Crash. Old car versus...old car...

[irish2]

Originally Posted by Agent86

Ol mate driving the EK needs a big pat on the back for being so calm under pressure.

Sadly, that incident was due to driver innatention.

Its a large risk on any run, especially one as sizeable as bright was.
I see the concertina effect like that almost daily around melbourne.
Its a shame thatit ocoured but its avoidable.

Glad to hear all were ok though and damn its great to see someone actually take the time to assist/ check on people after an incident. Too many just drive on like nothing happened.

Govco disagree. If the falcon was traveling at 10km/h, the crash wouldn't have happened, and therefore this accident is speed related.

[Agent86]

F word govco.
The people that push the propoganda on us, are uni educated, book and statistically full people who areincapable of seeing reality, much less acknowledging it.

[Olbucko]

Originally Posted by MAGPIE

Good example of why you should pull off the road onto the shoulder when wanting to turn right off a rural road.

How do you determine if the shoulder is safe to drive on, is it wide enough, does it have a drain hidden under the long grass? stop on the edge of the road here and a truck is likely to take the side off your car. Many roads around here don't even have shoulders - daft idea. The safest way to turn on a rural road is to indicate well in advance, slow down gradually making sure that the driver behind you is aware that you intend to turn. If you see that the driver behind you is not paying attention to your signals abort your turn rather than cause an accident.
I drive on rural roads every day delivering mail and have to turn off at unmarked driveways every km or so. You can't be to carefull. And pulling back onto the road can be just as dangerous.
The B Doubles and the timber trucks around here don't want to stop for anyone.

[galaxy xr8]

How close was the Val (I think) in front of the XY behind the car infront of it, (the Blue thing), Both of them that XY and the Val were both travelling way to close on an open road.

[pottery beige]

i wont even weigh into the old car new car bs.. in any car this could have been a whole heap worse..

btw looks like its on ACA tonight......

[TC200six]

Originally Posted by pottery beige

btw looks like its on ACA tonight......

Wouldn't surprise me. They do an in-car camera story every month or so.

[TC200six]

http://aca.ninemsn.com.au/article.aspx?id=8564435

Article on A Current Affair's website

[Jim Goose]

Originally Posted by galaxy xr8

How close was the Val (I think) in front of the XY behind the car infront of it, (the Blue thing), Both of them that XY and the Val were both travelling way to close on an open road.

I was thinking the same... but is the blue car turning right to go into the dirt driveway on the left? And watching it closely I honestly cant see if the blue car is indicating.... it may be a case that the blue car suddenly slowed down for the driveway and didnt indicate. The Val (with brakes we all know arent the best) has locked it up and kept it straight... meanwhile the XY driver went... "oh darn".... when you compare how poorly these old cars brake when compared to more modern cars which have ABS, you really have to maintain a larger gap between the car in front.

But it just shows how quickly a fun day crusing (or any drive for that matter) can turn pear shaped. Count the seconds you have to react when you see the GT emerge from the smoke!

[JimStone]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CgjtSilW8yM

Now thats out of my system, props to the EK driver - keeping calm in these conditions make all the difference. I have been fortunate enough to drive around a simmilar situation, only in my case I was driving the RS2000 and it was a 40 tonne B-double jack knifing across my lane.

[XR Martin]

Yeah those old cars are so tough. It hit an Excel (edit: after a closer look im not sure if its an Excel or not?)

[2011G6E]

Originally Posted by JimStone

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CgjtSilW8yM

Now thats out of my system, props to the EK driver - keeping calm in these conditions make all the difference. I have been fortunate enough to drive around a simmilar situation, only in my case I was driving the RS2000 and it was a 40 tonne B-double jack knifing across my lane.

Holy snappin duck crap...that old Commodore folded up didn't it.
Then I read the description...""Special testing of new facility in 1992. Car was loaded with 375 Kg /827 lb of sand and was 100Kmh into a solid wall not alloy honeycomb. Not a real test of the car."

Take a new FG or VE and try that...I would lay money on pretty much the same thing happening, especially as studies have shown that an impact with a solid object (bridge pilon, big tree, wall, etc) at 80kph or above is "basically unsurvivable".

