Drugged drivers...

[tranquilized]

Originally Posted by Bud Bud

And it is just not the users, even some legislators really don’t seem to want to take a responsible attitude for the real drug problems that has created this "devolving" (of what could ultimately become a human sub specious) either. I can't believe that they have softened over the years as well. The fallout of all this is that harm minimisation has become the new order over the last 20 years or so and a lot of people think that this type of behaviour it is ok now. In S.A. I have heard people say that is legal to grow three plants??? WTF??? It has never been legal to grow any plants in S.A., just decriminalised (another legislative golden milestone). This is why people now have such contempt for the drug laws. When I was a kid it was just classified illegal period.

Bud Bud

I agree with pretty much everything you've said there, but I think I can detect an attitude towards drugs which I dont agree with.

The important thing I think everyone needs to realise is, people are to blame - not the drugs. I've had my fair share of illegal drugs over the years, there, I've said it, flame away. To paraphrase the late great comedian Bill Hicks, I never killed anyone never hurt anyone never beat anyone never robbed anyone never lost a job house car or girl. I just had a real good time! And definitely never got behind the wheel of a car.

My point is, people are either responsible, sensible and intelligent, or they're not. The problems drugs are causing in society these days is a complex issue made even more so by the availability and legality of the most dangerous and harmful drug of them all - alcohol.

Drugs are most certainly not responsible for this devolving phenomena some have noticed, and I definitely believe is happening. Drugs are the scapegoat, stupid people are the real issue.

Speaking of;

Originally Posted by 04redxr8

All the other species on the planet manage to find the carrier of the idiot gene, and kill it. Except for humans. We nurture it, raise it, cherish it, and protect it. Even our crocs won't kill it.

Couldn't agree more! Need to add a few more undesirable genes to the list as well but thats for another day...

Its not a very PC position, but our modern society with all our technology, health care systems/abilities, welfare systems etc etc, is breeding a stupider, feebler, and less able human race. Pretty much just as Flappist said, although I dont think the contraceptive pill has played much of a part.

[mongoloid]

Originally Posted by flappist

For hundreds of thousands of years human beings have evolved. We as a species became stronger and smarter as the weak and stupid tended to be killed and therefore did not reproduce as much.

Then, in the middle of the 20th century, a terrible chemical weapon was unleashed on an unsuspecting public.

THE CONTRACEPTIVE PILL

Now humans could control how many children they have without restricting "activities".

But there was a problem.....

Intelligent women remembered to take their pills and have their planned family of 2.5 intelligent children and a dog.

Stupid women forget to take their pills and have 7.8 stupid children, 12 dogs, 4 cats and a parrot.

Due the the exponential increase in the ratio of stupid vs intelligent people and the democaratic systems in place in most of the western world in three generations into this pandemic we are faced with an increase of stupid people in places of power put there by other stupid people.

The signs of stupidity are everywhere not only in the political, legal or media arenas but in just day to day living. (Croc riding anyone?)

We are gradually devolving and will continue to do so until either we wipe ourselves out, get overtaken by another species (indigenous or extraterrestrial) or we split into two groups with one being subserviant to the other.

The forth option, we wake up to ourselves and start evolving again, would require the acceptance that we are not all equal and can never be made that way by lowering standards and tightening restrictions to allow inferior people to do things they are not really capable of.

There is very little chance of that happening.......

For those of you that enjoyed flappists post i highly recommend a book called 'Freakonomics', explores a few similar theories and is a highly entertaining read, anyone you come across who has read it will agree im sure.

For a lighter take on the subject the movie Idiocracy is gold.

Aplogies for the thread detour, as you were...

[Trek]

Originally Posted by mongoloid

For a lighter take on the subject the movie Idiocracy is gold.

And that's exactly what came to my mind when browsing the posts

Although, there is plenty of other media that touches on this subject.

Being confronted with this on a frequent basis is rather tiring, sadly, always being left asking 'why'. Seeing as the ball did indeed start rolling a long time ago now, fingers crossed that reset button otherwise seen as the collision, happens sooner than later...

Between being selfish and apathetic, most humans really aren't doing much to help prevent this 'epidemic' (or whatever you'd wish to call it).

