Are 4×4 dual cabs family cars?

[Falcon Coupe]

A dual cab may not do everything well, but what else can do everything?
Whilst they are a compromise nothing else is as versatile. You can see over much of the traffic mount gutters without rim rash carry tools and go camping at places inaccessible to 2wd's without the bother of a trailer slowing things down.

Do i wish I had the comfort of my Territory driving to the city loaded with tools? Hell yes. But for a 2000kg load carrying 4wd to average 10l per 100 it does me just fine.
The rear seats are not quite at Falcon spec but hey, my kids prefer the Territory 3rd row anyway




The new Amarok is a nice bit of gear with twin turbo and 8 speed auto, economy is fantastic in the mid 8's per 100.

[DJR-351]

This always makes me laugh, when those of us mates that have 4WD ute's or dual cabs mention we are planning on going on a week or two fishing/camping trip to some out of the way place, the first ones to put up their hands for a seat are the same ones who continually bag them out and would rather die than buy one.....go figure

[chevypower]

Originally Posted by DJR-351

This always makes me laugh, when those of us mates that have 4WD ute's or dual cabs mention we are planning on going on a week or two fishing/camping trip to some out of the way place, the first ones to put up their hands for a seat are the same ones who continually bag them out and would rather die than buy one.....go figure

Never had a car driver say no to being pulled out of a ditch/mud/snow

[chevypower]

Originally Posted by dirtyclevo

what are these like?

Jeep Wrangler unlimited overlander/rubicon

i was thinking about looking at one but not sure about them. i know they are tough. i like how the all the doors and roof come off.

image

Best you can get for off-road (stock that is). Dana 44 axles, ultra low low range gear, front and rear diff locks, electronic sway bar disconnect. Excellent articulation. I wish they would offer a diesel in the Rubicon. I also think they need a lift and bigger tyres for serious off-road. Sure they are not the best on-road, but for me that adds to the fun factor.

[dirtyclevo]

Originally Posted by chevypower

Best you can get for off-road (stock that is). Dana 44 axles, ultra low low range gear, front and rear diff locks, electronic sway bar disconnect. Excellent articulation. I wish they would offer a diesel in the Rubicon. I also think they need a lift and bigger tyres for serious off-road. Sure they are not the best on-road, but for me that adds to the fun factor.

I've looked at the wrangler unlimited overland a bit (the one in the picture)



it seems to be more of a road goer. but unfortunately it only comes in auto.

I like that they drive a bit like a truck. I loved driving this landcruiser 70 series ute years ago, had the turbo diesel straight 6 manual, it was great. it pulled like a train!

[JC]

Originally Posted by dirtyclevo

I've looked at the wrangler unlimited overland a bit (the one in the picture)

image

it seems to be more of a road goer. but unfortunately it only comes in auto.

I like that they drive a bit like a truck. I loved driving this landcruiser 70 series ute years ago, had the turbo diesel straight 6 manual, it was great. it pulled like a train!

Ummm, that's not a dual cab; that's a 4 x 4 wagon......

We have looked at all of the twin cab utes around, and none of them has anything like the back (middle row) seat of our explorer - we have 10 yo twins and an 8 yo - in reality, they are all roughly the same size and will only grow over the next 5 years+. I would love a ranger or other dual cab ute, but until these companies get more serous about having a proper 3 seat back seat (most have decent outboard seats, but the middle is half the size and is just sort of stuck in between with uncomfortable seatbelt buckle position), we will stick with what we have.

[ebxr8240]

Smaller trucks DON'T have particle filters..
NOT all big trucks have them !!
One thing to be aware of is changing own on long hills as the turbo busts its guts
to keep engine speed.. On an auto this isn't such an issue as they change down anyway..

[dirtyclevo]

[Cheese3]

Dual cabs are fine for families!

[johnydep]

Originally Posted by ebxr8240

Smaller trucks DON'T have particle filters..
NOT all big trucks have them !!
One thing to be aware of is changing own on long hills as the turbo busts its guts
to keep engine speed.. On an auto this isn't such an issue as they change down anyway..

What do you class as "smaller" and "big" trucks?

The Mitsubishi Triton & Nissan Navara have Particulate filters. most, if not all, diesel vehicle that meets Euro 4 will have a particulate exhaust filter.

[bigsta]

they are a compromise car but in life you gotta make compromises really.

the trucks from thailand, colarado, ranger, hilux etc IMO are just that trucks on the road they are not that quick but in 4x4 format go great off road.

because they are commercial vehicles they do not have to meet the same ADR that cars do so dont have the nice crumple zones and safety features on todays cars.

