up at the same time every year saying the same thing.....sit down and be quiet, you're offending everybody with your miserable and inane drivel. Our flag is our flag, no we don't get a choice in what it looks like, we didn't create this country, but by God we will love it and protect it and everything it stands for.

And no I don't care what Canada did, or if any other country has changed their flag, that doesn't justify it one bit.

If you don't like what the Australian flag looks like, go and start your own country where you can choose whatever bloody flag you like - that's fine.

I'm of Greek Cypriot (mother's side) and English/Welsh (father) decent, but I was born here, and I have an Australian flag proudly hanging on the wall in my bedroom. I have several family members and friends who are members of our armed forces, who wake up every day and salute the same flag with honour and pride every single morning, whilst others are actually championing that it should be replaced! What blasphemy!





Why does the anthem have to be any more emotive than it already is?? Do you guys not think that Advance Australia Fair suits this desciption??? Yes it's a bit old fashioned, and we don't even use some of the words anymore, but it's our anthem! You don't get a choice!!

Same as the flag - if listening to our anthem makes you sick, then you don't deserve to be an Australian - go somewhere else, start your own country and have whatever bloody anthem you like!

When done properly, the anthem can be quite emotive.....it also helps when the person leading the singing does a good job.....some people have absolutely massacred it over the years....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K4fOtbKUme0
Fast forward to the Austrlian anthem and hear the crowd screaming it out....gives you goosebumps...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=57ZGnOjLeWM
The Wallabies give it a go......

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVezM...eature=related
1986 AFL Grand Final...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYvZW...eature=related
Delta Goodrem gives it a softer touch at the Melbourne Cup

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U_AacQPKBI8
World Cup 2006

Rant over

Like I said, my $0.02....don't mean to offend or antagonise anybody.

+1
That's one of the best rants I've read in a while.


On the subject of, "Canada did it, why cant we?"

Why should we try to change our flag to have recognise the Aboriginals, when the USA dont have anything on their flag to recognise the native Indians?
or in other words "America didn't do it, why should we?"

[bigdude1011]

Sorry if someone else suggested this, but why not just get rid of the Union Jack, and put the Aboriginal flag in that corner?

[XBROO]

Look I don't agree with this F off were full business, but we have to sooner or later stop. Because with more poeple means more housing, which mean more australian bush and rainforrest being destroyed. The only other way is to start building a few cities in the desert. Which devolopers won't do because of the costs. And we don't want to over populate our country or lose any beloved wild life. Please don't take this the wrong way, I mean no disrespect to any new australians.

[LTDHO]

WOW a lot of people don't want the flag changed. I bet a lot of people didn't want our anthem to change either.
I know many men fought under that flag and died fighting for it.

However we do not need the Union Jack. So why have it? This county has a vast variety of different cultures and the UJ doesn't represent any of that, as it did in 1901. So it is very outdated and doesn't suit this country.

The Southern Cross is very Australian, we to me anyway. Shows you can be different yet in the same group as others. Stars sit their piecefuly, yet with sharp edges, can attack or defend if need be.

[FTE217]

Originally Posted by bingoTE50

The only thing I find is strange is that we always speak of green and gold with our sporting teams , but it does not relate to our flag unlike most all other countries.
In saying this,I am quite comfortable with our flag,and although I do not feel inspired by the National Anthem , my kids do , and thats great.
I grew up singing God Save The Queen initially .

Nah mate manymany countries sporting outfits do not have the colours of their national flag.

Being an oldie compared to many here I grew up with God Save the Queen at school,the change to Advance Australia Fair was a bit hard to adjust to at first but you can stand next to me at many sporting events I attend and hear me belt it out its my anthem our anthem and my kids sing it also with Pride !
Also its not the Tamworth Country Music festival having "True Blue" and similar songs for natinal anthems either, anthem's on the pi$$ yer.
Nothing wrong with the current flag, just the usual idiots wanting change for the sake of it phhht.

Dave93761 young fella I'll stand next to you in the trenchs.