Is the LPG excise purely to repay the LPG-rebate?

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by atec77

Lpg was a waste product and some still is being burnt off , a lot is sold to china for a few cents a litre and we over pay for the rest , in real terms we could run a lot more cars on gas than currently with ease

We have plenty reserves, also with China working on extracting their own gas we will have plenty.

[flappist]

Ok so lets have a mini hypothetical.

In the near future Prime Minister Bob Green commands that all new cars are LPG and petrol is to be phased out.

Suddenly there is a shortfall of revenue and as we already have a Hydrogen, Helium, Lithium, Beryllium, Boron, Carbon, Nitrogen, Oxygen......well we have 92 element taxes and none of them have worked out how to do compound taxes someone has a brilliant idea.

Not an original idea of course.

LETS TAX FUEL....that LPG stuff.....after all they not going anywhere without it and as GovCo now employs 75% of the population and needs 75% of GDP to keep running (up from 50% back in 2011) it is the right thing to do, worlds best practice and all.......think of the children and the future.....as we are moving forward (but not very fast as the speed limit is 20km/h).

That dirty smelly carbon based LPG is now $4/litre with a 0.01% discount for party membership.

LPG is just one solution to one small part of a very complex problem.

Unfortunately is appears to be starting to become the "Apple Macintosh" of the motor industry.

5% of the market, 95% of the crazy........

[sudszy]

Originally Posted by deesun

If it was to repay what they have forked out then why didnt they start putting it on 5 years ago when they started the rebate. The rebate is reducing but the tax is increasing if it goes on and it won't ever be comming off. There is huge hypocracy in this tax. Why tax a clean fuel when we are being encouraged to use it.

The time of it being a "clean" fuel has basically come to an end. True when the majority of cars that were being converted were leaded cars from the 70s with no catalytic converters, then it noticeably cleaned up the emissions compared to keeping the same car on petrol.
Anyone wanting to convert a car from that era has already done it and its only really newer cars that would make up any conversions these days.

The difference in emissions between a modern car now on petrol and lpg is not huge, and more importantly there is only an improvement in CO2 emissions of 3-5% running lpg.

There is however, the issue of how much emissions is caused in getting the LPG to the pump.

Presently, about 20% of Australia's pump LPG is a byproduct of producing petrol,(http://www.aph.gov.au/senate/committ...ions/sub91.pdf) so it basically the same amount of co2 is produced in getting it to the pump as is produced in actually burning the LPG.(no different to petrol)

The remaining 80% is currently being extracted from australia's large natural gas reserves, I dont know the figure on how much energy is needed there, but guessing it is not nearly as high as the refinery figure, so in that sense there is an emissions benefit in getting more of our fleet on LPG.


Does the excise have anything to do with the rebate, no, well I hope no, there are still thousands of cars converted before the rebate came in, and simply that wouldnt be fair to the people that got their cars converted before the assistance of the generous rebate.

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by sudszy

The remaining 80% is currently being extracted from australia's large natural gas reserves, I dont know the figure on how much energy is needed there, but guessing it is not nearly as high as the refinery figure, so in that sense there is an emissions benefit in getting more of our fleet on LPG.

The stuff use to be burned off into the atmosphere but now collected.

[xtremerus]

And the excise on ethanol will increase over the next few years.
Or more precisely, the temporary relief of the full excise [ the same as petrol] will be removed to eventually be the same as petrol.
LPG will head in the same direction.

[Bobman]

LPG prices have already been ridiculously high and don't fall that much as they used to (in Melbourne anyway). Average price is 57 cents per litre at the moment.

2005 - average 31 cents
2006 - average 40 cents
2007 - average 45 cents
2008 - average 49 cents
2009 - average 52 cents
2010 - average 55 cents

It might be cheaper than petrol, but as the gap closes, the savings dry up too as on average with a mixer system you're using at least 50% more than on petrol to achieve the same amount of kms.

[billy302]

The excise has nothing to do with the rebate.
This exactly the same as the excise on petrol.
It is another way of imposing a tax. As LPG usage has increased considerably the government thought that there is now enough usage to warrant a Tax.
In effect by using LPG you are avoiding a tax that the rest have to pay, and as such you and I are both tax dodgers