Ford Australia manufacturing not dead

[Vormund]

Originally Posted by eb2monty

You know what? I'm looking at my old car magazines of the early eighties. It was touted back then that the XF Falcon would be the last Australian made Falcon.

This has been going on for over 30 years.

The Falcon is not dead. Get used it.

I bought a copy of Wheels June 1985 off eBay which had the scoop pics of the EA. Quite a few comments in there were interesting

This all-Australia new car (and it wasn't so long ago that virtually all Australian motoring writers and observers believed the XD would be the last truly Australian new car) invokes scepticism - maybe tinged with jealousy among the four other local car makers who would love to be able to do their own thing.

There was also mentions of EA being exported, a turbo model, and the wagons dropping leaf springs and getting coils.

[Nikked]

Originally Posted by Fiesta_Man69

Industry experts and journalists (all who are much more qualified than anyone on this forum to comment irrespective of how much you wish to deride them) have consistently said the Falcons numbers as they are now are unsustainable in the long term (which is why the EB Falcon must get picked up by fleets).

Yet, Ford Management (all who are much more qualified than anyone on this forum to comment irrespective of how much certain AFF members and journos wish to deride them) are happy to let the falcon sell, and are happy to spend money on not only the falcon, but spending money on the plant...



Lets face it, the 2014 update (one that includes all new bonnet, boot and plastic pressings, plus upgrades to the interieor and global functions) would not happen if there was no interest in the product.



Go Ford, Go Further.

[flappist]

Originally Posted by Vormund

I bought a copy of Wheels June 1985 off eBay which had the scoop pics of the EA. Quite a few comments in there were interesting



There was also mentions of EA being exported, a turbo model, and the wagons dropping leaf springs and getting coils.

Well there was a turbo model although it was "special" like the DJR and it was exported to some third world country a few thousand km east of us.

The coil springs were probably dropped dropped because they did not have the internet and therefore did not know just how many they could have sold second hand.......

[Fiesta_Man69]

Originally Posted by Joe5619

The Liberty & Maxima arn't Falcon rivals, yet the Mazda 3 is?? How did you come up with that thinking??

There's been several articles written on this. The current 3 is the size of the original VB Commodore: also people are downsizing: taking the family in cars like the 3 and the Cruze. Feel free to disagree but sales figures and market research back this up. It ain't 1995 anymore....

[Fiesta_Man69]

Originally Posted by Nikked

Yet, Ford Management (all who are much more qualified than anyone on this forum to comment irrespective of how much certain AFF members and journos wish to deride them) are happy to let the falcon sell, and are happy to spend money on not only the falcon, but spending money on the plant...



Lets face it, the 2014 update (one that includes all new bonnet, boot and plastic pressings, plus upgrades to the interieor and global functions) would not happen if there was no interest in the product.



Go Ford, Go Further.

Spending $ on the plant isn't necessarily a vote in confidence for the Falcon. The plant can manufacture more than one model.

[Buntz]

Originally Posted by Fiesta_Man69

Spending $ on the plant isn't necessarily a vote in confidence for the Falcon. The plant can manufacture more than one model.

The update is. Why don't you find another forum to try and bring Ford down?

[Nikked]

Originally Posted by Fiesta_Man69

Spending $ on the plant isn't necessarily a vote in confidence for the Falcon. The plant can manufacture more than one model.

It already does...


Falcon, Territory, Falcon ute.

[FGII-XR6]

still got the same idiots turning a positive story into a the falcon is dead story. we need a dislike button as well as a thanks button so we can tell them how stupid they really are

[Ford_The_Win]

"More than ever, our two mainstream local cars will become products of overseas design, as the Falcon gives way to a European or US-sourced product. Today's products, albeit with some extensive re-design, will soldier on for a little while yet, the Falcon in particular being due for an extensive body change next time round, but there can be no question the locally-developed, front-engine rear wheel drive family six is nearing the end of it's time in Australia."



That could have been written last week. But guess what folks, that was written in 1984. Twenty-eight years ago. CDs didn't even exist when that was written. VHS has come and gone in that time period. And yet the Falcon is still with us. Someone please put an end to the constant doomsdayers.

[Joe5619]

Originally Posted by Fiesta_Man69

There's been several articles written on this. The current 3 is the size of the original VB Commodore: also people are downsizing: taking the family in cars like the 3 and the Cruze. Feel free to disagree but sales figures and market research back this up. It ain't 1995 anymore....

