Mullaly confirms Falcon and Mustang to share platform from 2016

[prydey]

cars have been steadily growing so much that a whole new segment has been created (yaris, fiesta, mazda 2 etc etc), and the LWB segment has disappeared.

i have an eb falcon and a bf2 falcon, and the size difference is huge. once upon a time the eb falcon was a large family car. it still carries 5 in comfort (well mine doesn't - its low and loud(v8)). the current focus/corolla is about the same size as the old large size sedans.

i realise a lot of the excess size is the improvement in passenger cell safety, but i think there is a lot of room to shrink them down a touch.

[irlewy86]

Originally Posted by XR6 Martin

I saw one comparison of the Taurus vs G8, and one thing that caught my eye was that the Taurus was alot quieter in terms of interior noise, was something like 3-4 DBA better everywhere.

Yeah but Falcon trumps VE fairly well also. There was a NZ article that had the F6 2-3 dB quiter than an Audi A3 IIRC as well.

[cosmo20btt]

Originally Posted by XR6 Martin

I saw one comparison of the Taurus vs G8, and one thing that caught my eye was that the Taurus was alot quieter in terms of interior noise, was something like 3-4 DBA better everywhere.

Well the G8 must be a bit noisy then as MSBC writer (Dan Carney) for Motorhead has given a not so glowing report on the ecoboost3.5 litre describing it as "louder and unrefined than most of its contemporaries" how ever he liked the rest of the car, you will find the site here.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/32205518/ns/business-autos/

[Chopped]

That 2010 Taurus SVO is a whale. (2008 G8 took care of it ! - Taurus Fail)

[phillyc]

Originally Posted by Ohio XB

I am not sure what they will do about size. Thinking back to the fuel shortage of the 1970's, I would think cars will be shrunk down, especially since Mulally said that there was a market shift to smaller cars. With that and the similar conditions to the fule shortage of the 1970's (high cost) I think shrinking across the board is likely, where possible. Just my thoughts.


Steve

I kind of wonder sometimes, that cars have grown and grown with each model following the trend for more space expectations. I wonder also if we are now on the precipice of when people would still like to keep the same 'nameplate' but would also like something slightly smaller.

[Brazen]

Originally Posted by phillyc

I kind of wonder sometimes, that cars have grown and grown with each model following the trend for more space expectations. I wonder also if we are now on the precipice of when people would still like to keep the same 'nameplate' but would also like something slightly smaller.

Falcon's size used to be an asset when people used 2wds to tow and airfares were expensive. Now its size is a liability, if you want to go interstate you get a $70 Virgin blue ticket, if you want to tow you probably already have a 4wd.

Whenever family, colleagues, friends are looking for a new car so many of them reject my Falcon suggestions because 'they are too big'.

[prydey]

Originally Posted by Brazen

Falcon's size used to be an asset when people used 2wds to tow and airfares were expensive. Now its size is a liability, if you want to go interstate you get a $70 Virgin blue ticket, if you want to tow you probably already have a 4wd.

Whenever family, colleagues, friends are looking for a new car so many of them reject my Falcon suggestions because 'they are too big'.

thats pretty small minded to think that you only need 1 plane ticket to go interstate. family of 4 = still cheaper to drive and then i have my own transport once i get there.

[cosmo20btt]

Channel nine reports on the Today show that Ford is moving some of it's operations back to the states. Does any one know more about this?

[Swordsman88]

Originally Posted by cosmo20btt

Channel nine reports on the Today show that Ford is moving some of it's operations back to the states. Does any one know more about this?

That was a little line added to the end of the sports report on T8 launching its new holdens (leaving Ford) and i have no clue what it refers to. I doubt anyone knows what it refers to other than perhaps an off handed remark from whincup/dane etc. re 'ford leaving' and so defecting to holden. It is very vague and frankly based in no fact...i don't think ford australia would have any idea what they meant by that frankly.....

[cosmo20btt]

Originally Posted by Swordsman88

That was a little line added to the end of the sports report on T8 launching its new holdens (leaving Ford) and i have no clue what it refers to. I doubt anyone knows what it refers to other than perhaps an off handed remark from whincup/dane etc. re 'ford leaving' and so defecting to holden. It is very vague and frankly based in no fact...i don't think ford australia would have any idea what they meant by that frankly.....

Ta after I wrote that line, I sat and thought to myself, why would Wincup bother even talking about Ford unless it was a final shot across the bow. He simply would have been using Jizz Spanks words against Ford.

[MickyB]

Originally Posted by cosmo20btt

Channel nine reports on the Today show that Ford is moving some of it's operations back to the states. Does any one know more about this?

