TS50 Front Brake Violent Shudder

[neila]

I purchased my TS50 new in April 2002 -- Tickford No. 058

I am a new member to Australian Ford Forums and hope someone can help with my problem.

After nearly 2 years of driving, the front rotors were worn and needed replacing. From that point on, I have had trouble. When braking, there is a violent uncontrollable shudder from the front brakes. Ford's answer is to machine the discs. After a number of services and re-machinings, I demanded that the rotors be replaced under warranty, which Ford did. However, the new brakes have exactly the same problem.

Initially, they feel OK, but a couple of K's driving sees the shudder coming back until it gets worse and worse to the violent stage once more and results in a machining being necessary.

Has anyone else got this problem and does anyone else know what the remedy would be???

I would like to know, as Ford have been, and are, absolutely no assistance to me in this situation, and obviously I am quite annoyed about it all.

Any help please ------------- Thanks.

[tony351]

i have been having the same problem with mine, was told by a brake specialist to try different rotors, no matter what i do to mine this problem occurs, its expensive but im even concidering upgrading the brakes in a hope it might cure it

[DaveTE]

Mate try the "Performance" section then "Tickford Vehicles". The guys that get in that area are all T3 experts and will be able to help. From what I understand the premium brakes were shocking for this. Brembos brakes don't seem to get this issue. I gather you have the premiums? Anyways try the Ford forums section that I have stated.

[ebxr8240]

Try another brake pad compound ?? The reason they machine the rotors other than being warped, the resin from pads sticks to rotors which causes this vibration...The pads require some seasoning to bed them in and set resin, IMO this is not good enough...Besides machining rotors is making them less so their efficiency is less every time...
http://www.fordforums.com.au/forumdi...aysprune=&f=20

[tony351]

i have tryed numerous compounds and nothing has worked in cars with the premium package........ just a design fault i guess

[trikee]

try some aftermarket rotors. all new cars are designed with "throwaway" items, such as disc rotors. 9 times out of 10, the aftermarket discs are better than the factory stuff. and cheaper too.

i know this is under warranty, but just a thought...

[FRDTUF]

When i had to replace mine, after about 2000ks i had a real bad shudder, went back to ford & got a new set replaced under warranty... now using Bendix heavy duty pads & they seem to work really well with NO brake shudder & very minable brake dust...

[FTE217]

Originally Posted by tony351

i have tryed numerous compounds and nothing has worked in cars with the premium package........ just a design fault i guess

That's BS as there's plenty of AU's using Premium package and importantly many TSeries. By the way the pad compaound doesn't cause the shudder,it's the rotors out of round.
My original rotors on the T3 were worn out/too thin when I bought the T3 and it didn't shudder them. Then put DBA4000's not a worry at all but now after 20000k's of spirited driving they are due for a machining/shuddering but thats normal. I'll get them shaved,new pads and she'll be right.

What rotors is the dealership putting on ? OE ones ?,aftermarket ?
Batch issues ?
If you have got a relationship with the service manager,let him know you have copped the costs and still disatisfied. Advise you are going to a brake specialist to solve your problem and would he consider giving you a good discount next service ? considering your problem is not solved.
Just some thoughts mate.

[tony351]

i have been using bendix ultimate, i must admit i have not tryed on the TS to swap anything around, on my BA XR with the premium package i had issues, so i might try those dba rotors.... thanks for the advice

[FLOORED]

[QUOTE=Bluedriver]That's BS as there's plenty of AU's using Premium package and importantly many TSeries. By the way the pad compaound doesn't cause the shudder,it's the rotors out of round.
My original rotors on the T3 were worn out/too thin when I bought the T3 and it didn't shudder them. Then put DBA4000's not a worry at all but now after 20000k's of spirited driving they are due for a machining/shuddering but thats normal. I'll get them shaved,new pads and she'll be right.

The pads can if not bedded in properly cause some pulsation and this is why pads need to be bedded in properly.There was a big problem with people using EBC greenstuff and DBA rotors they just didn't work together and a residue deposit was embedded onto the disc face which caused it and it still happens sometimes as we get cars in all the time with similar problems.An out of round rotor will also cause the problem and so will DTV which is disc variation thickness.This is when you measure the thickness of a rotor in 5-6 different areas and get a different thickness reading.DBA have a $100,000 PLUS machine that measures this on rotors at random in batches.

[ebxr8240]

It can pay to bed in new pads on old rotors or "before" machining or fitting new....
That way there's little chance of resin attaching to rotors...
If not bedded in properly....

[J.C.]

I am aware of the miss matching of pads and rotors but I have replaced the front rotors and pads on my TS T3 at about 47000kms. I replaced them with the original premuim package equipment. Cost me $1100 but it is original. To this day have never had a problem with shudder etc. Squecking, yes. Brake dust.

[highkid]

If the surface on the hub face where the disc sits isnt cleaned properly before machining (With the use of a wire brush or someother piece of equipment) the disc problems can occur right from the start causing the disc to be "Off Centre". Now this can cause the shudder to come back after a few trips or used under heavy braking as the pads wear into the shape of the disc once again.

I have RDA Slotted Rotors ... Not Crossed Drilled as ive had mention it does stuff all, Slots only carry the heat away alot better for normal road use, with the EBC Green Stuff pads ... Brake shudder wasnt an issue anymore after i slowly wore them in after 500 kms or so ... 300 kms or so is the min requirment, but there was still a little bit of a shudder in the steering itself, now this was caused by the "Tie Rod Ends" and the "Camber Kit" been worn out, now i had personally machined my discs about a year before i had even thought about the Tie Rods ... but the shudder came back about half way through and covered it up, so it could be another thing to look at the steering.

Now saying that also look out for the slide pins on the brake caliper sticking, as this causes the brake pads to move incorrectly with the disc, creating incorrect wear of the pads, causing the disc to wear incorrectly or the pads eating into the disc without applying the brakes as it sticks coming back to the home position, also the brake caliper out of alingment can cause this if it isnt seated or bolted back in correctly.

Check the hub itself, as its seperate from the brake disc, if the bearing has let go you would know about it, hearing a really annoying noise at the left or right side of the cabin as you speed up, but that would be highly unlikely, just if you have to have the brakes done again get them to check the bearing, or if the place has a hoist or a jack higher it up off the ground and spin the wheel, if you can hear a bad noise well, but most times you need something that you can listen in with to hear the sound ... forget what the device is called !

Last thing could be the ABS playing up, or the ABS sensors arent cleaned properly after machining the discs, causing it to sense its surroundings incorrectly and making braking a part nightmare, usually when a sensor plays up the ABS check on startup or during driving picks it up and throws the orange i think ... or possibly red now by memory ABS light onto the dash.

I think its just a case to do with the discs been machined incorrectly, if you try again with the ford products and have no luck, as well as having everything checked out and it comes up ok, well last resort is the brake shop i guess, and if they recomend a better solution with higher grade braking products it may be the way to go considering your luck.

[jimt3te50]

I would almost guarantee it's front wheel bearings, which is a complete hub assembly.

I've done 150,000km in my T3 and been through over four sets of front rotors and probably 6 sets of pads and I've had this shudder problem once. Wheel bearings were "within spec" so they were ruled out, we tried skimming the brand new rotors, different pads, different rotors, new tyres, different wheels etc etc.

In the end we replaced the wheel bearings/front hub assembly and it has never given a problem since.

Going to an alloy hatted rotor like DBA's 5000 series will prevent heat transfer into the hub and bering assembly and lengthen the life of the bearing dramatically.