Why drive a 4wd in the city? - Page 2

LTDHO · 03-03-2011, 08:50 AM

If one doesn't drive ones Lexus through the city, they one doesn't receive the due respect the one deserves.

CODSASR · 03-03-2011, 08:59 AM

All I see so far is

Pro 4x4= Its my choice and its a free country (superiority complex?)

Against 4x4= genuine list of reasons (not going to list them all there are too many)

JC · 03-03-2011, 09:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sudszy

I don’t see that whether people go off road or not should be a criteria or justification for using them in our suburbs.
If I drive my leopard tank around in the bush because its the only vehicle that can survive the terrain I like to destroy(and I only want to pay one lot of rego), should l therefore be inflicting my choice on the rest of society on public roads?

Not wishing to single out anyone here, but these statements from XB GS 351 provide the attitudes that should make review of 4wds on our roads an urgent priority.

Sorry, its everyone’s business what you do and the effect that it has on safety on public roads.

Really, so your wife can parallel park the thing without a shop window to assist? One aspect which would half the number of these things on the road would be to institute a licences category for vehicles with a mass over 1.8 tonnes, that means taking the test in a vehicle of that size and seeing if you can safely drive the thing, that would at least get rid of most of the soccer moms and dads who just scraped through their test in a barina or something.

Yeh, get great visibility out of the cab of a Kenworth too, the problem is that you reduce visibility for car drivers in traffic, we cant see what is in front of you when you choose to drop into our lane or what is approaching us on the left or right when you position yourself parallel to us at T intersections and the like.
It may be just my imagination, that its 4wd vehicles that don’t seem to pay any attention to what is happening in front, they don’t see someone ahead signalling to turn right and get stuck behind them, especially at lights. Combined with the fact that we cant see the indicator(or brake lights) of the car infront of it due to the mobile eclipse phenomenon of the 4wd it causes great traffic flow and further safety problems.
Oh, but what about trucks they are worse I hear the dimwits cry. Simple fact is there aren’t as many of them(we need them) and they aren’t increasing exponentially like 4wds numbers

There you go, the prevalent attitude, idiots, mentally deficient people drive smaller cars and cause all the accidents....Ill show em whose boss!

None of which is any justification for driving one in suburbia, you could always just hire one when you go on holidays.

Again, at the expense of the rest of the public

More of the same......... why not put metal spikes all around it as well, that will protect your further.

Further evidence that they make conditions unsafe for the rest of us.

Governments have allowed this cult to get out of control, there are a number of things we could do to stop it, Ive got a few ideas, anyone else want to share some ideas on effective ways of controlling the number of these things on our roads?

Are you serious? I hope not - that is nearly the worst attitude have have come across on these forums.

The roads are shared by everything from bicycles to mack trucks, and everything in between. The key to surviving the roads is to drive defensively, and expect the unexpected. If you can't do that, then a 4WD or 2 is not going to make any difference - remember, it's the driver, not the vehicle, that positions and controls the vehicle, so if the car (or 4WD) is not being driven with the vehicles capabilities, dynamics and limitations in mind, then whose fault is that? The vehicle's? No - the drivers.

Why do you think young P platers kill themselves after losing control at high speed in a commodore or falcon or a Hyundai Excel? It's because they have driven beyond their own and the car's abilities/capabilities, but based on some of the logic in this thread, we should stop P platers from driving anything that moves, because moving vehicles are dangerous.

MAV50L · 03-03-2011, 09:00 AM

More uneducated bleeting from the every growing paddock of old Nanna sheep on AFF.
Our driveway consists of a EL XR8 , a 5.0 V8 4x4 and an EF wagon.
I drive my 4x4 anywhere and everywhere. Including into the city. I have no issues and have no more near misses driving that then I do driving in the traffic with the ******* anyway.
In some ways having the 4x4 in the city can keep traffic flowing better. Coming up to a turning lane that is full with the 4x4 I can get up onto the medium strip at the entry to the turning lane to allow the trafiic behind me to get around me instead of blocking it. Certainly cant get the XR8 up on the medium.
Yes there are people who shouldnt be allowed to drive a 4x4 anywhere. There is also people just as stupid and dangerous driving the beige camry that seems to becomming every more popular on AFF.
People are just getting more stupid now days.

cheap · 03-03-2011, 09:01 AM

I specifically drive my large and cumbersome 4x4 because I want to give the bird to every person, every do-gooder and bureaucrat that preaches better fuel efficiency, lower CO2s, ANCAP, pedestrian friendly, limited vision, resource intensive, road damaging and European bull-bar law ethos.

