Climate change fact or fiction

[Trevor 57]

The climate is changing for sure, some of the change is natural and some caused by us - no doubt

[roKWiz]

Originally Posted by GasoLane

The cause of rising sea levels? Look no further.....

Imagine all that cake floating at sea......Cav ??

[slowsnake]

Am trying to copy link from ABC to the forum, will see if it will work.
Click on Transcript to read.

https://www.abc.net.au/radionational...level/10118674




Cheers Lucky King Billy

[Ben73]

Originally Posted by PASTOR CAKALOT

As of July 2019, the Global Coal Plant Tracker shows:

Within the 28 European Union countries, there are 268 coal-fired power plants in operation, with 7 in construction and 8 in pre-construction.

Turkey has 29 plants in operation, with 2 in construction and 31 in preconstruction.

South Africa has 19 plants in operation, with 2 in construction and 5 in preconstruction.

India has 291 plants in operation, with 33 in construction and 41 in preconstruction.

Philippines has 21 plants in operation, with 8 in construction and 19 in preconstruction.

South Korea has 24 plants in operation, with 3 in construction and 1 in preconstruction.

Japan has 83 plants in operation, with 15 in construction and 5 in preconstruction.

China has 1032 plants in operation, with 126 in construction and 76 in preconstruction.

Australia has 20 plants in operation, with 0 in construction and 2 in preconstruction.

https://factcheck.afp.com/these-figu...are-inaccurate

I still know people who quote this as fact with zero proof.

We have been told in the Hunter that coal is on the downward run in NSW. This isn't some media prediction, this is businesses working the the coal industry saying this.
Apparently there will not be any new coal mines in NSW now that Bylong has been knocked back after being approved.
Sure the current mines will keep going for decades, but It's unlikely the yearly tonnes will ever increase. We've hit peak already.

[b0son]

Originally Posted by Ben73

Apparently there will not be any new coal mines in NSW now that Bylong has been knocked back after being approved.

Maybe not, but ScoMo is giving us a gas plant whether we want it or not.

[Cav]

Originally Posted by Ben73

I still know people who quote this as fact with zero proof.

Ah, did you read the report?

Listed items are the facts, the intro mentioned inaccurate information and then the list, as I posted, is ridgy didge.

[slowsnake]

Wonder if they are still mining South Blackwater and Blair Athol mines in Qld?



Cheers King Billy

[Metdevil]

The problem with issues like this is that the facts get drowned out by politically motivated 'predictions'. Accelerated climate change caused by human-contributed global warming is an indisputable fact, the problem comes when, as we've seen in this thread, politicians and media warp research findings to push an agenda and we wind up with articles like "50% of Europe under water by August".

If we could do away with the scare tactics and political speeches, maybe we'd actually be getting somewhere with this...

Possibly the worst culprit in the way of this kind of progress is the media misconstruing research in order to make a more catchy headline. My favourite example was a lab researching using tobacco leaves as a medium for growing vaccines which could prevent certain types of cancer, so naturally the headlines read "Tobacco cures cancer". And of course, the journalists writing the articles, not being entirely clued up on the research put the explanation down to 'a trait of the tobacco plant'.
Obviously, this was interpreted as a benefit to smoking tobacco, but the 'traits' the article was referring to were things useful only to the researchers, how easy it was to grow, how broad the leaves were, and how well they hosted particular viruses.

In the end, the media coverage only negatively impacted the lab, there was local pushback to have their funding pulled, people protested that it was 'inethical', conspiracies about 'big tobacco' funding the research as a marketing campaign, and the lab had to do a lot of unnecessary PR work to have these articles corrected.

It's clear that the media is less interested in getting a story across than are in just getting a story out...

[Ben73]

Originally Posted by PASTOR CAKALOT

Ah, did you read the report?

Listed items are the facts, the intro mentioned inaccurate information and then the list, as I posted, is ridgy didge.

I was just referring to the part about the viral post that spreads around Facebook. Working in the coal industry someone shares this post every 6 months or so on Facebook.

