Changing lanes banned in Burnley Tunnel

[schmidty]

Originally Posted by tickford2001

sounds like another good reason not to use it!

merging in from kings way, right behind a truck, and having to follow it all the way up the hill will be great...especially if its fully laden and doing about 20-30kmh

Fully loaded i can quite comfortably pull out of the tunnel doing the speed limit, but some doubles pull out of there at 30 - 40kmh. I also cant stand ******* on the monash that do 70 - 80kmh in clear light traffic, then look at you like you're scum when you pass them at $1 in a truck.

I was coming through the tunnel this morning thinking knocking the speed back to 60 would make it much safer for all. It lowers the difference in speed between the cars sitting on the limit and the slow trucks, which is a good thing. Also if there was another accident you'd like to think that the severity would be reduced due to the lower speeds.

By banning changing lanes, everyone is just going to be in the right lane to avoid getting stuck behind anyone slow, and some goose will still wreck it for everyone and slow the lane down and still not be able to get out to let people through. Also if there is a breakdown, and lane changing is banned, when people have to do it to get around it'll be a foriegn action to them in the tunnel and it makes things more dangerous. People will get used to not having to anticipate movement between the lanes.

[GXL078]

Originally Posted by adrianb

Wouldn't know - Stage 3a restrictions!

Much more of this nonsense and I'm going back home to WA.

At least you can drive your cross-city tunnel for free

[T_Terror]

How do you guys think theyll plan on enforcing it?

I could only come with either the licence plate readers at the start and finish would match each car and raise a flag if one was in a differnet lane to where ti started.

The only worry i would have is people watching the cameras inside the tunnel and using footage to prosecute you.
But then again that would be HUGELY man-power intensive.

Would it be better to avoid attention by not using indicators?


Am I the only one whos uses the tunnel here? WHat do you do when the trucks are struggling UP the tunnel at 40-50kmh and a camry is blocking the right hand lane and doing 60? I usually overtake and everybody is happy. Im im stuck in a lane and some goose is scared to push the pedal then id be putting some road rage up his *** to get him moving.

[Charliewool]

When the Westgate bridge was first built (back in the days of the toll-booths), it was illegal to change lanes whilst on it.. This created absolute chaos (and countless accidents).. Especially to anyone who'd never driven over it before!
I also love the $183 + 3 demerits that this new rule carries.. Great man our Bracksie!

[Mechan1k]

Originally Posted by chief

That is correct GK5766. The only tunnel you can not change lanes in is the M2. They have a safty sigh advising drivers to turn their headlights on as they enter the tunnel. Pretty stupid when the tunnel is only what 250m or so long and its strait.

ANd now since West bound is 3 lanes now .... they managed to squeeze the original 2 lanes into 3 (with no breakdown lane).

And drop the speed limit from 100km/h to 70km/h ... and the first night of full traffic ... some idiot couldn't handle the narrow lanes and took out 4 cars in the process.

Good ol' NSW Labor party traffic planning at it's best again ... gotta love it.

During the day the tunnel is bloody dark ... but at night ... it's lit up like the MCG ... it way too bright and glary.

[Brent]

Why there isn't a truck free lane is beyond me. Also, if there aren't any trucks in a specified lane then you won't have to worry about being caught behind a slow one. Should extend to the whole Westgate freeway as well. Other countries do this and it works so much better. Cuts down on the ducking and diving and frustration levels quite significantly.

[T3ts50]

What about emergency vehicles. Just say that it is 5.30 in the afternoon all lanes are crawling in the tunnel and an ambo needs to get past? are you supposed to stay in the same lane and not let it past you?

[Keepleft]

Originally Posted by xcgxl

Been banned in the M2 tunnel since it opened, but that didn't stop a black Mazda 6 from changing lanes and speeding past me this afternoon (the nob). Looks like they have put the speed limit down to 70Km/h permenantly now.

Originally, you could change lanes in the short M2 tunnel, that was changed to a prohibition AND a change was made to lighting on approach so that the transition in lighting intensity was not as pronounced.

Speed limit changes were made that allowed 100 and 110km/h for a part.

Overtaking prohibitions are best suited to shortish tunnels, not ones exceeding 1,000-1,500 metres.

The M2 70km/h you see is not long term. Third lane construction will see the temporary removal of the hard shoulder in parts for a couple of years or three, and a lower typical speed limit of 70km/h will appy with even lower limits as decided during construction phase.