I keep a mental score card of how many people I annoy each day, I award myself extra points if little kids or grandmothers get scared. I park where I want, how I want and when I want.

I installed a lift kit just so wowser's can better look up my exhaust pipe. I deliberately drive at 99km/hr in the 100 zone across all 3 lanes. I tailgate everyone, my bullbar and spotties only a cigarette paper thickness away from the small car in front. Did I mention that I smoke 2 packets of cigarettes per day, drink excessively, compulsive gambler, I'm fat and overweight, my huge beergut makes turning the steering wheel difficult, I swear and fart. I have 7 kids to at least 9 different women (don't tell the current Mrs), I claim multiple centrelink payments so I can keep up my illegal drug habit, and tattoos are not cheap either. The unpleasant howl that comes from my muddies is music to my ears. How I wish I could get my arsenal of semi-automatic weapons back too.

I strive to comply with all the 4x4 stereotypes every day of my life. I love my 4x4.

Big 4x4, tiny peaker I'll show you a peaker!

MAV50L · 03-03-2011, 09:02 AM

Geez this is getting poor when the word re tards is considered offensive and activates the swear filter..........................what are we turning into?

66GT · 03-03-2011, 09:07 AM

Some years ago bought a Pajero wagon (7 seater) as have 4 kids & the EA wagon with extra dicky seats fitted, left very little space for camping gear etc. I believe the Pajero was much easer to park & drive in general as was narrower & shorter than EA, but had more internal space. Fitting a roof rack eliminated the need to tow a trailer when going on holidays. Was used as occasional weekend warrior (needing to engage both high & low range at different times). Taught our eldest son to drive in this & the misses Excel. He now ownes the Excel & drives a Unimog all day for work. Pajero much easier to drive than my XC coupe with manual steering & blind spots everywhere. Sold 4x4 a couple of years ago & replaced with AU sedan when eldest moved out. Overall Pajero was a great family transporter. I do acknowledge that a lot of 4x4 drivers are very arrogant when driving in the city, the same goes for many other types of vehicles & driver types - but don't blame them all because of a few.

pb02 · 03-03-2011, 09:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CODSASR

All I see so far is

Pro 4x4= Its my choice and its a free country (superiority complex?)

Against 4x4= genuine list of reasons (not going to list them all there are too many)

Ok, so we ban 4x4's from the city. Where specifically does the banning start and what constitutes a city? What happens to all 4x4's? Government byback???? Current models no longer allowed to be sold in Australia? (bad luck farmers/tradies/outdoor enthusiasts/people with large families/boat caravan owners that need tow vehicles).
What constitutes the type of 4x4 you want banned? does it include softroaders? How about people movers, some are bigger and harder to see around than 4x4's. Van's are in the same category too. If size is an issue how about larger family cars?

Seduce XR6 · 03-03-2011, 09:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Honest Gaza

I'm with the OP....way too many 4WD's for my liking.

Yes, you are entitled to drive what you like, but please consider the following points :

* You may feel safer because of your field of view, but how about the lesser field of view you create for other car drivers behind you and around you ? Should we all hop in Trucks because they provide the driver with a better field of view ?

* You may feel safer in an accident because they are "tougher". What about their ability to avoid an accident ? Surely, they are not as maneuverable as a car ?

* There have been reports that they are a greater danger to pedestrians than a car....(not sure about the validity of the argument)

So yes, you are entitled to drive whatever you want, but like the OP, I personally would prefer a lot less 4WD's (ie 4WD "styled" vehicles) on the road.

Agree with what you have said above.
I find many large 4WD's are driven by women who drive them way too fast & with little or no skill for that matter.
You see them looking nervous or angry or both with both hands clinched on top of the steering wheel while they are only inches from your rear.
As I never get below the speed limit for a given area apart from when I have slow traffic in front of me these women cannot be agro at me for going slow so whats up with them lol
I think its a dangerous mix of a nervous driver with little skill driving a 2.5 ton truck.
They may feel safer but in reality are they or for that matter are other drivers around them?
Given I have already established most of them have little or no driving skill would they not actually be safer in a yaris or something similar?
Oh you may ask how can I tell they have no skill, well because I can see how they are driving that being taking wrong driving lines, all over the road & even over center white lines & or braking mid corner because they have gone into it too fast & then getting all over the shop as a result.
I am not saying all women but most I see in the patrols or land cruisers etc are really bad drivers.
Or maybe they are not as bad a driver as they seem but are driving the wrong type of vehicle for their skill level, either way is bad

Seduce XR6 · 03-03-2011, 09:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAV50L

Geez this is getting poor when the word re tards is considered offensive and activates the swear filter..........................what are we turning into?

lol I know its pathetic these days, just heard that they have now stopped calling Fairy penguins that because it may offend people who are Gay

they will now be called small Penguins lol
That title may then offend Dwarfs so it goes on

aussie muscle · 03-03-2011, 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cheap

I specifically drive my large and cumbersome 4x4 because I want to give the bird to every person, every do-gooder and bureaucrat that preaches better fuel efficiency, lower CO2s, .....

sheesh, get an XR8 and do it PROPERLY!