Just because people are trading in Falcons & buying Mazda 3 does not mean the Mazda 3 is a competitor to Falcon. The only way for this to be true, is if the Falcon was on the shopping list of the Mazda 3 buyer in the first place & then they choose other wise. Moving market trends does not in any way mean Falcon & Mazda 3 are in the same market space as each other!! I think you are getting the 2 issues mixed up.

Also, you’re telling me it is not 1995, but then compare a VB to the current market (LOL). But you are right, if VB was new in the year 2012, then it would be a competitor for Mazda 3 of today. But the current Falcon/ Commodore is nowhere near that same size!! Just like back then the Mazda 323 (if it was around?? maybe corolla is better for this example) would have been smaller than the VB & therefore not in the same market space.

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by Ducati888

Ford doesn't have poor sales figures. It's the fourth biggest passenger car brand in Australia.

Falcon and Territory have poor sales figures. There is a clear distinction between the two.

For a company that has been, or challenged for, no1 for decades how is being number 4, soon to be no 5, a good thing.

That shows that the imported stuff isn't covering for lower Falcon sales. Territory is still doing pretty well, it was no 1 SUV last year and no 2 this year.

Originally Posted by DASH GT

Why would they shut now or 14?? They can build cars till 2016.... They have already designed an update for FG, why waste it now? Even if they don't sell stacks of cars they are better off repaying the R & D on what they already have now then walking away and losing their entire investment, or whats left to repay on it.

Exactly. There's no requirement to pull out now, they would want to make their investment in FG back.

Originally Posted by eb2monty

You know what? I'm looking at my old car magazines of the early eighties. It was touted back then that the XF Falcon would be the last Australian made Falcon.

This has been going on for over 30 years.

The Falcon is not dead. Get used it.

Originally Posted by DASH GT

I remember the media when the EF First came out... Last Falcon to be built... Your right nothings changed except people buy alot less of them then they did back then.

If Falcon was that close to being killed off all those years ago when they were selling them in numbers at least 6 or 7 times greater than they are now what does that tell you about the prediciment Falcon is in now.

The XF was the highest selling car in the country for every year it was on sale, the most successful Falcon ever and they were still going to can it for the Capricorn, based on a stretched Mazda 929 platform. Its amazing it's survived so long as it is, it can't go on forever in our domestic market, not unless they have an export plan, which god help me I hope they do.

[Buntz]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

If Falcon was that close to being killed off all those years ago when they were selling them in numbers at least 6 or 7 times greater than they are now what does that tell you about the prediciment Falcon is in now.

The XF was the highest selling car in the country for every year it was on sale, the most successful Falcon ever and they were still going to can it for the Capricorn, based on a stretched Mazda 929 platform. Its amazing it's survived so long as it is, it can't go on forever in our domestic market, not unless they have an export plan, which god help me I hope they do.

I think you can no longer see the wood for the trees Boss.

Originally Posted by Ford_The_Win

"More than ever, our two mainstream local cars will become products of overseas design, as the Falcon gives way to a European or US-sourced product. Today's products, albeit with some extensive re-design, will soldier on for a little while yet, the Falcon in particular being due for an extensive body change next time round, but there can be no question the locally-developed, front-engine rear wheel drive family six is nearing the end of it's time in Australia."



That could have been written last week. But guess what folks, that was written in 1984. Twenty-eight years ago. CDs didn't even exist when that was written. VHS has come and gone in that time period. And yet the Falcon is still with us. Someone please put an end to the constant doomsdayers.

Predicting Falcon demise for nearly thirty years and they still haven't changed their tune. Doing so now wouldn't make sense to them.

Facts are Ford has still been making the Falcon, and will continue to do so.

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by Buntz

I think you can no longer see the wood for the trees Boss.
Predicting Falcon demise for nearly thirty years and they still haven't changed their tune. Doing so now wouldn't make sense to them.

Facts are Ford has still been making the Falcon, and will continue to do so.

Are you serious

Falcon has never been in a more precarious position than it is now, at least not since the early 60's when the XK started falling apart on our roads.

It doesn't mean they don't have a plan for the future post 2016, but its very hard to see another billion dollar investment being justified for 1000 odd sales a month, unless they have an export plan.

If Detroit bualked at putting investment dollars into previous new Falcons when they sold in volumes 6 or 7 times higher than what they sell now then what do you think they might think if Ford asked for another billion dollars.

