June 2007 new car sales

[Fordmuscle1965]

Originally Posted by Cuey

It's not that bad boys.....

We've got the new Mondeo to be launched in just over a month, the new focus to be realeased in the next few weeks, including a diesel version, we've also just had the XR4 released, with Focus Convertible to follow soon, plus the new marketing campaign with the XR8 ute, plus the price slashes announced early this week, not too mention another brand new car appearing between November and March

I think it's very exciting times, this is the worst it will get. Things will improve from here on in

I agree with you mate! Every Car company has its ups and downs and at the moment Ford is on hard times but it will swing around. I personally have not had any problems with my Ford service department, always been to willing to fix any warranty issue with my territory. If your not getting feedback on your business good or bad you WILL not improve.
FoMoCo will get their rider back on the horse soon enough and good times will be ahead. Look at the V8 supercars for example: Ford dominated for three years untill late last year and early this year when the VE had its moment in the sun, but that makes you try harder and we can see a little bit of sunlight poking through back on the Ford camps again. I for 1 am sticking with my brand of choice through thick and thin, all my ford cars have been very reliable old and new and I'm very happy with the blue oval badge I'll be digging in and never leave the Blue oval trench!! :

[|||]

While we're on the the topic of whitegoods consider the following.

Would you rather have:

a) a washing machine that is well engineered and gets the job done even if it is a little slow & dull.

or

b) a washing machine with a really fast spin cycle to impress your mates, but the build quality is terrible and it uses twice as much soap powder as the machine in a)

The only people choosing b) are washing machine enthusiasts or people staying loyal to the brand becuase their parents always bought them and they remember how clean their nappies were in 1972.

It's not hard to see why Toyota is killing Ford in the sales race.

[merlin]

Originally Posted by |||

While we're on the the topic of whitegoods consider the following.

Would you rather have:

a) a washing machine that is well engineered and gets the job done even if it is a little slow & dull.

or

b) a washing machine with a really fast spin cycle to impress your mates, but the build quality is terrible and it uses twice as much soap powder as the machine in a)

The only people choosing b) are washing machine enthusiasts or people staying loyal to the brand becuase their parents always bought them and they remember how clean their nappies were in 1972.

It's not hard to see why Toyota is killing Ford in the sales race.

I would choose the one with the really fast spin cycle as I often have parties where we all just sit around watching the washing machine. So yes fast spin cycle is impressive to me and also I like the 1.3 inch black wheels on the b) model.

[Quicksand]

Also in agreeance here and well put. It's easy to be biased being a Ford fan but Toyota do make very good quality vehicles and along side Subaru have the highest resale value for their vehicles. Add to that economy (fuel discussion already occured many times on here) and other marketing factors and it is no wonder they are doing so well. Honestly those Toyota's just keep going you can thrash em all day long; i lived in the country for a while trust me i know lol! Good times ahead!

Originally Posted by Fordmuscle1965

I agree with you mate! Every Car company has its ups and downs and at the moment Ford is on hard times but it will swing around. I personally have not had any problems with my Ford service department, always been to willing to fix any warranty issue with my territory. If your not getting feedback on your business good or bad you WILL not improve.
FoMoCo will get their rider back on the horse soon enough and good times will be ahead. Look at the V8 supercars for example: Ford dominated for three years untill late last year and early this year when the VE had its moment in the sun, but that makes you try harder and we can see a little bit of sunlight poking through back on the Ford camps again. I for 1 am sticking with my brand of choice through thick and thin, all my ford cars have been very reliable old and new and I'm very happy with the blue oval badge I'll be digging in and never leave the Blue oval trench!! :

[|||]

Originally Posted by merlin

I would choose the one with the really fast spin cycle as I often have parties where we all just sit around watching the washing machine. So yes fast spin cycle is impressive to me and also I like the 1.3 inch black wheels on the b) model.

Just watch your insurance. You can only go 9/16 of an inch above factory wheel size with most policies, so unless you are looking at the Whirlpool E-4000 series I'd stay below 1.2 inches.

