What happens now with Ford?

[solomani]

Hi guys,

Returning home to Australia after a decade+ overseas and was surprised to find out from my Dad that Ford AU is shutting down. I know they will be bringing in the mustangs for us now - a good thing in my opinion as I am a big fan of this car - but I don't see that as a replacement for things like falcons and such.

Will the other American Fords be coming as well - Fusion, Taurus, hybrids, F150s, Expeditions etc? I couldn't find anything specific apart from the commitment to bring in Mustangs.

Thanks all.

[NX74205]

Originally Posted by solomani

Hi guys,

Returning home to Australia after a decade+ overseas and was surprised to find out from my Dad that Ford AU is shutting down. I know they will be bringing in the mustangs for us now - a good thing in my opinion as I am a big fan of this car - but I don't see that as a replacement for things like falcons and such.

Will the other American Fords be coming as well - Fusion, Taurus, hybrids, F150s, Expeditions etc? I couldn't find anything specific apart from the commitment to bring in Mustangs.

Thanks all.

The new American Fusion is our new Mondeo (due early next year if I'm not mistaken) - except Fusion is sedan only, Mondeo is hatch and wagon only. New US Ford Escape is Ford Kuga here.

Taurus is not coming, neither is the F150, nor the Expedition.

Ford range post-2016 will be Fiesta, Ecosport, Focus, Kuga, Mondeo, Ranger, Everest, Mustang.

No hybrids coming here that I'm aware of, although since the North American market gets Fusion and Focus Hybrids (and plug-in Hybrids), maybe we'll see a Focus plug-in hybrid and a Mondeo Hybrid. But that's just guessing on my part, there hasn't been any official announcements to that effect.

[XR Martin]

I seem to recall that will be eleven Fords on sale after Falcon?
With those mentioned in the post above you can add the Transit Custom and Transit which brings the total to ten.

So what do we reckon the eleventh will be?

[Bossxr8]

Edge.

[NX74205]

Originally Posted by XR6 Martin

I seem to recall that will be eleven Fords on sale after Falcon?
With those mentioned in the post above you can add the Transit Custom and Transit which brings the total to ten.

Yeah, forgot about those.

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Edge.

Has that been confirmed? I thought it was just a rumour at this stage - although it would make perfect sense, given Australians' obsession with SUVs.

[solomani]

Thanks all. So the Fusion is targeted to replace the Falcon as thejr family car entry? The Edge looks fine as a SUV crossover but is that meant to compete against Land Cruisers and their ilk? Seems its not the right car in their lineup to go against the full SUVs/4x4.

[Blueford260]

Everest will be Ford's more capable 4x4 based on the Ranger, Edge would replace the Territory.

[PX_Ranger]

Bring in the Raptor I say !

[solomani]

Originally Posted by Blueford260

Everest will be Ford's more capable 4x4 based on the Ranger, Edge would replace the Territory.

The Ranger was an Australian made SUV? So it seems like they are not just importing US models directly but doing a bit of mix and match - importing some, renaming some, and/or manufacturing specifically for Australia.

• Fiesta = Direct import, minimal changes.
• Ecosport = ?
• Focus = Direct import, minimal changes.
• Kuga = Rebadged Ford Escape.
• Ranger = Made for Australia.
• Everest = ?
• Mustang = Direct import, minimal changes.
• Mondeo = Rebadged Fusion with body changes.
• Edge = Direct import, minimal changes.
• Transit Custom = Direct import, minimal changes.
• Transit = Direct import, minimal changes.

Shame, would love to see the US Expedition or Explorer here.

[Grobbo]

Ranger is built for everyone, not just us, it had some development here in AUS like a lot of Ford products do now.

It's built in Thailand, as will be the Everest when it arrives.

All Fords will be imported - mainly from Asia. Although they are obviously developed all over the world...

I think there's a good chance everything we get will be built in Asia somewhere - even the Mustang. In no way is that a bad thing - the build quality on the Focus & Kuga now is awesome.

