Any reason why Falcon can't go to the UK?

[Road_Warrior]

Originally Posted by Silver Ghia

Obviously you have never driven on their motorways. If you do 70 mph (about 115kph, the limit on the motorways), you generally end up in the left lane being overtaken by most, some at quite a speed.

One big problem as has been mentioned, is that carparks are generally of a size that a Honda Civic almost has trouble squeezing into.

But on the motorways in an FG F6 or GT, wow, that would be something.

Makes me wonder then how the Germans and Italians would take to an F6 or GT on their Autobahns/Autostradas :evil3:

[SSVPom]

Originally Posted by BOOSTED-AU

falcon is too fast for poms

Not really, the amount of power generated by the lazy 4.0 engine is less than most higher strung smaller engined Euro cars.

60% of car sales in the UK are now diesel, so a large petrol engine only bread-and-butter branded car will fail to sell well at all, depreciate rapidly with 35% 3 yr. residual, cop huge road tax bills and drink plenty of fuel at $2.50 per litre.

[onfire]

Would the typical English point of view, that being, looking down on the Colonies have any effect on how well a car would perform in the UK?

Face it, like Commodores, Falcons are big, brutal tanks build for Australian conditions and reflections of local cultures and needs.

Instead of exporting cars and trying to break different territories, how about both Holden and Ford try rebuilding some interest in their current products or expanding on them for the local markets. A cheaper V6 Monaro type clone wouldnt go astray to break the youth market for those who still want the size, yet want that look.

[mik]

i guess its where you live over there, my cousin lives there ....had a benz for a while, but just too many smaller roads for her ,she traded her large Benz for a smart car, no more backing up when an oncomeing vehicle comes along.

[Wally]

Chatting with various guys in the UK and US, they complain they can't get the Falcon. Whether that translates into sales is another thing, but the interest is definitely there.

[robjh80]

Plenty of large cars in the UK, you only need to take a look at "Pistonheads.co.uk" which is a large car sales advertising site ... like "Carsales.com.au" over here.

Don't run away with this perception that they all drive around in "eensy winsy tiny little cars" over there, they have all sorts of vehicles on the roads, including plenty of muscle cars.

http://www.pistonheads.co.uk/sales/

[Kieron]

Originally Posted by RAREV8

I don't think that the decision has anything to do with the size of the car or its engine. There are and always have been plenty of big cars over there- think Jag sedans...far far more of them there than over here. Most of the larger "cheaper" cars (Ford, Vauxhall, Rover) never did that well, not due to their size but that the German offerings were vastly superior and reasonably affordable with some representing better resale vale.
Having said that, the Ford Scorpio was actually German built but not the same quality as the BMW's etc.

The big Jags, BM's, Merc's etc are bought by up market purchasers, not the average Joe. The larger UK Fords (never as big as a Falcon and never with anything more than 3 litre donks) wern't in competition with these cars.

I never considered a large Ford or Vauxhall when I lived there, Had 5 series and Audi' Quattros instead...miles better and very affordable 5 and 6 cyl cars.....my big aussie BA's and BF's were no faster than a 1983 528i that weighed more with a smaller engine!
Contrary to popular opinion, the small roads are quite big enough to accommodate large cars- having been brought up in the country and being one of 4 sons we had to have larger cars (CX Citroen Safaris) and I don't recall wedging them in small roads!

I'm not sure the small roads were in question, after all they still have large vans/trucks/buses to cater for. I drove my uncles TDi Peugeot 607 (in between Mondeo and Falcon) when last there and it's not a problem. The roads are in general smaller though.

4Vman, don't get "muscle" cars confused with "performance" cars....I am as big a fan of old Aussie V8s as anyone here but if I was after a "performance" car, they'd be close to the bottom of the list!

Pooh pooh the Uks tendancies towards smaller cars but I suggest that you have a look at the trend over here now....the cars here and on UK roads seem awfully similar in size, its no secret that sadly smaller cars are becoming far more prevalent here too now.

