1990 Laser TX3 whining/whistling sound when revving

WhistleBeGone · 08-04-2016, 03:23 PM

Hi

I recently had a broken head gasket replaced. At the same time, other things that were also replaced including the timing belt, both drive belts, radiator and water pump. Since I got the car back, there has been a whining / whistle sound when I rev the engine. This occurs if the car is in neutral or in gear. The sound is higher pitched than the normal engine sound and quieter. The frequency of the whistling increases with higher revs and decreases again when revs are reduced. The sound is most audible when changing gears due to the constant increase / decrease in revs. When at constant revs, the sound is hard to make out and I'm not sure if is present but not noticeable (because it is not changing frequency) or simply not present.

Aside from this issue, the car has been carefully looked after and is in pretty good condition. It has done close to 200,000 kms.

Does anyone know what might be causing this sound? I have taken the car back to Ford (who did the repair) but they weren't sure what the problem was.

GTLEGEND · 08-04-2016, 08:09 PM

Sounds like a possible vacuum leak somewhere or the timing belt is whining. to eliminate a timing belt, loosen the top timing cover back, spray a little lube on the belt and see if noise goes away. It wont last long as the lube will wear off the belt quickly, but will let you know if thats the concern. The belt can also rub against the metal plate that sits on the crank pulley behind the belt. That needs to be replaced in conjunction with the belt.

Also do the same with the normal drive belts or take off and see if noise is gone. If noise goes it could be the belt(s) or a pulley or the belt being over tensioned and putting load on a pulley bearing.

WhistleBeGone · 09-04-2016, 12:22 PM

Thanks for the reply - it's great to get some help on this. I probably don't know enough to try your suggestions myself but I will pass them onto Ford and see if they are able to fix things.

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTLEGEND

Sounds like a possible vacuum leak somewhere

Could you expand on this? Is it something that could of occurred as a result of the head gasket and other parts being replaced?

Quote:

or the timing belt is whining. to eliminate a timing belt, loosen the top timing cover back, spray a little lube on the belt and see if noise goes away. It wont last long as the lube will wear off the belt quickly, but will let you know if thats the concern.

Will definitely pass this onto Ford.

Quote:

The belt can also rub against the metal plate that sits on the crank pulley behind the belt. That needs to be replaced in conjunction with the belt.

Are you saying that this metal plate should also have been replaced? My repair invoice lists a few more items:
- v belt
- vrs kit
- timing kit
Are any of those what you are referring to?

Quote:

Also do the same with the normal drive belts or take off and see if noise is gone. If noise goes it could be the belt(s) or a pulley or the belt being over tensioned and putting load on a pulley bearing.

Again, will pass this onto Ford.

GTLEGEND · 10-04-2016, 01:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WhistleBeGone

Thanks for the reply - it's great to get some help on this. I probably don't know enough to try your suggestions myself but I will pass them onto Ford and see if they are able to fix things.

Could you expand on this? Is it something that could of occurred as a result of the head gasket and other parts being replaced?
Will definitely pass this onto Ford.

Are you saying that this metal plate should also have been replaced? My repair invoice lists a few more items:
- v belt
- vrs kit
- timing kit
Are any of those what you are referring to?

Again, will pass this onto Ford.

Yes dealer could have left off vacuum line or fitting or accidently pulled it off without knowing during the repair.

No there is a sperate metal plate that sits behind the belt on the crank pulley. It is not part of the Valve Regrind Set (VRS kit) or timing kit which usually consist of belt, tensioner and possiby seals (pending on brand kit). The part is in the attachment below as part #8 and has a part number of B541 11404 A. I think they are obsolete from Ford, so try Mazda or aftermarket???

Which dealer did you take it too?

Laser Crank.pdf

WhistleBeGone · 10-04-2016, 04:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTLEGEND

Yes dealer could have left off vacuum line or fitting or accidently pulled it off without knowing during the repair.

No there is a sperate metal plate that sits behind the belt on the crank pulley. It is not part of the Valve Regrind Set (VRS kit) or timing kit which usually consist of belt, tensioner and possiby seals (pending on brand kit). The part is in the attachment below as part #8 and has a part number of B541 11404 A. I think they are obsolete from Ford, so try Mazda or aftermarket???

Which dealer did you take it too?

Attachment 91858

Thanks for the extra info.

The dealer was John McGrath Ford, in Phillip ACT.

I have to take the car into them again anyway so that they can re-flush the radiator and I will ask them to check the points you have mentioned.

GTLEGEND · 10-04-2016, 06:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WhistleBeGone

Thanks for the extra info.

The dealer was John McGrath Ford, in Phillip ACT.

I have to take the car into them again anyway so that they can re-flush the radiator and I will ask them to check the points you have mentioned.

I saw that car when I was travelling through for work and stopped to buy some parts, red TX3 right? It was parked in the RH service driveway/dooor as you look into the workshop.

Would really have to hear it to make a proper assessment as I am only guessing at this point..hope it is what I suggested.

WhistleBeGone · 10-04-2016, 08:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTLEGEND

I saw that car when I was travelling through for work and stopped to buy some parts, red TX3 right? It was parked in the RH service driveway/dooor as you look into the workshop.

Would really have to hear it to make a proper assessment as I am only guessing at this point..hope it is what I suggested.

Yes it is red. What a coincidence

Are you a car mechanic by trade? If you have time, I could certainly bring it round for you to have a listen.

GTLEGEND · 10-04-2016, 08:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WhistleBeGone

Yes it is red. What a coincidence

Are you a car mechanic by trade? If you have time, I could certainly bring it round for you to have a listen.

