'Electronic safety assistance actually makes driving more dangerous' - your thoughts?

[Sprintey]

Sounds very repetitive & a drag.

[EBSXR6]

A guy at work has a Mercedes with lane assistance.
He was saying, that lane assistance uses the rear brakes and the lane assistance wears the rear brakes out more quickly than the front.

[CyberWasp]

It has been downhill ever since they introduced the Automatic Transmission.

[kypez]

I'll just weigh in here that I love the systems on the Teslas. They're not perfect but once you know how they work and under what circumstances to use them, they're great.

Few things that need work for our roads (not limited to Tesla here) is lane Departure correction. Driving trying to avoid a dead roo, the car swerved back into the lane thinking it needed to correct the car. Could still overrule it but it was not expected behaviour. I turn it off on all my cars when driving on highways now.

Problem is the car turns it on again every restart because that is the rules.

ABS is fantastic. I never understand people saying they can out perform ABS which isn't designed to reduce stopping distances anyway. It's designed so you can still turn and control the vehicle rather than going into a skid. It also only turns on when you over brake for the surface. You can avoid triggering ABS but not out brake it because that's not its job.

Traction control and stability control are fantastic driving aids. As is power steering, vacuum assisted brakes... More good than bad out there

[Itsme]

Originally Posted by Sprintey

This begs the question: say you turn off the ones you don't like (every time...) and are in an accident, what might the response of the insurance company be?

If the car maker allows these options to be turned off, then the insurance company can do nothing if you are involved in accident, as it is not a mandatory requirement.

Cheers.

[whynot]

Classic example of the value of lane control. Dash Cam of a driver who falls asleep at wheel - Menangle Park NSW


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B0Pp...wnersAustralia

[kypez]

Originally Posted by whynot

Classic example of the value of lane control. Dash Cam of a driver who falls asleep at wheel - Menangle Park NSW





https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B0Pp...wnersAustralia

Good driving by the DC driver to get out of the way

[simon varley]

Originally Posted by Itsme

If the car maker allows these options to be turned off, then the insurance company can do nothing if you are involved in accident, as it is not a mandatory requirement.

Cheers.

as they are now part of the ANCAP/NCAP score, does that mean they can't be turned off permanently? ANCAP isn't a legal thing, but I doubt any insurer would look favorably if you did inhibit them.

[383hq]

Originally Posted by simon varley

as they are now part of the ANCAP/NCAP score, does that mean they can't be turned off permanently? ANCAP isn't a legal thing, but I doubt any insurer would look favorably if you did inhibit them.

Correct. In an effort to reduce "human error" ANCAP was written up so:

the system needs to be default ON at the start of every journey and deactivation of the system should not be possible with a momentary single push on a button.

Personally, in the real world, with such increased complexity of systems, there are now critical times when driving work load actually increases with focus shifting inside the car, not out. Single button is quick. Multiple touch screens/warning lights/beeps not so much.

[roKWiz]

Originally Posted by .:4:.

God did that, its called a neck. Then humans worked out reflections, that evolved into the invention of mirrors, then some genius automotive engineer thought it was a good idea to integrate them into automobiles. But its 2024......

So, you're saying you are one of those that only use the mirror to pull out ?

[.:4:.]

Originally Posted by roKWiz

So, you're saying you are one of those that only use the mirror to pull out ?

Nah, i do both checks.

[Electrolyte Burns]

Haven't driven a vehicle with any of the mentioned assistance aids. Doesn't sound like I want to either.

[Top_Ghia]

For anyone judging all these systems from cars that are 2, 3, 4 years old or longer, you may need to reconsider your views.
These systems are constantly being refined, improved and recalibrated.
Todays Ford Ranger for example is miles ahead of a 2022 Ranger despite them being identical cars on paper. Todays lane keep system is far more subtle and less intrusive. You no longer feel like you are fighting it.
I used to hate all these systems but now tend to just leave them on as I now believe they do more good that harm.
There are exceptions and all are not created equal. Some other brands autonomous emergency braking does have a habit of jamming the brakes on at 100km/h because a butterfly flapped it’s wings 4 post codes away or a leaf blew across the road. But even that seems to be improving.

The one place I would turn off the lane keep system is a windy country road. Particularly if I’m in the mood for some more spirited driving.

I’d generally never turn off stability control or traction control as I’m too old for burnouts. And todays systems are very good, particularly on high performance cars as they tend to give you a certain amount of slip or sideways action, and intervention is now pretty smooth unless things are getting pretty ugly.

[Top_Ghia]

Originally Posted by EBSXR6

A guy at work has a Mercedes with lane assistance.
He was saying, that lane assistance uses the rear brakes and the lane assistance wears the rear brakes out more quickly than the front.

