Warming up

[LTDHO]

Originally Posted by Steffo

What happens thats so bad if you leave the car on a few minutes before driving away?

Glazed bores.
Usually the rings won't seal well, blow smoke, due to oil rings not sealing and can have low compression due to compression rings not sealing.

No easy fix, need hone and new rings, and running in procedure done properly and the motor warmed properly.

I've always warned my car up.

Give her a flick into electrical on (no engine power) for roughly 30 seconds, to let the barrery kick in, then fire her up for a few minutes.

I got my house keys and car keys on the same key ring, but on a clip, so i can take my car keys off, start her up, go inside grab my stuff, lock the doors which makes up the 4-5 minutes for a good old warm up

[Mike Gayner]

Originally Posted by LTDHO

You do not want your car to idle up to temp. The longest time needed at idle is about 10-15 seconds, this is how long it taks to get oil pressure.
Then drive car gently until engine temp is met. Then drive as hard as you want.
This is that safest way and will lenthen the life of your motor.

If you idle up to engine temp then you are doing more bad than good.

I wholeheartedly disagree. I dare you to jump into my XA with a chokeless Holley and drive off 15 seconds after firing it up. It won't happen. I usually fire it up, idle for a few seconds then work the throttle 1,000 - 2,500rpm for a couple of minutes (dunno if that's necessary, but I like to think I'm oiling the cam up, which doesn't get alot of oil at idle). Then i'll let it idle for another minute or two and take off nice and slow until the guage reaches about half way, then I flick the fans on and drive like normal.

[PULLY6]

Originally Posted by Mike Gayner

I wholeheartedly disagree. I dare you to jump into my XA with a chokeless Holley and drive off 15 seconds after firing it up. It won't happen.

Agree with you there mate, the older cars do need a warm up. But I think LTDHO is talking about more modern cars, eg E-series.

[LTDHO]

Originally Posted by Mike Gayner

I wholeheartedly disagree. I dare you to jump into my XA with a chokeless Holley and drive off 15 seconds after firing it up. It won't happen. I usually fire it up, idle for a few seconds then work the throttle 1,000 - 2,500rpm for a couple of minutes (dunno if that's necessary, but I like to think I'm oiling the cam up, which doesn't get alot of oil at idle). Then i'll let it idle for another minute or two and take off nice and slow until the guage reaches about half way, then I flick the fans on and drive like normal.

My XB had a 780 vac sec holley with primary and secondry meatering blocks and the choke filed off and I used the same warm up.

[Pilch]

Originally Posted by Mike Gayner

I wholeheartedly disagree. I dare you to jump into my XA with a chokeless Holley and drive off 15 seconds after firing it up. It won't happen. I usually fire it up, idle for a few seconds then work the throttle 1,000 - 2,500rpm for a couple of minutes (dunno if that's necessary, but I like to think I'm oiling the cam up, which doesn't get alot of oil at idle). Then i'll let it idle for another minute or two and take off nice and slow until the guage reaches about half way, then I flick the fans on and drive like normal.

as soon as the car can be driven, drive it! No doubt the older cars need a warm up! My car gets a 5 second idle to build oil pressure than driven fairly gently till the temp guage is out of the blue.

[XA Coupsta]

I cant see the validity of the argument to NOT warm your car up thoroughly.

With my XA - I cant drive it and keep it under 3000rpm. You can try - but its got a big cam and is a pig to drive at those revs. When it's fully warmed up I believe I can safely then drive it at the revs specific to that combo with less risk of damage. Im trying to understand the reasons behind warming up being bad.

Why/how do the bores glaze if warming up? Why dont they do it if you dont warm it up and start driving it straight away?

How can warming up do more damage than starting the key, giving it a minute or two and driving off????!!!!

Help me to understand. Im not saying what is right or wrong here. I will say I know my car - and if I were to simply start it, give it 15 seconds and drive off - it sure doesnt feel like its not doing it any damage!!!!

