Oh, Goodie..........

[aussiblue]

Does anyone know if they will fine drivers for smoking a cigarette while driving?

Only if they have children in the car too.

[93EB_SXR6]

Originally Posted by aussiblue

Only if they have children in the car too.

And so they should in that scenario! Cheers for the reply.

[NAK302]

wow another personal freedom removed from our pathetic lives to raise some cash using road safety as an excuse. by that i don't mean taking pics of someone on a phone but more to the point, to photogragh YOU in your car.

[ford71V8]

With all the focus on speeding and "encouraging" road-users to abide by the laws via the hip pocket, there was always something coming next to keep the revenue collection up once a big percentage of the "hoons" conformed.

If they are not getting the dollars one way, they'll find other ways.

[Itsme]

Originally Posted by Lotte

Read the article? They legitimately say "we have to guess on what some people are really doing, and we'll make that decision".
Sure it can be contested, but with the state's current system of guilty till proven innocent, this could turn into a nightmare. For VicPol, and for drivers.

And face it. All the officer manning the camera has to say is "I saw them using their phone/other distracting device/eating chips dangerously; and by the time the shot was taken, it was no longer in view".

It needs to be better utilised in it's inception. Great idea. However, they're admitting they're gonna **** it up.

Yes I read the article
In all my years of driving if I copped a fine I have surely deserved it, never had a policeman yet lie to to give out a fine if any I found the police to err in your favour, How many times have you been let off?

[Silver Ghia]

Originally Posted by trublu

Yes I read the article
In all my years of driving if I copped a fine I have surely deserved it, never had a policeman yet lie to to give out a fine if any I found the police to err in your favour, How many times have you been let off?

My experience is the opposite. Must admit it was about 30 years ago, but the first time fined was when radar guns were first coming in and I was pinged doing 80kph. No way was I doing that in the 60 zone, and problems with false readings with those guns surfaced shortly after. Then again a little later on when a couple of police in a plain XD (thats how long ago it was) played funny buggers to get me to exceed the speed limit. No fines since, fortunately.

So I am quite sceptical with these new cameras and the operator ethics/judgement required.

[Itsme]

Originally Posted by Silver Ghia

My experience is the opposite. Must admit it was about 30 years ago, but the first time fined was when radar guns were first coming in and I was pinged doing 80kph. No way was I doing that in the 60 zone, and problems with false readings with those guns surfaced shortly after. Then again a little later on when a couple of police in a plain XD (thats how long ago it was) played funny buggers to get me to exceed the speed limit. No fines since, fortunately.

So I am quite sceptical with these new cameras and the operator ethics/judgement required.

Well there you go the Radar gun had problems not the fault of operator I suppose but then again you can get an over zealous policeman doing his job.

As for being baited by police in unmarked police cars all I can say if you fall for it stiff titties..... This tactic has been around for a long time as it has been tried on me many times in my younger days.

[Lotte]

The statement is still made "they don't have to see you use the phone, just determine you are too distracted".

You might have fantastic experiences with the cops, but not everyone does.
As I said, if the photo needed to show the driver clearly using the phone for a person to be charged, fine. But it doesn't. Therein lies the problem.

[Full Noise]

Originally Posted by Lotte

The statement is still made "they don't have to see you use the phone, just determine you are too distracted".

You might have fantastic experiences with the cops, but not everyone does.
As I said, if the photo needed to show the driver clearly using the phone for a person to be charged, fine. But it doesn't. Therein lies the problem.

[Franco Cozzo]

[mcflux]

Easy solution to the mobile phone guesswork - VicPol have access to mobile phone carriers' metadata (phone # & time/duration for phone activity, be it make a call, take a call, txt or data). If you're pinged at 8.47am on 27/04/2014 for supposedly being on your phone, and your metadata records indicate you had received a call spanning 8.45 to 8.52, you're done. If no records exist of phone activity in that time, VicPol eat humble pie.

If your car has bluetooth, this can be determined by a check of your rego when pinged, and it can be assumed that you're not retarded/you're using bluetooth.

[Full Noise]

Originally Posted by Ghia5L

Easy solution to the mobile phone guesswork - VicPol have access to mobile phone carriers' metadata (phone # & time/duration for phone activity, be it make a call, take a call, txt or data). If you're pinged at 8.47am on 27/04/2014 for supposedly being on your phone, and your metadata records indicate you had received a call spanning 8.45 to 8.52, you're done. If no records exist of phone activity in that time, VicPol eat humble pie.