IMO the holden crewman is the best compromise out there, drives like a car but has the versatility of a ute but the tray is not as big as a ute and the cabin is not as big as a sedan.

was very close to getting a navara, until i saw someone legitimately take 20 mins to park in a tight spot in a private city carpark it took me to park 30 seconds in in the territory.

end of the day i need a ute for work which is why i have it and the dual cab allows me to have it do the family role too but I would not choose it for this unless i had to.

Amarock is not bad too but they are all trucks, when compared to the falcon/commodore utes.

The territory is the most versatile car out there and if you do not need the ute or proper 4x4 i would recommend that instead.

[Itsme]

Originally Posted by bigsta

IMO the holden crewman is the best compromise out there, drives like a car but has the versatility of a ute but the tray is not as big as a ute and the cabin is not as big as a sedan.

Your funny!!!
Go sit in the back of a Crewman for a long trip & see how you feel, might be OK for small kids but would have to be one of the worst designs ever.

[mcnews]

Originally Posted by bigsta

they are a compromise car but in life you gotta make compromises really.

the trucks from thailand, colarado, ranger, hilux etc IMO are just that trucks on the road they are not that quick but in 4x4 format go great off road.

because they are commercial vehicles they do not have to meet the same ADR that cars do so dont have the nice crumple zones and safety features on todays cars.

IMO the holden crewman is the best compromise out there, drives like a car but has the versatility of a ute but the tray is not as big as a ute and the cabin is not as big as a sedan.

was very close to getting a navara, until i saw someone legitimately take 20 mins to park in a tight spot in a private city carpark it took me to park 30 seconds in in the territory.

end of the day i need a ute for work which is why i have it and the dual cab allows me to have it do the family role too but I would not choose it for this unless i had to.

Amarock is not bad too but they are all trucks, when compared to the falcon/commodore utes.

The territory is the most versatile car out there and if you do not need the ute or proper 4x4 i would recommend that instead.

I agree with a lot of that. The 4x4 dual cabs are getting less crude but they are still crude and devoid of any driving enjoyment. The Crewman though is an abomination, I once heard a Holden employee joke that they were tasked with making the worst car they could make and the Crewman was the result :-)

[FTE217]

hehe turn a commode wagon platform into a dual cab - then saw the vertical rear bench seat forget it. The Aventra was another LOLzzzz

[Itsme]

Originally Posted by bigsta

they are a compromise car but in life you gotta make compromises really.

the trucks from thailand, colarado, ranger, hilux etc IMO are just that trucks on the road they are not that quick but in 4x4 format go great off road.

because they are commercial vehicles they do not have to meet the same ADR that cars do so dont have the nice crumple zones and safety features on todays cars.

Never heard so much tripe!
The new PX Ranger has a 5 star Ancap safety rating which makes it just as safe as other cars with the 5 star rating.

Do your homework before making misleading comments.

PS: To the other comment from another poster the Ranger is reasonably comfortable, no worse than driving my FG XR6 ute.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by johnydep

What do you class as "smaller" and "big" trucks?

The Mitsubishi Triton & Nissan Navara have Particulate filters. most, if not all, diesel vehicle that meets Euro 4 will have a particulate exhaust filter.

Not all Euro IV diesels have DPF, my Focus doesn't.

[smoo]

Originally Posted by dirtyclevo

what are these like?

Jeep Wrangler unlimited overlander/rubicon

i was thinking about looking at one but not sure about them. i know they are tough. i like how the all the doors and roof come off.

image

I've had a Rubicon, and nothing will touch them off road. They are no family hauler (limited space on inside), I'd say a double cab ute would do a better job, but these things will get further off road in 2wd with the rear diff locked. They drive better than what they should, ladder chassis with live axles etc. If going for a new 4wd to get the real deal its one of these or a 70 series IMO. I would say Defender but their wheel articulation and electronic traction control is good as tits on a bull. chevypower you can get the Rubicon diesel down here too, but some aftermarket parts are limited because the Yanks don't have them.

As for double cab utes they are the latest trend and nothing else. All the sheep have flocked to them. Unless you need a tray or 4wd on a daily/weekly basis a Falcon or Commodore will do a better job at everything else especially long distance driving. Nothing screams more poser than a double cab 4wd ute on low profile 20" rims and a hard lid on the back. From what I've seen most of them on the road are like this but people have to keep up with the Joneses I suppose.

[SumoDog68]

Originally Posted by johnydep

What do you class as "smaller" and "big" trucks?

The Mitsubishi Triton & Nissan Navara have Particulate filters. most, if not all, diesel vehicle that meets Euro 4 will have a particulate exhaust filter.

Navara 550 does not have a DPF.