[platinumXR]

Originally Posted by Jim Goose

I feel sick to my stomach here....
Just read this one:

A nine-year-old girl having a bath in her Perth home "miraculously" avoided death or serious injury when a clandestine drug laboratory exploded a couple of metres away, police say.

The girl was among five people at a Maddington house in Perth's east raided by police on Wednesday night after neighbours heard a blast and smelt ammonia.

A 39-year-old man has been charged with attempting to manufacture methylamphetamine and a 33-year-old-woman has also been charged with allowing premises to be used for making illegal drugs.

Assistant Commissioner Steve Brown said the girl was now in the care of the Department of Child Protection.

"To our distress we located in that house a young child, about two metres away from the site of the explosion, who was lying in a bath," he told ABC Radio.

"It's absolutely miraculous that that child wasn't injured seriously or actually killed in the event."

Only last week WA Police expressed concern over the number of children found living at houses where dangerous clandestine drug laboratories were operating, after uncovering six labs in two days.

Detective-Inspector Alan Morton said children were found at two of those sites and police were seriously concerned they were sometimes living in rooms where potentially explosive chemicals were stored.More than 60 clandestine labs have been found in WA so far this year.

Steady on mate, they were only doing it so they could buy a plasma and a Wii for the other 6.8 stupid children, 12 dogs, 4 cats and the parrot... what's wrong with that??

[mik]

Originally Posted by Jim Goose

I can remember reading a report where they did swabs of toilets of over half or so of niteclubs in the Brisbane Valley area. Over 90% of them gave positive readings when they swabbed the toilet cisterns (HOW DISGUSTING) and the wash benches.

Yet seemingly the courts do little when someone is caught dealing/ growing or making the product.

Again we see the softly softly approach hasnt worked.

perhaps the problem is so huge that the powers that be have sorta .....looked the other way up to a point, as a young bloke i can remember an apprentice at a holden dealer, i wont say high .......perhaps happily numb, he had a brand new hx premier he was about to work on, i watched him energise the cigerette lighter then he proceed to light his index finger..........a whisp of smoke came off it, he could`nt feel it, he looked at me and smiled, it left the burn mark from the red hot coil on the end of his finger, a disturbing image, one i have never forgotten one of many , this was a regular occurance with some of the young blokes in the motor trade, if its this bad in the work place is it any wonder drivers get nabbed.

[Jim Goose]

perhaps the problem is so huge that the powers that be have sorta .....looked the other way up to a point

Yes I would agree there.
Its such a large issue now that the problem is almost too difficult to work on.
But its not just the powers that be who turn a blind eye, we all do to some point.
Im sure we all know someone who uses, sells some form of drug, but we dont say anything or continue to work along side them or have mutual friends with them.
Remember that a drug user has no real friends, as the people they know are only interested in scoring from them.

Many years ago I knew of a dealer who I knew from friends of friends waaay back in school. This guy moved into my neighbourhood in the mid 1990s.
Every lunchtime massive amounts of cars would turn up.
This went on for a few yrs, until i go fed up and rang crime stoppers.
Sometime later these lunch time gathering stopped, however I seriously doubt he has stopped using.

The Aussie mentality of "not dobbing in ya mates" or mates of mates is stupidity at its best.

Steady on mate, they were only doing it so they could buy a plasma and a Wii for the other 6.8 stupid children, 12 dogs, 4 cats and the parrot... what's wrong with that??

Yes well, I cant understand so called "parents" who dont care about their kids or put them deliberately in danergous situations.
That poor girl has no hope in life as her idiot parents can only think about their next hit.

[platinumXR]

Originally Posted by Jim Goose

Yes well, I cant understand so called "parents" who dont care about their kids or put them deliberately in danergous situations.
That poor girl has no hope in life as her idiot parents can only think about their next hit.

Pretty selfish yes?

Originally Posted by Jim Goose

. The Aussie mentality of "not dobbing in ya mates" or mates of mates is stupidity at its best.

Spot on, but not just an Aussie mentality. It is prevalent in Afghanistan, Iraq, Northern Ireland, Bali, Italy, Spain, Egypt, Ukraine, Chechnya, Balkans, Bosnia / Herzegovina and anywhere else that harbour self righteous and stupid criminals - they also don't dob in their criminal 'mates'. Not wanting to get into a politics / terrorism debate (sorry Mod's), but it's a preservation mentality bred by fear and or apathy....no one cares until it affects them directly, so no one cares about the victims of these wombat criminals. And that's what they all are: criminals.