Quote:

Originally Posted by smally351

Why do people drive 4x4's in the city? It's a bit like asking why do some people have 500hp, 10" rear wheels and 4" fronts when they are not drag racing.

but a wannabe drag car isn't as obnoxious as a huge 4wd. At least semi drivers don't drive their rig to the shopping center with no trailer just to pick up milk.

I live in the country, so those that have them see them as "necessary".

try seeing oncoming traffic when parked nose-in, then you'll see my point of view. if a normal car is next to me, i can see through their windows, but 4wd i only see their doors. if you back out and someone runs into you, you are at fault no matter the circumstances.

That does it. my next car might be a HUMMER so i can lord it over all you 4wd owners.

CODSASR · 03-03-2011, 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pb02

Ok, so we ban 4x4's from the city. Where specifically does the banning start and what constitutes a city? What happens to all 4x4's? Government byback???? Current models no longer allowed to be sold in Australia? (bad luck farmers/tradies/outdoor enthusiasts/people with large families/boat caravan owners that need tow vehicles).
What constitutes the type of 4x4 you want banned? does it include softroaders? How about people movers, some are bigger and harder to see around than 4x4's. Van's are in the same category too. If size is an issue how about larger family cars?

Obviously you cant read or have a verry slow mind no where have I said I want them banned all I was getting at is I havent seen a decent reason why a person who dosent tow, dosent go bush and has less then 3 kids needs a 4x4 in the city.

obviously you dont understand the question so you resort too babbaling on about banning every man and his dog from the road

Seduce XR6 · 03-03-2011, 09:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aussie muscle

try seeing oncoming traffic when parked nose-in, then you'll see my point of view. if a normal car is next to me, i can see through their windows, but 4wd i only see their doors. if you back out and someone runs into you, you are at fault no matter the circumstances.

That does it. my next car might be a HUMMER so i can lord it over all you 4wd owners.

I may Join you

**Raptor** · 03-03-2011, 09:24 AM

Because the owner has decided that a 4wd works for them - or is at least the best compromise given the whole variety of uses they put their vehicle to and they need to drive in the city.

Does it need to be any more complicated than that

Wouldn't we all love the luxury a different car for each use we have (sports car, ute, 4wd, muscle car, bush-basher, luxury limo, family hack, minibus, etc)

If you want to be allowed to continue to enjoy your choice of vehicle best not to be criticising the choices others make, evn though you may not agree with them.

Landau Stable · 03-03-2011, 09:27 AM

Geez people are getting pathetic lately. Everyone needs to relax and stop getting so aggro at the drop of a hat. I too agree that there are too many 4wd's on the road. In saying that, the best vehicle i drove as a daily was an old Pajero. I tow regularly, and often times i found myself on dirt properties which needed the use of 4X4 when pulling my trailer. For those of you who actually use the darn thing for it's proper use, then GREAT! You are one of the few who actually do, so relax and take a chill pill. It's obvious that the anti 4wd people are not targeting you. Their target is the morons who buy them for a stutus symbol and then never take them out of the city or get them dirty with a bit of work. Is it really that hard to understand?

pb02 · 03-03-2011, 09:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CODSASR

Obviously you cant read or have a verry slow mind no where have I said I want them banned all I was getting at is I havent seen a decent reason why a person who dosent tow, dosent go bush and has less then 3 kids needs a 4x4 in the city.

obviously you dont understand the question so you resort too babbaling on about banning every man and his dog from the road

The questions is why do they drive them in the city. The simple answer, because they can. If you looking for a solution to curb 4x4's in the city you only really have two options without getting discriminatory. Those options are banning them from city areas, or stopping sales.

I may be babbling but you can't answer my questions. Also my babbling is in response to babbling from the other side of the arguement so lets not get hypocritical.

SB076 · 03-03-2011, 09:35 AM

As this is a car enthusiasts forum, I am surprised by some of the comments on here. People complain that governments label them as a hoon based on the car they drive (rather than how they drive) Then all of a sudden we turn on another minority group and label them all as poor drivers and want them banned from using their vehicles in the city.

