Holden closure

[Express]

Originally Posted by csv8

Holden in a global perspective...too long too post.
http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/busi...213-2zcyb.html

A good article. I’ll post it so it forms part of the thread.

Holden: Numbers tell the story for the small fry of General Motors' ecosystem

Date: December 14, 2013
Mark Hawthorne is Senior Editor at The Age.



The story of Holden and its demise needs to be viewed through a global lens if it's to be fully understood.

Debate over the sad demise of Holden this week has been dogged by equal parts myth, spin and subterfuge. Pity, because it was always the numbers that would tell this story in the end.

The big fact of Australia's car industry is this: the International Organisation of Motor Vehicle Manufacturers records the world made 84 million passenger cars last year. Australia's share was 209,730 - less than a quarter of 1 per cent.

Author Gideon Haigh describes it in his book End of the Road?: ''In a global sense, car production in Australia is of a magnitude smaller than a rounding error.''



After a fortnight of background briefing and rumour-mongering by a federal cabinet determined to flush out a decision by General Motors before Christmas, it was those numbers, and a $3750 shortfall on every car the company made here, that played a part in determining the day.

Even more important, however, GM needed to get its house in order on a global scale. That meant fringe outposts of its ''manufacturing ecosystem'', as the company's Harvard Business School-educated executives like to call it, needed to give way.

For GM, Australia is one of those fringe outposts.



In a simplistic sense, the great myths of the history of Australian car manufacturing are that the industry is Australian, and it manufactures.

All three of the country's remaining car makers are foreign-owned, and to an increasing extent assemble global platforms from mainly imported parts.

The current Falcon may be an exception, but when Ford started assembling that car in Australia in 1960, the local company was in fact owned by Ford of Canada, and the car was a rebadged North American model.

Toyota makes almost half the cars in Australia each year, but its Altona plant is one of nine where the Camry is made. The Altona-made Camry is about 70 per cent local content, but almost identical cars are pumped out of factories around the world cheaper than the Australian version.

At Holden, the ''all Aussie'' Commodore contains about 50 per cent local content. The Cruze fares even worse, at 25 per cent, and is basically bolted together in Adelaide from imported parts.

Even that much-loved and jingoistic advertising jingle, ''Football, meat pies, kangaroos and Holden cars'' was rebadged from America. The original version, penned by Madison Avenue ad agency Campbell Ewald and released in 1974, went: ''Baseball, hot dogs, apple pie and Chevrolet.''

It demonstrates how the story of Holden, and its demise as a local car maker, needs to be viewed through a global lens if it is to be understood.

The signposts on the road to Holden's departure have been evident for all to see.



In August, at the direction of Detroit, General Motors Holden general manager Mike Devereux pulled the pin on the Opel brand in Australia, just a year after it was launched in this country.

It was a small but significant decision for the company, and the first domino to fall in a chain of events that would lead to GM's decision to close Holden's factories.



Behind the scenes, GM in Detroit was working on a complete reorganisation of the company's troubled global operations - a restructure that has been unveiled in a flurry of announcements over the past week.

At the same time, Mr Devereux was working on a deal with the federal government, and on October 2 he met with federal Industry Minister Ian Macfarlane, South Australian Premier Jay Weatherill and his Manufacturing Minister Tom Kenyon.

In order to keep making cars at Elizabeth in Adelaide until 2022, GM wanted $80 million a year in addition to $275 million already pledged for seven years by the federal and state governments, and $40 million it was set to receive from the Automotive Transformation Scheme. All up, it would have given Holden $1.1 billion over seven years, or an average of $160 million a year, to remain here.

GM agreed that if it shut Holden before 2023, it would have had to repay the money.

For a new government that had won the federal election on a platform of fiscal prudence, it was big ask.



By the end of the month, it seemed GM's mind was made up. In late October, General Motors made a brief, three-sentence announcement. ''Effective November 1, Mike Devereux, director of GMH, will be taking on the roll of GM CIO vice-president - sales, marketing and aftersales,'' it read. ''Devereux will retain his responsibilities of managing Holden until the end of the year, as a replacement for his position is found.''

Many regarded the transfer of the local boss to Asia as the final straw for Holden in Australia, but not cabinet. Weeks after that announcement, Treasurer Joe Hockey was briefing far and wide that there was no rush for Holden to make a decision. He was telling stakeholders to wait for the results of the Productivity Commission's interim report on the industry.



