2010 TDCI Powershift problems - Page 2

manchu · 01-03-2016, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bundybear75

Has it logged a fault code or is the check engine light on? Do you have a tame mechanic mate who could scan it and check? (don't reset code though)

A vehicle that age with that many km has to have a warranty, take it back to them and see what they say. If they start the muck around then start making suggestions. Give them a chance first.

Good luck with it.

cheers. I think I'll need the good luck. I guess I'm already lucky on 2 counts...1) it was not bought privately, 2) the fault appeared it warranty period.

No lights or warnings at the moment. The "Trans Limited Function" warning went away after car restart. I'm sure my regular ind. mechanic will scan and check if I ask, but I need to be prepared for a laugh cos he told me to buy a Subaru!.

As a used car bought from a dealer it will have the 3month/5000km statutory warranty. I'm just not sure how to make sure I don't get stuffed around by the dealer with an intermittent fault.

Mondaveo · 01-03-2016, 01:48 PM

Sucks to hear that. I had a TS Astra that went a bit like that - independent mechanic didn't service to the book and omitted the timing belt renewal, a 60,000km/5yr interval item. If the belt snaps in service you'll destroy the engine so I was none too happy to learn about it; I was out to about 75,000km and 7yrs before I realised and had it rectified.

Maybe once your OBD tool gets here, you'll have a shot at identifying the intermittent issue since you'll be able to monitor it all the time when driving.

Of course the Subaru is the mechanic's recommendation, you have to service them 6-monthly!

rondeo · 01-03-2016, 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by manchu

cheers. I think I'll need the good luck. I guess I'm already lucky on 2 counts...1) it was not bought privately, 2) the fault appeared it warranty period.

No lights or warnings at the moment. The "Trans Limited Function" warning went away after car restart. I'm sure my regular ind. mechanic will scan and check if I ask, but I need to be prepared for a laugh cos he told me to buy a Subaru!.

As a used car bought from a dealer it will have the 3month/5000km statutory warranty. I'm just not sure how to make sure I don't get stuffed around by the dealer with an intermittent fault.

I'd take a photo of any "Trans Limited Function" warning including the odometer. Maybe consider getting an independent opinion from Ford, at least ask Ford if their system can see any 'historic' codes that Mazda service can't? A friend bought a new subaru and the DPF had to be replaced within 12 months.

manchu · 01-03-2016, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rondeo

I'd take a photo of any "Trans Limited Function" warning including the odometer. Maybe consider getting an independent opinion from Ford, at least ask Ford if their system can see any 'historic' codes that Mazda service can't?

Will definitely snap a pic next time. Annoyed I didn't the first. I'll get my mechanic check codes before it goes back to the dealer on Monday. Might consider getting ford to take a look if need be.

An interesting fact is that in the 4 days between me signing and taking delivery a new service stamp appeared in the book. 2,500km early and says "oil & filter change only". I asked at delivery and was told 'all our used cars get an oil change before we hand over'.

I didn't think much of it, but now I'll call BS. The stamp is from a 3rd party transmission specialist, and the dealer workshop would be capable of doing an oil change. I called the 3rd party, but they were not willing to give any information.

I suspect they experienced the fault before delivery, got it checked out and either couldn't diagnose or knew it was stuffed so kept quiet. Either way I think they've been deceitful, which isn't un-expected I guess.

rondeo · 01-03-2016, 03:40 PM

Any visible contamination of the transmission fluid filter by particles of plastic or metal would be good evidence of a serious issue. Might be an idea to change the fluid and take a look?

OK didn't see your last post. So the fluid has been changed?

Groomy · 01-03-2016, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rondeo

Any visible contamination of the transmission fluid filter by particles of plastic or metal would be good evidence of a serious issue. Might be an idea to change the fluid and take a look?

Does anyone know why there might be metal in the clutch pack oil?
Surely the thing that's going to degrade in the clutch is the friction material?
Is it a case of the friction material being completely worn away so the clutch is metal on metal? (surely that's going to slip like hell - especially when you're lubricating the situation!)

manchu · 01-03-2016, 03:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rondeo

Any visible contamination of the transmission fluid filter by particles of plastic or metal would be good evidence of a serious issue. Might be an idea to change the fluid and take a look?