[JG34JA]

The ones I've experienced I wouldn't consider family cars. The new Ranger has reportedly added comfort and 5 star safety, however.

I loved ladder frame chassis and simplicity of my Landcruiser when I was a surveyor and often worked remote. Comparing it to current model Triton, it was more nimble, more articulation, floated nicely offroad. More capable. Tighter turning circle too! And the cruiser was already 20 years old... I was expecting much of the new Triton but got lumped traveling back seat for a couple of weeks - torture off road! A friend bought the luxury version, tried that back seat and ugh... Then there were the mine 'Luxes... ugh.

For highway - ugh. You would do much better with a Falcon. Around town and parking, the medium/small SUV's seem to have cornered this market. For most dirt roads in this country (think: everything from the cities through the wheatbelts) a Territory provides safety, comfort and power with handling to spare. For a bit more offroad, Grand Cherokee, or a Prado.

For storage, the short tray at the rear can do a couple of dirt bikes (nearly as well as a full tray ute) but for safe storage of surfboards, forget it! Important if your family surfs or you take more than one board for differing conditions, and people still steal things from beachside carparks. You see dual cabs with the boards hanging out the back, worse if they are longboards... To stow them, lock in the cab, but only if they are the length of the cab or shorter. Very inconvenient. Or strap to the roof every time as you would with a sedan. The answer in this case is a wagon, or more crudely put on a canopy and take out the rear window. Ugh.

For those alpine roads chasing the snow, they will be out-handled by wagons with lower centres of gravity. The AWD helps them though.

But they are the great compromise, for in purchasing one you can have a little of everything (including crash safety). Again, the new Ranger seems to have lifted the bar to where it should be. And this little of everything appeals to many people and they pay top dollar for this.

[buggerlugs]

We had a dual cab when the kids were little and it was perfect. But as the kids got bigger and turned into teenagers there was just no room in the back.........

[bigsta]

Originally Posted by trublu

Never heard so much tripe!
The new PX Ranger has a 5 star Ancap safety rating which makes it just as safe as other cars with the 5 star rating.

Do your homework before making misleading comments.

PS: To the other comment from another poster the Ranger is reasonably comfortable, no worse than driving my FG XR6 ute.

Actually no it does not at all as the stars only rate it against other cars in their class and in the commercial class they are all woeful.

If you reckon a ranger is as good as a XR6, i put to you that you have never gone around a corner at over 30KPH and yes ive driven the ranger a fair bit.

All the dual cabs are compromises and if thats what you took from my comment that the back seat is crap on the crewman you totally missed my point.

Not saying ranger is a bad car, its great for its purpose, tow trucks are great for towing cars if thats what you want to do but IMO they are not the best family cars so unless you have no choice but to compromise then dont.

[wranger]

Originally Posted by bigsta

Actually no it does not at all as the stars only rate it against other cars in their class and in the commercial class they are all woeful.

If you reckon a ranger is as good as a XR6, i put to you that you have never gone around a corner at over 30KPH and yes ive driven the ranger a fair bit.

All the dual cabs are compromises and if thats what you took from my comment that the back seat is crap on the crewman you totally missed my point.

Not saying ranger is a bad car, its great for its purpose, tow trucks are great for towing cars if thats what you want to do but IMO they are not the best family cars so unless you have no choice but to compromise then dont.

In ANCAP testing all passenger vehicles are tested to the same conditions, and the Ranger has one of the highest results you can get from anything. Scores pretty significantly above an XR6 sedan.

Have gone around many, many corners at significantly more than 30kph, handles very well for for a four wheel drive, let alone a ute. May not handle as well as a low sedan, but how does an XR6 fare crossing 800mm of water?

[chookaradley]

Originally Posted by trublu

Your funny!!!
Go sit in the back of a Crewman for a long trip & see how you feel, might be OK for small kids but would have to be one of the worst designs ever.

+1 to this. Horrid backseat arrangement that is barely tolerable for any adult for more than a few minutes. It begs the question tho, are twin cabs truly a family car. It appears the back seat / tray is definitely a compromise. Interesting what manufacturers would do should they design a twin cab specifically from the ground up.

[Itsme]

Originally Posted by bigsta

Actually no it does not at all as the stars only rate it against other cars in their class and in the commercial class they are all woeful.

If you reckon a ranger is as good as a XR6, i put to you that you have never gone around a corner at over 30KPH and yes ive driven the ranger a fair bit.

All the dual cabs are compromises and if thats what you took from my comment that the back seat is crap on the crewman you totally missed my point.

Not saying ranger is a bad car, its great for its purpose, tow trucks are great for towing cars if thats what you want to do but IMO they are not the best family cars so unless you have no choice but to compromise then dont.

