(2011) Ford AU Posts Bigggest Annual Loss

[BroadyFord]

Let's start doing some number crunching regarding the closure of manufacturing operations, seeing as it's an inevitable prospect.

How many people currently work in Broadmeadows and how many in Geelong? The rule of thumb is that for every car manufacturing job that goes, a further 7 in downstream suppliers goes with it.

That equals A LOT of job losses and a further blow to Victoria's fractured economy.

Depressing times indeed!

[dimka100]

Originally Posted by Chilliman

... but I've got the feeling that there's no turning the ship around from here!

Ship? I think it’s more of a submarine now …

But more seriously, wouldn’t it be better to just save all the money that’s going to be dumped into the Falcon and instead redirect it into imports? Existing engineering can still be used to tweak imported products to better suit our Australian market (similar to how Toyota and Hyundai are doing it) and manufacturing can potentially be utilised build some of the custom parts for the imported products?

Being realistic I just can’t understand how Ford can turn this situation around considering that the Falcon numbers are already running 30% lower than last year and Territory numbers are no better than they were last year. While sure the imports part of the business has the potential to do a lot better this year with the Thailand plant increasing supply, the existing Falcon/Territory issue will remain and keep dragging the rest of the company results downwards.

[Nikked]

Originally Posted by BroadyFord

Ford manufacturing in Australia is officially finished.

What a mope....


Ford have spent a great deal over the last month on the Territory and Falcon, and they made profit for the last 2 (or 3 years?), while Asia pacific as a whole made a loss.


Alot of people here are quick to judge a write things off to easy.


Great going.

[Road_Warrior]

Originally Posted by Chilliman

I smell a conspiracy theory at work here. Most of the headline figure ($290Million loss) has come about because of 'accounting treatments'. I have a feeling that management has been given a directive from head office to paint the local operation in the worst possible light so that it easier to sell the closure of manufacturing operations.

Wouldnt this sort of 'creative accounting' be illegal?

[tweeked]

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

Wouldnt this sort of 'creative accounting' be illegal?

Not as long as you write things off in line with legal accounting practice. Either way, you carry it on the balance sheet or write things off. All legal and traceable. I cannot see them doing a dodgy.

[BroadyFord]

Originally Posted by Nikked

Ford have spent a great deal over the last month on the Territory and Falcon, and they made profit for the last 2 (or 3 years?), while Asia pacific as a whole made a loss.
.

As someone mentioned earlier it's largely because of FoA's performance that Asia-Pacific made a loss.

[BHDOGS]

So how long till Holden stops production to then once ford does 2/3 years?

[JPFS1]

Better tell them to stop all the work on the Falcon update...

Better tell them to stop filming the new FPV commercial...

Better tell them to not worry about that new opportunity for ...

All because of some fancy accounting and some drastic supply issues.

work continues...

[jpd80]

If we can stop from going into a flat spin for a moment and read the following passage,
I think you'll find things are not as bad as implied with the screaming headline:

The company’s “underlying” net operating loss was $78 million for 2011, though the total loss was blown out by a “one off” $212 million tax impairment that includes tax losses for 2011 as well as previous negative financial years where tax losses were deferred.

Ford Australia admits plummeting sales of its Falcon large car contributed to the net operating loss from revenue of $2.8 billion for 2011 – down on 2010 revenue of $3.3b – but also blamed the financial result on supply problems and costs incurred from 2011 changes that shed about 250 staff from the Broadmeadows workforce and reduced daily production output from 260 to 209 vehicles.

I'm not trying to paint a rosy picture here but maybe Ford is being more up front with its accounting compared to Holden..

It certainly looks like Ford is bringing out all those deferred tax losses and clearing the books...

I wonder why they are picking now to declare a huge loss, maybe seeking a huge hand out/funding before election?

[Nikked]

I'd say a funding grab...


Or cleaning losses out for more devlopment funds?

[BroadyFord]

Originally Posted by jpd80

If we can stop from going into a flat spin for a moment and read the following passage,
I think you'll find things are not as bad as implied with the screaming headline:



I'm not trying to paint a rosy picture here but maybe Ford is being more up front with its accounting compared to Holden..

