Should Ford drop the FALCON nameplate...?

[Nikked]

Originally Posted by Luke Plaizier

Brand awareness is an expensive exercise. Nissan found that out and brought back the Pulsar name. Even Ford knew that the Taurus was a known brand and brought it back.

If we're going to see a 4 Door Mustang, then if anything, the Falcon name should stay. If we're going to see an imported Taurus, then given the even poorer reputation of that name in Australia, the Falcon name should stay.

if we're going to see the Mondeo/Fusion replace the Falcon, then that name is known, and Falcon can go.

But it would be a real shame to lose one of the longest running nameplates in the world.

Lukeyson

Yep...and really, what else would you call a Falcon like car?


I'd rather see the money that would be used on a name-change (market research etc) used towards improving the Falcon image.

[Maka]

The versatility of the Falcon chassis over the last decade or more is astonishing- from a roomy & comfortable family car to a rip snorting sports car. When COTF racing starts here hopefully the German brigade will compete so the Falcon can defeat them all consistently & give our Falcon a better, bigger profile around the globe.

Hell, build some factory DTM racers, send them to Ford Germany and start building a profile there! Beating them on there own turf would certainly make the Germans (& the world) take notice! If the Falcon can do all that, it can become a world car at a certain price, build them in China i dont care! The Falcon will have to be built overseas for it to have future post 2016

But a 5 series et al challenger at a super competitive price sold in that market could springboard our Falcon into the international spot light. To see the Falcon do well oversea's would make ALL Aussies proud!

"My Ford , My Falcon" (copyright Maka* lol!)



cheers,Maka

[Maka]

Originally Posted by jpd80

The Falcon name will continue after 2016, you can take that to the bank..

I reckon it will too,good call jpd80!

cheers,Maka

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by Maka

I reckon it will too,good call jpd80!

cheers,Maka

Now this is just my opinion:

Far from being portrayed as the baddies in all of this, I'd say the Americans are bending over backwards
to accommodate the needs of Ford Australia, they are letting Falcon play its hand out but more importantly,
the Americans seem to be in no hurry to replace either their own Taurus or the Aussie Falcon.

It's almost as though they recognise that the market for large cars in the USA and Australia is now
much smaller and that it's becoming much more of a niche where buyres are prepared to pay for
what they see as essentials in a large car...plenty of space, comfort and good driving dynamics.

I'm hoping that the space efficiency of Falcons design can be merged with the impressive reductions
in weight possible with new designs, look at V6 Impala, it's the weight of a TDCI Mondeo.
FWD i know but surely, those lessons learned can be transferred from FWD car to RWD cars...

The biggest plus for FoA is somewhere else picking up the cost for the car, not only USA but
maybe Brazil, Russia, India and China (BRIC) could have serious need of an affordable large car.

[Bossxr8]

Ford might bend over backwards but there's only so far that they can bend before they break.

Sales volumes of less than 1000 a month are unsustainable. Hell, the original sales projections to be profitable on FG were 3500 a month.

Large export markets would be its only chance to continue in large RWD format.

I think its put up or shut up time for Detroit, either back the Falcon and open up export markets for it or kill it, there's no in between.

[Burnout]

The value of a large car was brought home to me today, stepped into the bosses Car a Santa Fe, thing was crap, after driving it for an hour I was in pain, squelshed up like a rotten tomato, I'm 5'11" and with the seat right back my head was between me knees.
My young bloke is 6'5", he wouldn't even be able to get into the thing, crikey me daughter is 6'2".......
If there isn't a market for the over six footers what do they do........ walk?

[Maka]

Originally Posted by jpd80

Now this is just my opinion:

Far from being portrayed as the baddies in all of this, I'd say the Americans are bending over backwards
to accommodate the needs of Ford Australia, they are letting Falcon play its hand out but more importantly,
the Americans seem to be in no hurry to replace either their own Taurus or the Aussie Falcon.

It's almost as though they recognise that the market for large cars in the USA and Australia is now
much smaller and that it's becoming much more of a niche where buyres are prepared to pay for
what they see as essentials in a large car...plenty of space, comfort and good driving dynamics.

I'm hoping that the space efficiency of Falcons design can be merged with the impressive reductions
in weight possible with new designs, look at V6 Impala, it's the weight of a TDCI Mondeo.
FWD i know but surely, those lessons learned can be transferred from FWD car to RWD cars...

The biggest plus for FoA is somewhere else picking up the cost for the car, not only USA but
maybe Brazil, Russia, India and China (BRIC) could have serious need of an affordable large car.

