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The Pub For General Automotive Related Talk |
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05-02-2005, 07:21 PM | #31 | ||
likes falcon's
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 6,091
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7speed mercs...
not impressive guys
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05-02-2005, 07:25 PM | #32 | |||
RAGE Engineering
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 651
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Quote:
Even as a passenger, manual Falcons are not a nice thing.
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If it doesn't fit, use a BIGGER hammer Last edited by FFOracing; 05-02-2005 at 07:34 PM. |
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05-02-2005, 07:33 PM | #33 | |||
Regular Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Geelong
Posts: 272
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05-02-2005, 11:37 PM | #34 | ||
I am The Brain!
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 648
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I have heard that the ZF 6 speed auto is actually lighter than the current 4 speed auto on the Falcons, which is something a lot of people would be happy with.
I am confident, 99.9% sure, we will see a 6 speed out this year on a Falcon. Whether it is the ZF is another story.
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Long Live Cricket - Australia's favourite sport Woohoo 1.6L 1999 Toyota Corolla....feel the power! I know that you believe you understand what you think I said, but I am not sure you realise that what you heard is not what I meant. |
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05-02-2005, 11:42 PM | #35 | ||
Miami Pilot
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: ACT
Posts: 21,703
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I opt for an auto now, and giving me 2 extra gears would certainly be no reason to go back to the dark ages, oops, sorry, back to a manual. Although, i currently have six gears, depending on how you want to define them: R N D 3 2 1
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The Hammer: FG GTE | 376rwkw | 1/4 mile 11.793 @ 119.75mph 1.733 60' (4408lb) 1 of 60 FG MK1 335 GTEs (1 of 118 FG Mk 1 & 2 335 GTEs). Mods: Tune, HSD/ShockWorks, black GT335 19” staggered replicas with 245 & 275/35/19 Michelin Pilot sport 5s Daily: BF2 Fairmont Ghia I6 ZF, machine face GT335 19” staggered Replicas with 245s and 275s, Bilsteins & Kings FPV 335 build stats: <click here> Ford Performance Club ACT |
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05-02-2005, 11:52 PM | #36 | |||
Miami Pilot
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: ACT
Posts: 21,703
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Quote:
Now, the merc in it's home country is equivalent to the falcon/commodore. Combined they (falcodores) hold about 30% of our new car market - around 15% each, give or take a few percent either way. Of this figure, around 90% would be auto. So roughly 13% of 200,000 = 26,000 cars sold each year are auto falcons. If we use the same 13% of the total number in the mercs market, you get 520,000 cars sold per year with a 7 speed gearbox. It is much easier to ammortise (spread) the cost of R&D for a 7 speed auto across 520,000 cars than it is to spread it across 26,000 cars. If Ford Oz tried to bring in a 7 speed box, the cars would probably end up costing more than a merc! Which is exactly why it's the Jag that gets the ZF 6 speed at the moment. Jag is the premium brand - ie the cars cost more anyway, so rich people won't even notice the extra they are paying for a 6 speed auto. Then, of course, there is the reason for needing 7 gears. Would we need that many with our piddly 110 km/h limit (actually, would we need 6?). probably not. But in the EU where you can do whatever safe speed (let's call it 250km/h) you want on some roads - eg autobahns in germany, autostradas in Italy - the 7 gears would (possbily) get used - over here, we would really only use the first 4!
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The Hammer: FG GTE | 376rwkw | 1/4 mile 11.793 @ 119.75mph 1.733 60' (4408lb) 1 of 60 FG MK1 335 GTEs (1 of 118 FG Mk 1 & 2 335 GTEs). Mods: Tune, HSD/ShockWorks, black GT335 19” staggered replicas with 245 & 275/35/19 Michelin Pilot sport 5s Daily: BF2 Fairmont Ghia I6 ZF, machine face GT335 19” staggered Replicas with 245s and 275s, Bilsteins & Kings FPV 335 build stats: <click here> Ford Performance Club ACT Last edited by JC; 05-02-2005 at 11:56 PM. |
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06-02-2005, 02:07 AM | #37 | |||
RAGE Engineering
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 651
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Quote:
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If it doesn't fit, use a BIGGER hammer Last edited by FFOracing; 06-02-2005 at 02:14 AM. |
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06-02-2005, 02:37 AM | #38 | ||
Solution Was Boost 4?, 6 & 8
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 23,624
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Better be a ZF 6 speed...
Typhoon with a ZF 6 speed, a few mods 300rwkw thats a machine...all we need is that v8 sound.
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06-02-2005, 08:21 AM | #39 | ||
RIP...
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 15,524
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I'd own a 6spd auto only if it shifted better than that absolutely disgusting 4spd that Ford currently use.
It appears that most people feel the tall first gear is the biggest problem with the current box, and yes I agree it is a problem, however I also hate how lethargic it is shifting gears, the flaring and the delay when the throttle is pushed. It gives little feedback, and is so unresponsive. Personally I think the current 4spd is very poor indeed, and the 6spd would have to rectify the above mentioned problems before I'd even consider one. Rick.