It certainly looks like Ford is bringing out all those deferred tax losses and clearing the books...

I wonder why they are picking now to declare a huge loss, maybe seeking a huge hand out/funding before election?

None of that explains the $78 million operating loss!

[jpd80]

Instead of looking at the $290 million loss, we should be asking, where did the other 2.8 Billion in revenue go.......

[Road_Warrior]

Originally Posted by BroadyFord

Let's start doing some number crunching regarding the closure of manufacturing operations, seeing as it's an inevitable prospect.

Gover? Hagon? Is that you?

[Brazen]

Originally Posted by jpd80

If we can stop from going into a flat spin for a moment and read the following passage,
I think you'll find things are not as bad as implied with the screaming headline:



I'm not trying to paint a rosy picture here but maybe Ford is being more up front with its accounting compared to Holden..

It certainly looks like Ford is bringing out all those deferred tax losses and clearing the books...

I wonder why they are picking now to declare a huge loss, maybe seeking a huge hand out/funding before election?

Nah this simply means that their previous years losses were bigger than they originally booked by simply deferring a loss event to the next financial year, over and over - you can't keep doing that forever.

[Chilliman]

Originally Posted by JPFS1

Better tell them to stop all the work on the Falcon update...

Better tell them to stop filming the new FPV commercial...

Better tell them to not worry about that new opportunity for ...

All because of some fancy accounting and some drastic supply issues.

work continues...

I want to remain positive, I really do but...

Better tell them to stop all the work on the Falcon update - projects get canned at the last minute all the time

Better tell them to stop filming the new FPV commercial - I might have a better view of Ford's future if they were filming new commercial for the EcoBoost Falcon

Better tell them to not worry about that new opportunity for - and pray tell, what is new opportunity that you speak of

All because of some fancy accounting and some drastic supply issues - the Accounting treatment wouldn't worry me at all, if next year's outlook was positive. If Graziano can't even spin a bit of positivity what hope do the rest of have?

[Road_Warrior]

Why are they carrying forward tax impairments year on year when they cannot be written off and have to be realised sooner or later?? Or is it a case of better having modest profits twice and then the big hit or...I don't get it why you would realise the loss in this way.

[burnz]

on a positive note: ford has advertised the falcon XR6 and Ecoboost on main stream tele.. nine and ten the ads were shown.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by Brazen

Nah this simply means that their previous years losses were bigger than they originally booked by simply deferring a loss event to the next financial year, over and over - you can't keep doing that forever.

And remember the bulk of the losses in 2008 were related to:
- topping up defined pension benefits
- reducing staff by 600
- and of courses losses in production of local cars..

I'm wondering whether Ford is writing down non-recoverable project costs of FG /SYII now that FGII/SZ have been released?
If sales have not been high enough to recover prescribed amounts booked to the projects, then there would be write downs..

[Chilliman]

Originally Posted by burnz

on a positive note: ford has advertised the falcon XR6 and Ecoboost on main stream tele.. nine and ten the ads were shown.

That is indeed a positive note - small, but positive at a time when it's desperately needed...Ford actually advertising the Falcon!

[FPV GTHO]

Originally Posted by madmelon

It really doesn't. It's me, a loyal Falcon guy (own two, am 26yo) from a loyal Falcon family (Including mine- 11x in 25 years, 7x were bought new) expressing my exasperation at the constant excuses and cover stories continuously being trotted out by Ford Australia Management.

Def'n of madness: Doing the same thing over and over and expecting diffrerent results.

Ford hasnt used that "excuse", as you put it, for a while. Not since theyve been doing 1500 sales a month on Falcon at best, when its been pretty clear they needed better results either from the return of LPG or a new market like Ecoboost.

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by jpd80

I'm not trying to paint a rosy picture here but maybe Ford is being more up front with its accounting compared to Holden..

It certainly looks like Ford is bringing out all those deferred tax losses and clearing the books...

I wonder why they are picking now to declare a huge loss, maybe seeking a huge hand out/funding before election?

I think they knew they were going to have a loss, they couldn't avoid that, so may as well make it a big one, get rid of any debt they have been carrying, and increase their chances of making a little profit next year. If its going to be a loss, its going to be a loss, simple as that I think.