Yes, again i agree. The business plan imo could call for Fords intended markets to all chip in / pay for building a new global Falcon but the business strategy is where Ford will be using all the their experience & guile in working out how best to a) build a lighter weight (1450-1500kg max) Falcon, b) knowing what & how many configurations would suit each market,

c) knowing that some times too much versatility is a bad thing just like too much value adding is - so maybe Falcon can live on in a maximum of 2 or 3 models- sport, comfort and shooting brake? (example versions only) with maximum flexibility on engine & transmission choice, trim,options etc. d) target presentation & marketing saturation frequency e) ongoing customer consultation throughout the lifespan of each model.

What i do know is that Ford can compete against established benchmarked marques on price/reliability if not quality (if they improve a bit) Ford, just like Forrest said- You can do it!

cheers,Maka

[Road_Warrior]

Ford has said the large car segment is important to them, and they want to be a part of it going forward. It is how and where they do it which will matter (well, to us anyway). The other thing is, the large car segment is relatively unimportant to the rest of the lineup - volume selling, mass market cars like Fiesta and Focus - so they can afford to let large cars dribble away in the background for a while until they get all their ducks in a row with the volume sellers and global platforms. Look at how long they strung out the Crown Victoria for - they know that having a large car with poor sales or whatever in today's market is not a deal breaker, for the time being anyway.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Ford might bend over backwards but there's only so far that they can bend before they break.

Sales volumes of less than 1000 a month are unsustainable. Hell, the original sales projections to be profitable on FG were 3500 a month.

Large export markets would be its only chance to continue in large RWD format.

I think its put up or shut up time for Detroit, either back the Falcon and open up export markets for it or kill it, there's no in between.

I think the speed of change shocked them, they obviously felt like they had more time.
Which also explains why there seems to be no action, most likely reason being that a
replacement vehicle won't be ready until 2016 but you're right, Ford has to keep Falcon alive,
even if that means a few with Fusion styled nose and corporate interiors for export in 2014...

[Road_Warrior]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

I think its put up or shut up time for Broadmeadows marketing department, either advertise the Falcon and open up export markets for it or resign, there's no in between.

Fixed.

[aussie muscle]

As i said on another thread this week i'd rather they kept the name if nothing else.

my guess is it'll be something simpler/shorter, everyone's copying Mazda with their 2,3,6 names. You know, so dumb people can remember the name!

[superfly]

Originally Posted by jpd80

The Falcon name will continue after 2016, you can take that to the bank..

Love that movie!

And I hope you're right.

[Kable72]

**** no.

[Itsme]

No....

Now if you want to try and keep the Falcon name sake why don't some mods on this site organise an online petition to Ford.... just over 80,000 Ford members is a big message to Ford Australia....a big voice of protest.

Up to you guys now!!!

[mike_nofx]

Instead of FalcON, maybe Falc-off?

[Falcman0o7]

No comment!

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by mike_nofx

Instead of FalcON, maybe Falc-off?

Russian Falcon?

[tranquilized]

I think its time for it to go unfortunately.

The Falcon has zero aspirational appeal to the mainstream market. Having spoken to a lot of non car people, and a lot of car people who are non-Ford (or Holden) people, it seems the general consensus among this lot (who make up the majority of the buying public) is that the Falcon is a lumbering, thirsty dinosaur, hopelessly behind the times and with its association with bogans - very uncool.

While some of that may be true, we know that most of it definitely isn't. But we dont buy enough cars so what we think is irrelevant.

I think the Falcon name is toxic. Its at the end of its very long life cycle; nothing called the Falcon will sell anymore, no matter how good it is.

Plus, once the current generation is finished - Ford say 2016 but it might soldier on for a year or two after that, the replacement will be on a FWD global platform - calling this car Falcon will alienate the Falcon fans, eliminate overnight any performance models, while throwing all the stigma of the old car onto the new one (for the people who believe there is a stigma to the Falcon name that is) - that would be a disastrous idea.

Its true that it costs a fortune to establish a new nameplate, but a fortune would need to be spent on changing views on the Falcon with no guarantee it would work. Its a gamble either way, but after 56 years and the inevitible change to FWD, my money would be on a change of name.

How about this pipe dream for post-2016;

Fully imported large car on a global FWD/AWD platform – call it the Fusion
Bring the next Mustang over for the performance market.
Manufacture the Ranger in Melbourne. A car of that size and type should be able to turn a profit even here, and supplies seem quite tight.