[flappist]

Originally Posted by platinumXR

Pretty selfish yes?




Spot on, but not just an Aussie mentality. It is prevalent in Afghanistan, Iraq, Northern Ireland, Bali, Italy, Spain, Egypt, Ukraine, Chechnya, Balkans, Bosnia / Herzegovina and anywhere else that harbour self righteous and stupid criminals - they also don't dob in their criminal 'mates'. Not wanting to get into a politics / terrorism debate (sorry Mod's), but it's a preservation mentality bred by fear and or apathy....no one cares until it affects them directly, so no one cares about the victims of these wombat criminals. And that's what they all are: criminals.

Really?

How many of your friends modified cars have you reported for possible emmissions non compliance?

If you are in you mates car and he does 110 in a 100 zone do you immediately ring crime stoppers?

If you see one of your mates chatting to a cute girl do you ring his wife/girlfriend and tell her?

If you think one of your mates might be just over 0.05 do you ring for an intercept?

Or is it only what you consider "serious crimes" that you dob your mates in for?

And if so what is your definition of a serious crime?

[Jim Goose]

And thats what is known as the grey area....

It all boils down to the individual and what they define as "enough is enough".
Some people may choose to ignore it, some may just choose not to be in that situation and walk away, others may report it to Police.

Sometimes it maybe as simple as telling ya mate "oi ****** what the hell are you doing?" in order to wake them up.

But doing something is better then doing nothing about it (whatever "it" may be).

[Bud Bud]

Originally Posted by tranquilized

I agree with pretty much everything you've said there, but I think I can detect an attitude towards drugs which I dont agree with.

Mate no problem, you are entitled to your opinion.

I do mix with a lot of people from time to time and especially with people half my age at times. It is impossible to know any large group of people ranging from close friends to acquaintances to friends of friends these days without being in constant contact with daily drug use and even abuse at times. I have actually mellowed and probably show more tolerance towards drug users now as I have gotten older. As long as they are good to me and the people around them, it really does not matter.

This is not what this is about and I know you understand this too as you did qualify that in your comments as well.

Originally Posted by flappist

And if so what is your definition of a serious crime?

Most people consider drink driving a serious crime these days. Only the foolish would disagree, but there are definitely now people who would ring the police if they saw someone swerving all over the road. It took a generation and the advent of the mobile phone to happen but it did happen.

The problem that seems to be happening here with recreational drugs tho is there is without doubt a generation under me that thinks that while drink driving is stupid and dangerous (which of course it is) driving drug stoned is somehow safer. That is why it is not considered to some, a dangerous crime.

Bud Bud

[platinumXR]

Originally Posted by flappist

Really?

How many of your friends modified cars have you reported for possible emmissions non compliance?

If you are in you mates car and he does 110 in a 100 zone do you immediately ring crime stoppers?

If you see one of your mates chatting to a cute girl do you ring his wife/girlfriend and tell her?

If you think one of your mates might be just over 0.05 do you ring for an intercept?

Or is it only what you consider "serious crimes" that you dob your mates in for?

And if so what is your definition of a serious crime?

Ok, once again you seem to be reading too much in to what I have posted and I thought long and hard about a general analogy to use. Ok to be fair: terrorists are not the same as speeding drivers or neighbours of a meth lab: but I am saying that silence and ignorance are not exclusive to Aussie's.

I am not going to get into one of your semantic arguments either: you know what I am trying to say so leave it at that.

[xtremerus]

Originally Posted by mik

perhaps the problem is so huge that the powers that be have sorta .....looked the other way up to a point,

Having needle disposal tins in our State and Federal Parliaments may show the caliber of some of our leaders, and may have something to do with 'looking the other way'.

[mik]

Originally Posted by xtremerus

Having needle disposal tins in our State and Federal Parliaments may show the caliber of some of our leaders, and may have something to do with 'looking the other way'.

Ahaa......you have hit a very big nail on the head.