Would it have really mattered that it was 290 million and not just 90, either way it still looks bad.

But I think the simple fact remains, that they are unprofitable at their current numbers, and unless they can find some serious volume increases then its inevitable they will be shut down. You can't keep an unprofitable business going forever with no hope of success, Fords build numbers and the fact they are only selling to a tiny market here mean only making cars for Oz and NZ is never going to work.

I think its quite clear that without an export market to get production numbers up to a viable level they are stuffed. No one can deny that now.

And it doesn't help that they are being royally butt raped by getting tiny supply numbers of cars vital to their success here. If Detroit don't fix this soon and give FoA the supplies they need of Ranger, Mondeo, Focus and Kuga then massive losses will continue.

At least Ranger production is going to increase and Focus and next Kuga will come from Thailand in September, they just need increased supplies of Mondeo.

[RASER]

Originally Posted by Joe5619

Why does this give you pleasure??


Sad day... Hate to say it, but time might be right to close local manfacturing for Ford?

I don't think HQ in USA would be all that happy with this.

It's the LARGEST loss they have ever had in AUS

They will be out of manufacture by decades end, just like Nissan and Mitsubishi before, import only range

Will GovCo have to tip in more money again?

Bring on the $30k F150's!!!

[Road_Warrior]

FoA's manufacturing here is viable, but they need a 3rd vehicle line, a volume seller that can be exported as well.

[Polyal]

Originally Posted by RASER

I don't think HQ in USA would be all that happy with this.

It's the LARGEST loss they have ever had in AUS

They will be out of manufacture by decades end, just like Nissan and Mitsubishi before, import only range

Will GovCo have to tip in more money again?

Bring on the $30k F150's!!!

I think Alan is to busy rolling in his billions per quarter to break a sweat.

They know FoA is worth far more to them within the region than one bad year.

[My poor XF]

Originally Posted by RASER

Bring on the $30k F150's!!!

Good luck with that!

[RASER]

Originally Posted by Polyal

I think Alan is to busy rolling in his billions per quarter to break a sweat.

They know FoA is worth far more to them within the region than one bad year.

There will come a time, a tip over point, where the Falcon production is to low, i think its very very close to that point, they use to make 300 a day now they make 1000 a month, they days of Ford manufacture are over in AUS.

Customer buying habits change, the Falcon is no longer on the buy list [and they think a 4cyl. Facon will save its ***?]

Yes, A/M would be very interested in the 100's of acres of prime real estate on Hume Hwy they can sell

[Chopped]

Swings and roundabouts.

[RASER]

Originally Posted by My poor XF

Good luck with that!

Ford F150's kick off [FULL RRP] @ $23,300 in USA

http://www.ford.com/trucks/f150/

With free-trade with USA [no duty/tariff] they *could* easily sell it here for around that if they had to [AND make money]

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by RASER

I don't think HQ in USA would be all that happy with this.

It's the LARGEST loss they have ever had in AUS

They will be out of manufacture by decades end, just like Nissan and Mitsubishi before, import only range

Will GovCo have to tip in more money again?

Bring on the $30k F150's!!!

They don't even make them in RHD, so how will that happen.

Originally Posted by RASER

There will come a time, a tip over point, where the Falcon production is to low, i think its very very close to that point, they use to make 300 a day now they make 1000 a month, they days of Ford manufacture are over in AUS.

Customer buying habits change, the Falcon is no longer on the buy list [and they think a 4cyl. Facon will save its ***?]

Yes, A/M would be very interested in the 100's of acres of prime real estate on Hume Hwy they can sell

They used to make 520 a day back in the BA days.

They would already be past the tip over point. The numbers they are making now are insignificant.

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by RASER

Ford F150's kick off [FULL RRP] @ $23,300 in USA

http://www.ford.com/trucks/f150/

With free-trade with USA [no duty/tariff] they *could* easily sell it here for around that if they had to [AND make money]

You cannot compare the prices of US vehicles with ones sold here. The prices do not even come close to compare.

Just look how much the F series sold for previously when they got them in factory RHD, they were over 70k. And now they no longer come in RHD.