That’s all just in my opinion though…

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by tranquilized

I think its time for it to go unfortunately.

The Falcon has zero aspirational appeal to the mainstream market. Having spoken to a lot of non car people, and a lot of car people who are non-Ford (or Holden) people, it seems the general consensus among this lot (who make up the majority of the buying public) is that the Falcon is a lumbering, thirsty dinosaur, hopelessly behind the times and with its association with bogans - very uncool.

So you canvassed a demographic that doesn't or would never buy Falcons and got a negative response...

how odd...

Its true that it costs a fortune to establish a new nameplate, but a fortune would need to be spent on changing views on the Falcon with no guarantee it would work. Its a gamble either way, but after 56 years and the inevitible change to FWD, my money would be on a change of name.

How about this pipe dream for post-2016;

Fully imported large car on a global FWD/AWD platform – call it the Fusion
Bring the next Mustang over for the performance market.
Manufacture the Ranger in Melbourne. A car of that size and type should be able to turn a profit even here, and supplies seem quite tight.

That’s all just in my opinion though…

Good thoughts...

Maybe a car wider than Fusion/Mondeo but with similar weight....

[tranquilized]

Originally Posted by jpd80

So you canvassed a demographic that doesn't or would never buy Falcons and got a negative response...

how odd...

Hardly an exhaustive survey of the market I admit, but I think its relevant - its the mainstream car buying demographic, and while only anecdotal, the feedback I got is reflected in the sales figures.

The demographic that would or might buy a Falcon is shrinking by the day, which is the whole point of this discussion.

[MethodX]

Rename Ford to FMC, with a round shiel, Blue and white background.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by tranquilized

Hardly an exhaustive survey of the market I admit, but I think its relevant - its the mainstream car buying demographic, and while only anecdotal, the feedback I got is reflected in the sales figures.

The demographic that would or might buy a Falcon is shrinking by the day, which is the whole point of this discussion.

And since around 75% of Falcon sales are or at least were to fleets, maybe you're really asking the wrong people..

But i do understand what you're saying...the relevance of falcon in modern buying preferences is fading
There is a direct correlation between the decline of Falcon sales and the rise of Mid/large SUVs.
A better mix of diesel economy, better space and utility than sedans, looks like handling is down the list..

[Road_Warrior]

Originally Posted by tranquilized

Plus, once the current generation is finished - Ford say 2016 but it might soldier on for a year or two after that

This is still a possibility BTW

Just sayin, yo

[jixel 78]

Originally Posted by tranquilized

I think its time for it to go unfortunately.

The Falcon has zero aspirational appeal to the mainstream market. Having spoken to a lot of non car people, and a lot of car people who are non-Ford (or Holden) people, it seems the general consensus among this lot (who make up the majority of the buying public) is that the Falcon is a lumbering, thirsty dinosaur, hopelessly behind the times and with its association with bogans - very uncool.

While some of that may be true, we know that most of it definitely isn't. But we dont buy enough cars so what we think is irrelevant.

I think the Falcon name is toxic. Its at the end of its very long life cycle; nothing called the Falcon will sell anymore, no matter how good it is.

Plus, once the current generation is finished - Ford say 2016 but it might soldier on for a year or two after that, the replacement will be on a FWD global platform - calling this car Falcon will alienate the Falcon fans, eliminate overnight any performance models, while throwing all the stigma of the old car onto the new one (for the people who believe there is a stigma to the Falcon name that is) - that would be a disastrous idea.

Its true that it costs a fortune to establish a new nameplate, but a fortune would need to be spent on changing views on the Falcon with no guarantee it would work. Its a gamble either way, but after 56 years and the inevitible change to FWD, my money would be on a change of name.

How about this pipe dream for post-2016;

Fully imported large car on a global FWD/AWD platform – call it the Fusion
Bring the next Mustang over for the performance market.
Manufacture the Ranger in Melbourne. A car of that size and type should be able to turn a profit even here, and supplies seem quite tight.

That’s all just in my opinion though…

+1. Its way past its use by date, and the name is defineately hindering sales. Young people who aspire to owning a new car and want a Falcon are but a tiny percentage of of the buying market. Now Commodore......well thats a little different. I work with a lot of young people 17 to 25, and the general consensus is if youre driving a Falcon, it mustve been cheap.

[tranquilized]

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

This is still a possibility BTW

Just sayin, yo

Well if history is any indication, its a very high possibility yeah. The last 3 generations have each run for 10 years, with more frequent and significant updates than the FG has had in its 4 years.

[mik]

No !!!