As Mr Devereux evaluated GM's options in Australia, even bigger moves were taking place on a global scale.

On Monday, the US government's bailout of General Motors finally ended, with the Treasury Department's announcement that it had sold its final GM shares.

For GM, gone at last was the stigma of being known as ''Government Motors'', but it still rankles company management that cross-town rival Ford did not need the same bailout to get through the global financial crisis.

In North America, Ford has picked up market share and now has double the profit margin of GM.

With GM's bailout behind it, on Tuesday chief executive Dan Akerson announced he will depart on January 15, and hand over the reins to Mary Barra, the first woman to lead a major global car company.



Of even more importance to Australia, however, was the announcement of a restructure of GM's operations in Europe and Korea.

In Europe, GM's Opel and Vauxhall brands, despite having 6.8 per cent market share, lost the company $US1.8 billion in 2012.

GM's venture into the EU with its Korean-built Chevrolet cars - to take on Hyundai and Kia - has also been a disaster. Chevrolet might be as American as baseball, hot dogs and apple pie, but in Europe it picked up just more than 1 per cent market share and was losing money.

''Chevy was likely cannibalising Opel's sales and also possibly damaging Opel's brand and pricing,'' International Strategy and Investment analyst Arndt Ellinghorst said. ''Model by model, we found Chevy was effectively selling the same product at a 10-15 per cent discount to Opel.''

The game plan from GM was simple. It would shut down Chevrolet in Europe, and hope to pick up that market share with Opel and Vauxhall.



To put the size and scale of that writeoff in perspective, GM has signed a $US559 million, seven-year deal to put the Chevrolet name on Manchester United's shirt. The first year of that deal - the biggest endorsement in European football - is next season, by which time GM won't actually be selling Chevrolet cars in Europe.

Manchester United announced the deal on a Friday and GM announced the resignation of chief marketing officer Joel Ewanick the following Sunday night. ''Mr Ewanick failed to meet the expectations the company set for its employees,'' was GM's statement.



Aside from one of biggest marketing white elephants in corporate history, GM has been stuck with another issue arising from Chevy's departure from Europe - the latent capacity at the old Daewoo plant in Korea.

Korea built 90 per cent of all the Chevrolets sold in Europe, which accounted for one-fifth of GM's production from that country.

It did not take long for the motor industry's best analysts to see the answer.

''The next logical thing for GM would be to transfer the Chevys produced in South Korea to other markets like Australia if it decides to shut its Holden unit down,'' Shin Chung-kwan of KB Investment & Securities in Seoul said.



While all this was going on in Detroit, Mr Devereux had his own ongoing concerns. The first was a public Productivity Commission hearing in Melbourne, at 8.30am on Tuesday.

The second was a federal government that had decided there was no chance of Holden remaining, and was desperate to get the bad news out.

Tuesday turned out to be the day when GM's worlds in Korea, Europe and Australia would collide.

Mr Devereux could not escape it. He was greeted that morning by a front-page headline in The Age declaring ''D-Day for Holden'', and a story that stated a decision to close down manufacturing in Australia would be made that day.



In the lift up to the Productivity Commission offices, a news screen headline declared: ''Holden wants $150 million to stay.''

The opening questions from the commission's deputy chairman Mike Woods are the only ones that will ever matter: ''I would wish to ask at the outset for the record, has General Motors made a decision regarding the future of its Holden operations in Australia?''

''No decision has been made,'' Mr Devereux replied.

''Thank you. Do you know a time frame for such a decision?'' Mr Woods then asked.

''I wouldn't speculate on it in this forum,'' Mr Devereux said.



For an hour, the Holden boss cooly, calmly and eloquently put forward the same case that he had made to Ian Macfarlane on October 2, and the commissioners made notes.

But after an hour, Mr Devereux had had enough.

''We need a public-private partnership over the long term to be able to be relatively competitive and to have GM be able to do what it wants to do, which is to build where we sell,'' he told the commissioners.

''Now, unless you guys have more questions, I need to move.''

The desire to ''move'' was driven by the time in Detroit, where it was by then approaching 6pm. Mr Devereux had an important call to make.



