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27-10-2020, 09:16 PM | #1 | ||
Starter Motor
Join Date: Oct 2020
Posts: 10
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Hi all,
Just replaced all four glow plugs but cold starts did not improve. Battery is good, 60 A glow plug fuse is good, so I figured it's probably the glow plug relay (assuming that there must be one somewhere). I monitored battery current as I turned ignition on and expected at least 40 Amps because each glow plug should draw about 10 Amps. I didn't see even 10 Amps hence I assume none of the plugs is getting any juice. Does anyone know where the glow plug relay would be on a 2010 LX Fiesta? |
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28-10-2020, 04:44 AM | #2 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 2,037
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I don't know where the relay is, but there is an additional fuse box behind the glove if you didn't already know.
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28-10-2020, 09:49 AM | #3 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 2,858
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glow plugs should only be active under a certain outside temperature. I don't believe they come on over about 4C. May be wrong though.
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28-10-2020, 02:49 PM | #4 | ||
Starter Motor
Join Date: Oct 2020
Posts: 10
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Thanks raceteam, but that one is for smaller electronic stuff. The heavy-duty circuits are mostly in the fusebox next to the battery and I expected the relay (or controller) to be somewhere nearby there too, but I can't spot it. I would follow the wiring to the glow plugs if I could see them, but they're buried in a tight space between the engine and the firewall.
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28-10-2020, 02:51 PM | #5 | ||
Starter Motor
Join Date: Oct 2020
Posts: 10
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They do seem to be temperature dependent, so at least I don't think that the dash indicator comes on when the engine is warm.
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29-10-2020, 01:42 PM | #6 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: NSW
Posts: 1,610
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Near battery-fuse box 1 has fuses and relays left side 2nd down from top iirc
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29-10-2020, 10:33 PM | #7 | |||
Starter Motor
Join Date: Oct 2020
Posts: 10
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Quote:
Unfortunately the relay appears to be working in that the 70 Amp contacts make when 12 V is applied to the coil. I also checked that there was voltage going to the coil when the ignition was turned on. The voltage appeared to stay there as long as the ignition was on - that is, it did not time out after 5 or even 10 seconds. (The relay was not plugged in for this test.) So the question now is why don't the new glow plugs pull 10 Amps each? I still don't reckon that they are seeing any volts. Not sure what my next step should be..... Any tips welcome! |
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29-10-2020, 10:58 PM | #8 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: NSW
Posts: 1,610
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Are you sure it doesn’t switch the earth side of the relay to pull it in
Check with a test light or multi meter for power at relay contacts and see if you loose it when you remove glow plug fuse Bridge relay socket contact connections while checking for power at glow plug connections. Don’t leave on long time just long enough to test |
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30-10-2020, 05:28 PM | #9 | |||
Starter Motor
Join Date: Oct 2020
Posts: 10
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Quote:
Thanks for your suggestions.... Pulling the 60A glow plug fuse does not remove +12V from the Ignition Relay (2nd one down on the LHS), however pulling the 60A Ignition Relay fuse does indeed remove the +12V from the Ignition Relay socket contact. That leaves me wondering what the function of the Ignition Relay is, and also whether there is still a separate Glow Plug relay that is yet to be discovered. With the Ignition Relay withdrawn, I bridged the two socket contacts (the fat ones) and measured both the bridging current and the battery current: Bridging current = 0.3 Amps Battery current = 3.0 Amps When bridged, another relay can easily be heard operating on the other side of the engine (I can't actually identify where it is). It is quite a loud 'clunk'. And this is presumably what is pulling most of the 3 Amps. Interestingly, when the car's ignition is switched on to the position where the glow plugs should be powered, this same loud relay does not operate. However, at the same time, the Ignition Relay gets 12 Volts to its coil circuit. That is confusing! Unfortunately I can't even see (with a mirror and torch) the wiring to the glow plugs - let alone find, or put a meter on the wiring. Also of interest, is that the resistance to earth of the non-hot socket contact for the Ignition Relay is 10k Ohms - not what I would have expected if that contact was connected to the four glow plugs in parallel. I am fresh out of ideas now...... |
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31-10-2020, 08:08 AM | #10 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: NSW
Posts: 1,610
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Suggest try testing power at relay 3 while removing glow plug fuse apply the same for other large relays
also have you scanned for codes - copy and clear if present as the system may have locked out if it sensed faulty glow plugs |
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01-11-2020, 09:12 AM | #11 | |||
Starter Motor
Join Date: Oct 2020
Posts: 10
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Quote:
I scanned for fault codes but didn't get any. I noticed that my scanning application reported that it wasn't connected to the ECU, however the scan appeared to proceed normally. I have a friend coming over later today to try his scanner. |
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01-11-2020, 10:44 AM | #12 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: NSW
Posts: 1,610
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Is relay 2 a 5 terminal relay and others 4 terminals
What number is glow plug fuse Is vehicle ws or wt Verify engine type |
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01-11-2020, 10:55 AM | #13 | |||
Starter Motor
Join Date: Oct 2020
Posts: 10
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Quote:
Glow Plug fuse (60 Amps) is Fuse 8. Vehicle is WT Engine is 1.6 litre turbo diesel. |
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07-11-2020, 08:22 AM | #15 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: NSW
Posts: 1,610
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07-11-2020, 08:47 AM | #16 | ||
Starter Motor
Join Date: Oct 2020
Posts: 10
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It was an auto-electrician who found it and I haven't seen it yet but understand that it's a simple relay, connected such that the PCM provides the ground signal to operate it.
The relay was found to be in working order, but the problem is that the PCM isn't providing the ground signal. The wire from the PCM to the relay is intact. On the surface, it would appear that the PCM may be faulty, but that assumes that the appropriate input signals are being received by the PCM. At a cost of nearly $2200, and considering the age of the car, replacing the PCM is out of the question; it would be far cheaper to install a 'cold start' push button switch to manually operate the glow plug relay. |
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