Sort of, the trend in Aus has been for large car buyers to graduate to even bigger vehicles - SUV's.

It really is a case of too large in body and engine in the UK.



500SEC, I found quite a few old Aussie Fords in London back in the late 80's, could have had them for scrap metal value. There was an American car wrecker just outside the Blackwall Tunnel (next to where the Millenium Dome now is), XA's, XB's, wagons and sedans but no coupes. Nobody wanted them complete due to size, and no wrecking value.

Found the 83 LTD in an East London dodgy car dealer, it was apparently an ex Aus Embassy car, complete with MKII Granada taillights.

[last fairlane]

Have a look at Ebay UK and type in Falcon
you come up with three AU Utes for sale one of them an E Gas
also check out the build dates 2004 for an AU what the ?
The LTD was exported in the 80s to the UK but it looked to them just like a stretched Granada which looked like an XD

[Kieron]

Originally Posted by robjh80

Plenty of large cars in the UK, you only need to take a look at "Pistonheads.co.uk" which is a large car sales advertising site ... like "Carsales.com.au" over here.

Don't run away with this perception that they all drive around in "eensy winsy tiny little cars" over there, they have all sorts of vehicles on the roads, including plenty of muscle cars.

http://www.pistonheads.co.uk/sales/

Pistonheads is a little site that caters for the car enthusiast, the equivalent to carsales.com.au is autotrader.co.uk.

I can guarantee you won't see many muscle cars on the streets in the UK. I used to haunt the US car places in London/Birmingham/Luton and knew a car dealer in East London who specialised in US cars. One of the best places to see big Muscle on the street was outside Ed's Diner on the Kings Rd in London on cruise nights.

I've also seen the Monaro (including at static displays at Donnington raceway) rarely over there, even seen one of the very few AU Falcon ute's for sale at a commercial dealer in Birmingham. Sat there for ever, the salesman said he couldn't even give it away!

[Mark351]

Originally Posted by last fairlane

Have a look at Ebay UK and type in Falcon
you come up with three AU Utes for sale one of them an E Gas
also check out the build dates 2004 for an AU what the ?
The LTD was exported in the 80s to the UK but it looked to them just like a stretched Granada which looked like an XD

Yeah, some AU utes went over, but not as Fords but as some other company and rebadged as something beginning with V but my memory is failing me. :(

[500SEC]

Yeah i remember the LTD piece now, and recall seeing some later model utes for sale on autotrader.co.uk.... but never saw one in the flesh.

In my suburb (Barnes, London SW15), there is an American car importer who sells Mustangs, Hummers, Suburbans etc.... but nothing Australian. I should have popped in and asked them why not...

My runabouts were an 80 series Landcruiser and a Merc 500SEC. Never felt that either were too big for getting around London. Falcon would not work there simply because it's a big Ford.

[aussiblue]

The big Jags, BM's, Merc's etc are bought by up market purchasers, not the average Joe. The larger UK Fords (never as big as a Falcon and never with anything more than 3 litre donks) wern't in competition with these cars.

Yes; but could a Falcon price compete with say a V8 Jaguar if exported in low volumes to the UK. I expect that after export costs it's price would rise to where it was actually competing with the larger European luxury cars. An XJ Super 4.2 litre V8 Supercharged has a list price of only 49,382.98 UK pounds and costs 57,760.00 UK pounds on the road.

See http://www.jaguar.co.uk/uk/en/xj/mod...rrer=000309964 And in the Uk Jag spares would be easier to get than Oz Ford Falcon ones.

[SSVPom]

Originally Posted by Mark351

Yeah, some AU utes went over, but not as Fords but as some other company and rebadged as something beginning with V but my memory is failing me. :(

Verte Tempest is the name you're looking for !

Rebadged AU1 and AU2 utes sold new until 2005 approx, hence the late registration date, most E-gas, but some XR's made it over too, through Verte and also private import.