It is now a matter of record that, while acting prime minister Warren Truss and Treasurer Hockey were ripping the car maker to shreds to ''come clean'' and be ''fair dinkum'' with the Australian people in Parliament, GM's decision was being finalised.

''Either you're here or you're not,'' Mr Hockey bellowed at GM in Parliament. Mr Truss chimed in with: ''They owe it to the workers of General Motors not to go into the Christmas period without making a clear commitment to manufacturing in this country.''

It was a remarkable outburst.



Inside the Holden camp, an insider sent a text message that sounded a death knell for Holden. ''Are you seeing this question time attack on Holden?'' it read. ''Taunting [Holden] to leave. It's extraordinary.''

Opposition Leader Bill Shorten would later ponder if the government had ''bullied, hectored and backgrounded Holden out of this country''.

But at the end of the day, it was more myth, spin and subterfuge.



Over in Korea, Mr Shin Chung-kwan can't see what all the fuss is about.

''GM's decision is to raise the utilisation of large plants - in this case in the EU - to maximise its profitability, and close the smaller ones,'' he said. ''Australia is among the smaller ones.''



The numbers have been run, and the result is Australia no longer fits into GM's ''manufacturing ecosystem''.

.

http://www.smh.com.au/business/holde...213-2zcyb.html



.

[buggerlugs]

I wish the above post had been the first post in this thread..........

[UberKnee]

The big fact of Australia's car industry is this: the International Organisation of Motor Vehicle Manufacturers records the world made 84 million passenger cars last year. Australia's share was 209,730 - less than a quarter of 1 per cent.

I think thats all that really needs to be said, when you're talking about such an insignificant market but one that's losing you money on every single car built there is pointless to keep building there.

[2011G6E]

Originally Posted by stevz

VE and VF are 100% Australian designed and engineered.

...with only about 50% of it actually being made here...possibly less...

[Nikked]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

...with only about 50% of it actually being made here...possibly less...

I can vouch for that...you see all sorts of funny countries on the parts packages...

[1TUFFUTE]

Originally Posted by stevz

I'm sorry but I'm sick and tired of hearing this argument. What 'creature comforts' does an import have that an Aussie built car doesn't? Some fancy but useless gimmicks that will probably never be used once the novelty wears off?
You say a cheap asian imports has more kit than a W427? Whoopty do. Does your cheap asian import match it's performance credentials too? Not in a million years.
If playing with useless gimmicks is so important then go and visit a toy store.

I'd like to weigh in here.....most of my female friends and family that have new tech laden cars have ZERO idea about any of the tech in their car. They simply drive them. My wife doesn't even use Cruize control for eg. My friends wife didn't know the cars wipers were automatic and nearly drove us off the road when they came on. I then proceeded to show her the sunroof,the ELECTRIC seats and even Phonelink for her mobile....all of which she didn't know about. Oh and she bought it new this year and found out it she needs to lay the seats down to fit the new babies pram in lol . She doesn't use Cruize either.....neither does my bros wife.......
There's some food for thought.

[1TUFFUTE]

Originally Posted by borough

That was the VF replacement. The Cruze is about 30%

Yep...and the next commadore update was quoted to match the cruzes shocking 70% imported content.(correct that.....75% imported apparently)

[1TUFFUTE]

The above latest quoted article is a good read. Most we allready new....(well some ve been ignorant) but it's also an insight to some of GMHs seemingly terrible buissiness structure. To put so much money into a project like Europe and pull out after 1year seems bad. Then their bread n butter market...North America.....they are building cars at half the profit ford is. WOW. And all without bailout money on fords part

I'm shuddering thinking about some of the global cheap Chevys they may send here soon. Globally GMHs products appear to be near bottom of the rung these days. That won't get sales here.......

[Crazy Dazz]

Originally Posted by UberKnee

I think thats all that really needs to be said, when you're talking about such an insignificant market but one that's losing you money on every single car built there is pointless to keep building there.