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06-02-2005, 08:32 AM | #40 | ||
meow
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Where the Pirates are.
Posts: 2,744
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I'd take one, more fun
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06-02-2005, 10:21 AM | #41 | ||
Former E-Series Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,733
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It will be an exciting day when the woeful inefficiency of the current auto driveline is addressed.
However, to those who think that more gears is better, bear in mind that time/energy wasted constantly shifting gears equals increased wear on the transmission and reduced performance. There has to be a line to be drawn, and I think 5 or 6 speeds with well chosen ratios is all that would ever be necessary. In terms of performance, many a drag car does just fine with 2 speeds. |
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06-02-2005, 11:57 AM | #42 | |||
LPG > You
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia
Posts: 4,277
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06-02-2005, 12:06 PM | #43 | ||
Former E-Series Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,733
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I agree, a good spread of gears is potentially better than having a silly number of ratios. Mercedes might as well look at CVT... though for Falcon, I think the price of transmission rebuilds would be a big factor, particularly for taxi drivers.
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06-02-2005, 12:20 PM | #44 | ||
LPG > You
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia
Posts: 4,277
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They could always make a taxi-pack using the same BTR M97LE they use now.
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06-02-2005, 12:37 PM | #45 | ||
Curry in a hurry
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Perth
Posts: 429
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It will be good to see a 6 speed auto in the falcon and im sure it will improve sales but at this moment in time id opt for a manual as auto's are boring to drive imho.
Maybe later down the track when im older ill make a move to auto but thiers no way id do it now. |
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06-02-2005, 12:41 PM | #46 | ||||
RIP...
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 15,524
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Quote:
Lightweight cars with big blocks (lots of torque) are most efficient with 2 gears, as any more gears are wasted. Usually bigger/heavier cars such as sedans benefit from more gears. Road cars have very different requirements. Quote:
Few drag cars have ratios taller than 4.5:1. Rick.
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. Oval Everywhere... |
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06-02-2005, 03:01 PM | #47 | ||
Right out sideways
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Coffs Harbour NSW
Posts: 5,306
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if there was a definate announcement of a 6 speed i would wait off ordering our GT-P till then for sure !
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06-02-2005, 03:06 PM | #48 | ||
DJR TM#54
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: on my p.c now with internet! ok i'll still use works internet too.
Posts: 2,248
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I would opt for the 6 speed auto if it was the same gearing as the manual. Quicker gear changes with the auto.
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06-02-2005, 04:23 PM | #49 | ||
Once more with feeling
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 537
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considering the amount of owners on here who bitch about the quality of their manual boxes and driveline shunt - which again seems to be mostly an isssue in manual equipped cars, what wouldn't be to want about a 6 speed auto with similar ratios as the manual and few of the problems?
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Cheers JR |
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06-02-2005, 06:43 PM | #50 | ||
Abuser of Charvels
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: ACT
Posts: 4,053
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I would definitely take one for a test drive or 3!!
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06-02-2005, 06:59 PM | #51 | ||
Last warning
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Mornington Peninsula, Victoria HeadCount: 3
Posts: 11,194
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aslong as i can make it work in the EF!
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06-02-2005, 07:02 PM | #52 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 22,922
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Quote:
Ive driven an XR6 Turbo in an AUTO and thought it was brillant, i certainly wouldn't buy a Manual Clunk box As for a Six speed auto id have one tomorrow. In todays conditions and with city driving autos are far far superior then manuals. As for the boring part, YOUR BORING! You whinge about clutches etc falling out of the Manaul yet you say a Turbo sedan would have to be the most boring BA, thats the biggest load of crock ive ever read, best you go join the denial forum! I reckon the most boring BA would have to be an EGas XT...
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2022 RAM Laramie 5.7 2023.50 Ranger Wildtrak 3.0 V6 Premium Pack 2024 Everest Sport 3.0 V6 Touring Pack 2024.50 Mustang Darkhorse 6M Blue Ember + Appearance pack ETA Jan 25. Last edited by Smoke Pursuit; 06-02-2005 at 07:22 PM. |
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06-02-2005, 07:10 PM | #53 | |||
RAGE Engineering
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 651
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Quote:
Seriously, these things go hard. Damn hard straight out of the box. Your NA six would not hold a candle to it.