[Trevor 57]

Old cars just ain't that good, my wife wasn't so happy with the XP after this - DOH!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=joMK1WZjP7g

[TC200six]

Originally Posted by XR6 Martin

Yeah those old cars are so tough. It hit an Excel :

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Gosh, that looks nasty.

That reminds me of a thread that appeared on here nearly 5 years ago with a picture of an XW or XY ute that was completely torn up (the front end was completely separated from the rest of the vehicle). I tried a search and can't find anything. From what I remember, the driver somehow survived.

[XR Martin]

Lexus vs Pontiac Lemans.... Airbags didnt even need to deploy...

[Ben73]

Originally Posted by XR6 Martin

Yeah those old cars are so tough. It hit an Excel (edit: after a closer look im not sure if its an Excel or not?)

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lol gotta love the way the peoples faces were edited out.
I think I my do this in the future.

Sucks about the car though.


Pulling onto the left shoulder to turn right is a good way to get out of every bodies way, but then you have to watch oncoming traffic and traffic in your mirror, which is just putting your risk of a crash back into the high bracket.

[mickbundy]

Don't see any of the usual Holden Bogen type comments that are usually here. Hard when the fact is for real aye even us Ford drivers mess up and it is captured on video.Could you imagine if it was the other way round ?. In saying this we are all capable of messing up with in attention and yes I have been caught out so I am not the perfect driver. Just glad no one was hurt in this bad situation,Sad for the cars but glad for the people. So all take care

[2011G6E]

I remember that one with the Pontiac...someone pointed out that the car that t-boned it vaulted the traffic island and went in above the sill. Any modern car would behave pretty much the same if hit square on like that, especially a two door with a long door. Note the sill is still pretty much straight, so the chassis wasn't hit at it's strongest point.

Guess it's all down to the luck of the draw where you get hit...

[XR Martin]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

I remember that one with the Pontiac...someone pointed out that the car that t-boned it vaulted the traffic island and went in above the sill. Any modern car would behave pretty much the same if hit square on like that, especially a two door with a long door. Note the sill is still pretty much straight, so the chassis wasn't hit at it's strongest point.

Guess it's all down to the luck of the draw where you get hit...

Wonder how long it would take you to chime in. You just dont realise how weak old cars are. Just because the outer 'appearance' panels are thicker, doesnt mean the structure underneath is.

Side impact tests dont hit the floor/sill area. And you can bet the Lexus wasnt going anywhere near 31mph/50kmh

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m_PPeB-FNVo

[Ford_The_Win]

Originally Posted by XR6 Martin

Wonder how long it would take you to chime in. You just dont realise how weak old cars are. Just because the outer 'appearance' panels are thicker, doesnt mean the structure underneath is.

Side impact tests dont hit the floor/sill area.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m_PPeB-FNVo

Exactly. 2011G6E, you can gloss over the evidence if it makes you feel better, but the fact remains. Old cars look and sound nice, and bring back a lot of happy memories for a lot of people, but they're weak as wet toilet paper in any kind of accident in comparison to a newer vehicle.

[noosacuda]

Originally Posted by MAGPIE

Good example of why you should pull off the road onto the shoulder when wanting to turn right off a rural road.

Turn right from the left,WTF??? You WOULD have to a Victorian!

[stevz]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

I wonder how the crash would have turned out if you were not in an EK, but instead in a nice little 5 star rated Kia or something and had a virtual head on like that with a solid old XY...?

The accident was more of a sideswipe than a head on collision. If it was a true head on collision there probably wouldn't have been any survivors.
Face it... cars of this era, especially the EK, have the safety characteristics of a wooden billy cart and you would have to be insanely naive to believe otherwise.

[Trevor 57]

Originally Posted by noosacuda

Turn right from the left,WTF??? You WOULD have to a Victorian!

It is a recomended practice in rural roads, I used to be an advanced driver trainer and it makes a lot of logical sense to pull of the road to the left, wait for 'all' traffic to clear then make the turn, for all the reasons shown in the very first video.

