please help with police harrasment incident

[EA Bogan]

on the wednesday night i was on my way home from work and approached the newton rd/gorge rd. intersection. A light blue early 1990s model Mitsubishi Lancer was approaching the traffic lights whilst driving in front of me. The driver brought down their speed to less than 40 km/h in a clearly marked 60 zone that is a main road. The Lancer was proceeding past the traffic lights and was not braking, he was either using the engine to brake or simply did not accelerate and reduced his speed by coasting. I was travelling at the speed limit behind the lancer, and drew closer to it as the driver inexplicably reduced speed. Not wanting to run a red light, i cauciously pulled out ahead of the lancer, and proceeded to accelerate back up to the limit to overtake him, past the lights, thereby avoiding this driver who was a clear hazard on the roads

I had turned into Hancock rd. when a police Ute pulled me over. I exited my car, walked up to the police Ute greeting the officer in a friendly and courteous manner, stating "what can i help you with mate?" The policeman appeared agitated and said he saw me speeding. I was not aware of any offenses that i had committed and so naturally i was puzzled at his claims. He also claims i was following a car too closely and that i should not lie to him. I remained calm and stated that i did not wish to lie to him, and attempted to explain the situation to him, that the car had decreased its speed and i merely changed lanes to avert an incident leading up to a red light. He spoke to me in an aggressive and threatening tone, stating that "if i talk to him like that he will search my vehicle and take it apart"

I felt threatened by him and did not argue, i was polite and co-operative throughout the incident. He said he would give me a warning for the speeding, but would write me up for following the vehicle too closely. He did NOT give me a copy of the expiation notice, and told me it would be mailed out to me when i approached him in the car as he was about to drive off, to check with him. He my have believed i was speeding because i overtook the Lancer at about 20 km/h faster than it was traveling, though the Lancer itself was traveling at not even 40 km/h, as i was gaining on him slightly with my speedometer pointed at 40 km/h as i was reducing my speed in response to his erratic driving. I had no intent to break any road rules, and took the safest and most efficient course of action by changing lanes to avoid this driver, who was himself committing an offense of driving far below the posted limit on a busy main road for no reason.

I had not signed anything stating that i have been booked for this offense, he did not tell me what speed i was traveling at (im nearly completely certain i had not exceeded 60, the traffic light camera would have caught me as i passed it if i had)

Is there anything i can do to challenge this offense? I assume the courts would never believe my story over the two police officers, but i do not wish to be the victim of this arrogant harassment and wrongful offense.

I would really appreciate any advice on this matter.

[Iggypoppin']

Don't stress mate, I think for a fine to be binding they MUST give it to you on the spot. You sound like you did everything right, you just might have got a bad cop. It happens, especially here in Adelaide.

[Fireblade]

You wont win, basically bend over and take it no offence intended. They can mail out fines to you but they might think its not worth the paperwork.

[EA Bogan]

>.< im getting mixed messages here..although them not giving me a form seemed very suss to me, i even ASKED them myself. So im basically guilty until proven innocent??? I have no way of proving what the other car was doing, they obviously pulled ME over (about 500m later btw) instead of the REAL ******* on the roads..The fact that the first thing he said that i was speeding proves that hes picking on me. He had no way of showing me my speed. His arrogant, hostile behaviour and threats to "tear my car apart piece by piece" didnt help me think very clearly, i was real nervous as i cant afford to lose my lisence (i have 3 points but that would be 1 off).

[XRSIKS]

Originally Posted by NJXR6

Don't stress mate, I think for a fine to be binding they MUST give it to you on the spot. You sound like you did everything right, you just might have got a bad cop. It happens, especially here in Adelaide.

they dont have to give it to you on the spot...

i got done speeding, got it in the mail 3 weeks later.

[Iggypoppin']

Crap I thought you had to get it on the spot. Ohwell. Sorry EA bogan, might just have to lump it.

[EA Bogan]

Thanks for the insight guys..so basically they can accuse me of whatever they want and i have no way of proving otherwise?? Australia is a fascist country.

[XRSIKS]

Yah, and he was rude too.

[mik]

do you think the lancer guy was annoyed at you some how and was deliberatly trying to .... you off, some people are very sensitive to how close others travel behind them, you may have seen a sticker the "closer you get the slower go"... , maybe your head lights were in his mirror or something, and your word against 2 police ......this one, i would just wear it and put it down to experience maybe travel a couple of metres further back next time.

[EA Bogan]

i approached him from quite far alway, there were no other cars around so he had no reason whatsoever to reduce his speed THAT much. I definately did not tailgate him. i had my cruise controll set at 60. Him cutting me off makes NO sense as his low speed means he himself was running the risk of running a red light.

[seXCmont]

maybe not stress too much and wait and see what happens might not get anything in the mail

[EA Bogan]

he may have just been bluffing, i have no way of knowing. It does seem very unlikely to me however. Would i not want to challange or pay off the fine ASAP? that is, if i ignore it should it not arrive, wouldn't that get me into a lot more trouble?