The rest seems to be right. Quite a few coal power plants still around and will be for a while.

[T3rminator]

A lot of noise today about Great Barrier Reef being potentially added to the UNESCO World Heritage "in danger" list, due to climate change. A lot of the coverage has been on the politics.

What is not clear (to me anyways) is what does this actually mean for the local industry. Some of the news outlets mentioned there might be loss of revenue from tourism and job losses. Why would that be?

I would have thought it would attract more people to go visit something that might "disappear"?

[Itsme]

Originally Posted by T3rminator

A lot of noise today about Great Barrier Reef being potentially added to the UNESCO World Heritage "in danger" list, due to climate change. A lot of the coverage has been on the politics.

What is not clear (to me anyways) is what does this actually mean for the local industry. Some of the news outlets mentioned there might be loss of revenue from tourism and job losses. Why would that be?

I would have thought it would attract more people to go visit something that might "disappear"?

Naturally the idea is to preserve your world heritage sites and that would mean limit access and any potential development, with the case of Barrier reef it would mean restrict the numbers of operators and tourists accessing the reef.

Another example is look at Australia's national parks and the restrictions that has been imposed on peoples access to these places and what you are only allowed to do in them.

[T3rminator]

Originally Posted by Officemanager

Naturally the idea is to preserve your world heritage sites and that would mean limit access and any potential development, with the case of Barrier reef it would mean restrict the numbers of operators and tourists accessing the reef.

Another example is look at Australia's national parks and the restrictions that has been imposed on peoples access to these places and what you are only allowed to do in them.

Interesting, never knew that was all dictated by an external body. I wonder how many other sites are at risk of being flagged.

[Itsme]

Originally Posted by T3rminator

Interesting, never knew that was all dictated by an external body. I wonder how many other sites are at risk of being flagged.

You be surprised as to what our governments sign up to and follow, have a look the UN and see how many UN charters Australia has signed and follow, all from foreign people making rules and we as a sovereign nation that must follow.....Bloody ridiculous in my view.

[slowsnake]

This whole planet should be declared a UNESCO Heritage site, the oceans the countries and especially the earths atmosphere!
No good mucking around with one section of the whole (barrier reef) but the whole shebang!....only my opinion, and I still believe that Covid-19 travels on the 3rd oxygen molecule of O3 or Ozone!....



Cheers King Billy

[five 7]

And for some good news, you couldn't make this up if you tried. Cancil culture eating it's self.
https://amp-rnz-co-nz.cdn.ampproject...t-and-disbands

[T3rminator]

Australian teenagers' climate change class action case opens 'big crack in the wall', expert says

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-05-...dent/100169398

Originally Posted by Officemanager

You be surprised as to what our governments sign up to and follow, have a look the UN and see how many UN charters Australia has signed and follow, all from foreign people making rules and we as a sovereign nation that must follow.....Bloody ridiculous in my view.

Pros and cons with these sorts of memberships. In exchange, we get to hold others to account e.g. human rights.

[PhilT2]

Originally Posted by T3rminator

[B]Pros and cons with these sorts of memberships. In exchange, we get to hold others to account e.g. human rights.

The idea that we "must" follow UN treaties is all bs anyway

[Crazy Dazz]

Originally Posted by Ben73

We have been told in the Hunter that coal is on the downward run in NSW. This isn't some media prediction, this is businesses working the the coal industry saying this.
Apparently there will not be any new coal mines in NSW now that Bylong has been knocked back after being approved.
Sure the current mines will keep going for decades, but It's unlikely the yearly tonnes will ever increase. We've hit peak already.

Yeah, because Australia is the only country in the world that mines or uses coal, and the rest of the world always does what we tell them.

