Look what the stupid RTA told me I couldn't buy...

[Outbackjack]

Originally Posted by D1XR2C

Yep yep, it sucks. Most p platers are going to get to used to driving low powered cars, then soon as they are off their p's, out comes V8's, XR6T's and all that good stuff. With no experience at all.
Check my signature....

I'm not sure I understand your logic here. Is it better to get into a "high powered car" as soon as you get your license, or after you have some years on the road driving a "low powered car". I would have thought that the latter made better sence.

:eclipsee_

[XR8putts]

Bah, move to NZ. A 15yo can drive (and own) a Ferrari Enzo, so long as it's not after 10pm.

[70caprigt3k]

In qld P Platers can currently drive whatever the hell they want and i have noticed that the majority of P plate crashes i have seen involve a (for lack of a better discription) piece of crap car, They take the car thrash the living hell out of it, run over stuff, ram stuff etc etc because it doesn't matter its just a s**t box but if they have a decent car (be it high performance or not) they will tend to respect it more and treat it well therefore being a safer driver and these laws force young drivers to have a s**tbox to an extent. Its not foolproof logic i know and there will be exceptions but its based on my observations/experiences. Sweet landy too.

[Outbackjack]

Originally Posted by puts99

Bah, move to NZ. A 15yo can drive (and own) a Ferrari Enzo, so long as it's not after 10pm.

Better still, come to the Territory and enjoy open speed limits. And anyway, who wants to live with crappy NZ weather...... :

[poolkeeper]

Originally Posted by Outbackjack

I'm not sure I understand your logic here. Is it better to get into a "high powered car" as soon as you get your license, or after you have some years on the road driving a "low powered car". I would have thought that the latter made better sence.

:eclipsee_

Well not big horsepower cars, normally aspirated v8 would be alright. My point was that "hooning" there is no stop to it. I know of people that take risks simply because their sigma or camry cant give them a thrill of power.
And Im starting to be one...

[poolkeeper]

Originally Posted by 70caprigt3k

In qld P Platers can currently drive whatever the hell they want and i have noticed that the majority of P plate crashes i have seen involve a (for lack of a better discription) piece of crap car, They take the car thrash the living hell out of it, run over stuff, ram stuff etc etc because it doesn't matter its just a s**t box but if they have a decent car (be it high performance or not) they will tend to respect it more and treat it well therefore being a safer driver and these laws force young drivers to have a s**tbox to an extent. Its not foolproof logic i know and there will be exceptions but its based on my observations/experiences. Sweet landy too.

100% agreed

[TIRED6]

I can't agree with the laws. Whats the point of driving 4cyl then jumping straight to 8cyl. I have a 1980 Corty 4cyl, and a 1978 F100 V8. I would rather have the weight and solidarity of a full sized motor in front of me if i hit sumfin. Because i can do 160km/h just as easily in the corty as in the truck.
I was fortunate enough to learn to drive in a v8 xb coupe. lotsa power and no weight. But i soon learnt that you need to respect the vehicle and the roads as i have had some learning experiences.

But wether a 4,6, or 8cyl. I can still get into trouble regardless. 100% agreed with above statement.

[Outbackjack]

Originally Posted by D1XR2C

Well not big horsepower cars, normally aspirated v8 would be alright. My point was that "hooning" there is no stop to it. I know of people that take risks simply because their sigma or camry cant give them a thrill of power.
And Im starting to be one...

Well, it all comes back to attitude then. If a driver doesn't have the right attitude, then he/she shouldn't have a license. If you need a thrill, of power, or any other type of driving thrill, join a car club and get your thrills in a controlled environment. You will learn how to drive properly as well. And its a truck load of fun.

[MRJUCY]

I haven't looked in months but when the list of banned cars was released the Courier Turbo Diesel was banned for some bizarre reason despite most diesels being exempt.

[Bluehoon]

I see the logic behind the ruling, however whether is a BF F6, or a 1982 Honda Civic, they both can still do enough speed to cause damage to people.

The civic just takes longer to get up speed....

