Student tax deductions

[MAD]

http://www.smh.com.au/national/stude...111-17pe7.html

What's your thoughts on this? I'm of a couple of minds about it.

A small bit of background first....
If you have worked enough and have been declared 'independent' by Centrelink, you can receive full benefits while living with your parents. But if you move out to live with your new girlfriend, you instantly become a dependant again and both incomes are taken in to account. I had this situation and went from full benefits to receiving a max of $30 a fortnight for 'rent assistance' and that was if I didnt work any shifts a BigW stocking shelves in the evening.
So living in a household with an income of just over $30k I received very little assistance, but move back home with the folks in a household earning around $140k and I receive full benefits. I never quite understood how that worked, and why your new girlfriend was automatically expected to support you. I had two jobs going while I was studying, a casual day job that I could turn up to whenever I wasn't at TAFE and BigW doing night-fill. So I very rarely received any benefits.

My partner and I ended up moving in to my parents for 4 years while I finished studies because it was too hard to make ends meet renting together and travelling to school. We lived in Noble Park, my first 3 years were in Carlton and my last 2 years were in Bundoora. I consider myself extremely lucky to have had the option to move back home available to me, if I had not had that option I'm sure I wouldn't have finished.


Ok, on to this new situation of being able to claim deductions because to maintain qualification for the benefits you are required to go to school and this can incur 'expenses'.

It's great that a low income earner, receiving benefits can now end up with a little more in their pocket to help them on their way through school, but at the same time why is the person working their own way through (with less spare time to study) denied the opportunity to claim the same deductions?

Share your thoughts.

[GT0132]

My take on this is that if you are in receipt of a study allowance then any expenses incurred in qualifiying for that allowance should be firstly offset from the allowance given that it was given for the purpose of covering tose sort of costs in the first place, not offset from the income from part time employment.

It seems Daddy saw a window of opportunity, was probably cashed up and not busy in his own law practice, so thought, why not give it a go. Students without those resources at their disposal would not be so fortunate.


The government should legislate now to plug the hole.

I find it concerning that a recipient of a government grant has the financial capacity to take on the ATO (not to mention the 4 year timeframe) only to receive a few hundred dollars tax refund. Then she says it's been fun !!

The flipside is that the High Court saw fit to disallow the appeal so there must be some sense to the madness.

This will now be known as the Anstis Case and be referred to in all law texts published and discussed at all universities in future and will be teh subject of debate among the legal and accounting professions for years to come.

[Airmon]

Yeah it does seem a bit odd. Isn;t the whole point of AuStudy and Youth Allowance to help you study financially?

Im a bit against people who abuse it and bludge off the system as it is, this just seems a bit much, I mean they're essentially giving you free money as it is and this person is still complaining?

[XlR8TED]

Originally Posted by GT0132

I find it concerning that a recipient of a government grant has the financial capacity to take on the ATO (not to mention the 4 year timeframe) only to receive a few hundred dollars tax refund. Then she says it's been fun !!

She doesn't stand to gain anything. She's not even a student anymore. She's 25 and working as a teacher.

I don't understand the butt hurt here. Most people on YA aren't living in luxury, so why we're getting upset about them getting a couple of hundred bucks back a year (which is a LOT for a student) is a bit mystifying.

[Crazy Dazz]

In some respects, this is “old news.” Students receiving taxable youth allowance have been able to claim legitimate deductions against it for year.
(In point of fact what this decision affirms is that you have ALWAYS been able to claim them.)
It is only that the ATO, in typical bureaucratic style, insists on fighting to the death.

The vast majority of all tax deductions are claimable under the old sect 51.1 “necessarily incurred in the earning of assessable income” and “not of a private domestic nature.”
So, do you earn assessable income? Yes. Are the expenses necessary to earn that income? Yes. Are they private or domestic (eg food, clothing, toilet paper)? No.
Equals DEDUCTIBLE!

In regards the OP’s other point. You don’t lose your independence by moving in with your girlfriend, rather if you are living as a defacto couple, you are treated as a couple. The solution is to simply say that your girlfriend is only your flatmate.

[GT0132]

Originally Posted by XlR8TED

She doesn't stand to gain anything. She's not even a student anymore. She's 25 and working as a teacher.

I don't understand the butt hurt here. Most people on YA aren't living in luxury, so why we're getting upset about them getting a couple of hundred bucks back a year (which is a LOT for a student) is a bit mystifying.

Of course she gained - she got a successful outcome from the High Court who effectively awarded her a tax deduction for self eduction expenses incurred while receiving a Youth Allowance - expenses for which we the tax payer have already payed in any event. Ok the amount was only $300 (and massively disproportional to the amount it would have cost her to fight the case) but it's the principal .