OK didn't see your last post. So the fluid has been changed?

Not sure if your post is for me or someone else. (I probably shouldn't have hijacked the thread, but didn't want to start another powershift problem thread!).

anyway..I don't know if there's contamination.

No..according to the co. that did the 60,000km service the fluid wasn't changed.

Deo · 01-03-2016, 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by manchu

but didn't want to start another powershift problem thread!

Until you've established what codes you have, you may have different problem from the OP. (who never came back...) Also, your problem is mostly a commercial one - how to make the Mazda dealer pay for the repair.

Quote:

Originally Posted by manchu

No..according to the co. that did the 60,000km service the fluid wasn't changed.

Rondeo was inferring from your post that the trans specialist may have changed the oil after you signed the contract. Sometimes that's all the problem is.

Sent from my GTi-9305 using bloody Tapatalk

Deo · 01-03-2016, 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Groomy

Does anyone know why there might be metal in the clutch pack oil?
Surely the thing that's going to degrade in the clutch is the friction material?
Is it a case of the friction material being completely worn away so the clutch is metal on metal? (surely that's going to slip like hell - especially when you're lubricating the situation!)

Rondeo said plastic OR metal. Also, there is only one fluid system, so the metal could be from elsewhere such as the gears.

Sent from my GTi-9305 using bloody Tapatalk

manchu · 01-03-2016, 04:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deo

Rondeo was inferring from your post that the trans specialist may have changed the oil after you signed the contract. Sometimes that's all the problem is.

Maybe they did but they weren't keen on telling me.

The note in service book said Oil, not Fluid, so I assumed it was engine not trans. And their stamp was on the 75,000km page which doesn't have trans service.

Groomy · 01-03-2016, 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deo

Rondeo said plastic OR metal. Also, there is only one fluid system, so the metal could be from elsewhere such as the gears.

Sent from my GTi-9305 using bloody Tapatalk

My Clutch pack apparently has metal in the oil..
(I resurrected the thread this week)

The clutch is a sealed and separate unit from the gears, so unless there's hoses connecting the gearbox to the clutch pack I don't think the metal could possibly be the gears.

Groomy · 01-03-2016, 04:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by manchu

Maybe they did but they weren't keen on telling me.

The note in service book said Oil, not Fluid, so I assumed it was engine not trans. And their stamp was on the 75,000km page which doesn't have trans service.

I've read elsewhere that the clutch oil is ~$300, so you'd definitely notice it if it were done in a service!

rondeo · 01-03-2016, 05:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by manchu

Maybe they did but they weren't keen on telling me.

The note in service book said Oil, not Fluid, so I assumed it was engine not trans. And their stamp was on the 75,000km page which doesn't have trans service.

If I've been following this correctly, the transmission should now be given a fluid and filter change, since there is some doubt about it having been done.
Just who would do it etc is the question?

Binny · 01-03-2016, 10:58 PM

@manchu
So let me get this straight. The RACV mechanic admitted to not changing the trans fluid at the 60k service, has records of the owner bringing back with transmission issues in the following 10,000km but still never changed the trans fluid? Sounds like a great workshop! The transmission fluid needs changing ASAP.
There is no way that the dealer changed the trans fluid. They wouldn't spend 50 bucks on tranny fluid after you have signed the dotted line let alone the $200+ that powershift fluid costs. Not that a Mazda dealer would even know how to change the fluid on a Powershift. They are referring to changing the engine oil. Which leads me to -
They change the oil in all used cars out of the goodness of their heart to give you warm fuzzies that it has been serviced. But I can guarantee they didn't use the correct Ford spec oil. They would have used whatever cheap **** they get in bulk. If you don't want to end up with DPF issues as well I would get it changed ASAP. Come to think of it the RACV "mechanic" probably hasn't been using the correct oil either.
The car came with a statutory warranty so don't take any **** from the dealer. Hound them until you get outcome you are entitled to.