They are trying, but sadly it's cat and mouse.......... :

im so glad i never had to go through all that as id hate to be told what bike i could ride and what car i couldnt drive

[poolkeeper]

And to make matters worst my dads got a pursuit, with goodies. Ive been into cars since I was like, i dunno 6 :

[460cixy]

thats a realy good price i would grab that im looking at a geting a diesel defender at the moment. as for dumb rules when i got my range rover i was 17 i went to insure it with nrma i think it was from memery and thay basicly said no its a v8. i said its a 3.5 liter v8 in a 2 ton truck thay said no i hung up

[pauljh74]

Originally Posted by ea_silver_ghia

Thst's ridiculous. I've read about the cars NSW P-platers can't drive, and there are some real weird ones. You wouldn't be able to drive any turbos either, ruling out all the turbo diesels. Also, you can't drive a Smart car because it has a turbocharged 3 cylinder engine, with nearly 45kW! Talk about high powered! And some of the safest cars on the planet, Volvo and Saab are ruled out because a lot of them are fitted with turbos. This shows how little idea the government has on car safety. Thankfully, in Victoria, they still use power-to-weight ratios to determine which cars a P-plater can drive (but I believe that may be changing to the NSW system). It's just ridiculous

Yes the Vic government are proving they are even more stupid - because they are copying someone else's stupid idea. The power to weight and/or capacity to weight was a fair system. I could understand higher performance turbo motors banned, but low power small capacity turbo engines getting banned is stupid, as well as allowing hi-po N/A 4 cylinder cars, but banning lower power V8s with less power than a current 4 cylinder Camry.

[jimmy_c]

The funny thing is you cant drive any 6cyl porsche yet i know for a fact some of them are slower than an xf but you can buy any 6cyl powered BA falcon with more power than some holden and ford v8s. take it to whom ever you please and get the tits worked off it.

or if you can afford it build up a 13sec Banks turboed F250.


Beat the idiots with the own rules. may not be as cool with the girls but you still have a High HP moving road block.

If they had put in decent rules in place with TRAINING then i would be all for them but like everything else KNEE JERK to a government created problem.

next they will be telling us how to drive. Im glad off my Ps and i got the car I WANTED and not some POS Mr Lemma told me i couldnt drive.

[Steffo]

Originally Posted by 70caprigt3k

In qld P Platers can currently drive whatever the hell they want and i have noticed that the majority of P plate crashes i have seen involve a (for lack of a better discription) piece of crap car, They take the car thrash the living hell out of it, run over stuff, ram stuff etc etc because it doesn't matter its just a s**t box but if they have a decent car (be it high performance or not) they will tend to respect it more and treat it well therefore being a safer driver and these laws force young drivers to have a s**tbox to an extent. Its not foolproof logic i know and there will be exceptions but its based on my observations/experiences. Sweet landy too.

Agree 100%. A change I noticed within myself going from a '91 Nissan Pintara that I ended up selling for $400 to a new Fiesta Zetec.

Its not only that though, high performance cars are safer. For good reason. They have better brakes, suspension, grip etc. They can stop faster, they're better able to avoid accidents. A 20 year old POS Camry or Magna/Sigma has poor brakes that lock up very easily, horrible suspension and an appaling chassis and about zero ability to avoid anything.

The restriction thing is garbage. In the not too distant future I hope to buy a $40,000 VW Golf 2.0 TDI DSG (prefectly legal for a P-Plater, despite the fact that it can outrun a BA/BF XT, or say... a V8 EL Falcon... and its turbo so its an easy thing to mod, but its diesel so apparantley that doesn't matter).

Now, if I didn't want something the least bit practical or comfortable, I could buy something like this...

http://www.carsales.com.au/pls/carsa...c=3&make_id=42

Lets see some of its vitals...

1.8 litre inline-four, naturally aspirated, 88kW (great in the RTA's opinion).

0-100km/h in 5.5 seconds (hmm?)
0-400m in 13.5 seconds (hmm?)