The M2 as a road, is not particularly well designed and was created back in the days of Nick Greiner. Consultants and local government politics played a part as to why the road is so badly designed.

No 'seperated' central bus lane, delinneation etc.

The F3 to M2 tunnels will ensure a long term mess in current design, let alone 'political' route selection, I promise, and I'm a roads fella.

I will begin soon a quite campaign to ensure the F3-M2 tunnels are constructed with emergency shoulders AND that future expansion for three lanes is made rather than risk one day losing the emergency lanes.

This project it must be realised is of national importance, NO state-like shortcuts in design quality must be made. I know 'exactly' how the spin folk are going to play this once we discuss emergency shoulders, and most here can predict this.

[xdc351]

There's something being jerked here but I'm not so sure its a knee.

Bracks has lost the plot... this will create traffic chaos at peak hour and I especially can't wait to see how they setup the signs etc. I'm tipping 125 signs in total, 50 to tell you how to get to where you want to go and another 50 to contradict the first 50 signs with vague and confusing arrows and diagrams and at least 25 signs reminding you that speed kills and blah blah blah.

Something like the end of the monash where it splits into 5 lanes (3 to the hallam bypass and 2 to the sth gippsland fwy)... but the arrow for the 5th lane hangs over the 4th lane and makes the 3rd look like an ongoing one, only to find it ends 150m after you get over the top of the hill forcing anyone unfortunate enough to be caught in it to merge into the 2nd lane @ 100kmh... nice planning you 'tards.

Best of luck to those that have to use the tunnel daily once this kicks in.

[TZENU]

Looks like the government wants to and continues on insisting, on learning the hardway....Stupid really

[melbzetec]

Originally Posted by Outbackjack

This Brax guy is a genius. First he builds the cheapest tunnel possible. Charges a fortune to drive in the thing. Then when it becomes apparent that the thing is dangerous and has cost lives, he makes new laws that will bring in even more money. Jeeez he is good!! No wonder you Victorians keep voting for him!!

Kennet built the tunnel and introduced tolls, not Bracks.

But don't let the facts get in the way of a good story.

[Pistol]

Most accidents happen due to lane changing or merging traffic there are drivers that are too lazy to use their mirrors. Or to put it blantly just dumb.

[Keepleft]

Someone at LS1 reports a story relating to this issue on tonights 'A Current Affair', about trucks etc.

Another bashing excersize maybe??

Just a heads up.

[Full Noise]

Originally Posted by Keepleft

Someone at LS1 reports a story relating to this issue on tonights 'A Current Affair', about trucks etc.

Another bashing excersize maybe??

Just a heads up.

No maybe about it.

The promo shows a Freightliner trying to change lanes and contacting the right-hand side of a Merc, ending in the old PIT manoeuvre. The car was in front of the truck’s mirror and was in a blind spot.
Does anyone out there think that this bloke would have changed lanes if he could see the car there?

This was an unfortunate accident and an error of judgement from the truck driver and ACA, typically want to turn it into one of their highway horror stories.

Typical one sided ACA garbage.

[Outbackjack]

Originally Posted by melbzetec

Kennet built the tunnel and introduced tolls, not Bracks.

But don't let the facts get in the way of a good story.

I guess that what I get for not living in the countries premier police state.

[Full Noise]

Originally Posted by Outbackjack

The countries premier police state.

That’s what it’s turning into.

[Keepleft]

Numerous faults in the story, if you saw it.

The lady should have kept left, EVEN THOUGH "Keep Left Unless Overtaking" does not apply to 80km/h zones UNLESS SIGNPOSTED.

As is typical, in Australia the MIDDLE LANE is the left lane when on three-laned sections.

The chef, if he was telling the truth about being unlicensed, should do jail time, he won't of course but a small fine will be imposed.

The boat being towed at over 100km/h, trouble. Many driving errors exhibited all over the story.

A major problem is the low speed limit that bunches traffic up. Nothing will improve things till these are removed or raised.

[SavageF6]

Originally Posted by BJ

What a load of bullshit. Why not just close the bloody thing and be done with it.

Thats a clever comment.

[GXL078]

Originally Posted by Keepleft

The lady should have kept left, EVEN THOUGH "Keep Left Unless Overtaking" does not apply to 80km/h zones UNLESS SIGNPOSTED.