Ford dealers can't wait for the Falcon to die - they sell next to none, and there is a widespread perception that Ford is pulling out of Australia. Not helped by the media constantly saying "Ford is closing down".

Once it finally goes, then people will realise Ford has actually got a whole bunch of great vehicles which are much better built than the Falcon...

It actually has segment leading cars in nearly every category, but the sales numbers in Australia are way off what they are in other markets - Ford Focus for instance - worlds top selling car in 2012 and 2013. Only got to number 12 here - this has nothing to do with our car market, as Corolla was number one here, it's entirely the public's perception of the brand.

[Grobbo]

Originally Posted by PX_Ranger

Bring in the Raptor I say !

If they bought Americas number one selling vehicle to Australia (F-150) we are similar in so many ways, I reckon it would sell in pretty decent numbers.

Maybe by the time you tool up a RHD version it gets too expensive who knows...

It is probably only Australia who would buy it in RHD as it is probably just way too big for nearly every other RHD market...

Shame

[Blueford260]

Originally Posted by solomani

The Ranger was an Australian made SUV? So it seems like they are not just importing US models directly but doing a bit of mix and match - importing some, renaming some, and/or manufacturing specifically for Australia.

• Fiesta = Direct import, minimal changes.
• Ecosport = ? India
• Focus = Direct import, minimal changes.
• Kuga = Rebadged Ford Escape.
• Ranger = Made for Australia.
• Everest = ? Thailand
• Mustang = Direct import, minimal changes.
• Mondeo = Rebadged Fusion with body changes.
• Edge = Direct import, minimal changes.
• Transit Custom = Direct import, minimal changes.
• Transit = Direct import, minimal changes.

Shame, would love to see the US Expedition or Explorer here.

The PX Ranger was designed in Australia but it is made in Thailand, the Everest will be the same, designed here built over there.
The problem will most of the US built Fords is that they are designed for the north american market which as you know is LHD, and most of their platforms are base on this so unless they can sell that car in RHD to the rest of the world as well Australia is to small of a market to spent the money to redesign their LHD platform to RHD. So in the short term the only way we will get the US Expedition, Explorer or F series here is if state governments change the law on registration of LHD vehicles.

[solomani]

Great, thanks for the feedback guys.

[simon varley]

what happens now with Ford? It will become the largest automotive employer in Victoria, if not the country, employing 1000 engineers and forming the engineering centre of excellence for the whole Asia Pacific Region.

Oh, and some franchised dealers will sell some imported cars.

[Grobbo]

Originally Posted by simon varley

Oh, and some franchised dealers will sell some imported cars.

If any survive to beyond 2015... I bet there's not many Dealerships making money out of selling new Fords at the moment.

[reds89]

We lost the F series in 92 because FORD america said that australia was 2 percent of total sales volume and thats back when most states were running effies for ambulance etc.
Now there is the ranger, effies now are full import by small companies,which most of us can,t afford.
I took a 2013 150 harley davidson for a run last year[in for a blue slip] $155,000,thats our dollars.
Would i love one...yes,can i afford one nooo.

[Trump]

Originally Posted by simon varley

what happens now with Ford? It will become the largest automotive employer in Victoria, if not the country, employing 1000 engineers and forming the engineering centre of excellence for the whole Asia Pacific Region.

Oh, and some franchised dealers will sell some imported cars.

I'd love to see your optimism turn into reality, but the days are numbered for Ford's Australian engineering division. Despite assurances to the contrary, what it boils down to is one Australian engineer or ten Indian engineers...

[Bucket]

Originally Posted by Loud_Noises

I'd love to see your optimism turn into reality, but the days are numbered for Ford's Australian engineering division. Despite assurances to the contrary, what it boils down to is one Australian engineer or ten Indian engineers...

You can't buy experience and talent though....

[JG66ME]

Originally Posted by Bucket

You can't buy experience and talent though....

Try and tell that to a bean counter :-(

[simon varley]

Originally Posted by Loud_Noises

I'd love to see your optimism turn into reality, but the days are numbered for Ford's Australian engineering division. Despite assurances to the contrary, what it boils down to is one Australian engineer or ten Indian engineers...