I’d bet real money that is not the case. The lane assist would function through the electric power steering.

It is possible that some functions of the stability control or traction control use individual brakes to manipulate the attitude of the car to either initiate or eliminate a slide. This is common in some sports cars that have a sport or drift setting in the stability control.
I’m not aware of any cars using brakes for lane keeping duty.

[kypez]

Originally Posted by Top_Ghia

I’d bet real money that is not the case. The lane assist would function through the electric power steering.

It is possible that some functions of the stability control or traction control use individual brakes to manipulate the attitude of the car to either initiate or eliminate a slide. This is common in some sports cars that have a sport or drift setting in the stability control.
I’m not aware of any cars using brakes for lane keeping duty.

But his mate said so!

You're 100% spot on btw

[jgmdat]

Originally Posted by Top_Ghia

I’d bet real money that is not the case. The lane assist would function through the electric power steering.

It is possible that some functions of the stability control or traction control use individual brakes to manipulate the attitude of the car to either initiate or eliminate a slide. This is common in some sports cars that have a sport or drift setting in the stability control.
I’m not aware of any cars using brakes for lane keeping duty.

My wifes AMG 45s slows the car as part of the lane keeping function, it is actually annoying.

[Toiler]

Originally Posted by Top_Ghia

I’d bet real money that is not the case. The lane assist would function through the electric power steering.

It is possible that some functions of the stability control or traction control use individual brakes to manipulate the attitude of the car to either initiate or eliminate a slide. This is common in some sports cars that have a sport or drift setting in the stability control.
I’m not aware of any cars using brakes for lane keeping duty.

From a risk of something going wrong point of view (electric gremlins) - what can cause the most damage - steering or rear brakes? IMO rear brakes a lot safer way to do it.

[kypez]

Originally Posted by Toiler

From a risk of something going wrong point of view (electric gremlins) - what can cause the most damage - steering or rear brakes? IMO rear brakes a lot safer way to do it.

Braking the rear brakes to hold it in lane makes no sense. Stability control slide to keeping in a lane are two very different events.

[Toiler]

Originally Posted by kypez

Braking the rear brakes to hold it in lane makes no sense. Stability control slide to keeping in a lane are two very different events.

You are thinking like an engineer . . think like a car company lawyer looking at potential liability :-)

[kypez]

Originally Posted by Toiler

You are thinking like an engineer . . think like a car company lawyer looking at potential liability :-)

On the Everest and Tesla, it definitely turns the steering. On our old Mercedes, it turned the steering too to keep it in its lane.

The rear brakes activated if you slid out the rear (like on track or low friction surfaces).

[minheim]

2018 escape titanium with tech pack here. I really appreciate the adaptive cruise control, blind spot monitoring, rear cross traffic alert, auto dipping high beam, and auto wipers. Lane keeping works fine enough for me. I would love my daughter's next car to have these features. I haven't made any use of the auto parking but I guess I will one day but it is not on my must have list as the rear camera and sensors provide enough help

[simon varley]

auto park is a bit of fun, but try it first when nobody is around

[Syndrome]

I agree as I know I can take more liberties with these safety devices.

[383hq]

Was the original post due the autonomous vehicle burnt sacrifice in SF?
I'm sure they're good most of the time...

https://youtu.be/88lK8L_RvpA?si=AV5UO8rVLUs-F--j

[Charliewool]

Originally Posted by Syndrome

I agree as I know I can take more liberties with these safety devices.

Agree… Free hands to hold your stubby and text

[Syndrome]

QUOTE FUNCTION NOT WORKING AGAIN

No and no Charliewool.

[Sprintey]

Journo cops a prang via brake assist:

https://www.carsguide.com.au/car-new...ssion-with-new

[fatgas]

Originally Posted by Syndrome

QUOTE FUNCTION NOT WORKING AGAIN

No and no Charliewool.

You're right, up until now I couldn't quote.


Anyway, these electronic aids generate a false sense of security and cause the driver to abrogate any personal responsibility and defensive driving skills they may have. It turns already shit drivers into rolling hazards.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by fatgas

You're right, up until now I couldn't quote.


Anyway, these electronic aids generate a false sense of security and cause the driver to abrogate any personal responsibility and defensive driving skills they may have. It turns already shit drivers into rolling hazards.

Works a treat with flog drivers on the road, got someone good by making their AEB jam on the freeway with an abrupt no indicator lane change on purpose

The thing got on the picks so hard, works mint on people driving like flogs, use their own car against them.

[kevino]

Be careful with that
Some will stand on quick
My Skoda saved my bacon with aeb when an l plater changed into my lane heading for my bonnet on the freeway
The aeb on my Puma sometimes prefers to just flash a pre collision alert rather than slam the brakes on most of the time in which case you might get a broken spine trying that manouevre