Chicago Places Order For 500 New Ford Police Interceptors

[Moby Vic]

Originally Posted by jpd80

Thanks for your positive comments Moby Vic,
I can understand that this is a watershed moment for North American police departments who hold
the Crown Victoria in high regard, it was a vehicle that started out as a regular production large Ford
but ended up being tailored to police needs and became their dependable and robust "office".
No wonder that Ford continued forward selling as many CVs as PDs would take right up to the end,
that was a brilliant move IMO, that shut the door on competitors and gave Ford the gap they needed to
establish the new PI sedan and Ute.

That's not quite right. The Crown Vic became the nation's police car mostly by default.

When the downsized 1979 LTD was introduced (the first of the Panther chassis), it was Ford's new full-size car, yet it was smaller than the midsize LTD II (which hadn't been downsized, and was soon replaced by the Fairmont). It was offered as a police vehicle then.

Ford was the first US manufacturer to offer a dedicated police vehicle, starting in the 1950 model year. The fullsize Ford was offered as a police vehicle pretty much every year after that. Prior to that, even dating back to the Model T days, Fords were popular as police cars. At first this was because they were cheap, but when the V8 was introduced for 1932 it was because they were cheap and had excellent performance.

Back to the Crown Vic, though, in the '80s Chrysler had popular police cars in the Diplomat and Gran Fury. The Chevy Caprice was also popular. The Mopars died off in 1988, I think.

Ford and Chevy ran neck and neck until the LT1 Caprices debuted for 1994. From 1994 through 1996 the Chevy Caprice was popular, especially with highway patrol agencies. Many police still consider the 1996 LT1 Caprice the best police car ever built.

But Chevrolet decided the profit was in trucks, and killed the Caprice to expand truck production. So for the 1997 model year, Ford was the only game in town for a RWD police sedan.

It wasn't until the Charger debuted (I can't remember the model year, but I'm thinking it was 2005) that Ford had any RWD competition. The Chargers were much more powerful than the Crown Vics, but have horrible visible and tiny trunks.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by Moby Vic

That's not quite right. The Crown Vic became the nation's police car mostly by default.

Yeah because no other manufacturer could be bothered pandering to the needs of PDs wanting the cheapest squad cars possible.
GM in disgust cancelled the last Caprice and closed down the plant because they couldn't make money on the deal...
For GM to walk away after that and only supply Impalas and Tahoes speaks volumes...

[Moby Vic]

No, Chevy was making money, but they made more money selling trucks to general consumers than selling Caprices to fleet customers.

Profits on fleet sales are nothing compared to retail sales. Police cars especially are bought on a bid price. The manufacturers compete, and typically the lowest bidder wins. It's a good deal for the agency, but there's not much incentive for the manufacturer/seller.

[jpd80]

ATM, state fleet pricing for V6 Charger is around $18,500, who can compete with that...

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by jpd80

Or like that entrepreneur mate who always gambling big to make money,
you wish him all the best but more often than not, it all ends in tears..

Ford is like the other mate that doesn't talk much about his plans but just
gets in and does what he can on a modest budget, the quiet achiever..

Nailed it in one.

[aussie muscle]

Originally Posted by Moby Vic

Dodge's problem is that it is Dodge.

Dodgey

[trentski]

Originally Posted by falconnut

I am guessing the strong AUD $ and the weak USD $ would have something to do with it.

FNA would lose money and have very narrow profit margins if the sent these to FoA and they would probably be very expensive to make up for it.

Other way around, the high Aus dollar means they could sell these to us at RRP and we woud still think we were getting a bargain. FNA could sell them to FOA at RRP and FOA would add 50% to them and they would still be cheap.

Look at car prices in the states compared to here.........

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Nailed it in one.

What worries me is that V6 business case may be getting better, that 30% difference makes the 3.7 a lot cheaper to import now.
I know I should bite my tonge for suggesting it but I hope I-6 numbers punch back up there and keep the wolf at bay....

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by jpd80

What worries me is that V6 business case may be getting better, that 30% difference makes the 3.7 a lot cheaper to import now.
I know I should bite my tonge for suggesting it but I hope I-6 numbers punch back up there and keep the wolf at bay....

Engineering it to pass crash testing for V6 Falcon was rumoured to be over $10 million alone.

Its been left too late in my opinion. They would never make back the cost savings in the 3 or 4 years it would be on sale by the time it could get into production. Even if they started now it would still take 12-18+ months to get it to market.

[Jason[98.EL]]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Engineering it to pass crash testing for V6 Falcon was rumoured to be over $10 million alone.