[vztrt]

One thing I forgot was that Falcons do go over to the UK.
Ford build hearses(well the car bit anyway) and send them over.

[UKXR8]

Hi, this has been covered a few times before.
I'm living in the UK, I've got an AU2 XR8, I don't have any trouble parking it, driving it around the roads over here (which seem to be packed with BMW X5's merc M class and loads of truly awful big French people carriers) and I love it. Luckily the new CO2 based car tax rules don't apply to it and it is very cheap to insure at around £200 pa.
The Monaro was pretty well received when it came over here, it got a lot of airtime on both TG and 5th Gear, strangely the VXR8 has barely had a mention, I have no idea how well they are selling, however I do see the odd Monaro around, I have yet to see a VXR8.
The Monaro did good things for Vauxhall because at the time their range of cars was truly awful, not that its much better now but it is better.
I'm guessing that one of the reasons the Scorpio wasn't replaced was that at the time Ford owned Jaguar, so there would be no point bringing in a large luxury car to compete with their own large luxury cars. I know that Ford did look at bringing the Falcon over (thats how my one came over) but for some reason it wasn't taken up.
I would love to see Falcons exported over here, even if it was in low volumes so as to boost the image of Ford over here. That said Ford's image is riding pretty high at the moment with the new Fiesta which are selling really well despite the current climate and they do have a hero car in the shape of Focus RS, which has got all the local car press in a spin.
I've seen quite a few of the Falcon based hearses, they are converted over here by a company called Coleman Milne...

I know its not going to happen but could someone please send a few FG's this way!!!!

[SSVPom]

Bit sad this, but I noticed that on last weeks episode of BBC's Shameless on SBS, they featured a brand new Ford Falcon/Fairlane hearse by Coleman Milne !

Fairlane front and interior with wagon back end - didn't look too bad !
See photo of their stretched FG sedan.... Hearse coming soon apparently.

I'm heading back to the UK in 2 weeks so will see if I can snap some Aussie cars whilst over there.

[XplosiveR6]

Originally Posted by onfire

Instead of exporting cars and trying to break different territories, how about both Holden and Ford try rebuilding some interest in their current products or expanding on them for the local markets. A cheaper V6 Monaro type clone wouldnt go astray to break the youth market for those who still want the size, yet want that look.

Holden did make V6 monaros... they diddnt sell well at all, thats why they discontinued it.
What do you mean 'break into the youth market'? they most popular cars for P-platers are Commodores and falcons, but unfortunately most are second hand because uni students or apprentices cant afford $40,000 cars.

[Kieron]

Originally Posted by aussiblue

Yes; but could a Falcon price compete with say a V8 Jaguar if exported in low volumes to the UK. I expect that after export costs it's price would rise to where it was actually competing with the larger European luxury cars. An XJ Super 4.2 litre V8 Supercharged has a list price of only 49,382.98 UK pounds and costs 57,760.00 UK pounds on the road.

See http://www.jaguar.co.uk/uk/en/xj/mod...rrer=000309964 And in the Uk Jag spares would be easier to get than Oz Ford Falcon ones.

Thats one of the big issues I mentioned with the G6Et, it's pricing would be up with the Euro luxo cars and wearing a Ford badge, which automatically associates it with Cortina/Sierra/Mondeo's etc


UKXr8, how is your car insured? I had a MKIII Capri S insured in a nice suburb in Birmingham in lock up garage and its cost me more than that for third party.

[Blue_XR]

How cheap is a bottom of the range 5 series or E class in the UK? You would think it is that these cars a G6ET would compete with. Also with the exchange rate at around 2:1 you would think that getting the car over there would be cheaper

[Yellow_Festiva]

Originally Posted by Blue_XR

How cheap is a bottom of the range 5 series or E class in the UK? You would think it is that these cars a G6ET would compete with. Also with the exchange rate at around 2:1 you would think that getting the car over there would be cheaper

The exchange rate is only a small part of the equation. It isn't that simple.

Taxes and duties, as well as public perception of the brand and local tastes play a big part.