I am but no longer shifting spanners, sorry but I am in Sydney, was travelling up from the coast via Canberra and stopped for some parts along the way.

When will be back at dealer?

WhistleBeGone · 11-04-2016, 06:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTLEGEND

I am but no longer shifting spanners, sorry but I am in Sydney, was travelling up from the coast via Canberra and stopped for some parts along the way.

When will be back at dealer?

I see, that is a pity. I was thinking to call them today to arrange a time sometime this week.

WhistleBeGone · 14-04-2016, 08:06 PM

I took my car in today and apparently the whistling noise is coming from the power steering pump. The pump is not leaking. The power steering belt was apparently one of the belts replaced previously. (Is it one of the drive belts?) I was told the noise is due to the new belt being tighter than the old one and that the noise should go away in 2000 kms or so as the new belt loosens.

I was pretty surprised by this as I would not have thought the power steering was doing anything unless the steering wheel was being turned. Even stranger, to me at least, that it is affected by revs.

Anyway, hopefully this goes away soon enough and it is good to know that it is nothing to be concerned about.

Thank you very much for responding here. I really appreciated it.

GTLEGEND · 14-04-2016, 11:15 PM

Yes the pump is always running when the engine is operating as this is what gives the lighter feeling in your steering all the time, otherwise the steering will be rock hard when in straight position.

If that is the case, I suspect the drive belt is over tensioned. I would wait a couple of weeks and if the noise is still there, have somebody release some tension in the belt. What tends to happen is a new belt will stretch when put on, so you have to put it on with slightly more tension than normal so the belt does not come loose when it stretches. If its too too tight you are putting too much tension on the pump and other bearings and will need to be backed off slightly. If you put it on normal tension when it stretches it will come loose and slip. So getting the right balance is hard. Once stretched it will normally settle and not stretch any further. if you keep it too tight for too long you can damage the bearing in the pump..

WhistleBeGone · 15-04-2016, 07:11 AM

That makes a lot of sense. Thanks for explaining it.

Sometimes the car does not get driven much so I will wait until its done another 600 kms. (It has already done about 400 kms since all the work was done.) At that time, if the whistling sound is still present, I will contact Ford again. Does that sound reasonable?

GTLEGEND · 15-04-2016, 08:37 PM

yeh, 1000 kms is a good test, it usually does not take that long for the belt to stretch and if too loose it would be squealing by now. So I suggest ask them to back the tension off a little, there is a bit of a knack knowing how much to tension that only comes with experience and even then easy to get wrong.

WhistleBeGone · 16-04-2016, 12:59 PM

OK great - I'll wait until its done another 600 kms and let you know how things turn out. Thanks again!

Edit: sorry, are you saying I should get them to loosen it a little already or wait another 600 kms?

GTLEGEND · 16-04-2016, 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WhistleBeGone

OK great - I'll wait until its done another 600 kms and let you know how things turn out. Thanks again!

Edit: sorry, are you saying I should get them to loosen it a little already or wait another 600 kms?

Wait another 600..

WhistleBeGone · 16-04-2016, 03:58 PM

OK will do.

WhistleBeGone · 23-05-2016, 05:38 PM

My car has now done over 1000 kms since it was taken in for repairs. Unfortunately the whistling sound is still there. I don't believe the issue has improved over time (maybe it is a tiny bit better but it is hard to tell).

I took my car into Ford this morning. We went for a short drive, first with one older guy, and then with a younger guy who had better hearing (the first guy couldn't hear the issue). The second guy told me he couldn't hear anything unusual and I shouldn't worry about it. Though they opened the hood and had a quick look around, they did not make any belt adjustments.

At this point I don't know what to do. The car is making a sound it wasn't making before the repair but perhaps it really isn't a big issue?? I certainly don't know enough to tell.

GTLEGEND · 23-05-2016, 07:53 PM

Since you took it to Woden branch, go to Belconnen or Mitchell branch and ask for a second and third opinion, is possible it is a normal noise, but you could also have a problem...

WhistleBeGone · 24-05-2016, 05:05 PM

Thanks for the suggestion. I may do this. At the moment I'm feeling a bit disappointed in the fact that they told me previously the power steering belt being too tight was the cause and yet they didn't try adjusting it when I brought it in yesterday.

something wrong · 12-11-2016, 03:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WhistleBeGone

I took my car in today and apparently the whistling noise is coming from the power steering pump. The pump is not leaking. The power steering belt was apparently one of the belts replaced previously. (Is it one of the drive belts?) I was told the noise is due to the new belt being tighter than the old one and that the noise should go away in 2000 kms or so as the new belt loosens.

I was pretty surprised by this as I would not have thought the power steering was doing anything unless the steering wheel was being turned. Even stranger, to me at least, that it is affected by revs.

Anyway, hopefully this goes away soon enough and it is good to know that it is nothing to be concerned about.

Thank you very much for responding here. I really appreciated it.

.
Is the belt to the power Steer a single belt EG: Doesn't also drive the alternator and water pump?

If that's the case can you take the Pwr Steer belt of and start the car to hear if the noise is gone, since you said its there in neutral?

WhistleBeGone · 13-11-2016, 09:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by something wrong

.
Is the belt to the power Steer a single belt EG: Doesn't also drive the alternator and water pump?

If that's the case can you take the Pwr Steer belt of and start the car to hear if the noise is gone, since you said its there in neutral?

Hi,

Thanks for the reply. I personally don't know enough to be able to do this myself. Is this something the people at Ford should of thought of? The sound is still there (nothing has changed) but at this stage I think I will just have to live with it and hope that it is nothing serious. I could get someone else to have a look at it but it's already taken up quite a bit of my time and mental energy. Thanks again for the reply. I appreciate it.