I swore at my TV when she spouted that rubbish. Got to love the uninformed indoctrinating the public with BS

[cosmo20btt]

Originally Posted by MickyB

I swore at my TV when she spouted that rubbish. Got to love the uninformed indoctrinating the public with BS

It's time some one wrote/emailed these Programs (Nine in particular as they were the one that mimicked Jizzes words) to correct some of there statements that they have made regarding this issue.
If it was any other company that had been misrepresented by the media, there would have been a retraction made public, albeit at 2 o clock on a Sunday morning. It would be great if Ford themselves come out and release a press statement to the media, but I won't hold my breath on that one. :

[Bossxr8]

Spotted turning off the street into Product Engineering, one brand new LHD evaluation Taurus, and one LHD Fusion.

Just wait until the media spot them out on the road. Cue new "Falcon replacement already in testing" headlines.

[Fordman1]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Spotted turning off the street into Product Engineering, one brand new LHD evaluation Taurus, and one LHD Fusion.

Just wait until the media spot them out on the road. Cue new "Falcon replacement already in testing" headlines.

Oh Dear...................

[Road_Warrior]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Spotted turning off the street into Product Engineering, one brand new LHD evaluation Taurus, and one LHD Fusion.

Just wait until the media spot them out on the road. Cue new "Falcon replacement already in testing" headlines.

Is PD at Broady involved in the next gen C/D platform development at all?

[Chilliman]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Spotted turning off the street into Product Engineering, one brand new LHD evaluation Taurus, and one LHD Fusion.

Just wait until the media spot them out on the road. Cue new "Falcon replacement already in testing" headlines.

If the decision has already been, and I'm still holding out hope that it hasn't, then the Subaru Liberty that replaced my EF XR6 will be replaced by another Subaru product.

Doesn't mean that I won't get a second hand E-series or B-series to play with down the track.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

Is PD at Broady involved in the next gen C/D platform development at all?

Yes the US team is giving regions like FoA work to do on the combined Mondeo/Fusion platform.

Maybe we are recognised exponents in RHD versions of Ford vehicles?
Wouldn't it be neat if FoA did all the Global RHD versions of other region's vehicles.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by boris

What do you see as their differences, strengths etc?

Sorry for the late response but regarding Falcon and Taurus differences,
it's an opportunity to test the depth of G6ET market by offering an AWD product?

I'd like to see Ford import high series Taurus SHO and Lincoln MKS Ecoboost
if only to give HSV something to think about in terms of luxury sports vehicles....

I see it as an opportunity for Ford to to grow its large vehicle sales by offering more products....

[Ghiadude]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Spotted turning off the street into Product Engineering, one brand new LHD evaluation Taurus, and one LHD Fusion.

Just wait until the media spot them out on the road. Cue new "Falcon replacement already in testing" headlines.

What the? have we been led astray?

[Road_Warrior]

Originally Posted by Ghiadude

What the? have we been led astray?

It could also be for benchmarking purposes too, because development work on FGII would more than likely be finalised and work on the 2012 model will now more than likely be in full swing.

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by Ghiadude

What the? have we been led astray?

No need to worry, Ford always evaluate cars from across the Ford world. Detroit always have a fleet a global Ford vehicles including Falcon and Territory too. They could have been testing anything from the transmission to the electronics to anything in between, or benchmarking them against the new Falcon.

I've seen Lincolns and Mustangs and all sorts of vehicles over the years. Even Cadillacs and such.

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

Is PD at Broady involved in the next gen C/D platform development at all?

PD is in Geelong.

[Chilliman]

Originally Posted by jpd80

Sorry for the late response but regarding Falcon and Taurus differences,
it's an opportunity to test the depth of G6ET market by offering an AWD product?

I'd like to see Ford import high series Taurus SHO and Lincoln MKS Ecoboost
if only to give HSV something to think about in terms of luxury sports vehicles....

I see it as an opportunity for Ford to to grow its large vehicle sales by offering more products....

As a brand, Taurus is poison in Australia. A wide cross section of people that I've spoken to believe that if Ford Aus. replaces Falcon with Taurus then Ford is finished in this country. It's that sort of perception that has the potential to damage the entire Ford brand downunder.

The Lincoln MKS on the other hand may be positive - it would be a sort of new-kid-on-the-block and with Lincoln branding it would have none of the Ford negatives associated with it.

[Chilliman]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

No need to worry, Ford always evaluate cars from across the Ford world. Detroit always have a fleet a global Ford vehicles including Falcon and Territory too. They could have been testing anything from the transmission to the electronics to anything in between, or benchmarking them against the new Falcon.

I've seen Lincolns and Mustangs and all sorts of vehicles over the years. Even Cadillacs and such.

The real worry is that we just become a 'design house' and lose all our manufacturing capability, which would be very likely in a scenario where Falcon is replaced by a FWD car.

Maybe Ford don't quite grasp the nature of this market - the large car market is the RWD market made up of predominately Falcon and Commodore with a few Statemans, Caprice and 300Cs at the luxury end.