[nfury8]

challenge the ticket in court, i have had a a GR8 experience regarding dodgy animals of the blue variety and on the day they were unable to produce the evidence required to prosecute me (hand radar speeding) offence. Judge instanty dismissed the ticket and apologised for wasting my time...seriously couldnt believe it. BEST OF LUCK

[EA Bogan]

Originally Posted by nfury8

challenge the ticket in court, i have had a a GR8 experience regarding dodgy animals of the blue variety and on the day they were unable to produce the evidence required to prosecute me (hand radar speeding) offence. Judge instanty dismissed the ticket and apologised for wasting my time...seriously couldnt believe it. BEST OF LUCK

Indeed thank you, much appreciated. I know they cannot book me for speeding if they cannot produce me the figure on a radar gun. They did not measure my speed. As for the "tailgating" does them saying that they "saw me do it" count in the court? That ability could be abused so easily its not funny. Isnt the whole basis of the justice system the fact that you are innocent until PROVEN guilty?

If i slam my brakes on the guy behind me, would they book him for tailgating me too? all just common sense.

[ozfast]

did the lancer guy ---- himself when he saw the cops,maybe the reason he pulled up quick? ring police complaints and lodge one against them!

[WOTDAH]

If the cop was by himself and he wasn't recording you then it becomes your word against his and will be dismissed in court. He needs a witness.

[EA Bogan]

There were two police officers. The second one did nothing and just watched.

[alter_EGOXR]

if its one of those general patrol police utes, it most likely does not have a fixed speed camera...so they cant do you for speeding even if you did go 100km/h over the speed limit, because they have no proof..and yep, if you are going to get a ticket, it should be most likely on the spot...rest easy mate, most coppers give a bit of lip so the POI complies with them....you should be alrite and you did the right thing...

[EA Bogan]

its the one with the mini holding cell in the back. Another question i have is what happens if i appeal the fine and lose? also what is the POI??

[smacxr8]

I had a run in with the police a while back on the M1 heading towards the Gold Coast at about 8pm in our BA XR8. I pulled over to the side of the road for a minute, and since there was a fair bit of traffic on the road i had to wait for a while until i could pull back on, when i saw an opening big enough i accelerated quickly to join the flowing traffic in doing this a got a small amount of tyre squeal (marginally unintentional) Glancing in my revision mirror instead of at the speedo, i wasnt sure how fast i got to before i settled with the flow of traffic. Within a few seconds there was a cop car behind me flashing his lights. They pulled me over and tried to tell me i was doing atleast 140 (its a 110 zone) but of course they couldnt have proved it as they would have been a few cars back. Then they told me i did a burn out and it was reckless and stupid (which it sort of was). Anyhow they said we will let you off with a warning on the speeding but we are going to fine you for unnecesary disturbance or something, which as mentioned was on the highway miles from any built up area so im not sure who i was distubing? Anyway i think it is because they couldnt think of anything else to get me for so they got me for that. As i dont deny a had done the wrong thing, I just paid it, i think it was about $220 but no points lost luckily. So i feel for you EA Bogan you really do feel a bit helpless you want to fight it but dont think its worth it.

[XA-Coupe]

Don't listen to the Internet Lawyers here, so far you have got nothing but dodgey advice. If you really want to fight it, go and see a proper solicitor.

[Bucknaked]

I don't think you are allowed to exit the vehicle and approach the police car. This is most likely why he was agitated. It's not mean't to be a friendly experience.

[OLDFORDNUT]

Originally Posted by EA Bogan

Indeed thank you, much appreciated. I know they cannot book me for speeding if they cannot produce me the figure on a radar gun. They did not measure my speed. As for the "tailgating" does them saying that they "saw me do it" count in the court? That ability could be abused so easily its not funny. Isnt the whole basis of the justice system the fact that you are innocent until PROVEN guilty?

If i slam my brakes on the guy behind me, would they book him for tailgating me too? all just common sense.

WRONG AND WRONG
Sorry mate but yes they can on both counts im afraid,
a Police Officer's claims are taken seriously as they are considered good judges of speed from their training ,ive fallen victim to it myself and i know i was in the right but still found guilty and fined, :
and yes you are 100%wrong about them needing to prove you as guilty as the burdon of proof now wrests on our shoulders ,and it is abused by police every day.
you just got a nasty cop, there are lots out there who are good too, just ware it,and as chopper says Harden The Fook Up.

[RG]

Originally Posted by XA-Coupe

Don't listen to the Internet Lawyers here, so far you have got nothing but dodgey advice. If you really want to fight it, go and see a proper solicitor.

Best advice here and the only one you should listen to IMO.

I still don't understand how a slow moving vehicle could possibly make anyone run a red light, I would have thought that the lower the speed the less chance of running a red there would be due to the longer reaction time. Unless you were trying to make an amber?

[Laminge]

Thread closed

So sick of reading the crap people think they know about the law

Take xa coupes advice