Good Luck

manchu · 01-03-2016, 11:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rondeo

If I've been following this correctly, the transmission should now be given a fluid and filter change, since there is some doubt about it having been done.
Just who would do it etc is the question?

I really don't know.

The service stamp 2 days prior to me taking delivery says "oil and filter only", but it's by a transmission specialist so I think there's a good chance it was Trans fluid change, in an (unsuccessful) attempt to resolve the problem.

If it hasn't been done yet and dealer can fix issue without fluid renew then I guess I'll have to do it.

manchu · 01-03-2016, 11:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Binny

@manchu
So let me get this straight. The RACV mechanic admitted to not changing the trans fluid at the 60k service, has records of the owner bringing back with transmission issues in the following 10,000km but still never changed the trans fluid? Sounds like a great workshop! The transmission fluid needs changing ASAP.
There is no way that the dealer changed the trans fluid. They wouldn't spend 50 bucks on tranny fluid after you have signed the dotted line let alone the $200+ that powershift fluid costs. Not that a Mazda dealer would even know how to change the fluid on a Powershift. They are referring to changing the engine oil. Which leads me to -
They change the oil in all used cars out of the goodness of their heart to give you warm fuzzies that it has been serviced. But I can guarantee they didn't use the correct Ford spec oil. They would have used whatever cheap **** they get in bulk. If you don't want to end up with DPF issues as well I would get it changed ASAP. Come to think of it the RACV "mechanic" probably hasn't been using the correct oil either.
The car came with a statutory warranty so don't take any **** from the dealer. Hound them until you get outcome you are entitled to.

Good Luck

RACV man says the owner requested to not change fluid at 60kkm. God knows why, but the shouldnt have stamped the logbook!

I'm not yet ruling out that the Trans fluid was just changed as the book was stamped by a tranny place not the dealer.

It's all very fishy, and frustrating that I can't get the full records or talk to previous owner.

I'll try my best at hounding the dealer. I'm booked in for Monday but think I'll pay them a visit before so it's clear what is already known and what actions are planned.

I'm also tempted to suggest they just refund me then flog the car off at the auctions. It could be best option for both parties, But I think I'm dreaming.

manchu · 02-03-2016, 01:36 PM

I've decided to fork out $160 and get Ford to carry out Inspection and Report prior to handing the car over the Mazda dealer.

If the report indicates what constitutes a 'major failure' I will be seeking a refund, in lieu of repair. I believe this should be possible under Australian Consumer Law. How likely that is remains to be seen.

manchu · 03-03-2016, 10:05 AM

So I took the car to Ford for inspection and the result wasn't good.

No fault code was stored, so there's no way to know what's wrong. They scanned while I waited and after a chat I decided not to proceed with full inspection/report because it would be somewhat pointless.

His recommendation was to drive as much as possible and if the fault occurs to drive straight to a mechanic (preferably ford) so they can scan while car is still running and fault is active.

I mentioned I'd ordered a scanner so I could monitor myself, but he wasn't sure a cheap scanner would read transmission fault codes. Even if it does and I make note of the code I'm not sure the dealer will be willing to fork out for repairs based on my diagnosis.

So...what to do? I guess I'll still take it into the dealer on Monday, but fully expect them to find nothing and say there's nothing to fix.

Deo · 03-03-2016, 11:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rondeo

the transmission should now be given a fluid and filter change, since there is some doubt about it having been done.

Sent from my GTi-9305 using bloody Tapatalk

rondeo · 03-03-2016, 12:23 PM

manchu,

Another possibility is that TCMs PCMs etc may be 'provoked by the customer' (exact phrase from Ford TSB document, although not relating to TCM but PCM). In other words, is it possible you were driving in a manner not completely followed by the TCM, and it was confused? A glitch in other word? Just another possibilty. Speculation.

Powershift fluid changes are mandatory and critical at 60000km.

Powershift transmissions are not like the old 'slushboxes' (300000km + without a change).

Maybe you should point the above out to the dealer and suggest that there is no evidence it was done. Maybe Ford would give you some confirmation of the seriousness of missing Fluid change.