In the 1980s BHP opened the Ok Tedi mine in PNG.
As per common Australian (dry desert) practice, they built a dam to contain the tailings. Due to the hug rainfall and underlying instability, it collapsed, and since then tailings have simply been fed into the river.
For decades, you couldn't open a newspaper without reading about somebody screeching about "Ok Tedi".
Due to the public outcry, BHP tried repeatedly to close the mine, but the PNG government refused to allow it. Ultimately BHP walked away and gave it to the government. It has continued to operate, but you don't hear about it any more.
In the 1990's the Porgera Gold Mine was opened. Learning from BHP's mistake, they didn't bother building a Tailings dam, and dumped into the river from day one. Most people have never heard of Porgera.

When I worked in Indonesia, a local politician got himself on the front page of the national newspaper, with disgusting graphic photos of how we had polluted a local freshwater lake.
Which was interesting since there are no lakes, and the only freshwater is what we shipped in on barges. What he had actually photographed was a large puddle in the bottom of one of our coal pits.

Some people love to "protest" and join movements. It gives meaning to their empty & selfish lives. But 90% of the time they have NFI what they are talking about, and are only attracted to whichever cause the media has made popular.

[marty351]

Anyone, with any brains need not look at the "media". Fake news all the way, all day to sell advertisements from erectile disfunction to period pain and geriatric insurance. It's getting worse with the rise of the multi coloured hair brigade, trying to enforce veganism upon the masses by feeble attempts to make the majority feel guilty. Whatever happened to democracy? Media BS and those who believe it. Com'on man, stop using farcecrook and critter and use common sense, dollars ane earned and cents is all they have.

[Itsme]

Originally Posted by T3rminator

Australian teenagers' climate change class action case opens 'big crack in the wall', expert says

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-05-...dent/100169398





Pros and cons with these sorts of memberships. In exchange, we get to hold others to account e.g. human rights.

FYI
UN was formed in 1945 and Australia for the first time got a seat in 2017; so much for your comment we hold others to account in all those years before we got a seat.
The UN is one big joke caused more problems than good! should be disbanded for what it is worth.

[oldel]

If you lived in wonder of the future:
In the 1960s you'd imagine 1980s having moon bases to live on.
In the 80s you'd be less optimistic and maybe think we would soon have flying cars or something
By the 90s you'd be dropping expectations even lower and thinking smart phones would be cool in 2000 (sorry, have to wait another decade even for them to be good)
In the 2020s you're just hoping the world doesn't end and we're not soon hunter-gatherers...

When the world was in actually in a cold war we were more optimistic. But cool dreams never realised, everything is turning us into pessimists (or working out how to get rich and FYGM) due to being let down again and again.
Governments have stood back from the brink of war and stood back from everything, letting the corporations run the show. But now corps are running everything into the ground. You might think this is ridiculous but it was that that brought down the soviet union, that which empowers China. It's all about the money now it's impossible to argue.

Corps just want to make money and for the past 20 years trying to find new ways of getting money out of you, and otherwise letting everything rot.
E: I know it's always been like that, but before it was small scale or ignorance, or in some other place. Now it's in your face and it's made China and Russia powerful too.

[slowsnake]

Originally Posted by marty351

Anyone, with any brains need not look at the "media". Fake news all the way, all day to sell advertisements from erectile disfunction to period pain and geriatric insurance. It's getting worse with the rise of the multi coloured hair brigade, trying to enforce veganism upon the masses by feeble attempts to make the majority feel guilty. Whatever happened to democracy? Media BS and those who believe it. Com'on man, stop using farcecrook and critter and use common sense, dollars ane earned and cents is all they have.

You mentioned erectile disfunction?....do you remember the ad dude?
Could do with a little help in me old age!..lol, hahaha


Cheers King Billy

[slowsnake]

Originally Posted by oldel

If you lived in wonder of the future:
In the 1960s you'd imagine 1980s having moon bases to live on.
In the 80s you'd be less optimistic and maybe think we would soon have flying cars or something
By the 90s you'd be dropping expectations even lower and thinking smart phones would be cool in 2000 (sorry, have to wait another decade even for them to be good)
In the 2020s you're just hoping the world doesn't end and we're not soon hunter-gatherers...