[csv8]

Originally Posted by Cuey

It's not that bad boys.....

We've got the new Mondeo to be launched in just over a month, the new focus to be realeased in the next few weeks, including a diesel version, we've also just had the XR4 released, with Focus Convertible to follow soon, plus the new marketing campaign with the XR8 ute, plus the price slashes announced early this week, not too mention another brand new car appearing between November and March

I think it's very exciting times, this is the worst it will get. Things will improve from here on in

I thought the MONDEO wasn't being released until November ? good news if it is August, but thats same time as FOCUS ?

[new2ford]

Originally Posted by PepeLePew

I'd be interested to know how many of those Corollas were private sales and how many small fleet/government. They seem to be getting more popular with the small fleets these days...

I feel sorry for the government fleet managers who are pestered by the PC brigade to buy small hybrid cars instead of the "gas guzzling 4WDs" (referring to Ford Territory in one news report). If you turn to the NRMA operating costs guide (http://www.mynrma.com.au/cps/rde/xch...768EC-F2CF2A7B)
the Toyota Prius costs more to operate ($235.60 per week) than a RWD TX Territory ($234.44). This is because fuel costs are only part of the equation. There is service and parts, insurance, depreciation..... In the relevant tables the cheaper end is dominated by Australian made cars and the expensive end by imported.

Tom Gorman was simply stating the truth when he said that a diesel Territory wouldn't stack up economically for most buyers. Unfortunately we are a nation of uncritical buyers, fuel cost is everything (otherwise why would people pay more for their food at the supermarket just to get "cheaper" petrol - WTF?). So the marketing people have to say: put in a diesel/hybrid/LPG, people want it no matter how irrational. The NRMA is doing a great job with the operating costs guide but how many use them when buying a car? Likewise resistance (both by buyers and manufacturers) to public reliability surveys (like Powers) and supporting NCAP testing. There is some truth in the use of the term sheep when it comes to buying a car in Australia.

And yes a Corolla will cost less to operate than a Falcon (basic models, Corolla $152.43 a week, Falcon $228.13 a week) but you're not going to get your family, luggage and caravan onto a Corolla are you? Not comparing like with like. There is obviously a large sector of the market that only needs a small car. (Again interesting to note that there are small cars cheaper to operate than a Corolla - Viva and Focus included.) Who's rational?

Edit: BTW regarding the washing machine analogy, those operating costs take account of the cost of downtime for faults and yet still the Australian made cars are at the cheaper end of their cost categories. So is this really the big issue its made out to be?

[Dave_au]

Originally Posted by new2ford

I feel sorry for the government fleet managers who are pestered by the PC brigade to buy small hybrid cars instead of the "gas guzzling 4WDs" (referring to Ford Territory in one news report). If you turn to the NRMA operating costs guide (http://www.mynrma.com.au/cps/rde/xch...768EC-F2CF2A7B)
the Toyota Prius costs more to operate ($235.60 per week) than a RWD TX Territory ($234.44). This is because fuel costs are only part of the equation. There is service and parts, insurance, depreciation..... In the relevant tables the cheaper end is dominated by Australian made cars and the expensive end by imported.

Fleet managers are not being pestered to buy Hybrid cars. The Toyota Prius certainly isnt in the top 20 cars for the month, it's very much a moot point.

Infact the YTD figure of privately purchased Hybrid cars for 2007 is 783 and for fleets it is 1374. The low resale value and the high purchase costs are more off-putting to fleets than a normal 4cyl petrol or diesel.

What is happening however is a larger emphasis on the smaller car by fleets - it doesnt matter to business what capability these cars have for towing or carrying around 4 people because in most circumstances what your describing is what only occurs during private use. Most employers have no interest in providing you a company car to take on holidays.

[new2ford]

Originally Posted by Dave_au

Fleet managers are not being pestered to buy Hybrid cars. The Toyota Prius certainly isnt in the top 20 cars for the month, it's very much a moot point.