I thought it was 80 or above unless otherwise signposted, but I had a look at the Australian Road rules and it says "above 80Km/h"
And why did the Merc driver jump into the middle lane next to the truck? Why do Merc drivers do anything? Three lane roads are iherintly dangerous, too much choice. M2 (two lanes) is safer than the M4 (3 lanes), soon they will add extra lane to M2, watch how number of crashes goes up. That chef in the VN is a goon. I wonder what else he cooks up besides food,

[Dr Smith]

Originally Posted by 1QWKF6

Did you Victorians really vote this **ck head into Government. What a knee jerk reaction. :monkes:
Come the revolution out:

Just to set the record straight and end the silly party politics issue, in fact it is the coroner charged with holding the investigation into the tunnel road deaths that came out last week at the start of his inquest and stated that if any changes to increase safety within the tunnels were considered appropriate then they should be implemented now and not after the inquest is finished. He also called for public feedback now rather then later. It is only after Vicroads, Police, engineering and road saftey experts and Citylink, the tunnel operator, discussed the matter that the new changes have been announced. Hardly knee jerk stuff and after the coroner's report maybe things will be changed again. Let's remember that it's our safety everyone is working on and not raising money because the fines are purely voluntary, if you stay legal you don't pay...

[schmidty]

Still chilling to watch that video no matter who's in the right/wrong whatever.

Would love to put a camera in the truck sometimes in peak times on the monash or the frankston freeway, western ring rd, princes fwy. Its actually quite scary some of the things you see and some of the near misses that occurr so frequently. Winter is going to be interesting.

1 other huge thing that just spins me out, is the amount of people sending text messages now on the road! And from all age groups and walks of life. Young mums make me angry, precious little kids in the car and more worried about sending an sms thanthe lives of their young ones at the time.

1 flaw i see with the ban on lane changing is that it is in my opinion going to cause a large increase in tailgating and many will be likely to automatically go for the right lane before they enter the tunnel in a bid to hopefully avoid the slower traffic.

[FPV8U]

Originally Posted by Full Noise

No maybe about it.

The promo shows a Freightliner trying to change lanes and contacting the right-hand side of a Merc, ending in the old PIT manoeuvre. The car was in front of the truck’s mirror and was in a blind spot.
Does anyone out there think that this bloke would have changed lanes if he could see the car there?

This was an unfortunate accident and an error of judgement from the truck driver and ACA, typically want to turn it into one of their highway horror stories.

Typical one sided ACA garbage.

Yep the normal ACA garbage, onboard with some stupid women who was paranoid about trucks watching her speed like a hawk and essentially her driving is in my view the cause of that accident, be ACA don't let the facts get in the way of a great story, hell you grabbed a driver that was able to cause a truck accident on your camera, great work. :

When i was younger i used to go in a Semi with my pop everyday, i have seen first hand some of the stupid things people do around trucks and it's much, much worse today.

These laws for the tunnel are a joke that will no doubt cause more frustration and no doubt no money for old Bracksy to blow on doing bugger all...

People losing licences for changing lanes and avoiding congestion, now there is an idea... he's a thinker _

[Elks]

What a stupid concept.

For instance. How does someone who isn't familar take the richmond exit? Will they know to be in the left lane before they enter the tunnel? Probably not. So last minute larry cuts across 3 lanes at the exit of the tunnel? That is a recipie for disaster.

The coroner has not released his recommendations yet has asked the Govt to act on them. That is dumb. But wait there's more. The pack of idiots that hold office in this state have not waited for the coroners findings to to implement them!!! That's even dumber!. How did they know what to do if there is no considered recommendations? Or was this simply a case of politics and "being seen to do something".

I think that this was a freak accident and almost any level of planning could not have preventeded it.

This state is so over regulated and monitored road wise that people are right to blame the current governmet. Cameras are everywhere. and seroiusly punitive. I know of a truckie whos company has been hit with a fine for 102kph, thats right people 102kph, between Broadford and Epping the timed cameras on the Hume. Thats how they will police it.

The scary part is this mentality is about to run the country.


Victoria - The nanny state..

[Dezza]

Originally Posted by Dr Smith

Just to set the record straight and end the silly party politics issue, in fact it is the coroner charged with holding the investigation into the tunnel road deaths that came out last week at the start of his inquest and stated that if any changes to increase safety within the tunnels were considered appropriate then they should be implemented now and not after the inquest is finished. He also called for public feedback now rather then later. It is only after Vicroads, Police, engineering and road saftey experts and Citylink, the tunnel operator, discussed the matter that the new changes have been announced. Hardly knee jerk stuff and after the coroner's report maybe things will be changed again. Let's remember that it's our safety everyone is working on and not raising money because the fines are purely voluntary, if you stay legal you don't pay...