And?
We all know the Australian Car industry has been rooted, that’s kinda the point.
Australia is the world’s largest exporter of Iron ore, Coal, and Bauxite (aluminium ore). We’re about number 3 for copper ore, and in the top ten for many other important commodities including LNG.
Obviously, it would be far more “efficient” for us to export the final products including cars, and all it would have taken is a bit of planning, foresight, and judicious management of the economy by our governments.
Instead they have pranced around the world stage signing FTA’s whilst the rest of the world laughs behind our back.
40~50 years ago, China was nothing but a Billion starving peasants, who couldn’t even make themselves a decent pot to **** in. Whilst Australian Universities were at the forefront of research in many areas of technology. Of course we would never hope to compete in industries where unskilled labour is king, but there is no reason Australia couldn’t have become a major metals and heavy industry exporter, and gotten a decent slice of the technology pie.

Australian expertise still leads the world in Mining and many areas of Agriculture. And how much mining and agricultural equipment is made here? **** all.

I am actually stating to believe that the liberal party HATES Australian Motorists. There can be no other explanation for the FTA with South Korea. I mean cheaper Kia shitboxes and more Holden badged Daewoos are the last thing we need.

[2011G6E]

Originally Posted by Crazy Dazz

Instead they have pranced around the world stage signing FTA’s whilst the rest of the world laughs behind our back.

That's the problem. Governments...both Labor and Liberal...have for decades told us we have to "lead the world" and sign up to crap like this first, as with the carbon tax, we were assured that if we do it first, the rest of the world will surely follow and see what a great idea it is and come over all cuddly all of a sudden and hold hands with us.

Nope. The best comparison I can come up with is a little kid in the playground surrounded by the big strong bullies, who are trying to convince him to eat a worm, because they just promise that if he does it first, they'll eat one too...promise...*snigger*...


Interestingly, on cost of manufacture, I noticed this tucked away in an article today...
http://www.carsguide.com.au/news-and...80800_20131213

Although other General Motors factories in South Korea and Thailand can build cars for $3750 less than Holden does in Australia, the savings likely won’t be passed on because the company made a loss on its locally-made models.

That's right...only $3750 less. Hell, you can negotiate a discount of more than that...you can get more than that on "minimum trade in offer" times at dealerships.

[Road Games]

I just love the comments about KIA making shitboxes ... especially from the ignorant keyboard warriors who havn't even driven one...

So answer me this , when you buy your hand on heart Australian only product do you actually go further and prop up the aftermarket industry as well ??

So far i have modified the wheels/ suspension/ tuned the engine / re-painted it/ upgraded the stereo and although the majority of my initial purchase $$$$$ may have gone offshore , i have since pumped over 8k back into the local economy modifying our KIA Rio !!

IMO spending money modifying our cars is also a BIG part of what makes the country go round not just an initial purchase ...

[DRU842]

Originally Posted by stevz

VE and VF are 100% Australian designed and engineered.

Please check your figures, the engine & drive train, at least, were and continue to be engineered, designed & developed overseas.

[pottery beige]

Originally Posted by 9sec Menace

I just love the comments about KIA making shitboxes ... especially from the ignorant keyboard warriors who havn't even driven one...

So answer me this , when you buy your hand on heart Australian only product do you actually go further and prop up the aftermarket industry as well ??

So far i have modified the wheels/ suspension/ tuned the engine / re-painted it/ upgraded the stereo and although the majority of my initial purchase $$$$$ may have gone offshore , i have since pumped over 8k back into the local economy modifying our KIA Rio !!

IMO spending money modifying our cars is also a BIG part of what makes the country go round not just an initial purchase ...

is this the sunday funny pages??

youve spent over $8k doing up a KIA sh!tbox

in ten years ownership of an Aussie built performance sedan ive mainained it with genuine parts

thats all its ever needed.. not modified for the sake of it..

[2011G6E]

If you've ever changed anything from standard on your car because you wanted to do it (not because you needed to do it) then you've "modified for the sake of it".

And yes...no matter where your car is made, when you modify it or pay to have it modified, you are spending money in Australia. Doesn't matter what badge is on the front.

As for "genuine" as compared to "aftermarket" parts, especially pricing, it mightn't hurt so much if the damn things didn't usually all come out of the same damn factory in Taiwan or China but put in different boxes...

[Maka]

Originally Posted by 9sec Menace

I just love the comments about KIA making shitboxes ... especially from the ignorant keyboard warriors who havn't even driven one...

So answer me this , when you buy your hand on heart Australian only product do you actually go further and prop up the aftermarket industry as well ??