I agree that most people on YA (the word "most" underlined) aren't living in luxury, but this case is excpeptional. I'm sorry but if you receive a handout from the government and then spend a zillion defending legal proceedings in the High Court because you feel you ought to have been entitled to a $920 tax deduction, then it's questionable whether you were a worthy recipient of YA in the first place.

[|||]

youth allowance should never have been taxable in the first place. if there's one thing this country needs its more kids learning & less kids with too much time on their hands getting into trouble.

all welfare is open to abuse, but the majority of people receiving YA will more than pay back any money "given" to them by the government in the form of higher income taxes throughout their working lives.

[MAD]

Originally Posted by Crazy Dazz

In regards the OP’s other point. You don’t lose your independence by moving in with your girlfriend, rather if you are living as a defacto couple, you are treated as a couple. The solution is to simply say that your girlfriend is only your flatmate.

Yes you are correct, you can just say they are living with you and not your partner, and after that statement you also then need to fill out a "living arrangement" form with stat dec's and such.

[Baron.LSN]

I'm on YA, and it pays out a whopping $11,500 a year. I'm living an absolute life of luxury, honestly.

If someone has the resources and the inclination to set a precedent, and has, as here, what is obviously a valid legal entitlement, why should they be derided for their decision to pursue the case? Maybe it makes no real difference to her, but the ATO was in the wrong, and it can possibly make a difference to others.

Good on her for her efforts, as far as I'm concerned.

On another issue, I have a problem with people living at home being given benefits to study... anything more than a nominal amount, anyway.

[Crazy Dazz]

Originally Posted by GT0132

I'm sorry but if you receive a handout from the government and then spend a zillion defending legal proceedings in the High Court because you feel you ought to have been entitled to a $920 tax deduction, then it's questionable whether you were a worthy recipient of YA in the first place.

I’m pretty sure this was an ATO funded test case. ie They funded the defence to get the precedent decided by the High Court.

[trippytaka]

The biggest difference that so many people seem to miss here is the fact that Youth Allowance for Students isn't a "handout". You're being subsidised to study, which goes beck into the economy when you graduate and get a full time job. Study is hard work.

Anyone who has been to Uni knows how much work you're allocated and how hard it is to fit in a job around it. I worked part-time in a servo three nights a week for $250 a week when I was at uni. That barely covered my travel and food. There was no way that would cover books and fees.

Study = work.

*** note: Most students also have HECS, which is a loan (with interest) paid to the government, of around 30-80k by the time they finish their studies.

Now... the dole is a hand out. A teenage single mum being paid for having kids is a handout. But Youth Allowance for University students is an INVESTMENT by the government to educate and skill our future labour market.

[xy500]

Originally Posted by trippytaka

The biggest difference that so many people seem to miss here is the fact that Youth Allowance for Students isn't a "handout". You're being subsidised to study, which goes beck into the economy when you graduate and get a full time job. Study is hard work.

Anyone who has been to Uni knows how much work you're allocated and how hard it is to fit in a job around it. I worked part-time in a servo three nights a week for $250 a week when I was at uni. That barely covered my travel and food. There was no way that would cover books and fees.

Study = work.

*** note: Most students also have HECS, which is a loan (with interest) paid to the government, of around 30-80k by the time they finish their studies.

Now... the dole is a hand out. A teenage single mum being paid for having kids is a handout. But Youth Allowance for University students is an INVESTMENT by the government to educate and skill our future labour market.

damn right, thats about the best thing i've seen you post taka!
funny thing how people become more indifferent to education as the person becomes older, for primary schools we all ask for more investment, high schools we dont care too much, and universities we want to tell all the students to get stuffed and get a job!
I'll never understand the attitude of some people who only want to make it harder and harder to get a good education, so we're not stuck digging ditches the rest of our lives.
We need to help people get to uni, or we'll have to import more white collar workers in the future. simple.

[trippytaka]

Originally Posted by xy500

damn right, thats about the best thing i've seen you post taka!
funny thing how people become more indifferent to education as the person becomes older, for primary schools we all ask for more investment, high schools we dont care too much, and universities we want to tell all the students to get stuffed and get a job!
I'll never understand the attitude of some people who only want to make it harder and harder to get a good education, so we're not stuck digging ditches the rest of our lives.
We need to help people get to uni, or we'll have to import more white collar workers in the future. simple.

That's the thing. The engineers, the city planners, the doctors, the accountants (lol) they are all Uni educated.

If I may get on my high horse, just for a second, I would much rather see a massive jump in funding for apprentices and Uni students, including lump sum bonuses for graduating and start up capital for business ventures than to waste another cent on dead-end handouts.

And if that means students and apprentices get more tax deductions, then sign me up. Lets's just make sure it comes from the pocket of those who rort the system.