[Auturbo6]

Sadly i know of many of our cab drivers that indulge in such activities. Speed or a more pure version Crystal Meth, being the main culprit. To think these drivers are carring our loved one's to their destination, is in my opinion outragious, however as i have stated many times before, as long as humans are in control of vehicles what can we do. Truck drivers anyone (Not all of course). Ive been at the department of transport may a time getting a taxi passed (and occasionally failed) and have had to endure the incessant rantings and ravings of a HIGH truck driver wilst waiting for my paperwork. Can only recommend that we all hang back and watch the idiocy unraval in front of us as whilst driving, as getting tested is much like playing lotto, many will never get caught. Later......................

[mik]

Originally Posted by Auturbo6

Sadly i know of many of our cab drivers that indulge in such activities. Speed or a more pure version Crystal Meth, being the main culprit. To think these drivers are carring our loved one's to their destination, is in my opinion outragious, however as i have stated many times before, as long as humans are in control of vehicles what can we do. Truck drivers anyone (Not all of course). Ive been at the department of transport may a time getting a taxi passed (and occasionally failed) and have had to endure the incessant rantings and ravings of a HIGH truck driver wilst waiting for my paperwork. Can only recommend that we all hang back and watch the idiocy unraval in front of us as whilst driving, as getting tested is much like playing lotto, many will never get caught. Later......................

these days i don`t think you could say that with interstaters, getting pulled up is a pretty frequent occurence, local drivers might be a bit more of a lotto, but there is not much reason for local drivers to use as much.

[SEZ213]

Originally Posted by Auturbo6

Sadly i know of many of our cab drivers that indulge in such activities. Speed or a more pure version Crystal Meth, being the main culprit. To think these drivers are carring our loved one's to their destination, is in my opinion outragious, however as i have stated many times before, as long as humans are in control of vehicles what can we do. Truck drivers anyone (Not all of course). Ive been at the department of transport may a time getting a taxi passed (and occasionally failed) and have had to endure the incessant rantings and ravings of a HIGH truck driver wilst waiting for my paperwork. Can only recommend that we all hang back and watch the idiocy unraval in front of us as whilst driving, as getting tested is much like playing lotto, many will never get caught. Later......................

I used to work with about 40 truck drivers - I would see them on a daily basis, they for the most part would be forewarned by management that drug testing that was taking place, the sad part is...I was drug tested more times just sitting in the office organising their jobs for them...

http://www.dailyexaminer.com.au/stor...ches-truckies/

From this article this is the most disturbing part...

Research conducted by the Roads and Traffic Authority indicated as many as one in five truck drivers take methylamphetamines, such as speed, to stay alert on long trips.

Someone once tried to tell me that without trucks Australia stops...I refuse to believe it. We had a fantastic rail set up - but the likes of large trucking companies put a stop to it...(Fox et. al.). Evidently it was too expensive to change the gauges...how many people have died since as a result of this 'expense' is what I would like to ask?

The damage to the roads caused by 30-40 tonne loads is astronomical...and they think a speed camera will help it?

I know...it's completely off the topic...but I had to say it...and I get very passionate about it so I'm sorry in advance...

[Iggypoppin']

Originally Posted by Auturbo6

Sadly i know of many of our cab drivers that indulge in such activities. Speed or a more pure version Crystal Meth, being the main culprit. To think these drivers are carring our loved one's to their destination, is in my opinion outragious, however as i have stated many times before, as long as humans are in control of vehicles what can we do. Truck drivers anyone (Not all of course). Ive been at the department of transport may a time getting a taxi passed (and occasionally failed) and have had to endure the incessant rantings and ravings of a HIGH truck driver wilst waiting for my paperwork. Can only recommend that we all hang back and watch the idiocy unraval in front of us as whilst driving, as getting tested is much like playing lotto, many will never get caught. Later......................

Guarantee you could meet all the truckies on AFF(there's a few) and none are juiced up on the gear.
Are you a cab company bloke? Do you work in the industry? Taxi driver?

[mik]

Originally Posted by Sezzy

I used to work with about 40 truck drivers - I would see them on a daily basis, they for the most part would be forewarned by management that drug testing that was taking place, the sad part is...I was drug tested more times just sitting in the office organising their jobs for them...

http://www.dailyexaminer.com.au/stor...ches-truckies/

From this article this is the most disturbing part...

Research conducted by the Roads and Traffic Authority indicated as many as one in five truck drivers take methylamphetamines, such as speed, to stay alert on long trips.