[Ford Fanatic]

Originally Posted by Casper

I do exactly the same.
Apparently us odd ones who drive AU1's and not those "fancy" AU3's actually have working oil pressure guages so we can actually see the pressure guage go up and reach full pressure. :

Mmm, whats this about "fancy" AU3's. Mine has an oil pressure guage!!!!
I concur with waiting until the oil pressure comes up (only takes a few seconds in reality), then I drive off and dont thrash it until some heat has gone into the engine.

[FNQracing]

Originally Posted by XA Coupsta

Why/how do the bores glaze if warming up? Why dont they do it if you dont warm it up and start driving it straight away?

How can warming up do more damage than starting the key, giving it a minute or two and driving off????!!!!

On cold startup, the engine is running a rich mixture which "washes" oil from the cylinder bores. Prolonged idling means the engine is running a rich mixture for longer periods as opposed to a short idle time and easy driving until your water temp comes into normal operating temperature. Its at this point your ECU will lean out the mixture and go into closed loop. Generally speaking, the sooner this happens the better.

The longer it takes the car to warm up above the vapor point for the combustion byproducts, the larger the amount of particulate formation and growth. This leads to sludge, varnish and particulates in your oil. In addition to the wear these types of particles cause, you also end up needing to change your engine oil more frequently because these get you to your oil's particulate threshold faster.

[rag top]

I start it with a bit of choke, and move off as soon as possible. I don't live far from a decent stretch of road, and it normally warms up as I putter along.

I can't sit at home at 5.15am trying to warm up an old school V8... My neighbours don't appreciate the exhaust note as much as I do, especially in the middle of winter. I've got pretty good neighbours, I prefer to keep it that way.

[XA Coupsta]

Hey FFO - man thanks for the response. Very impressive!!! That has given me some serious understanding about it.

One question - you talk about ECU's. Its just not them though? The same theory (of rich mixture washing oil away) would apply to carburettor engines too?

[Amazer]

I usually let the Lynx warm up and warm down.

or if I don't have time to wait I keep it off boost till I start to see the temp gauge move up.

warming down time depends on how I have been driving just before I am going to turn it off, if I haven't been on hard boost and have mucked around a bit while parking it doesn't stay on long, but If I have been doing quite a few 7000rpm changes just before stopping it gets a good few minutes at least till the fan kicks out.

With my new Astina it just gets 20 seconds or so and then I'm off and no warming down, no point its not turbo.....yet!

Rob

[Steve_T]

Originally Posted by Ford Fanatic

Mmm, whats this about "fancy" AU3's. Mine has an oil pressure guage!!!!

No - it doesn't. It has a riced up display with a fake/decorative oil guage on it. Sorry As proof, have you ever seen it move off the 50psi mark? Only reason it takes a few secs. to get up to it's preset value instead of instantly popping up is 'cause the guage movement is electronically dampened.

I have just been discussing it here http://www.fordforums.com.au/showthread.php?t=7511

Steve.

[FNQracing]

Originally Posted by XA Coupsta

One question - you talk about ECU's. Its just not them though? The same theory (of rich mixture washing oil away) would apply to carburettor engines too?

Basicially yeah. Only in your case, you have control over the choke. EFI cars are much much better on cold startups, but otherwise, carby'd cars suffer the same problems of prolonged cold ideling.

[Kapn_Kiwi]

Originally Posted by Steve_T

No - it doesn't. It has a riced up display with a fake/decorative oil guage on it. Sorry As proof, have you ever seen it move off the 50psi mark? Only reason it takes a few secs. to get up to it's preset value instead of instantly popping up is 'cause the guage movement is electronically dampened.

I have just been discussing it here http://www.fordforums.com.au/showthread.php?t=7511

Steve.

That's pretty terrible. Especially the way that it's not able to be changed, 'cause I'm sure most people who are smart enough to realise, and get it changed are also smart enough to know it's not malfunctioning. Also in your thread you change from "gauge" to "guage". Gauge is the correct spelling.

[v8ford351]

there is alot of confusion about warming up any engine whether its efi or carby. do you wait for the water temp to get up a bit, or oil pressure or just count in minutes. Well the most IMPORTANT thing is actually oil temperature, but it is very often overlooked. How many people have oil temp gauges in their hotted up cars???

it is often the case in engines, that after a couple of minutes the car can have close to normal water temp, but still not have good oil temp. obviously the oil needs to be at a certain temp to do its job properly, and to aviod wear.