Infact the YTD figure of privately purchased Hybrid cars for 2007 is 783 and for fleets it is 1374. The low resale value and the high purchase costs are more off-putting to fleets than a normal 4cyl petrol or diesel.

What is happening however is a larger emphasis on the smaller car by fleets - it doesnt matter to business what capability these cars have for towing or carrying around 4 people because in most circumstances what your describing is what only occurs during private use. Most employers have no interest in providing you a company car to take on holidays.

It has been in the news that some govt/council agencies have been lobbied along these lines - indeed your figures suggest that more hybrids are going to fleets. You are right about the smaller cars for fleets though, I forgot to mention that. I wonder how much of lower Falcon sales and higher Corolla sales are due to fleets turning away from Falcons and other large cars in favour of small cars? How many of that big number of Corollas are fleet purchases?

My point about the irrationality of many private purchases remains though.

[aualright]

The Toyota perception is a good one, but even they have issues and here are 3 recent experiences:

1) Wife's previous car before the Territory was an IS200, bought new. Living on the Northern Beaches of Sydney saw early rust spots develop even though I am a chronic car washer. Oil used to require topping up between services - never had to do that with my other cars.
2) Neighbour has a V6 Avalon, bought new and is now about 4yrs old. He has always had chronic oil burning issues, especially at startup. Toyota refused to accept responsibility and always told him it was 'normal'.
3) Work colleague bought a new Yaris 2 weeks ago. Already back at the dealer with 'unspecified' electrical issues causing radio and dash lighting issues.

No bull, all true. I'm sure no.3 is easily fixed, but that isn't the point. Whilst some of the fit and finish in the Territory Ghia could be better (after all it is a $60k vehicle once onroad), it is mechanically tough and a really great drive (even surprised me). I'm sure the FPV Territory would exceed the Ghia in this regard.

****

[Dave_au]

Originally Posted by aualright

Whilst some of the fit and finish in the Territory Ghia could be better (after all it is a $60k vehicle once onroad), it is mechanically tough and a really great drive (even surprised me).

Its quite true Toyota will have their problems, likewise as we all know Ford has had problems too. What it's going to boil down to is brand experience and public perceptions.

[sleekism]

Here Is Two Interesting Facts:

1) Ford Was Voted Best Quality Car Brand In Britain

2) The Brand Spanking New Toyota Camry Has Been Recalled For A Leaking Roof Among Other Problems

[BAxtER]

Originally Posted by sleekism

Here Is Two Interesting Facts:

1) Ford Was Voted Best Quality Car Brand In Britain

2) The Brand Spanking New Toyota Camry Has Been Recalled For A Leaking Roof Among Other Problems

not to mention the fact that a few of my friends have aurions and bag the crap out of them...seating position, things inside falling to bits.

does anyone else know of unhappy aurion owners?

[XD 351 Ute]

Originally Posted by AussieJason

but Toyota do make a very good car.

Snipped your quote a bit, but I beg to differ here.

From my experience, the majority of newer cars are all rubbish.
Rubbish in the fact that they are not made to last, they are made to die, or be sacrificial in an accident to save the person/s inside.

Not that it's a bad thing, but this factor alone has removed any sense of enjoyment or feedback that you got from driving a car.

We have a brand new Hilux 4 x 4 in our workshop right now, and the majority of our crew don't like it.

Boring, bland, no character are all similar responses when asked about it.
Getting back to my first paragraph, it is this requirement of car design that gives us these results.

When you add the customer disatisfaction, and the build quality isses that a lot of people seem to have on this forum, and others like it, that is how I reach my stated opinion. I have used the Toyota as an example, but what from what I've seen of Ford and Holden, they have a lot to answer for too.

They're all turning into washing machines, and I won't waste my money on one until I have to.

Ed

[Falcon Freak]

Originally Posted by |||

While we're on the the topic of whitegoods consider the following.