When the world was in actually in a cold war we were more optimistic. But cool dreams never realised, everything is turning us into pessimists (or working out how to get rich and FYGM) due to being let down again and again.
Governments have stood back from the brink of war and stood back from everything, letting the corporations run the show. But now corps are running everything into the ground. You might think this is ridiculous but it was that that brought down the soviet union, that which empowers China. It's all about the money now it's impossible to argue.

Corps just want to make money and for the past 20 years trying to find new ways of getting money out of you, and otherwise letting everything rot.
E: I know it's always been like that, but before it was small scale or ignorance, or in some other place. Now it's in your face and it's made China and Russia powerful too.

And we, the rank and file allowed it, we the people accepted it in that "opine like manner"
And what your timeline shows is the repetitious greedy nature of humanity.
Been going on for millennia, and none of us has learned sweet FA!


Cheers King Billy

[oldel]

I think you're missing the point. It used be optimism for the common person, but clearly it's all downhill from now on, and has been for 30 years if you ignore trinkets , distractions, apps and cheap junk.
There's been highs and lows throughout history of course but there's always been a promise of better times IMO. Now it's a choice between FYGM, lower taxes, junk from China, housing prices (never going to get better with low interest rates), lower wages (doesn't look like it's going to get better but even if it does not much chance of saving with low interest rates and high bank charges), oceans are undeniably more ****ed than ever. Fires, drought, pandemics and to top it all off there's climate change deniers that like to whinge about everything before they shuffle off...
Life is hard, there's always been challenges but this is the first time gramps held their finger up and said ****off to their grandkids.

[slowsnake]

Originally Posted by Officemanager

FYI
UN was formed in 1945 and Australia for the first time got a seat in 2017; so much for your comment we hold others to account in all those years before we got a seat.
The UN is one big joke caused more problems than good! should be disbanded for what it is worth.

But in 1945 the world was a different place, the whole of Europe was decimated, I was born in 1953 in Liverpool UK, I remember my school history lessons, and ration cards, and being hungry and cold in winter.

At the time the allies tried to put some well meaning plan together to stop future conflict, it actually started in 1941 and signed in 1945, but the world was a simpler place to be than now, there were 2 conferences one at Dumbarton Oaks, a mansion in America, and the Yalta Conference in the Crimea.

But they had to do something to try bring or promise a peace, mainly peace of mind for decimated countries, later conflicts I dont think were even in the minds of the signatories back then.

Cheers King Billy

[slowsnake]

[quote=officemanager;6594309]fyi
un was formed in 1945 and australia for the first time got a seat in 2017; so much for your comment we hold others to account in all those years before we got a seat.
The un is one big joke caused more problems than good! Should be disbanded for what it is worth.

HAVE POSTED TWICE, CAN THIS ONE BE DELETED PLEASE

[slowsnake]

Originally Posted by oldel

I think you're missing the point. It used be optimism for the common person, but clearly it's all downhill from now on, and has been for 30 years if you ignore trinkets , distractions, apps and cheap junk.
There's been highs and lows throughout history of course but there's always been a promise of better times IMO. Now it's a choice between FYGM, lower taxes, junk from China, housing prices (never going to get better with low interest rates), lower wages (doesn't look like it's going to get better but even if it does not much chance of saving with low interest rates and high bank charges), oceans are undeniably more ****ed than ever. Fires, drought, pandemics and to top it all off there's climate change deniers that like to whinge about everything before they shuffle off...
Life is hard, there's always been challenges but this is the first time gramps held their finger up and said ****off to their grandkids.

Optimism is a positive state of mind, I still have that same mind now, the world ideal, had it since I was a kid, its still in me, the rest going on around me is peripheral, a coincidence in my life, the only thing that's changed is our perception of what we think, see and feel!


Cheers King Billy

[Crazy Dazz]

Many People Misunderstand what optimism is.

Somebody who looks at the world, but continues to gush "positivity" isn't an optimist.

An optimist is a realist who believes that things could get better, and hopes that they do.