Florida Legislature " Porn more dangerous than rifles.

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by Junkyard-Dog

They'll never let go of their guns. There will be a second US civil war before that happens.

Considering the amount of gun owners that shoot themselves in comparison to actual gun crime...it wouldn't last long.

[au350hp]

There are millions upon millions of guns in the states & stopping production will achieve nothing. Like any issue that keeps rearing it's head in society, EDUCATION is the answer. Start with the next generation, get them young and change the mentality. That is the only way to effect change with any issue, whether it be drugs, bullying or even the road toll.

[Mercury Bullet]

Now Tasmanian liberals want to loosen their gun laws and bring back semi autos and pump action shot guns. Supposedly because farmers NEED them.
I think they might have just done a John hewson.

Sick livestock don't run away from you.

There really is no need for semi autos outside the military, heck sliding a bolt isn't that hard.
Gun lobby is alive and well here too.

Tasmania of all places....

[solarite_guy]

Originally Posted by vztrt

Considering the amount of gun owners that shoot themselves in comparison to actual gun crime...it wouldn't last long.

Here's is some interesting reading.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_vi..._United_States

"Gun violence in the United States results in tens of thousands of deaths and injuries annually.[1] In 2013, there were 73,505 nonfatal firearm injuries (23.2 injuries per 100,000 U.S. citizens),[2][3] and 33,636 deaths due to "injury by firearms" (10.6 deaths per 100,000 U.S. citizens).[4] These deaths consisted of 11,208 homicides,[5] 21,175 suicides,[4] 505 deaths due to accidental or negligent discharge of a firearm, and 281 deaths due to firearms use with "undetermined intent".[4] Of the 2,596,993 total deaths in the US in 2013, 1.3% were related to firearms.[1][6] The ownership and control of guns are among the most widely debated issues in the country."

The FBI has some pretty detailed stats. I forgot the name of the report(s). If I think of the name I'll get the link to the top one and folks can drill down to the various sub-reports.

An interesting and troubling trend was a marked increase in gun homicides/murders in 2015 and 2016. Quick googles will find that. Some would say this corresponds with the mood the prior administration fostered toward the law enforcement community.

[lucas2]

There are arguments that the removal of the 2nd amendment would set a precedent whereby the other amendments could also be easily removed. People argue that if the 2nd amendment is removed - what's to stop the government changing the free speech laws? (1st amendment) or even the 4th amendment (unreasonable search and seizures)?

I think it's a valid argument if you are a law abiding and sane gun owner.

I still think there should be a licensed graduation system (like getting your drivers license) to own a gun and eventually to own a higher calibre gun and larger capacity magazines. If 18 year olds can't go out and drive a powerful V8 over here - I don't think they should be able to own a gun that can fire 45 rounds per minute.

[roddy1960]

Originally Posted by lucas2

CNN does lie, often. They will retract statements but the damage is often already done. CNN's problem is that they lie by omission. Something Fox news used to and probably is still known for. The difference being that Fox admits it is conservative and plays to that audience. CNN claims to be non-biased but I think everyone knows that isn't true. They are clearly anti-gun where Fox is very much pro-gun.

What's wrong with having news outlets actually not being overtly slanted either way ? If I watched Fox and Friends for any length of time at all I wouldn't have a TV pretty quick because I'd chuck a brick at it. They frustrate me with their Republican and pro 2nd Amendment NRA fuelled fantasies . When they do get anywhere near a Democrat , as soon as they argue much different they cut them off like no-one's business. That mob may just as well be on Trump's staff.

The best prospects in Washington these days for jobs are sign makers for the White House offices. It's about time they put revolving doors on the joint too seeing the staff come and go so often .

It'll be interesting to see what Dimwit Trump does with the import tariffs on steel and other stuff , especially if his crowd vote to levy it against us and other allies. I hope Turnbull had a word on that the other day with him.

[au350hp]

We rarely if ever get the truth about anything political these days. Without complete transparency, those in charge of the public's assets & taxes will always do what they want, which is to further their own agenda & financial gain. Why does everybody seem to overlook the fact these people are 'public servants'? When I was a kid, there was a general belief in society that many who went into public service did so because they couldn't cut it in the private sector & the wages at the time supported that. These days, their wage growth outstrips ours and the endless lists of benefits just grows the higher up the food chain you are, and who else gets a pension of $160,000 a year or more, for the rest of their lives? They have done nothing but drink from the public coffers & we tolerate this? I wonder who the bigger fools are sometimes.