Ford of India have been working on car programs for 10 years now and not to put too fine a point on it - they are crap! If anything the risk is from Ford of China, but they are a very young inexperienced workforce, who won't be able to stand on their own two feet for at least five years yet, if ever. There is a massive investment in facilities going on in China, but such a high turnover rate of staff that there's nobody competent to run them.

We have so much work on in Ford Australia Engineering right now it's almost not funny.

[Trump]

Originally Posted by simon varley

Ford of India have been working on car programs for 10 years now and not to put too fine a point on it - they are crap! If anything the risk is from Ford of China, but they are a very young inexperienced workforce, who won't be able to stand on their own two feet for at least five years yet, if ever. There is a massive investment in facilities going on in China, but such a high turnover rate of staff that there's nobody competent to run them.

We have so much work on in Ford Australia Engineering right now it's almost not funny.

As JGG mentioned, the bean counters don't distinguish between good and bad engineers, they see the bottom line and thats it.

Do you work for Ford in engineering Simon?

[simon varley]

guilty

[solomani]

I work in the financial industry where there has been a lot of offloading of work to India over the last decade. However, the quality of service has always been crap and they have never come up to scratch so over the last few years a reversal has happened.

Anything that requires skill, especially specialty skill like engineering and design, remains in country (wherever that country is) and very low skill IT/accounting work is off shored to India. Anyone in India who is found to be competent is taken out and moved to where the business needs them. I would expect the same to happen to automobile engineering.

China is not much better. Though they are technically more competent when it comes to IT the quality of work is rubbish not to mention the constant risk (and cost) of theft.

Again, OK to offshore grunt work to China but anything important or a high level of skill remains in-house and in country. China has gotten to the point where the cost to protect a companies reputation (by making sure the quality is good) and intellectual property is getting to the point where it makes sense to bring things back to their originating country - USA, AU wherever.

This is from my 17+ years in the finance industry in Asia/Oceania. I wouldn't expect it to be much different in other fields.

[XR Martin]

Corruption is rife in India and China, so alot of companies are weary of outsourcing engineering in those countries.

[NX74205]

Originally Posted by solomani

• Fiesta = Direct import, minimal changes.
• Ecosport = ?
• Focus = Direct import, minimal changes.
• Kuga = Rebadged Ford Escape.
• Ranger = Made for Australia.
• Everest = ?
• Mustang = Direct import, minimal changes.
• Mondeo = Rebadged Fusion with body changes.
• Edge = Direct import, minimal changes.
• Transit Custom = Direct import, minimal changes.
• Transit = Direct import, minimal changes.

It might be semantics, but I'd say that the Escape is a rebadged Kuga; and the Fusion a rebadged Mondeo. The new Escape and Fusion has far more in common with the European Kuga and Mondeo than its own predecessors.

In any event, the Ford lineup going forward post 2016 is going to consist of more European Fords than American Fords - and that's something I'm very happy about. We've had the Explorer here before and I personally don't see how it'll be any better than the Everest we're going to get. The Expedition is another size up altogether, and I wonder if there's going to be enough of a market to justify a low volume import.

[simon varley]

escape/kuga are unique top hats sitting on the same platform. Same for Mondeo/Fusion. this means they share technology and powerpacks, but can have touchy feely stuff and exterior design features that are more aligned to the target markets. You can't really say one is a rebadged other. They both launched at the same time AFAIK. It's just that our local marketing team are a bit slow on the uptake.

[XR Martin]

Originally Posted by simon varley

escape/kuga are unique top hats sitting on the same platform. Same for Mondeo/Fusion. this means they share technology and powerpacks, but can have touchy feely stuff and exterior design features that are more aligned to the target markets. You can't really say one is a rebadged other. They both launched at the same time AFAIK. It's just that our local marketing team are a bit slow on the uptake.

New Mondeo still hasnt been launched anywhere.