So far i have modified the wheels/ suspension/ tuned the engine / re-painted it/ upgraded the stereo and although the majority of my initial purchase $$$$$ may have gone offshore , i have since pumped over 8k back into the local economy modifying our KIA Rio !!

IMO spending money modifying our cars is also a BIG part of what makes the country go round not just an initial purchase ...

As long as YOU are proud of your done up KIA, it dosent matter what anyone thinks lol & kudo's to you for supporting oz's aftermarket autoparts industry!

cheers, Maka

[Bossxr8]

The Manchester United deal for Chev, not to mention the total f up that was bringing Opal here, just shows how much of a pathetic business GM really are. They are run by a bunch of total wallys that should be stacking cardboard boxes in a GM factory, and not in the GM boardroom.

No wonder they went bankrupt.

And they have just launched the new range of pickup trucks to take on the years old F series not long due for replacement by an all new model itself, and they have actualy lost market share to the F series with their brand new models. Alarm bells are ringing when their cash cows and being flogged by F series.

[csv8]

1TUFFUTE I was reading your post about relo's and friends and their new cars. Then I saw where you come from. Sorry !! couldn't resist having a dig at Ipswich!!!! Cheers!!!

[dragons90]

Anyone know the aussie content of the fg falcon.

[jpd80]

IMO, GM has nothing but utter contempt for the Australian market, rebranded Daewoo Korean rubbish with Holden badges
and now a FWD four cylinder replacement for Commodore coming from China, totally and utterly disgraceful.

I hope Holden fans turn their backs on GM, an absolutely disgusting betrayal of production workers,
giving them a haircut on benefits while promising the moon but knowing they would close down operations...



Ford is a lot of things but not even they would stoop so low.....

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by jpd80

I hope Holden fans turn their backs on GM, an absolutely disgusting betrayal of production workers,
giving them a haircut on benefits while promising the moon but knowing they would close down operations...

http://fordforums.com.au/showpost.ph...8&postcount=19

http://fordforums.com.au/showpost.ph...&postcount=163

Big Damo told you guys first, filthy accountant tactics 101.

[1TUFFUTE]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

The Manchester United deal for Chev, not to mention the total f up that was bringing Opal here, just shows how much of a pathetic business GM really are. They are run by a bunch of total wallys that should be stacking cardboard boxes in a GM factory, and not in the GM boardroom.

No wonder they went bankrupt.

And they have just launched the new range of pickup trucks to take on the years old F series not long due for replacement by an all new model itself, and they have actualy lost market share to the F series with their brand new models. Alarm bells are ringing when their cash cows and being flogged by F series.

Agreed wholeheartedly.....same as what I said above. And we can see the same type of descissions by Holden in Australia. There export deals over the years and the current waste of money export deals. The massive money they spend in v8 supercars and even sponsoring leage. Yet there not making anymore money then ford despite being given over 2 billion the last 12 years.
How they have ANY fans beats me.....

[Rodge]

We are looking for a small cheap fuel efficient car for my daughter and her boyfriend at the moment.

Holden Barina Spark $13,990 Kiwi brand new drive away. There is nothing in the Ford brand for this money or even close.
They drove it and are very happy. All they care about is its safe, has all the latest safety kit for them and their kids, its fuel efficient (5.1 L/100 km's), it comes with a new car factory warranty and its very cheap. My brother who is a panelbeater with 30 years experience told me today they have a good safety rating and he had to work on one that had been involved in a serious accident and they appear to be well made and quite strong for a small car.

Its been a unique insight into how young people on a tight budget think.
I suspect there are millions of other young people in Australia that think along very similar lines.

[Nikked]

Originally Posted by 1TUFFUTE

Agreed wholeheartedly.....same as what I said above. And we can see the same type of descissions by Holden in Australia. There export deals over the years and the current waste of money export deals. The massive money they spend in v8 supercars and even sponsoring leage. Yet there not making anymore money then ford despite being given over 2 billion the last 12 years.
How they have ANY fans beats me.....

Because, funnily enough, not every one gets on forums and chews on every bit of information and financial figures...


They just buy cars, and/or see Jamie Whincup win races.

[Road Games]

Seem's some people rest on their mis guided beliefs and then wonder why jobs dissapear ?

[1TUFFUTE]

Originally Posted by Nikked

Because, funnily enough, not every one gets on forums and chews on every bit of information and financial figures...


