I6 production to drop

Bossxr8 · 11-12-2010, 10:08 PM

I6 production will be dropping 25% next year, with the Territory TD expected to make up 50% of total Territory sales it will mean I6 numbers will drop from 255 to 190 a day.

Despite the companies denial that anyone will lose their jobs a number of employees on contracts have already been sent packing, and any excess employees will be moved to the casting or stamping plants to make up for the increases in Territory panels and Bosch brake rotors. With the Ecoboost Falcon coming later in the year this could drop again, although Lpi production will make back up some of the losses.

This would not have happened if LPi was ready to go in October as it was supposed to. With I6 numbers dropping lower than 200 and the potential for Ecoboost to steal more sales from I6 it puts it down to a point where it surely must be becoming unviable and a V6 would make better financial sense. Can't see a 2015/16 Falcon using an I6, especially with Euro 6 further down the track. Euro 5 is do-able depending on when it will be introduced.

JG34JA · 11-12-2010, 10:14 PM

Sad news as it really is a fantastic motor, and the last Australian one left.

Hope the LPi is released soon.

I cannot help think that a couple of niche products sprung off Falcon/Territory could further its numbers, but I guess it's all about development ca$h.

If it is discontinued, watch the Chinese or Indians froth to get the tooling! We'd be mad to lose it.

Ford Falcon XR6 · 11-12-2010, 10:19 PM

It would be sad to loose such a great and strong motor it just wouldn't be a falcon without an I6 or V8 under the bonnet (or a diff and the rear of the car) :(

TheInterceptor · 11-12-2010, 10:44 PM

Dropping the I6 is like changing to fwd and battery power...and then being forced to wear a pink tu tu to be able to use the car.

Resurrection · 11-12-2010, 11:00 PM

The only thing which can save the I6 is the LPi version. Hope Ford release it soon and get it right.

kezzer · 11-12-2010, 11:06 PM

Id rather have an ecoboost falcon then no falcon at all

Bossxr8 · 11-12-2010, 11:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JG34JA

Sad news as it really is a fantastic motor, and the last Australian one left.

Hope the LPi is released soon.

I cannot help think that a couple of niche products sprung off Falcon/Territory could further its numbers, but I guess it's all about development ca$h.

If it is discontinued, watch the Chinese or Indians froth to get the tooling! We'd be mad to lose it.

Word was the Chinese had a good look at the engine plant when it was scheduled to be shutdown, also DSI were thinking of buying it to make their new 6 speed autos.

Resurrection · 11-12-2010, 11:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kezzer

Id rather have an ecoboost falcon then no falcon at all

Don't hold your breath.

Road_Warrior · 12-12-2010, 12:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Can't see a 2015/16 Falcon using an I6, especially with Euro 6 further down the track. Euro 5 is do-able depending on when it will be introduced.

Well I think the writing was always on the wall for the next gen Falcon - should be no surprise really. There's no way in hell it can run as a global platform with an orphan engine.

And yeah I'm starting to get a bit sceptical of LPi and Ecoboost. It's getting here when?? All we keep hearing is that its being pushed back.

Ohio XB · 12-12-2010, 12:37 AM

I know what it is like to see a beloved engine go. At one of the Cleveland engine plants they used to make a 4.9L I6 which was used for the F-150, Econoline, and the trucks that UPS used in the US. It was a low RPM, high torque engine that ran on gasoline but functioned a lot like a diesel engine. It was a great workhorse engine and would easily go 200 - 250 thousand miles before needing a rebuild.

When Ford announced the discontinuation of this engine UPS bought up many extra engines to have on hand. I am fortunate enough to have one in my 1993 F-150. It's got 131,000 miles on it right now. It started life as a toy and didn't have very many miles on it when I got it in 2003, but since then I have put almost 100,000 miles on it.

China buys a lot of leftovers from manufacturers around the world. Many times they have bought out-dated equipment here in the US when it was being replaced with modern technology. I suppose they got it for the price of scrap so they got it cheap. They certainly were not concerned with their air quality at the time, which is why the equipment was being replaced.

Steve

**Fordman1** · 12-12-2010, 01:01 AM

I6 will be gone if there is another Falcon built here in 2016 (book mark it).

LiLPG is late because it was reintroduced after the I6 was brought back from the dead.

The alternative is an imported V6.... so any I6 production is a positive.

Production down due to a Tdi Territory ?

Get over it.

It should have happened 3 years ago .....

Bossxr8 · 12-12-2010, 11:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

Well I think the writing was always on the wall for the next gen Falcon - should be no surprise really. There's no way in hell it can run as a global platform with an orphan engine.

And yeah I'm starting to get a bit sceptical of LPi and Ecoboost. It's getting here when?? All we keep hearing is that its being pushed back.

Lpi will be ready 3rd/4th quarter. Most likely at the same time as the update. Ecoboost probably similar time frame, maybe late 2011.

Bossxr8 · 12-12-2010, 11:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barraxr8

I6 will be gone if there is another Falcon built here in 2016 (book mark it).

LiLPG is late because it was reintroduced after the I6 was brought back from the dead.

The alternative is an imported V6.... so any I6 production is a positive.

Production down due to a Tdi Territory ?

Get over it.

It should have happened 3 years ago .....