[ilsautomotive]

Another factor to throw into the mix, alloy head engines need to be warmed up as slowly as possible to avoid warping the head gasket with the different expansion properties of alloy and iron, and idling is the logical way to do this. I suppose the bottom line is that there isn't an absolute right or wrong.

[Dez]

certain oils also work at certain temps dont they? like the more expensive ones are made to be effective at lower temps....

my car starts first time everytime, and has never once stalled on me, no matter how cold it is at 4am.

i usually get in, start it up and give it a minute or so if i have time, then drive it nice and easy till the temp gauge is up.....if i dont have time, i start it and go, and it goes fine, but i dont drive hard until the temp gauge is up

[HOON69]

i hardly ever warm mine up
i never try rev its gutts whilst cold nor drive it hard from the word go,i putt about till it warms up..

[deesun]

Not my bloody wifey she backs out on to road,motor only going for about 45secs and the floors it,I hate it. I at least get a couple of streets away before giving it some. Then she complains when I kick it in the guts at 100k to overtake sumone.

sorry folks I have a BA xr6 it wasn't until I read back through the posts that I realised you were mostly talking about your hot XA's and other older cars.

[Steve_T]

Originally Posted by Skinny_Puppy

...Also in your thread you change from "gauge" to "guage". Gauge is the correct spelling.

LOL, thanks mate. Just goes to show - trust your instincts :

[Biggoggs]

Not my bloody wifey she backs out on to road,motor only going for about 45secs and the floors it,I hate it. I at least get a couple of streets away before giving it some. Then she complains when I kick it in the guts at 100k to overtake sumone.

Get a manual next time :

[smciner1]

Originally Posted by v8ford351

there is alot of confusion about warming up any engine whether its efi or carby. do you wait for the water temp to get up a bit, or oil pressure or just count in minutes. Well the most IMPORTANT thing is actually oil temperature, but it is very often overlooked. How many people have oil temp gauges in their hotted up cars???

Very true. I notice a drop off in the oil pressure in my XB after the water temperature has reached normal level. Once the oil pressure has settled down, I know the engine is up to temperature and can be given a hard time.

[mcflux]

I drive very gently (<1/4 throttle) until the temp gauge is above C, in the normal operating range. The car doesn't seem to mind

[v8ford351]

while we are on the subject of water temp gauges, it is interesting to know that alot of manufactures make their gauges so that normal operating temp is actually under half way or in the cold range (e series falcon's as one example)

it is supposed to be much more pleasing for the driver to see colder all the time, allthough, this means that when the gauge is at normal or starting to get hot, its actually getting very hot, more like gasket popping hot.

[ilsautomotive]

Originally Posted by v8ford351

while we are on the subject of water temp gauges, it is interesting to know that alot of manufactures make their gauges so that normal operating temp is actually under half way or in the cold range (e series falcon's as one example)

This could be a misunderstanding, but I don't think E Series Falcons are supposed to be much below half way on the gauge. If they have a buggered thermostat and are running cold/rich this is not normal or healthy.

[Mike Gayner]

My EA guage reads exactly half way pretty much all of the time.

[v8ford351]

how do u know "normal" is actually normal operating temp in terms of degrees celcius? it could be 50 degrees or 80 derees depending on how the manufacturer has Calibrated the gauge. i struggle to get them to R in normal when i drive them, but its not uncommon for them to overheat either.

but then again, when u cook an E series to the point where the coolant is boiling and starts to evaporate, the sender unit can't work when not submerged in water so the gauge goes back down to cold, even though the head is closer to melting into a puddle of alloy at this point. good old E series falcons, keeping engine reconditioners in business all over australia.

[bowsaw]

My Ford owners manual says not to idle for prolonged periods, what prolonged periods is, ??????? my temp gauge always sits on just above L, when its 45 outside, it will sit on M, which is 95 degrees.