Regarding limited visibility when driving behind a 4WD. We have the same issue wth trucks, vans and cars with roof racks. If you can’t see drop back its your responsibility to ensure you have enough room to stop should you need to.

The city should be for everyone, if a farmer wants to drive down and park in the city with his one and only vehicle, he should be entitled too.

At the end of the day, its the drivers attitude and driving ability that we judge them on, this doesnt have anything to do wth the type of car they drive.

CODSASR · 03-03-2011, 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pb02

The questions is why do they drive them in the city. The simple answer, because they can. If you looking for a solution to curb 4x4's in the city you only really have two options without getting discriminatory. Those options are banning them from city areas, or stopping sales.

I may be babbling but you can't answer my questions. Also my babbling is in response to babbling from the other side of the arguement so lets not get hypocritical.

I cant answer your question because I am NOT calling for them too be banned. I would just like to understand why a mum with 2 kids who does not tow or need too get through muddy roads or bushland needs a 4x4 in the city?. Or why a single bussines guy needs too drive around the city in his hummer?

Alot of people I know have 4x4's but they have a need for them ( all live out bush some are farmers some tow horse floats my uncle tows his caravans and generators for his earthmoving bussines)

On a side note recently I have seen alot of these 4x4 mums getting around with stickers on there windows that say "get out of my way I'm a crazy mumma"

vztrt · 03-03-2011, 09:54 AM

Why drive a large car in the city when a small car will do the job perfectly fine and use much less space? Actually why not just take public transport into the CBD. Ban cars altogether??

Seriously some people have one car. If you cannot negate the roads with other vehicles please hand your licence in as your a danger on the roads.

BTW I dislike 4WD but I can handle driving with them on the road.

fairBA · 03-03-2011, 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IH8HSV

Hi fellas...

Since I live out of the metropolitan area, I'm lucky that I don't have to drive in and around the city everyday.

However In the past 2 weeks Ive been forced to drive to Perth and in & around the city for most days.

My grunt is: I cant believe how many near misses Ive had with 4wds. I'm no where bias against people driving 4wds - but I have had some really bad run ins with them lately.

I personally don't see why you need to drive these things in the city, with there limited vision. Not to mention how hard people seem to have parking them. Where in Perth do you need to engage the gear box into 4wd???

I thought I was just unlucky to have so many bad encounters with them but it seems so many do in the city. I could add 50+ links on the negativity of them - mainly about the damage they can to do to pedestrians and other cars... But I'm not here to do that.

Im just surprised why people use such a big vehicle in the city. Not to mention the high fuel costs, registration costs and the cost to service them.

Quit bitching and buy a bigger car if you have a problem..
To all the people how say 4wds never go off road - HOW WOULD KNOW IF YOU ONLY STAY IN THE CITY???
How do you feel drive next to a van, buses, and trucks and anything bigger than a Falcon??
Harden the ***** up or stop driving.

spoken buy a Land Crusier owner - for the record does go off road.

pb02 · 03-03-2011, 10:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CODSASR

I cant answer your question because I am NOT calling for them too be banned. I would just like to understand why a mum with 2 kids who does not tow or need too get through muddy roads or bushland needs a 4x4 in the city?. Or why a single bussines guy needs too drive around the city in his hummer?

Alot of people I know have 4x4's but they have a need for them ( all live out bush some are farmers some tow horse floats my uncle tows his caravans and generators for his earthmoving bussines)

On a side note recently I have seen alot of these 4x4 mums getting around with stickers on there windows that say "get out of my way I'm a crazy mumma"

The issue as I see it is, how do we know the mum with 2 kids doesn't have a weekend retreat in the country or have horses that they tow around or the family doesn't have a boat or camper they tow with a 4x4 on weekends.

Why lash out against one group and ignore the issues within other groups. (performance cars, trucks, taxi's, young drivers, drunks etc etc...)

Society in general needs to be more accepting of other peoples choices and obtain more information and facts before telling other people what they should and shouldn't be doing/driving etc.

We need to be more tolerant to peoples individual rights and choices. Otherwise we'll end up with anti-everything groups.

SB076 · 03-03-2011, 10:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CODSASR

On a side note recently I have seen alot of these 4x4 mums getting around with stickers on there windows that say "get out of my way I'm a crazy mumma"

Thats a seperate issue, it has nothing to do with the type of vehicle, everything to with person behind the wheel. Whilst our goverments continue beleiving the only answer to our road issues are more speed cameras, dont expect any improvement anytime soon.