[music189]

I Still reckon Ford is going to "Aussifiy" the next Mondeo and call it a Falcon and make it here, this would continue the Ecoboost 4 cyl line ,bring back the Falcon wagon and Lets face it the Mondeo is almost as big as the Falcon these days
It would save heaps in development cost's and keep Broady going

[1TUFFUTE]

Originally Posted by DASH GT

If we had exports the Falcon would be sustainable... Obviously in the long term future it wont be just supplying Australia... If it can share a platform with say the Mustang, as well as motors / gearbox then perhaps, but with one Ford this just won't fit. I am hopeful they can still build something from the 1 Ford line up here, but it has to be exported otherwise its just not going to be feasible.

has anything been said about that sedan 4x4 being built off the ranger platform....surely with the current global demand there os no way in hell it will be built at the current ranger plants.....a possability alongside the falcon/mustang option perhaps?????

[Dr Smith]

Originally Posted by 1TUFFUTE

has anything been said about that sedan 4x4 being built off the ranger platform....surely with the current global demand there os no way in hell it will be built at the current ranger plants.....a possability alongside the falcon/mustang option perhaps?????

Do you mean the Ford Everest replacement?

[SpoolMan]

Originally Posted by Buntz

The update is. Why don't you find another forum to try and bring Ford down?

In any business venture its about sales, how much of the product you can sell.
Many people here support the brand, the support and passion we all read everyday, the only thing that will ensure any products future are sales people are not putting there hand in there pocket to buy the new Falcon.

Development costs are huge, lets say there going to make another model for eg: 2017 and beyond following current trends and say they sell 1500 units a month, 36,000 units over 2 year model run, they wont sell enough units to make any investment profitable.

This is why car manufacturers are all on global work and platforms, if there is to be any hope for the Falcon it could only be importing, although our high manufacturing costs and dollar wont help that cause.

The 4 cylinder eco boost Falcon is a large car with small car fuel costs would have loved to see this model marketed more aggressively.
It just won best large car under $60,000 I haven't seen Ford capitalise on this great motoring achievement, instead we watch John Farnham sing your the voice.

[Nikked]

Originally Posted by SpoolMan

although our high manufacturing costs and dollar wont help that cause.

Average cost of a Ford employee

$79 p/h Canada
$64 P/h U.S.,
$48 p/h Germany
$35 p/h Australia


So, we already have the cheapest labour outside Asia...just our utilities cost would be a bit more then US...

“I don’t have a specific number, but we do have factories that are lower than that,” Nair told News Limited, adding that low output alone was not a reason to close a factory.

“It’s a matter of matching capacity to demand and running it as efficiently as you can,” he said. “We don’t get into specific details of viability of any specific factories. [But] we always balance the advantage of local production with importing on every product.”

[Smoke Pursuit]

Originally Posted by Nikked

Average cost of a Ford employee

$79 p/h Canada
$64 P/h U.S.,
$48 p/h Germany
$35 p/h Australia


So, we already have the cheapest labour outside Asia...just our utilities cost would be a bit more then US...

Where do you get those figures from?

[Nikked]

Originally Posted by DASH GT

Where do you get those figures from?

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-0...e-workers.html

[FPV GTHO]

Originally Posted by Nikked

Average cost of a Ford employee

$79 p/h Canada
$64 P/h U.S.,
$48 p/h Germany
$35 p/h Australia


So, we already have the cheapest labour outside Asia...just our utilities cost would be a bit more then US...

Means little when we'd be likely to lose local production TO Asia.

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by 1TUFFUTE

has anything been said about that sedan 4x4 being built off the ranger platform....surely with the current global demand there os no way in hell it will be built at the current ranger plants.....a possability alongside the falcon/mustang option perhaps?????

Its an SUV like the terri. Its still under development but 2016 could see it ready. Just depends on demand.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by Fiesta_Man69

Spending $ on the plant isn't necessarily a vote in confidence for the Falcon. The plant can manufacture more than one model.

A lot of people will be shocked at how much internal help Falcon is getting and from where...

[Nikked]

Originally Posted by jpd80

A lot of people will be shocked at how much internal help Falcon is getting and from where...

Still won't matter...

The same old still seem to have a better idea, same old dribble...

[Smoke Pursuit]

Originally Posted by Nikked

Still won't matter...

The same old still seem to have a better idea, same old dribble...

Why don't you go out and buy one and show some support?

Put your $$$ where your mouth is like the rest of us, that's if you want Ford to continue manufacturing in Australia.

[Nikked]

Originally Posted by DASH GT

Why don't you go out and buy one and show some support?