Diesels make up 50% of the SUV market, its an area Ford must play in. It will attract a lot of new customers who are only interested in buying diesel or who are scared off by the Territorys fuel bills. Why Tom Gorman thought it was a stupid idea when half the market is diesel is just beyond me. He really had no clue. No wonder Geoff Polites was peed off.

Max460 · 12-12-2010, 06:36 PM

Don't forget it was only a few years ago that the I6 was slated for discontinuation due to Euro 4 non-compliance. It would have ended in July 2010, every year beyond that has been, and will continue to be a bonus for the engine, the Falcon and the plants.

The I6 will end in the next cycle. The current production number aren't viable, but front end packaging has been a major design restriction for several generations of the vehicle, and that will be as big a deciding factor as any.

It's not a bad thing.......as much as I love the engine and the plants that make them.....it's an evolve or die situation.

jpd80 · 12-12-2010, 08:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Diesels make up 50% of the SUV market, its an area Ford must play in. It will attract a lot of new customers who are only interested in buying diesel or who are scared off by the Territorys fuel bills. Why Tom Gorman thought it was a stupid idea when half the market is diesel is just beyond me. He really had no clue. No wonder Geoff Polites was peed off.

I wonder what I-6 numbers would be like if Ford introduced V6 Diesel into Sedan and Ute as well....
I'm pretty sure Ford are aware of what the consequences would be and are probably
not ready to make wholesale switches just yet. If a RWD Falcon is in the offing for post 2015,
then it would be prudent to roll out new power trains before this time and confirm reliability.

One thing I did notice on my FG, the radiator support panel juts forward to accommodate the I-6,
there's every possibility that the same could be done with a global platform:

**Polyal** · 12-12-2010, 08:18 PM

IF true then aslong as manufacturing is moved to other areas and jobs are kept then I must say its not all bad, could be alot worse thats for sure.

Its a bitter pill to swallow, we have all grown up with the I6 falcon, but if it means the brand survives into the future, with a more global reach then im all for it. What we lose in configuration we will gain in quality and spec with other systems.

Lock me in to a last of the run I6T though when it happens. Although if they manage to get a NA 5.0 in a falcon by that time I probably wouldn't bother with a 6 anyway.

Longevity of the brand and jobs should be priority IMO...whatever it takes.

vztrt · 12-12-2010, 10:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpd80

I wonder what I-6 numbers would be like if Ford introduced V6 Diesel into Sedan and Ute as well....

Ute would do well, Sedan wouldn't really.

Road_Warrior · 12-12-2010, 10:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vztrt

Ute would do well, Sedan wouldn't really.

The sedan would do well in foreign markets I reckon if it had a diesel...

Actually, the 2.7 TDi in a Falcon would be a bit of a beast I reckon.

Bobman · 12-12-2010, 11:55 PM

If BMW can make it work for their award winning straight six engines, then surely Ford can. The I6 is what makes a Falcon a Falcon. In 2008 when it was slated to be dropped it was saved and became huge news at the time.

If they do drop it, then it would be the beginning of the end for the Falcon platform as nothing can really compare for torque, towing and smoothness.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpd80

One thing I did notice on my FG, the radiator support panel juts forward to accommodate the I-6,
there's every possibility that the same could be done with a global platform

Looks like you have no coolant in the overflow bottle.

b0son · 13-12-2010, 12:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobman

If BMW can make it work for their award winning straight six engines, then surely Ford can.

BMW have a few more people buying their product than Ford Aus.

FalconXV · 13-12-2010, 01:21 AM

Territory's diesel would make for an excellent G6E variant.

jpd80 · 13-12-2010, 08:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobman

Looks like you have no coolant in the overflow bottle.

Not level, my driveway has a nasty slope to the left of the car

jpd80 · 13-12-2010, 08:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

The sedan would do well in foreign markets I reckon if it had a diesel...

Actually, the 2.7 TDi in a Falcon would be a bit of a beast I reckon.

Look what the higher series did for the XF Jaguar, 6.7 l/100 klm and 0-100 in 6.4 seconds
I know that was the 3.0 twin turbo engine but surely economy would be similar to Jag
and the performance fairly impressive too.

**Polyal** · 13-12-2010, 10:46 AM

Yeah Ford would be mad not to put diesel across the range. AFAIK if they get it in a Terry the a normal falcon should be easy. A diesel G6E/T would be a really nice car with the ZF.

Road_Warrior · 13-12-2010, 11:02 AM

But if they offered the diesel across the range the I6 would suffer and the ongoing viability of the engine plant would be called into question much sooner than the 2015-2016 date being mentioned.

Swings and roundabouts

**Polyal** · 13-12-2010, 11:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

But if they offered the diesel across the range the I6 would suffer and the ongoing viability of the engine plant would be called into question much sooner than the 2015-2016 date being mentioned.

Swings and roundabouts

If its going to happen and they have a plan to fill the void then go for it IMO.

As much as I love the I6, and it and a Clevo are the only engines I have "owned", if going with a V6 in both ecoboost and diesel means more sales and stability then its hard to argue against.

BigAL_250 · 13-12-2010, 11:55 AM

As much I love the smooth power delivery of the Straight-6, I'd rather loose it than the Falcon.

At least with the powerplants we have access to a replacement that is almost as good as the 4.0L I6. Between the Duratec 35/37 and an EcoBoost V6, we'd do pretty well.