Would you rather have:

a) a washing machine that is well engineered and gets the job done even if it is a little slow & dull.

or

b) a washing machine with a really fast spin cycle to impress your mates, but the build quality is terrible and it uses twice as much soap powder as the machine in a)

The only people choosing b) are washing machine enthusiasts or people staying loyal to the brand becuase their parents always bought them and they remember how clean their nappies were in 1972.

It's not hard to see why Toyota is killing Ford in the sales race.

c) a washing machine that has stripes and a bulge in the lid.

Originally Posted by Cuey

It's not that bad boys.....

It is worse then that. It is abysmal. Ford will only sell 30,000 odd Falcons in 2007 which makes it the worst year in more then four decades. Ford has cut is daily production from 520 to 360 a day. Even at 360 a day they are making more cars then they are selling. 2007 figures are 2/3 the figures of 2004 which wasn't that long ago.

FF

[Whitey-AMG]

Originally Posted by sleekism

Here Is Two Interesting Facts:

1) Ford Was Voted Best Quality Car Brand In Britain

2) The Brand Spanking New Toyota Camry Has Been Recalled For A Leaking Roof Among Other Problems

This is the reality of mass production. Defects are going to afflict every manufacturer. Despite some agitated people that have commented on here in earlier posts.......TOYOTA also has its fair share of manufacturing issues. I'm sure FORD, GM and especially TOYOTA all utilise a 6 sigma type program to reduce variation tolerances to an "acceptable" deviation. In fact TOYOTA pioneered this process so it ain't no surprise that they may be better at it !!!!!!!

At the end of the day, the sale numbers do the talking................

Interesting to note though......in the latest RACV magazine that there has been a shift in the growth ratio from small car to medium/large again. I recall reading that although small car sales were quite high, the large car sales were clawing this back. Possibly good news for ORION ???

Wish I still had the mag to quote the actual stats............

[XR Martin]

Originally Posted by BAxtER

not to mention the fact that a few of my friends have aurions and bag the crap out of them...seating position, things inside falling to bits.

does anyone else know of unhappy aurion owners?

I drove one and it had a nasty driveline thump when manually changing from 2nd to first. And a new Camry I drove there were parts of the center console falling apart.

[jdg]

Just out of interest, are Commodore and Falcon sales greater now or were they greater when competing with Mitsu Magna and Toyota Avalon?

[AussieJason]

Originally Posted by XD 351 Ute

Snipped your quote a bit, but I beg to differ here.

From my experience, the majority of newer cars are all rubbish.
Rubbish in the fact that they are not made to last, they are made to die, or be sacrificial in an accident to save the person/s inside.

Not that it's a bad thing, but this factor alone has removed any sense of enjoyment or feedback that you got from driving a car.

We have a brand new Hilux 4 x 4 in our workshop right now, and the majority of our crew don't like it.

Boring, bland, no character are all similar responses when asked about it.
Getting back to my first paragraph, it is this requirement of car design that gives us these results.

When you add the customer disatisfaction, and the build quality isses that a lot of people seem to have on this forum, and others like it, that is how I reach my stated opinion. I have used the Toyota as an example, but what from what I've seen of Ford and Holden, they have a lot to answer for too.

They're all turning into washing machines, and I won't waste my money on one until I have to.

Ed

New cars are going down in quality, yes. But whether we like it or not, Toyota still leads the way as far as reliability and reputation. I too find Toyota's bland, boring and with no character. The fact is though we are the minority. The sales figures worldwide speak for themselves.

[BAxtER]

looking at the sales and from peoples opinions here about toyota, they have good variety and cars that suit peoples needs, just a thought if Ford Australia will import the new c-max in the future (obviously not in 2 years cause no mention of it) but would this model work in Australia
http://www.ford.co.uk/ie/cmax/-/-/-/-/-/272246

or the s-max or top of the range galaxy which you can view under vehicles on the website

[sleekism]

It doesn't matter if Ford sells only a 1000 Falcons a month as long as they turn a profit they will be fine I'm pretty sure the Porsche factory is no bigger than the Broadmeadows factory.