Its been left too late in my opinion. They would never make back the cost savings in the 3 or 4 years it would be on sale by the time it could get into production. Even if they started now it would still take 12-18+ months to get it to market.

didnt they do most of the r&d as well as engineering before govco came in to save the I6 engine plant a few yrs ago

I thought that that was the only reason that we didn't end up with the V6 then

Only my thoughts there so I could be wrong and prob are wrong

Jason

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by Jason[98.EL]

didnt they do most of the r&d as well as engineering before govco came in to save the I6 engine plant a few yrs ago

I thought that that was the only reason that we didn't end up with the V6 then

Only my thoughts there so I could be wrong and prob are wrong

Jason

As far as i'm aware most of the installation work was done, basically just getting it to fit inside the engine bay, and they had built mules. But it hadn't been crash tested yet and calibration, durability testing and emissions work was only in its early stages. It still required a lot of work to get it into production.

[Jason[98.EL]]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

As far as i'm aware most of the installation work was done, basically just getting it to fit inside the engine bay, and they had built mules. But it hadn't been crash tested yet and calibration, durability testing and emissions work was only in its early stages. It still required a lot of work to get it into production.

ahh o/k I knew they had done some work on them but was not sure how far they got

Jason

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Engineering it to pass crash testing for V6 Falcon was rumoured to be over $10 million alone.

There's a submerged problem, the biggest cost would have been making 600 people redundant
but not only that, ensuring that their superannuation was fully funded for transfer to other funds..

You see, Ford is very behind in topping up their global pension plan obligations
and in 2008/9, that would have been red ink everywhere....

[ivorya]

Why do they have to spend so much money and time on durabilty testing?

We've seen all the video's from the US showing the Ecoboost pulling trees out of the jungle etc, than after 2500millionKm's stripping the engine down to show us how good/durable it is.
this engine would be sitting in front of our Falcon, hooked up to a 6-speed auto (same as the US 1), Is it just over kill?

[JPFS1]

Originally Posted by jpd80

45% of all F150s are now Ecoboost V6s so that skepticism is basically from supporters of other manufacturers.

There are several reasons for this...

2011 saw significant production issues for Coyote. Part shortages (block, head & Crank) are a common issue at the moment.

FordNA also went on a very agressive marketing campaign for their V6, but left Coyote out to dry in comparison.

Things should change in 2012. Many of the part shortages will be relieved in the 1st qtr of 2012 as the items mentioned above move in house.

Forward projections/demand for the 5.0 is quite high for 2012, above 300,000, shortfalls are expected due to ongoing union/Ford issues and Ford not wanting to spend the extra dollars to put resources on the line.

Sorry for the off topic post though.

[Chilliman]

Getting back on topic - the City of Ottawa (Canada) has ordered 58 Ford Police Interceptors (all N/A V6, AWD) and plans to order more in the future as it upgrades its 200-car fleet over the next 4 years.

I expect that Ford will see some big orders from the NYPD, LAPD and the Michigan State PD.

[Chilliman]

Other Ford Police Interceptor orders (just small ones at this stage):

Collin County - 11 (all SUVs)

Ardmore County - 6

Dodge County - 5 (ironically the Dodge Charger is Ford's biggest threat in the County Police market)

Tipp County - 1 (an SUV)

[1TUFFUTE]

so ford looks like theyve done the smart thing by bulk building and stocking PDs with as many older cars as they wanted...now as they all do their homework they will slowly as demand needs it..replace with the new ford cruisers. Great thinking if you ask me. Keeps sales and police in fords and lets them all slowly get used to the new ford cruises as oppossed to the shock of everyone worring about the cars at once and perhaps cross shopping. geniuses...
would love to see some accumulative numbers from all the diff police cars....

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by ivorya

Why do they have to spend so much money and time on durabilty testing?

We've seen all the video's from the US showing the Ecoboost pulling trees out of the jungle etc, than after 2500millionKm's stripping the engine down to show us how good/durable it is.
this engine would be sitting in front of our Falcon, hooked up to a 6-speed auto (same as the US 1), Is it just over kill?

Different applications can throw up different problems. Airflow for one thing is different between cars, and then all the parts required to fit it to a specific application like engine mounts, sumps, inlet hoses/airboxes, exhausts, cooling and heating hoses etc.

There is so much going on it basically needs to go back and be tested from the start all over again. And same goes for calibration and emissions, all the little changes can throw it all out of whack.

A good example was the BA F6 clutch issue, under a certain circumstance the clutch pedal went to the floor and stayed there, it was found to be a certain harmonic vibration unique to the I6 that caused it. That same harmonic vibration was not present in all the other vehicles who used the same type of clutch. It just shows how you can't take a part from one vehicle and put it in another and have it work 100% under all circumstances.

And Ford protocol demands a full testing from start to finish. If it doesn't pass the durability tests, it doesn't go on sale. Oddly enough though in all Fords testing they never had a problem with the F6 clutch. It was only after Motor was able to induce the problem that they realised something was wrong.