If there is still any doubt: Get a Fluid/filter change.

manchu · 03-03-2016, 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rondeo

manchu,
is it possible you were driving in a manner not completely followed by the TCM, and it was confused? A glitch in other word? Just another possibilty. Speculation.
.

Yes it's possible. I'd been playing around with D, S and manual shifts. Nothing severe, but it may have been 'confusing'.

But, the servicer told me "That car had a known transmission problem, it wasn't resolved and that's why it was traded", which makes me think it's likely to be a legitimate fault. That or the previous owner also drove in a confusing manner.

rondeo · 03-03-2016, 01:30 PM

I should stress the purely speculative nature of my 'computer gear clash' remarks, if as you say there was an unresolved issue, it's unlikley to be 'customer provoked'

I can't believe no-one can say if the fluid was changed or not.

Given the history of problems and no evidence of a vital service would not the dealer make a good will offer to pay for a fluid change? Ford should be able to inspect the filter and sieve the fluid without extra cost?

Sorry can't suggest anything more helpful.

manchu · 03-03-2016, 06:51 PM

I'm currently stranded in Donvale (VIC). Limited function apparently means No drive at all!!

Called RACV in hope that they'll be able to read code before I try restart.

If anyone with scanner is near Donvale and wants to help shoot me a message. Slab of your choice! Within reason.

bundybear75 · 03-03-2016, 07:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by manchu

I'm currently stranded in Donvale (VIC). Limited function apparently means No drive at all!!

Called RACV in hope that they'll be able to read code before I try restart.

If anyone with scanner is near Donvale and wants to help shoot me a message. Slab of your choice! Within reason.

Sorry to hear this. When mine stopped, it logged a code and went into limp mode when I restarted it. The CEL stayed on. That's when I took it to Ford.

Interestingly, when I used the cruise control whilst in limp mode, I got a transmission over temp alarm and was told by the display to turn off cruise.

Good luck with it.

manchu · 03-03-2016, 08:21 PM

RACV came, with scanner, but he switched car off before reading code!

There was a code (U0415) present, but his scanner said it was ABS system.

Car seemed to be fine after restart but died again just down the road. Unfortunately RACV man had just left, so I called again but put and back of the que.

manchu · 03-03-2016, 08:55 PM

Take 2 with RACV. Still no code even if left running. All warnings gone from dash after restart. Drove 20m, Very rough auto shift, shortly followed by warning msg.

That's the first time Trans actually felt funny.

Waiting for the tow truck. At least now I'm not worried about reproducing the fault!

Binny · 03-03-2016, 10:01 PM

Well yeah that sucks. But with a glass half full it's good that it has happened now and you have some documented evidence and RACQ as a witness to the problems while it is still under warranty.
I would be urging the dealer to send it to Ford or a transmission specialist that knows powershifts. Mazda won't have a clue what to do with it.

Good luck with it all Manchu.

manchu · 03-03-2016, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Binny

Well yeah that sucks. But with a glass half full it's good that it has happened now and you have some documented evidence and RACQ as a witness to the problems while it is still under warranty.
I would be urging the dealer to send it to Ford or a transmission specialist.

Yep it sucks but to me this is a much better scenario than the once off intermittent fault.

I will be urging dealer to give me a refund, or at least suggesting I'd take one if they offered. Before they start pouring $$ into it. Wishful thinking?

manchu · 08-03-2016, 09:04 AM

The dealer GM called with an update yesterday as promised.

Ford couldn't reproduce the fault but have suggested the 'master computer' needs replacing, so I figure he means the TCM. Apparently all seems fine otherwise, including fluid level and condition. So, it looks like I'll be getting a new TCM and he also agreed that new fluid/filter would be done.

ope126 · 08-03-2016, 10:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by manchu

The dealer GM called with an update yesterday as promised.

Ford couldn't reproduce the fault but have suggested the 'master computer' needs replacing, so I figure he means the TCM. Apparently all seems fine otherwise, including fluid level and condition. So, it looks like I'll be getting a new TCM and he also agreed that new fluid/filter would be done.

That's a positive outcome...