Going around a corner fast does not define driving comfortable.
The ranger handle quite well for its size & of course it won't match the FG in cornering at speed, then again most of us do not drive like race drivers on roads.
I drive a Ranger every day & accordingly to road conditions & certainly think the ride is as comfortable as the FG XR & yes I did own one for 3 years.

What defines a family car is open to anyone's interpretation so any vehicle can really fit that description, hence this topic if a 4x4 dual cab vehicle can fit the description of being a family vehicle.

Ancap safety ratings, As far as I understand all vehicles are assessed under identical testings standards and conditions, so where do you get the idea vehicles are tested in different classes eg commercial you speak of.
Your comment on Ancap rating test I completely disagree with.

[jimmyxr6t04]

I don't understand why people are comparing the comfort and handling of a sedan to a dual cab? Of course a sedan is more comfortable and handles better.

Once again, people don't by dual cabs as substitutes for sedans. I bought mine for the versatility of being able to go offroad, load the back with camping stuff, throw rubbish in the back, keep dogs in the back without getting any carpet dirty etc etc.

I didn't buy it and think, wow, i wish i got a sedan as this thing doesn't handle well. Drive it accordingly and it will get you from A-B and do it reasonably comfortably. Done several long trips in the Triton, and whilst it's not Holden Caprice of FPV GT it's still comfortable enough with added versatility.

We have enjoyed owning our dual cab so much, that we have decided to keep it. We had originally planned to buy a prado after the lease on the triton, but the triton hasn't missed a beat and does everything we want. The prado will probably come as the kids get older (currently 6 and 3), so for now the triton is fine.

[mcnews]

For sure, like anyone thinking that to drive something like a Ranger is anywhere remotely in the same ballpark when it comes to handling, comfort and dynamics compared to a Territory is in la la land.

[Gabbs]

I would love to get a ranger wildtrak for a family car. Sure people are saying it doesn't handle as well as a sedan or Territory but last time I checked a sedan couldn't go bush either.

[JG34JA]

As an interesting aside, one time the survey Landcruiser was being repaired, I was required to go offtrack to reach some radio towers, with nothing but the family ED sedan. I gingerly took it up the escarpment's rocky track, stopping each time to get out and remove larger rocks in the way. It made it up and down, taking very conservative lines, but still made it. I was quite stoked that it made it.

If you go back to FB-EK Holdens they had ground clearance and were used in situations most wouldn't take softroaders. My partner's family cleared their farm with an old FJ, a tractor and a chain... I've seen footage of early surfing in WA where EK's are being flogged along sandy beaches. Did much the same with my Kingswood wagons. Then there's Brocky's run with VB Commodores across the red centre upon its release in 1979 or so, then there's FOA testing early Territories at 140kmh on the Gibb river road. Going back further, there's Rolls Royce with RWD and front IRS/rear live axle in the red centre...

[Itsme]

Originally Posted by mcnews

For sure, like anyone thinking that to drive something like a Ranger is anywhere remotely in the same ballpark when it comes to handling, comfort and dynamics compared to a Territory is in la la land.

I'm not being bias because I own one but the PX Ranger is better than what you are making it out to be but to be fair here is two links for you to read.

Be sure to read the ratings.

http://www.caradvice.com.au/247083/f...-4x4-dual-cab/

http://www.caradvice.com.au/199747/f...ritory-review/

Cheers.

[chevypower]

Originally Posted by JG34JA

As an interesting aside, one time the survey Landcruiser was being repaired, I was required to go offtrack to reach some radio towers, with nothing but the family ED sedan. I gingerly took it up the escarpment's rocky track, stopping each time to get out and remove larger rocks in the way. It made it up and down, taking very conservative lines, but still made it. I was quite stoked that it made it.

If you go back to FB-EK Holdens they had ground clearance and were used in situations most wouldn't take softroaders. My partner's family cleared their farm with an old FJ, a tractor and a chain... I've seen footage of early surfing in WA where EK's are being flogged along sandy beaches. Did much the same with my Kingswood wagons. Then there's Brocky's run with VB Commodores across the red centre upon its release in 1979 or so, then there's FOA testing early Territories at 140kmh on the Gibb river road. Going back further, there's Rolls Royce with RWD and front IRS/rear live axle in the red centre...

I must admit even when I go off-road, I can do 95-99% of my driving in 2wd. The same is also true on my Polaris ATV. But I wouldn't be as daring without 4x4. Or that 1% of the time, definitely glad to have it. It's amazing what momentum and a bit of wheel spin can do, but it will only take you so far.