Larger FWD cars in this coutry such as the Toyota Aurion and Nissan Maxima are cross shopped against the wider medium sized market inhabited by Camry's, Mazda 6s, Subaru Libertys, Hyundai Sonatas etc.

By moving Falcon onto a FWD platform, Ford Aus is effectively swapping 30-40k sales in an essentially 2-player market for a max of 10-15K sales in what may well be a 10-player market by 2015. A big problem for the medium market is the growing size of C-class cars.

In the medium market the Falcon name will have a perception problem - Ford better be prepared to spend big on marketing if they wish to keep the Falcon name in that market because at the moment it is perceived as being a guzzler among potential Camry/Liberty/Mazda6 customers. All the Comparisons against the Commodore 3.0 SIDi haven't changed that perception amongst this crowd -it's just made the Commodore look thirstier.

The Taurus name is out for the reasons I've alluded to in a previous post, and with only 15K potential sales a year it would hardly warrant local manufacture - UNLESS we are to be exporters of said FWD car?

I realise that at the end of the day Australia is very small fry in the Ford world; Ford Aus. annual sales are equivalent to about one-months worth of Ford brand (excluding Lincoln & Mercury) sales in the US, and that the decision will be made regardless of how strongly we feel about it:

The only consolation is that we may get a proper RHD Mustang, not the coverted LHD job we had with the Mustang Cobra.

[jpd80]

In my opinion, the large car market is not the problem, it's the failure of Fiesta/Focus/Mondeo
to capture significant sales in their respective areas, there would be less pressure on Falcon
if these vehicles would pull their weight. Head office must be tearing their hair out looking at poor results.

I'll make a small wager that Ford head office tries again with the Taurus.... this one:

[Chilliman]

Originally Posted by jpd80

In my opinion, the large car market is not the problem, it's the failure of Fiesta/Focus/Mondeo
to capture significant sales in their respective areas, there would be less pressure on Falcon
if these vehicles would pull their weight. Head office must be tearing their hair out looking at poor results.

I'll make a small wager that Ford head office tries again with the Taurus.... this one:

Yes the large car market is doing relatively well for Ford Aus -why then would you want to abandon that market to compete in other segments where you haven't been doing so well lately; which is effectively what will happen if Falcon is replaced by a FWD model.

While I agree that the current Taurus is lightyears ahead of the crap that was sent here last time -anything with that name here in Aus. would be suicide. They better think of a new name and fast!

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by Chilliman

Yes the large car market is doing relatively well for Ford Aus -why then would you want to abandon that market to compete in other segments where you haven't been doing so well lately; which is effectively what will happen if Falcon is replaced by a FWD model.

That alternate universe is still five years away, what about now?
Why isn't Ford competing more heavily in these other markets?
it is possible to do two things at the one time.....

Originally Posted by Chilliman

While I agree that the current Taurus is light years ahead of the crap that was sent here last time -anything with that name here in Aus. would be suicide. They better think of a new name and fast!

Not necessarily, I think it would serve FoA's purpose perfectly.
Sell Falcon and Taurus side by side, Marin then gets his real world buyer
demographics and approaches Dearborn for more RWD funding after Taurus
sales perform like Ford's other FWDs.

This could be perfect timing for the RWd stalwarts to get exactly the ammunition they want,
perfect part is the Aussie buying public would get to decide which vehicles it really wants.

[Chilliman]

Originally Posted by jpd80

Not necessarily, I think it would serve FoA's purpose perfectly.
Sell Falcon and Taurus side by side, Marin then gets his real world buyer
demographics and approaches Dearborn for more RWD funding after Taurus
sales perform like Ford's other FWDs.

This could be perfect timing for the RWd stalwarts to get exactly the ammunition they want,
perfect part is the Aussie buying public would get to decide which vehicles it really wants.

I hope that is Marin's line of thinking - a real world demonstration of how badly a FWD replacement for Falcon would fare :

[R-Design]

Originally Posted by jpd80

This could be perfect timing for the RWd stalwarts to get exactly the ammunition they want,
perfect part is the Aussie buying public would get to decide which vehicles it really wants.

I like this idea too, but does Ford sell a RHD Taurus anywhere in the world?

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by Chilliman

I hope that is Marin's line of thinking - a real world demonstration of how badly a FWD replacement for Falcon would fare :

I chose to see it another way, Taurus capturing sales from buyers who don't normally purchase Falcons.
If Taurus adds sales without competing with the Falcon, it becomes a master stroke but in saying that
Marin will still have his ammunition to prove that a RWD Falcon is justified in Australia but Taurus is welcome too.

PS, I like your thinking on Lincoln MKS, maybe as a newer Ford LTD it can capture another buying group...