[lucas2]

Originally Posted by roddy1960

What's wrong with having news outlets actually not being overtly slanted either way ? If I watched Fox and Friends for any length of time at all I wouldn't have a TV pretty quick because I'd chuck a brick at it. They frustrate me with their Republican and pro 2nd Amendment NRA fuelled fantasies . When they do get anywhere near a Democrat , as soon as they argue much different they cut them off like no-one's business. That mob may just as well be on Trump's staff.

I think you missed my point. I want news to be central with as little bias as possible. If it is going to be bias then admit that you are bias. Fox admits it's bias and you should take much of what they say with a grain of salt. I will say that Fox doesn't seem too happy with Trump's recent comments on gun control. If you feel like throwing a brick at your TV when watching Fox - I'd suggest changing the channel. You and I both know what they are like, so why bother watching it?

CNN claims to be the "most trusted name in news" (their motto) but if you've ever watched Don Lemon, Anderson Cooper and Brian Stelter who often have stacked panels, it becomes laughable.

[CoupeKing]

Another possible massacre stopped in it's tracks..that's about 6 or so since the Florida incident:

http://www.newsweek.com/texas-teen-t...-school-827461

http://time.com/5182797/rowlett-texa...l-diego-horta/

Wow!

[mick taylor]

Originally Posted by Roostercam

There are millions upon millions of guns in the states & stopping production will achieve nothing. Like any issue that keeps rearing it's head in society, EDUCATION is the answer. Start with the next generation, get them young and change the mentality. That is the only way to effect change with any issue, whether it be drugs, bullying or even the road toll.

Switzerland has more population ratio with guns than USA by far with no problems worth talking about, but the people are not like Americans culture at all.

The State of Israel Jews all have guns, but they are a militant State because they have to be because if they were not they would be all dead, I don't know how many Jews get shot by their own, but I am sure they are trained with guns correctly, but people in the USA are not trained people on the whole and that maybe much of the real problem.

The gun issue in the USA is about freedom rights and we know the History of Nations that took away such rights, have always went and killed all who oppose them.

Socialist Nations have a greatest track record that led to the murder of millions of their own people, but most people just disregard this fact, because they are totally ignorant and have no regard for history.

I remember the Head of the RSL old Bruce, informing people about this little fact and some people did not like such truth's being pointed out at all and got all wound up about it, I wonder why, why not educate people on the truth. who are this mob who love to stand over people ?

[Ross 1]

Originally Posted by mick taylor

Switzerland has more population ratio with guns than USA by far with no problems worth talking about, but the people are not like Americans culture at all.

Please quote your source on this data, I am having trouble finding anywhere that supports this. I can only find Switzerland at approx. half the guns per capita than the USA. The Swiss mainly have a basic firearm at home that they have kept after military service.

[Blue Shadow]

Originally Posted by Ross 1

Please quote your source on this data, I am having trouble finding anywhere that supports this. I can only find Switzerland at approx. half the guns per capita than the USA. The Swiss mainly have a basic firearm at home that they have kept after military service.

All I could find is this from wiki, so most likely not to accurate

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Esti...ita_by_country

[Blue Shadow]

Originally Posted by Blue Shadow

All I could find is this from wiki, so most likely not to accurate

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Esti...ita_by_country

Or this

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/ma...ies-with-the-m

[Ross 1]

Originally Posted by Blue Shadow

All I could find is this from wiki, so most likely not to accurate

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Esti...ita_by_country

Not too reliable a source but it does correspond with all the other sites I could find that put Switzerland no where near the USA in guns per capita, which is still not over half of the USA. To make a statement that the Swiss have, far more, is interesting but needs to have some form of study backing it.

[Ross 1]

Originally Posted by mick taylor

Socialist Nations have a greatest track record that led to the murder of millions of their own people, but most people just disregard this fact, because they are totally ignorant and have no regard for history.

Whilst you are fact checking re the gun ratio please supply source or clarify this statement as well, I don't know weather you are including famines induced by communist regimes as a form of murder of their citizens.

[solarite_guy]

Originally Posted by Ross 1

Not too reliable a source but it does correspond with all the other sites I could find that put Switzerland no where near the USA in guns per capita, which is still not over half of the USA. To make a statement that the Swiss have, far more, is interesting but needs to have some form of study backing it.