Put your $$$ where your mouth is like the rest of us, that's if you want Ford to continue manufacturing in Australia.

Lol...the "go out an buy one" tribe.


Bit hard to rush out and buy a new car after just taking out a loan for the house and paying for a wedding...not everyone here is cashed up to rush out and buy a car on the drop of a hat. I suppose all the people with new Falcon are the only ones that can have an opinion?

Sure, if i had the money, new GS and Ranger wildtrak in the driveway.

But the missus MA mondeo and my ol' reliable EL XR6 will do the trick until then.

[jpd80]

Given the timeline of CD4 Taurus. it will be delivered in the first half of 2015,
not long after the 2014 Falcon arrives and Ford Europe receives the upgraded Mondeo.

Falcon is not going anywhere and if anything will be evolving into a more sophisticated vehicle.

[BroadyFord]

Another article from Go Auto:

LA show: Ford chief Fields Falcon questions


http://www.goauto.com.au/mellor/mell...257AC60023491F

30 November 2012
By MIKE COSTELLO in Los Angeles
RECENTLY appointed Ford global chief executive officer Mark Fields has re-affirmed the company's commitment to retaining car manufacturing in Victoria until at least 2016.

Speaking at this week's Los Angeles motor show, Mr Fields – who is tipped to take over from Alan Mulally as global chief executive in two years – also confirmed Ford Australia would still launch an upgraded Falcon by late 2014.

As reported, this facelift is expected to consist of revised, more aerodynamic front and rear styling, and a 5.3 per cent reduction in carbon emissions for the locally made inline-six engine.

The design work was funded by a $103 million federal and state government co-investment announced in January this year.

The investment is in addition to the $232 million Ford Australia has already received and used for last year’s facelifted Territory diesel and LPG-fuelled Falcon EcoLPi, and the new Falcon EcoBoost turbo-four introduced earlier this year.

Mr Fields told assembled media in LA this week that as far as head office in Dearborn, Michigan, was concerned, this arrangement still stood.

"We made an announcement recently about investment and some next-generation products in our operations down in Broadmeadows," he said.

"Those investments take place in 2014 and take the vehicle obviously through to 2016.

"There is no more news at this point but I think it's a good affirmation of our presence in Australia."

The future of Ford's Australian manufacturing arm beyond 2016 is still murky, however, with the long-time staple of local manufacturing – the rear-drive Falcon sedan – continuing to bleed sales.

Volume is down 26.2 per cent so far this year, with sales less than 20 per cent what they were 15 years ago, and the vehicle is expected to sit on global front-drive architecture and use a global V6 engine from 2016.

Ford has not yet announced it the replacement for the current Falcon will be a stand-alone design or a localisation of a global vehicle such as the Taurus or Mondeo.

Ford Australia shed 330 blue collar workers earlier this month – 212 were made redundant involuntarily – and trimmed daily production from 209 vehicles to 148, nearly half of which are the stronger-selling Territory SUV.

However, the company told GoAuto at the time that its workforce would remain at 2900 for the foreseeable future, with its "re-adjustment" of staff numbers said to have brought its level of employees into line with its declined production.

The company's local design and engineering arms remain comparatively strong, with a multi-million dollar upgrade of Ford's Victorian design centre – one of three in the world alongside Dearborn and Cologne – recently completed.

Ford Australia has played a key role in the development of the global Ranger ute and Indian-market Figo city-car, and has at least one car – a Ranger-based SUV – in the works, and also contributes to various other global programs.

[P6LTD351]

I'd love to buy a new Falcon but can't afford any new car at the moment.

I like to think I support Ford by purchasing genuine parts from my dealer when necessary and available.

That's me putting the money (that I can afford to) where my mouth is.

I don't believe you need to buy a new Falcon to have sole right in being able to foster a positive attitude on this forum in regards to Australian manufacturing.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by eb2monty

I'd love to buy a new Falcon but can't afford any new car at the moment.

I like to think I support Ford by purchasing genuine parts from my dealer when necessary and available.

That's me putting the money (that I can afford to) where my mouth is.

I don't believe you need to buy a new Falcon to have sole right in being able to foster a positive attitude on this forum in regards to Australian manufacturing.

What Ford is asking is that people who are in a position to buy a new vehicle to at least consider Falcon and Territory.
Th next best thing is supporting dealer networks through either servicing or buying genuine parts.

Good to hear you are still supporting the Ford brand by purchasing genuine parts..