CODSASR · 03-03-2011, 10:03 AM

I dont live in the city my town is full of 4x4 and 90% are used for the reason intended the other 10% are people who have recently moved here from melbourne due to the towns growth and the farmers, hunters, fisherman, campers and 4x4 enthuseusts who live here are always complaining about them and I have seen alot of our local farmers say to thses people why own one if you dont use it for what it was built for ( but in a nastier way).

prydey · 03-03-2011, 10:14 AM

this is a rather humerous topic that rears its head from time to time.

personally it doesn't bother me. if you don't like driving behind large vehicles then maybe you should hand in your licence (or just change lanes or back off till you feel more comfortable)

one comment that i will make is in relation to 'why' some buy them. there have been a few comments regarding 'extra room'. our friends have a prado and there is probably less room in the back of it than in my boot. they can't even fit a our 3 wheeler pram behind the rear seats.

chevypower · 03-03-2011, 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fairBA

To all the people how say 4wds never go off road - HOW WOULD KNOW IF YOU ONLY STAY IN THE CITY???

Amen to that hey! But your Land Cruiser is so clean and shiny when they you driving down the road, so that means you must never ever take it off road!

RedHotGT · 03-03-2011, 10:29 AM

can't see this thread lasting long... ;)

I also drive a AWD Terry... (not a traditional 4x4 of course)...
I have 4 kids... Try fitting that into a small car...

As i've come in late to this discussion - I suppose i'll only be repeating what others have said...

The OP states "I personally don't see why you need to drive these things in the city"... as far as I know - if you come from the 'burbs' into the CBD - there isn't a checkpoint area where you can swap your 4x4 for a small car to commute further... perhaps there's a business idea there for you??

As we are all enthusiasts, a lot of the time there is no logic to owning the cars that we do... be it a 4x4, a mini moke, a GT Falcon... But there is passion, and an enjoyment that we get out of driving our cars wherever/however/whenever we can...

If we didn't make illogical purchases with cars, we'd all be driving prius's and taragos, and if that's where we end up.... please arrange my euthanization...

RedHotGT · 03-03-2011, 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chevypower

Amen to that hey! But your Land Cruiser is so clean and shiny when they you driving down the road, so that means you must never ever take it off road!

There is an amazing thing called a 'Car Wash' where one can drive a dirty vehicle into... spend a few bucks and some time.... and then drive out the end CLEAN!??!?!

Perhaps you've not seen them???

BAxtER · 03-03-2011, 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xy500

its the wang factor.
the responses here confirm my theory that a lot of the members here are well spoilt for cash, because you almost couldn't own a more expensive car than when you drive a 4wd in the city. It would literally be cheaper over a few years to buy a buzz box and keep it in rego.
its the cool thing because if you drive a 4wd/suv you are sporty and adventurous and have lots of fun in life. At least that's how they're sold. Just ignore the fact that most are never even taken off road even briefly. and those that are, will mostly be occasional weekend warriors.
First its track days/cars now unnecessary 4wd's what next? gold & diamond teeth grills? some of you guys need a sponsor child.

LOL, ease up. But Its probably all on credit anyway, so no stress.

XCXDBABF · 03-03-2011, 10:36 AM

I'll throw another reason into the mix. For many years I've had a daily driver car and a 4WD. The 4WD didn't get used often and was only used for towing, 4WDing or when the space was needed. However, it's getting near time to replace the car and the 4WD is a little tired. I'm going to get rid of both and get a new 4WD. The simple fact is, with registration costs and insurance what they are now, it pays for a lot (if not all) of the extra fuel the 4WD will use. Then there is the extra costs of servicing, etc, etc. The simple fact is, I can't justify having a car as a daily driver anymore. If the government allowed people to have a single registration cover both a 4WD and a car (maybe only have one set of plates and you put it on whichever you're driving) for the price of the 4WD registration and CTP, then I'd probably continue to maintain 2 vehicles, but I don't think that will happen.

TheSneakiness · 03-03-2011, 10:52 AM

I fear the OP is scared of being hit.

I have a 4WD that gets used all day, every day.

The reason of the arrogance is because everyone in stupid little cars, Falcons and Commodores like to cut off 4WDs when we are trying to leave room so we can pull up without having to go through your boot cause your impatience causes traffic accidents.

I sometimes get a lift to work in a Commodore SV6 and I hate how close to the road it sits. I feel like I'm going to get crushed by standard height VW Golfs and Fiestas.

How do you go when buses, trucks and vans drive by you? Do you hesitate cause you're scared you're gonna get hit? I think some people need a cup of HTFU.

Either deal with it or get out of the way, this trend is never gonna stop whether you want it to or not.