Where are they listening to public feedback? From what I understand, they are bringing in this new law without asking any of the public's opinion. If they were looking for public feedback, they would see that the majority oppose the new tunnel law, and it wouldn't be implemented.

[Dr Smith]

Originally Posted by ea_silver_ghia

Where are they listening to public feedback? From what I understand, they are bringing in this new law without asking any of the public's opinion. If they were looking for public feedback, they would see that the majority oppose the new tunnel law, and it wouldn't be implemented.

As I said it's the sitting coroner that has asked for feedback from the public to help formulate his recommendations once the inquest is complete.

[SB076]

Originally Posted by Dr Smith

As I said it's the sitting coroner that has asked for feedback from the public to help formulate his recommendations once the inquest is complete.

Only concern I have with that, is that the coroners job is to determine cause of death (correct me if I am wrong) Any recommendations he/she has to make regarding the tunnel should be forwarded to the appropriate road safety department for action.

My only concern is that the government has convinced itself that "camera's cut crashes" despite no evidence of a decline in the road toll (as was noticed when seat belts became mandatory)

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by FPV8U

Yep the normal ACA garbage, onboard with some stupid women who was paranoid about trucks watching her speed like a hawk and essentially her driving is in my view the cause of that accident, be ACA don't let the facts get in the way of a great story, hell you grabbed a driver that was able to cause a truck accident on your camera, great work. :

When i was younger i used to go in a Semi with my pop everyday, i have seen first hand some of the stupid things people do around trucks and it's much, much worse today.

These laws for the tunnel are a joke that will no doubt cause more frustration and no doubt no money for old Bracksy to blow on doing bugger all...

People losing licences for changing lanes and avoiding congestion, now there is an idea... he's a thinker _

you cant seriously believe for one second the driver carrying the camera caused that accident?????!!!!!!
For starters that car was atleast 30-40 metres ahead of the truck.
The Truck driver changed lanes into a car just forward of its front wheels, he clipped the rear 1/4 of the benz and spun it into the front of the truck sideways and continued to drive for what seemed like over 100m's before he realised what had happened. In this instanse It was clearly the truck driver who caused the accident, and i must say it was rather scary watching it unfold, im sure the tunnel opperators felt vindicated with their decission to ban lane changes after seeing it...

[SB076]

From what I saw on the ad, the benz did a good job not to flip

I would be interested to see what actually caused the accident in the tunnel, was the driver on his phone? Was he watching his speedo rather than the road - dont laugh go through the tunnel as a passenger and watch the drivers around you - lots of people looking down at the speedo.

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by SB076

From what I saw on the ad, the benz did a good job not to flip
.

Yes, it was VERY lucky it didnt roll or it would have been game over.. Im still astounded by the footage and how long it took for the truck driver to realise there was a benz accross his front bumper, the ad is only a snip, you need to see the whole footage to appreciate what and how it happened, and how lucky the benz driver was to escape..

[schmidty]

That accident also shows how the new FUPS (Front Underrun Protection System) compliant front bars will help stop accidents like that becoming more serious.

If that driver in the Argosy didnt change lanes so aggressively he may not have ended up in that predicament, as more than likely the Merc driver may have had more of a chance to take evasive action, or the merc might have moved enough out of his blindspot for it to be seen. It is also a big design Flaw with the Argosy's that they dont have a lower window in the passenger door. If i've got a car sitting below my mirror in the IVECO, you can see them no worried through the lower viewing window in the door. In the argosy, you can only see when they are in your mirror, or almost the length of the car in front or you.

I've been getting so frustrated in the last few days that trucks and truck drivers are being made out to be the bullies of the road, yet i'm getting cut off a or being cut in on every 3 - 4 minutes! Drop back, regain your gap, someone else tries to swap paint with your front bumper. I was cut in front of, with less than 2m between my bumper and the mercedes that cut in front of me, then he hit the brakes, right in the bottom of the burnley tunnel. Then second time through the burnley today, someone in the right lane pulling out of the tunnel with a caravan doing 35 - 40kmh, everyone riding with meters to spare and weaving lanes. It's really getting bad.