I was involved in a re-enactment of a road accident where 2 kids in one car and a bloke in another car were killed, bottom line was that the car was stopped against the white line to turn right into a minor road off a major highway, was rear ended by an idiot truck driver who then shunted the car into oncoming traffic, killing 2 kids in the car turning right, and the bloke coming the other way, I drove a replica of the offending truck in the re-enactment, if the driver had pulled to the left to wait for the trucks to go past and all traffic to clear there would have been no accident

As a former farm pick-up milk tanker driver, I used to do this all the time on busy roads where there was enough verge to do it. It is logical.

[DJR-351]

I know the older cars are not as safe by todays standards, but for personal driving pleasure, i will take an old classic over the new white goods anyday....

[gtxb67]

can there be a realistic test between new and old cars
no one in their right mind will ever doubt that new cars are much safer in an accident, but how can a 30-40 year old car truly represent how it was when brand new
things like metal fatigue, rust, undetected damage and previous repairs will certainly make an old car much more dangerous now than it was when brand new

there can never be a brand new old car to crash test into a new car - so why bother comparing apples to oranges

if you plan on crashing, drive a new car - if you want a driving experience that is unforgettable, run the risk of someone hitting you

Originally Posted by noosacuda

Turn right from the left,WTF??? You WOULD have to a Victorian!

yep, it makes it much safer in some traffic conditions - it is a pity making things genuinely safer creates too much confusion for the average earthling
simple things are apparently too hard for some people

[2011G6E]

Originally Posted by XR6 Martin

Yeah those old cars are so tough. It hit an Excel (edit: after a closer look im not sure if its an Excel or not?)

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Correct me if I'm wrong...but I don't even see a crumple in the roof of that XY, something that's very common with modern cars in even fairly low speed solid impacts. I also think you could very likely still open the passenger side doors...another thing that become a problem with more modern vehicles in front corner impacts like that XY had.

I don't doubt that airbags and anti-lock brakes have made a huge difference...it's just that modern cars are made to be very flimsy by comparison. I'd just like my large FG G6E that somehow weighs well over 1700kg even with all the light alloys and thin sheet metal, to have thicker panels than the fifty year old Morris Minor we used to have, and to be able to more or less shrug off minor impacts without having to pay a panel beater many thousands of dollars...

[Agent86]

You dont see the minor crimples in the roof but they will be thwre.
Modern cars use everything as sacrificial energy absorbsion zones to maintain integrity in the passenger compartment.

I love my old cars, but ive seen too many minor incidents with unacceptable intrusion into the cabin.

[aussie muscle]

Originally Posted by The Yeti

yes and the bigger danger would be falling asleap at the wheel casue the late model cars are so booring

dude, sell that corolla! i've got a modern car, but i wouldn't call it boring.

Originally Posted by MAGPIE

Good example of why you should pull off the road onto the shoulder when wanting to turn right off a rural road.

huh? isn't that illegal? you have to make right turns from the right-most lane in your direction, not from the left shoulder. I'm sure it was just a momentary lapse in concentration (all it takes).

[OzJavelin]

I've twice had a similar brake lockup with my '69 Javelin on my own street (80km/h zone) because of cars heading toward me on the wrong side of the road (winding, rural road .. people like to admire the view). Very scarey, and despite attempting to pulse the brakes, etc I ended up sideways on the wrong side of the road. Luckily both times I somehow missed the other car. Old cars passive safety sucks .. eg. lack of ABS, ESC, etc ..

Driving my C-Body (i.e. fullsized American sixties car) wouldn't have been much better. Brakes probably are about the same (bigger car but bigger brakes), but driving dynamics are worse. They are a unibody car - and are actually very strong (in non-pillarless form) - but the strength isn't designed around driver safety .. it's more about stopping rattles and squeaks, how doors shut, etc. A C-body Mopar would probably make a mess of a small modern car, but typically what it would hit these days out my way is something bigger, SUV etc. I know I'd come of second best.

[noosacuda]

Well pardon my ignorance then! I've only had my licence for 32 years and have NEVER heard of that before. Except in Melbourne city because of the trams.

[karj]

Yeah it's been a practice on rural roads for many years, much in the same way that you would complete a u-turn.

This incident happened a couple of years ago when Abbott's driver went to complete a right turn off a highway from the right side of the road rather than pulling over to the left and waiting for traffic to clear.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-7pa82PUc9w