When it comes to wiki, the information shouldn't be straight discounted until you look at the references.

In this case, the source for the US in this link is reputable (Congressional Record), however it is from 2009. That said the direction went up over the course of the previous administration.

In the case of Switzerland the source is from University of Sydney School of Public Health. 2016. Retrieved 2017-04-20. Is that a reputable and accredited institution of learning? If yes, then you can be sure the numbers are were accurate enough for the time. Which is fairly recent.

[Ross 1]

Originally Posted by solarite_guy

In the case of Switzerland the source is from University of Sydney School of Public Health. 2016. Retrieved 2017-04-20. Is that a reputable and accredited institution of learning? If yes, then you can be sure the numbers are were accurate enough for the time. Which is fairly recent.

Awesome, thanks for that. Do you have a link.

[Blue Shadow]

Originally Posted by Ross 1

Not too reliable a source but it does correspond with all the other sites I could find that put Switzerland no where near the USA in guns per capita, which is still not over half of the USA. To make a statement that the Swiss have, far more, is interesting but needs to have some form of study backing it.

Yeah, what surprised me was Australia at 24.1 20th in the world

[Ross 1]

Originally Posted by solarite_guy

In the case of Switzerland the source is from University of Sydney School of Public Health. 2016. Retrieved 2017-04-20. Is that a reputable and accredited institution of learning? If yes, then you can be sure the numbers are were accurate enough for the time. Which is fairly recent.

Have found that study, thanks, still shows Switzerland way down the list compared to USA. I am just trying to see the study he found to state that Switzerland has more per capita than USA.

[solarite_guy]

Originally Posted by Ross 1

Awesome, thanks for that. Do you have a link.

Y/W.

The link to the reference is right in the wiki. Scroll down to Switzerland and look over to the 4th column. You will see: figures from 2016[12]. Click the 12. It will link to information in the footnotes.

The wiki folks usually do a good of of following up on included references.

[Ross 1]

Screen shot from Sydney uni study that has a graph showing, USA, Switzerland, Australia and Israel.

[solarite_guy]

Good graph.

YetI would have expected a slightly higher number for the US. Maybe around the 105 mark. But I could be misinterpreting the graph.

[solarite_guy]

Originally Posted by Ross 1

Have found that study, thanks, still shows Switzerland way down the list compared to USA. I am just trying to see the study he found to state that Switzerland has more per capita than USA.

Just thought of this. i wonder what the definition of possession is for this study? Does it include weapons issued? I would think the percentage of population who are issued weapons in both Israel and Switzerland would be higher, unless some of the requirements have changed over the years.

[au350hp]

://www.statista.com/topics/1287/firearms-in-the-us/

Highlight the above and follow the prompts to access all the current figures on gun ownership in the USA.

[solarite_guy]

The number of guns registered category is pretty interesting. Many people have guns that where purchased before registration at time of purchase became law. Additionally, in my state at least, there is no law making these people have to register these guns.

Additionally, black powder weapons do not require registration at time of purchase and fall outside of gun laws for the most part. I even had one state official tell me, black powder weapons are not considered guns.

Interesting, I have a .50 cal black powder Hawkin rifle that has the ballistics of a stout 30-30 and a .45 cal black powder revolver that has the ballistics of a .357 magnum. They can and have put boar and deer on the table. "Not guns".

[Bent8]

Switzerland has the 3rd highest gun ownership per citizen in the world and hasn't had a mass shooting since 2001... go figure.

https://www.businessinsider.com.au/s...-deaths-2018-2

The Israeli govt actually encourages gun ownership for civilians and since they began training and arming their teachers in schools, they have only had 2 shootings there since 1974.. both ending in the deaths of the shooters.

https://www.israelnationalnews.com/A...cle.aspx/21714

[GasoLane]

Originally Posted by Bent8

Switzerland has the 3rd highest gun ownership per citizen in the world and hasn't had a mass shooting since 2001... go figure.

https://www.businessinsider.com.au/s...-deaths-2018-2

That was 2007. In 2016 they were 18th on the ladder.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Esti...ita_by_country

[Bent8]

Let's see what happens...

http://video.foxnews.com/v/574011960...#sp=show-clips

[CoupeKing]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...-Parkland.html

[solarite_guy]

Originally Posted by CoupeKing

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...-Parkland.html

I'm sure these first person shooter games have "nothing" to do with these inclinations....