They just buy cars, and/or see Jamie Whincup win races.

Who said anything about whincup...it's toll HRT that's spending Holden money big time. Plus the other teams Holden back.
And maybe if more did read forums they'd see more of the way Holden treats our country....it's employees....it's goverment and us the taxpayers. They went down in true American style. Lies, blackmail and so on.
And I spose your comment means you agree with their money spending.....despite loosing money in handfuls.

[superyob]

Originally Posted by Rodge

We are looking for a small cheap fuel efficient car for my daughter and her boyfriend at the moment.

Holden Barina Spark $13,990 Kiwi brand new drive away. There is nothing in the Ford brand for this money or even close.
They drove it and are very happy. All they care about is its safe, has all the latest safety kit for them and their kids, its fuel efficient (5.1 L/100 km's), it comes with a new car factory warranty and its very cheap. My brother who is a panelbeater with 30 years experience told me today they have a good safety rating and he had to work on one that had been involved in a serious accident and they appear to be well made and quite strong for a small car.

Its been a unique insight into how young people on a tight budget think.
I suspect there are millions of other young people in Australia that think along very similar lines.

My oldest daughter has a Barina Spark. I think they are utterly dangerous as side and rear vision is extremely limited...

[b0son]

Originally Posted by 1TUFFUTE

And maybe if more did read forums they'd see more of the way Holden treats our country....it's employees....

Judging by the EBA, Holden treats employees a little too well. Would you have them paid even more?

[Nikked]

Originally Posted by 1TUFFUTE

Who said anything about whincup...it's toll HRT that's spending Holden money big time. Plus the other teams Holden back.
And maybe if more did read forums they'd see more of the way Holden treats our country....it's employees....it's goverment and us the taxpayers. They went down in true American style. Lies, blackmail and so on.
And I spose your comment means you agree with their money spending.....despite loosing money in handfuls.

Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa...hold up...


Redbull Racing Australia was initially wooed over to Holden by two factors, 1) Ford pulling back funding, 2)Holden funding them.

But that's all just un-important details. When it comes to the effect of motorsport, its Holden winning, not X-brand. Holden fans see this...its that's the basics of this.

Don't forget, Holden fans are not just a recent phenomenon, they are fans of the cars of the past, the Torana, Monaro, EH...Gemini. Are you suggesting they should all abandon ship because of a factor of the times? Should us ford fans burn our GTHO posters and ride pushbikes because Ford shuts down manufacturing here?

And Holden, they are still a separate enterprise from General motors, the past year has proved this. Holden (and Ford) in Australia a clearly not integrated in to the world, largely independent except for reporting back running costs and receiving funding.

That's whats changing now...

But really, you can't blame Holden for what's happened. Holden is the local factories, the employees...the decision is from the GM brass the other side of the world.

And who am I (or even you) to ultimately decide or judge how people spend there money? If joe-blow wants to buy a Captiva that's there choice (problem?). People are capable of making their own decisions, and really, does it matter? People don't buy cars to support a charity, they buy them for there needs, at a price they can afford, and for what they like about them. Not what disgruntled forum lurker's think...

[GCRXR6]

Originally Posted by TC200six

http://www.facebook.com/generalmotors

I see a lot of protesting on the General Motors Facebook page, mostly by a user named Matt Brokenbrough. They want GM to overturn their decision and continue making the Commodore forever. Yeah, good luck with that.

No different to some on this forum?

[Road_Warrior]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

That's the problem. Governments...both Labor and Liberal...have for decades told us we have to "lead the world" and sign up to crap like this first, as with the carbon tax, we were assured that if we do it first, the rest of the world will surely follow and see what a great idea it is and come over all cuddly all of a sudden and hold hands with us.

Nope. The best comparison I can come up with is a little kid in the playground surrounded by the big strong bullies, who are trying to convince him to eat a worm, because they just promise that if he does it first, they'll eat one too...promise...*snigger*...


Interestingly, on cost of manufacture, I noticed this tucked away in an article today...
http://www.carsguide.com.au/news-and...80800_20131213


That's right...only $3750 less. Hell, you can negotiate a discount of more than that...you can get more than that on "minimum trade in offer" times at dealerships.

Ah yes, what did Nick Xenophon say? Australia, the "free trade taliban". I.E. fundamentalist and stupid.