So lets see here. Its an n/a 4 cyl, that's fine. No matter it can out accelerate an FPV GT, out corner almost anything, good chance of losing it with an unexperienced drivers, especially as it lacks ABS, and almost any other passive saftey thing most normal cars have, is super stiff etc. Its pretty much a street legal race car, that's P-Plate legal.

Great legislation there.

It gets funnier though.... only the 987 Boxster (2005+) is banned. The 986 (1997-2004) is perfectly ok. So a P-Plater with a rich daddy, or who was fortunate enough to make some success for themselves early in life can step into a 986 Boxster S (3.2 litres, 191kW, 5.7 sec to 100, 13.9 1/4 mile, 250km/h top whack) if they like.

The 993, 996 and 997 naturally aspirated Porsche 911's are banned. That spans 1994-Present. It leaves the 964 and older models (1963-1993) exempt. A 964 Carrera 3.6 can be had for 40-60k, with a sub 5 sec 0-100km/h time... nice.

Then you have the Porsche 944 S2. Can be had for $20-$30k. 3.0 Four-Cylinder, capable of low 14's and low 6's to 100km/h. And its successor, the Porsche 968 and the more aggressive 968 ClubSport. They have the same 164kW 3.0 n/a inline-four, and they're just as fast. Also perfectly P-Plater legal.

Great legislation RTA. Its quite clear that there is a massive amount of brainpower being put to legislating what young people can drive in this state.

:

[poolkeeper]

Well said^

[poolkeeper]

Just in, page 9 daily telegraph
Double the deaths since new p plate laws introduced.....
Check it out

[Zetec20]

another thing I've noticed is the charade turbos are banned!

I'm sure a 1L 3cyl turbo is going to cause so much trouble too, a normal corolla can go faster...

[TEaaron]

We get the same pwoer restrictions coming to vic in june 2007 so I just get them and they're not thought out at all, it's stupid.

I can jump in a brand new bf falcon with 190kw but I'm no way aloud to drive a stock 302 cleveland with 142kw?

Also they're banning any performance enhancing engine mods, and high performance N/A 6cyls as well as turbo and supercharged cars.

So what this means is I can jump in a japenese S2000 honda Vtec or a N.A 20b rotary.

They should have kept the old ones they made alot more sence, power to weight ratio restrictions, banning a car because of how many cylenders it has or how the air gets fed into the engine is totaly stupid in my opinion. There are so many faults in these new laws and they're not going to stop "hoons" all they're going to do is make them do stupid things in different cars.

If they really wanted to make the roads safer they should encourage taking your car to a track rather than waiting at the bottom of steep hills with speed cameras.

[70caprigt3k]

With that sort of logic they should just ban everything for P platers because essentially you can hoon in any type of car, Before i had my license my mum had a 1.0L dihatsu sirion for a bit and i managed to rip up the handbrake and get the fronts spinning in that thing in our front yard (acerage). Instead of wasting time and money on a pretty much un-winnable war against performance cars they should instead educate drivers i.e. a mandatory driver training course for first year p platers etc. etc. which i think could make a world of difference. Its one thing to do something stupid on the roads but its another to be able to pull yourself out of it if it starts to get hairy.

[Yaw]

I don't understand your problem....It is very definitly a high powered vehcile, why would you think it owuld be ok??????????????????????

[Yaw]

Originally Posted by 70caprigt3k

In qld P Platers can currently drive whatever the hell they want and i have noticed that the majority of P plate crashes i have seen involve a (for lack of a better discription) piece of crap car, They take the car thrash the living hell out of it, run over stuff, ram stuff etc etc because it doesn't matter its just a s**t box but if they have a decent car (be it high performance or not) they will tend to respect it more and treat it well therefore being a safer driver and these laws force young drivers to have a s**tbox to an extent. Its not foolproof logic i know and there will be exceptions but its based on my observations/experiences. Sweet landy too.

Are you aware as of July 2007 QLD will have similar laws as VIC and NSW?, Its pretty much guaranteed now since Premier Pete got back in with his huge majority.