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If it doesn't fit, use a BIGGER hammer |
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06-02-2005, 08:09 PM | #54 | |||
Hello
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Mt Barker, SA
Posts: 4,300
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Quote:
Im sooo sorry, I totally forgot that we are not allowed OPINIONS on a public forum! The fact that I drove ONE XR6T and found it boring just HAPPENS to be my opinion! You find it fantastic? Well goody goody for you. Im pleased for you. For my part, I grew up driving cars on a track long before I was driving on a regular road and probably long before a lot of people on this Forum were driving at all, so perhaps my (apparently flawed) opinion is to be taken in this context. I have never hidden the fact that I have had issues with my CLUTCH, however, I have never had ANY issue with my T5 and in fact, the T5 is rather good - and NO, this is not just my OPINION, God forbid! It is actually the opinion of people who would KNOW, who have driven it on many occasions! And in any case, my clutch has been repaired, not at my expense and it actually survived the drags at Heathcote rather well, I might add. Just because something breaks does not mean it is not preferable to something else... Id rather fix something I liked, rather than drive something I didnt like, just because it was less trouble! I still maintain that the XR6T I drove in the auto was BORING, and I compared this to the manual XR6T (which I loved) and the manual XR8 (after driving I couldnt get the smile off my face) and even my own manual NA. And whats more, the auto XR6T still IS the most boring BA I have driven except for perhaps an auto XT Hertz hire car and that is my OPINION. If you have one and you like it, then thats very nice. I dont happen to agree. I also drive mine an hour a day in peak hour traffic, I also live in the hills and I also do a lot of country driving. I have also driven in interstate peak hour traffic. I have never had a problem with driving a manual under such conditions. I have also driven it with a completely smashed left foot for quite a long time under such conditions, and also with the foot in a bad way at the drags at Heathcote. I still never had a problem and would have never traded it for an auto. I do not agree that everyone would find the auto superior to the manual at all. If you cant handle it, then drive the auto. I, for one, can handle it and whats more, I actually enjoy the clutch and changing gears regardless of the conditions and if I feel that doing otherwise is boring, then please kindly accept my opinion and move on thanks. I might add that people are BORING who cannot take someones OPINION for what it is, and deal with that by personally insulting people! And it's also a tad childish! I am not saying the 6 speed auto is a bad thing, for those who like it, then I am sure it will be a good thing. As I stated in my post (if you care to re-read it) and also I did state that it was a matter of preference (if you care to re read that part too).... And the last time I checked, having a preference was not illegal or against the Forum rules. I dont like autos. Get over it. I prefer manuals. Get over it. I stated my opinion. Get over it. You cannot read a post properly. I will get over it. You cannot distinguish between an opinion/preference and a personal attack. I will get over it. You respond to peoples opinions/preferences with insults. I will get over it. And I also will have a laugh. I wish you a better nights sleep tonight and I recommened some therapy for your stick envy - all with the best intentions of course! Relaaaax..... breathe deeeeeply...... sleep:
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2008 FPV TERRITORY F6-X Silhouette, window tint, roof racks, 3rd row seats, ROH Mantis 19s, black custom plates 'FPVF6X' and no stripes. : Cobra : Last edited by XRchic; 06-02-2005 at 08:58 PM. |
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06-02-2005, 08:19 PM | #55 | |||||
RIP...
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 15,524
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
You only steer autos, but you drive manuals. Rick.
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. Oval Everywhere... |
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06-02-2005, 08:24 PM | #56 | ||
Soooo Cute!â„¢
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: TenderCity™ The Land of Long Hours & Number Crunching!
Posts: 743
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Ok kiddies.. Obligatory warning about threads getting out of control..
This is a good thread.. lets not cock it up with crap.. it:
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06-02-2005, 08:25 PM | #57 | |||
Hello
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Mt Barker, SA
Posts: 4,300
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Quote:
I know what times the auto XR6T are getting on the strip. So yes, they do appear to go hard. The one I drove didnt, or it didnt FEEL like it. My Dad who has an auto preference, also was disgusted with it. Having said that, I am sure he would like the 6 speed auto. I just wouldnt. I know my car is never going to get low 14s on the strip. And perhaps a manual XR6T wouldnt either. But if I had a manual XR6T Id gladly trade off a tenth for the fun I would have driving it every day. And yep, the pulse is going quite fine thanks, it just slows down a bit when I hear an awesome sounding car go through an auto gear change.... You dudes all gotta take a chill pill and RELAX!!!! Coz Im starting to feel a bit intimidated here!!! ROFL! _2: : :evil_laug
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2008 FPV TERRITORY F6-X Silhouette, window tint, roof racks, 3rd row seats, ROH Mantis 19s, black custom plates 'FPVF6X' and no stripes. : Cobra : |
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06-02-2005, 08:33 PM | #58 | |||
Hello
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Mt Barker, SA
Posts: 4,300
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Quote:
Nah seriously, sorry if I offended anyone, it was not my intent. :
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2008 FPV TERRITORY F6-X Silhouette, window tint, roof racks, 3rd row seats, ROH Mantis 19s, black custom plates 'FPVF6X' and no stripes. : Cobra : |
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06-02-2005, 08:34 PM | #59 | ||
.
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Bundoora
Posts: 7,199
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Some people like auto's, some manuals! Everyone is entitled to say what they prefer guys
We all have a choice and we can make that choice when we look for a car to purchase! |
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06-02-2005, 09:13 PM | #60 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 22,922
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Nah im just a little ****ed off with the word choice. Xrchic says she despised it and her old man was disgusted with it which I just cant understand. Getting out of an AU Fairmont and into an Auto or Manual T he should have had alot of fun. Either the car was faulty or your comments are a little biased (I dont know).
Neways they are a quick car, the quarter mile times prove it. Auto or manual. . I didn't intend to take a stab at you XRchic, but your comments seemed to be a little biased and a little off topic.
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