Someone once tried to tell me that without trucks Australia stops...I refuse to believe it. We had a fantastic rail set up - but the likes of large trucking companies put a stop to it...(Fox et. al.). Evidently it was too expensive to change the gauges...how many people have died since as a result of this 'expense' is what I would like to ask?

The damage to the roads caused by 30-40 tonne loads is astronomical...and they think a speed camera will help it?

I know...it's completely off the topic...but I had to say it...and I get very passionate about it so I'm sorry in advance...

i would dispute the pro`s and con`s of railway vs truck ,for a start railways create double handling, trucks go where ever needed, trucks do damage to roads yes, trucks also pay huge taxes/fee`s, i would also not judge the whole industry because one mob you worked for gave drug warnings out to drivers, or an estimate by rta, my first experience with a semi was 1964, i am also passionate about this subject, i`m not sorry.

[Iggypoppin']

As the saying goes, without trucks Australia stops....If you dispute this then
stop them for a day, with no alternate arrangement for transport. Even with rail/other means, I guarantee it would cause a big problem Australia wide. Trucks are a big part of australias economy, no two ways around it.

[302 XC]

Just on the truck Vs rail debate here
I live 200Ks west of brissie,many years ago we had rail out here (long long time ago)
But the powers that be decided not a viable option and ripped it all up
Never will i understand why,it could have linked the country to the city
But hey im not as smart as a pollie

[SEZ213]

Originally Posted by mik

i would dispute the pro`s and con`s of railway vs truck ,for a start railways create double handling, trucks go where ever needed, trucks do damage to roads yes, trucks also pay huge taxes/fee`s, i would also not judge the whole industry because one mob you worked for gave drug warnings out to drivers, or an estimate by rta, my first experience with a semi was 1964, i am also passionate about this subject, i`m not sorry.

I'm by no means judging the whole industry by the actions of a few 'managers', I've worked with many truckies, and would prefer them over customers, as they're a lot more 'real' than most people - the testing however, is not stringent.

You have a tester come into the office (if truckies are doing their job properly, which most of them are) at 10am and drug test people (this has now occurred at 3 businesses that I've worked in). As long as they're testing me, and not the drivers, they're not really doing their job are they?

I guess you could further add to that, well at least they tested someone - but I'm not the one driving around in a massive truck.

[GasoLane]

Originally Posted by Sezzy

I used to work with about 40 truck drivers - I would see them on a daily basis, they for the most part would be forewarned by management that drug testing that was taking place, the sad part is...I was drug tested more times just sitting in the office organising their jobs for them...

http://www.dailyexaminer.com.au/stor...ches-truckies/

From this article this is the most disturbing part...

Research conducted by the Roads and Traffic Authority indicated as many as one in five truck drivers take methylamphetamines, such as speed, to stay alert on long trips.

Someone once tried to tell me that without trucks Australia stops...I refuse to believe it. We had a fantastic rail set up - but the likes of large trucking companies put a stop to it...(Fox et. al.). Evidently it was too expensive to change the gauges...how many people have died since as a result of this 'expense' is what I would like to ask?

The damage to the roads caused by 30-40 tonne loads is astronomical...and they think a speed camera will help it?

I know...it's completely off the topic...but I had to say it...and I get very passionate about it so I'm sorry in advance...

Posters like this just enforce my belief that God really does have a sense of humour.

OK it's off topic but.. If Sezzy (or the reporter) looked a little harder the article says that the Police "conducted 400 breath tests and more than 200 drug tests in a 36-hour period" and “We had four people who tested positive for drugs, which included three heavy vehicle drivers,”

Not exactly 1 in 5 is it ?

Originally Posted by Sezzy

Someone once tried to tell me that without trucks Australia stops...I refuse to believe it.

Wherever you are now, look around you. Everything there was (at some stage) brought by a Truck.

[SEZ213]

Once again, not disputing trucks are an integral part of Australian life, I for one would have been out of a job a long time ago if it wasn't for them (I would have driven on safer roads in south western Victoria though).

The original comment was about drugs, yes, the article is full of propaganda - but that's the whole idea of a paper. The article is also poorly written, as it doesn't say how many people, trucks or otherwise, were caught drink driving in this period. The journalist has hacked into the meatiest part of the story (in his opinion) and gone with it. The additional research regarding the RTA is an addition to the article, Journalists have an obligation to not just give a blow by blow but have some relevant information to back it up (regardless of whether they have been misled in this information by the provider - think Wheels magazine - HSV, Holden and the articles surrounding them, not to further go off topic).