BTW I have some respect for Toyota products eg. Supra, Soarer but the fact that they have abandoned this is annoying to say the least, imagine if Toyota concentrate on building a genuine large RWD sedan with a V8 option (3UZ-FE?).

Toyotas cynical approach towards consumers makes me sick and the fact that it works is unbelievable.

The torque steer in the Aurion is dangerous to say the least I hate to see what the supercharged Aurion is going to be like.

[Dave_au]

Originally Posted by sleekism

imagine if Toyota concentrate on building a genuine large sedan with a V8 option (3UZ-FE?).

They do. Unfortunately their so good Toyota would rather use them against the european premium sedans than our local standard efforts here.

[vztrt]

Looking at the figures from Drive, Fords has finally had a good month (you got remeber that they want to sell more then 3000 falcons a month). They dont built that many cars and have set up campbellfied for lower volume. I just hope they had an increase in private sales. Hope they can keep this up till orion.

Oh and big deal about Toyota, they need to sell large volume to turn a profit, unlike Ford.

[jodi]

Originally Posted by gz1

You don't think that quality control (or lack thereof) has anything to do with this do you?

actually i would say its defiately marketing, ford is definately a better product but lack of marketing lets it down but i think thats all about to change ( i hope)

[irlewy86]

People often wonder why Toyota tops car figures despite thier products being "bland". Truth is new car sales are made up of the unique combination of private and fleet sales. The Rolla always fairs well with the fleet purchasers but Toyota understands the complex nature of todays private new car buyer. 20 years ago most new car purchasers were the decision of a man (who traditionally likes power, aggression, size, local make). But today the majority of private new car purchases are driven be the female species. Toyota caters and has always been one step ahead of this cultural shift and ensures their cars are effiminate, good value for money, asthetically pleasing the female eye (gay colours like peach and fuschia instead of vermillion fire). Thier larger 4WD still maintain a strong blokey image but thier is the subtle hints in both thier marketing and sales and styling that a women would just as comfortable behind the wheel of a 100 series heading to the shops as a farmer crossing a floodeed creek to fetch some livestock.

One day all car companies will operate in such a manner and next time you step into a car yard the dealer may try to sway your decision by throwing in a free manicure with your next test drive.


I have my suicide pills at the ready.

[Falcon Freak]

Domestic sales of Australian made cars for June 2007 (June 2006)

Ford

Falcon: 3,206 (4,358) -26.4%
Territory: 2,056 (2,225) - 7.6%
Falcon ute: 1,261 (1,793) - 29.7%
Fairlane: 149 (157) - 5.1%
LTD: 0 (5) - 100%

Total: 6,672 (8,538) - 21.9%

Holden

Commodore: 5,588 (5,014) +11.4%
Utility 4x2: 1,132 (1.296) - 12.7%
Statesman: 261 (184) +41.8%
Caprice: 203 (27) +651.9%
Monaro: 10 (64) -84.4%
Adventra: 76 (260) -70.8%
Utility 4x4: 0 (60) -100%

Total: 7,270 (6,905) +5.3%

Toyota

Aurion: 2,626 (0) N/A
Camry 4cyl: 2,645 (1,395) +89.6%
Camry V6: 1 (997) - 99.9%
Avalon: 0 (2) -100%

Total: 5,272 (2,394) +120.2%

Mitsubishi

380: 877 (1,569) - 44.1%
Magna V6: 0 (22) - 100%
Verada: 0 (1) - 100%

Total: 877 (1,592) - 44.9%

Summary Australian industry

20,091 (19,429) +3.4%

Summary all new vehicle sales

105,097 (96,448) +9.0%

Imported vehicle market penetration

80.9% (79.9%)

In the mid 1990s more then half of all new cars sold in Australia were Australian made.

FF