If your car has bluetooth, this can be determined by a check of your rego when pinged, and it can be assumed that you're not retarded/you're using bluetooth.

But herein lies the problem. They don’t have to prove anything.

You only have to be touching your phone to have committed an offence, it doesn’t even matter if it’s turned off, they’ll still ping you.

For example, I have mild eczema and often find myself scratching the side of my head. If one of these bozos was looking through a zoom lens and saw my hand against my ear, it would be fair to assume that they would happily write out an infringement because “they say” that I was on my phone.

[mcflux]

Yes, that is a serious problem with this thread topic - that they don't have to prove anything, and I find it silly that a phone switched off (or not "in use") can get you pinged, but my observation above related to removing any guesswork for whether someone actually gets busted with a phone "in use".

[T-Pak Addict]

Lots of people have forward facing car cams....

Looks like having another facing showing what you are doing as a driver could be the evidence to guard against this kinda BS.... I would rather buy a 2nd car cam than get done for something I haven't done and cant prove!!!

[Full Noise]

Originally Posted by T-Pak Addict

Lots of people have forward facing car cams....

Looks like having another facing showing what you are doing as a driver could be the evidence to guard against this kinda BS.... I would rather buy a 2nd car cam than get done for something I haven't done and cant prove!!!

I don’t find myself driving cars very often, but I have thought of this. I have multiple cams in the truck but for it to work, you’d have to take it to court and convince a magistrate. If it meant saving four points on my licence, I’d do anything but remember, coppers lie through their teeth in court and a magistrate may discard the video footage it they choose to.

[Stefan]

So I'll adjust my heater / AC which happen to be in a low position in my car and receive a fine for texting.

I bet my ar$e they won't be pulling you over either, you'll just get the fine in the mail a month or two later and you will have no chance to prove your innocence there and then, you either pay or take it to court on a "my word against theirs" basis.

Even if you have a dash cam do you keep footage for two months? Probably not, even if you did, try and find it and pin point the time of the alleged offense.

My understanding is also that even if the court overturns your fine the demerit points still stick? (correct me if I'm wrong, I've read this on the net a few times)

All the guys applauding this, I bet will sing a different tune when you receive a $450 fine in the mail for scratching your gonads!

[Full Noise]

Originally Posted by Stefan

So I'll adjust my heater / AC which happen to be in a low position in my car and receive a fine for texting.

I bet my ar$e they won't be pulling you over either, you'll just get the fine in the mail a month or two later and you will have no chance to prove your innocence there and then, you either pay or take it to court on a "my word against theirs" basis.

Even if you have a dash cam do you keep footage for two months? Probably not, even if you did, try and find it and pin point the time of the alleged offense.

My understanding is also that even if the court overturns your fine the demerit points still stick? (correct me if I'm wrong, I've read this on the net a few times)

All the guys applauding this, I bet will sing a different tune when you receive a $450 fine in the mail for scratching your gonads!

I’m not sure about other states, but in Victoria, you are correct, the points still stand. This is where it gets expensive as you will need a big $$$ beak to argue that the offence was not actually committed.

It’s no point going to court and asking for leniency, you must straight out deny that the offence was committed and to do that you will need proof, proof that the court will accept. As we all know, your word against theirs only works if you drive through a red light and your name happens to be Paul Keating.

I took a fine to court in 2003 and was fined $100 without conviction, however, the points were still added and the magistrate had no control over this. As far as I’m aware, the government changed this because of the amount of taxi drivers clogging up the court system, basically they just take everything to court regardless of whether they did it or not and just plead guilty on the day.

[Yellow_Festiva]

Originally Posted by Stefan

So I'll adjust my heater / AC which happen to be in a low position in my car and receive a fine for texting.

I bet my ar$e they won't be pulling you over either, you'll just get the fine in the mail a month or two later and you will have no chance to prove your innocence there and then, you either pay or take it to court on a "my word against theirs" basis.

Even if you have a dash cam do you keep footage for two months? Probably not, even if you did, try and find it and pin point the time of the alleged offense.

My understanding is also that even if the court overturns your fine the demerit points still stick? (correct me if I'm wrong, I've read this on the net a few times)

All the guys applauding this, I bet will sing a different tune when you receive a $450 fine in the mail for scratching your gonads!

Used to be the case up until a few years ago I believe...

Agree with the rest.