[castellan]

Truck drivers have been taking drugs to keep awake for over 50 years. why! to keep awake so they don't have a crash. maybe they have saved more lives because they are on the rubbish.

But what i do know from people who drive them is they are pushed to take the drugs and there superiors do teach them how to get around all the obstacles the gov put in place.
I had a mate that lost the plot because of all speed he on. he was a interstate driver and i do believe all the people involved with his situation should be locked up. they are monsters!
But there are a lot of employers that don't care less about anything but themselves. the cunning filthy mongrels should be kicked out of the country.

[Franco Cozzo]

Everyone disputing trucks, I don't see a freight train docked in my IGA loading dock.

[Iggypoppin']

Originally Posted by castellan

Truck drivers have been taking drugs to keep awake for over 50 years. why! to keep awake so they don't have a crash. maybe they have saved more lives because they are on the rubbish.

But what i do know from people who drive them is they are pushed to take the drugs and there superiors do teach them how to get around all the obstacles the gov put in place.
I had a mate that lost the plot because of all speed he on. he was a interstate driver and i do believe all the people involved with his situation should be locked up. they are monsters!
But there are a lot of employers that don't care less about anything but themselves. the cunning filthy mongrels should be kicked out of the country.

You're not serious are you?
You think it's safe to hit a line of gear then haul 20ton of cargo 2000klms across the country...???

[302 XC]

What alot of rubbish !!!!
Truck drivers NEEDING aline to drive long distances
Seriously !!!!!!!!
My step dad was an interstate truckie near on 30 years,and never ever took the stuff
Maybe a coupla nodos,
But never any hard drugs

Its about time there was a real crack down on DUI,Influence of drugs and fatigue
They all impair your ability to drive, alter/affect your reaction time
I define ANYONE to proove me other wise

[Jim Goose]

Originally Posted by castellan

Truck drivers have been taking drugs to keep awake for over 50 years. why! to keep awake so they don't have a crash. maybe they have saved more lives because they are on the rubbish.

But what i do know from people who drive them is they are pushed to take the drugs and there superiors do teach them how to get around all the obstacles the gov put in place.
I had a mate that lost the plot because of all speed he on. he was a interstate driver and i do believe all the people involved with his situation should be locked up. they are monsters!
But there are a lot of employers that don't care less about anything but themselves. the cunning filthy mongrels should be kicked out of the country.

You seriously cant be for real?

I dunno what planey your on, but the reason why they take pills to stay awake is because they are forced to drive LONG hours (most of the time by their employers) and break the rules or its because they wanna jam in as much driving as possible to make money to pay the bills (or break even).

Pills wont keep you awake for ever.
If you think they will you got rocks in your head seriously

[3vXT]

Originally Posted by Iggypoppin'

You think it's safe to hit a line of gear then haul 20ton of cargo 2000klms across the country...???

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FDPRyP-G2fs

[Seduce XR6]

Originally Posted by 302 XC

What alot of rubbish !!!!
Truck drivers NEEDING aline to drive long distances
Seriously !!!!!!!!
My step dad was an interstate truckie near on 30 years,and never ever took the stuff
Maybe a coupla nodos,
But never any hard drugs

Its about time there was a real crack down on DUI,Influence of drugs and fatigue
They all impair your ability to drive, alter/affect your reaction time
I define ANYONE to proove me other wise

Right on Matey

While I dont agree with any driver taking any sort of drugs I do agree with what you have said here as all you have said is 100% correct & apart from all you have said drugs also affect your reasoning logic skills & if your controlling a large vehicle is just a recipe for disaster!

Now an old argument by drivers is well if we had no trucks you would have no goods etc, but that has nothing to do with drug taking or speeding or dangerous driving.

Yes we do transport most of our goods by road though it does not have to be that way as we can use rail if we improve the tracks etc & have small local trucks moving goods from rail depots to stores etc..

And we can have non drugged truck drivers doing the right thing.

Is no excuse to take drugs & kill somebody on the roads is there?
Neither money or time constraints justify this.

So no drugs for anybody in society at all let alone truck drivers ok

If you cant drive without drugs then dont!