[Chilliman]

Originally Posted by Chilliman

Other Ford Police Interceptor orders (just small ones at this stage):

Collin County - 11 (all SUVs)

Ardmore County - 6

Dodge County - 5 (ironically the Dodge Charger is Ford's biggest threat in the County Police market)

Tipp County - 1 (an SUV)

Other new orders that have just come in:

Muskegon Township - 2

Fostoria Safety Services (Police) - 3

Maplewood Fire Dept - 1 (SUV)

Scranton Police Dept - 8 (4 bought, 4 leased - needs to replace up to 30 vehicles in the future)

Crete Village, Indiana - 6 leased

Huntington City Council - 1 (SUV)

Bluffton Village Council - 1

Borough City Council - 1

[Chilliman]

Windham Police Dept - 1

Phippsburg Police Dept - 1

Sao Joaquin County - 1

Waseca County - 5

Sedgewick County - 2 (SUV)

York County - Unspecified multiple SUV

Many single orders are departments/municipalities trialing the vehicles before they committ to larger orders next year.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by JPFS1

There are several reasons for this...

2011 saw significant production issues for Coyote. Part shortages (block, head & Crank) are a common issue at the moment.

FordNA also went on a very agressive marketing campaign for their V6, but left Coyote out to dry in comparison.

Things should change in 2012. Many of the part shortages will be relieved in the 1st qtr of 2012 as the items mentioned above move in house.

Forward projections/demand for the 5.0 is quite high for 2012, above 300,000, shortfalls are expected due to ongoing union/Ford issues and Ford not wanting to spend the extra dollars to put resources on the line.

Sorry for the off topic post though.

Ecoboost V6 sales response in F150 has both surprised and delighted Ford,
rather than displacing the 5.0, it has in fact replaced nearly all 6.2 V8 sales.

So much so that Ford has announce that transit in the US will also get
not only
the 3.7V6 but also the Ecoboost V6 as well, must be a V8 replacement for
former E-Series Van buyers...

[Chilliman]

State of Oklahoma - 1

Ok this could potentially be a huge one:

The Suburban Purchasing Cooperative (SPC), which covers 135 Municipalities across 6 Counties in Northern Illinois has awarded contracts for the supply of Police vehicles to Currie Ford for the Ford Police Interceptor and Utility. Municipalities covered by the SPC will have access to massive fleet discounts for the Ford Police vehicles.

[aussie muscle]

Originally Posted by falconnut

I am guessing the strong AUD $ and the weak USD $ would have something to do with it.

FNA would lose money and have very narrow profit margins if the sent these to FoA and they would probably be very expensive to make up for it.

They look great though, i wonder how people will go importing them?

Why didnt they make a 400HP+ RWD Highway/Interstate Patrol version?

it'd be better than our police driving toyotas and holdens.

i'd imagine the highway patrol version wasn't done because those divisions are looking for fuel savings at the moment. maybe a higher HP version will come later.

[Chilliman]

Originally Posted by falconnut

Why didnt they make a 400HP+ RWD Highway/Interstate Patrol version?

No need when they have a 365HP+ AWD version to do that sort of work even when said highway is iced over. The Ecoboost V6 will easily see 450hp with just intake & exhaust (no tuning), but hp isn't the be-all-and-end-all of police work.

[FPV GTHO]

Originally Posted by jpd80

Ecoboost V6 sales response in F150 has both surprised and delighted Ford,
rather than displacing the 5.0, it has in fact replaced nearly all 6.2 V8 sales.

So much so that Ford has announce that transit in the US will also get
not only
the 3.7V6 but also the Ecoboost V6 as well, must be a V8 replacement for
former E-Series Van buyers...

I wonder if those engine options will flow onto Ranger eventually.

[Chilliman]

More orders (some smaller municipalities are diving into the deep end):

- Arcadia Police Dept - 1
- Beverly Hills Fire dept - 2
- Claremont Police Dept - 2
- Village of Woodridge - 7
- Cook County - 2 (SUV)
- Mt Pleasant Police Dept - 2
- South Saint Paul City Council - 2 (SUV)
- Culpeper Police Dept - 5
- Auburn City Council - 1
- Grand Forks City council - 7
- City of Livonia - 4 & 2 (SUV)
- McLeod County - 3 & 1 (SUV)
- Tallahasse Police Dept - 40!
- Wabasha County Sherrif - 1
- St Thomas Police - 3
- County of Riverside - 2
- Senaca Village - 1
- California University of Pensylvania - 1

[dylancox]

Hmm.. why not just import the police Ford Intercepter as 'Ford Intercepter XR6TT' as it is and sell it here as the large sedan for civilians. Interceptor has a heaps nicer ring than Toreass, or Mundano. They could turn the Aussie production line into a LHD to RHD conversion line, like they did with the late 90s Mustang at Tickford?

[FPV GTHO]

Not worth the money when you can just build them RHD in the first place.