A Matiz in Singapore costs around 30 grand, and you won't get much change from 60 grand for a Mondeo.

Taxes and local charges make up around double the wholesale cost of both these cars.

[Blue_XR]

Originally Posted by Yellow_Festiva

The exchange rate is only a small part of the equation. It isn't that simple.

Taxes and duties, as well as public perception of the brand and local tastes play a big part.

A Matiz in Singapore costs around 30 grand, and you won't get much change from 60 grand for a Mondeo.

Taxes and local charges make up around double the wholesale cost of both these cars.

I understand its not all about the exchange rates, taxes are huge.....just look at the price of the Euro cars in this country

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by Yellow_Festiva

The exchange rate is only a small part of the equation. It isn't that simple.

Taxes and duties, as well as public perception of the brand and local tastes play a big part.

A Matiz in Singapore costs around 30 grand, and you won't get much change from 60 grand for a Mondeo.

Taxes and local charges make up around double the wholesale cost of both these cars.

In sing we worked out it was about 300% of the original cars cost. Then you have the tolls at every corner, high insurance costs, and high petrol costs. Hence why one family will have 1 car.

lol, but talk to the taxi drivers and they will tell you the government has made it 'cheap' to own a car. lol

[UKXR8]

Originally Posted by Kieron

UKXr8, how is your car insured? I had a MKIII Capri S insured in a nice suburb in Birmingham in lock up garage and its cost me more than that for third party.

The XR8 is insured fully comp with Adrian Flux, I guess I must be a fairly low risk to them, 37yo living in a nice part of Lincoln, 10 years no claims, car is garaged.
The arrival of the online comparison sites like comparethemarket.com and confused.com has made it very competitive in the car insurance market over here. Every year they try and put my premium up, I give it a day or two make up a quote a few quid cheaper than the previous year and they always manage to beat it.
I've also had a quote for my 351 XA coupe of £104 fully comp for when it eventually goes back on the road (limited miles). Can't wait to tax that one for £0.00 when it gets its mot (1972=historic vehicle=free road toax : )

[Road_Warrior]

OK, to move the goal posts a bit, would a TDCI Falcon (say a G6ET but with a different name and without the turbo I6) sell? Would they move 1000 a month over there?

[gcg2503]

1000 a month. No way!

Not even 10 I would say

[UKXR8]

I think a well specced Falcon with a decent diesel (can't believe I just used those 2 words in the same sentence) such as the 2.7 twin turbo used by Jag could be viable over, here I think especially if it was priced and marketed well.....

[RAREV8]

Originally Posted by Kieron

The big Jags, BM's, Merc's etc are bought by up market purchasers, not the average Joe. The larger UK Fords (never as big as a Falcon and never with anything more than 3 litre donks) wern't in competition with these cars.

Correct....they weren't in competition with the Mercs, Beemers etc but that was down to brand perception.


I have to disagree with you on pricing and availibility of the bigger Euro marques - mercs, beemers etc are very commonplace indeed- I am not from a wealthy family at all but all of our cars have been nice Euro cars. They are quite often bought by average Joes as they are not as expensive there as they are here.

Sure, they all have high end models that are beyond the financial reach of most of us but their core competency vehicles are designed for the mass market.......Spain, Germany and many other Euro countries use vast fleets of Mercedes as taxis......can't get much more humble than that!
I'm not sure I understand what you mean by a "market purchaser".....whilst big Jags and similar cars were not exactly cheap, there is no denying that there are a hell of a lot of them around London...irrespective of whose driving them.


Its a funny place, I think you said you lived there for a while so you'll know- sure, lots of smaller cars around, not due to preference but oil prices put paid to many larger cars years ago and still does but whatever you do drive, at least you can drive them at a decent speed and around (mostly) reasonably competent drivers. (Sydney driving!!)


3 litres is about the biggest "common" engine size- would buyers consider a 4l six? Don't know...on paper, it may seem to be a little OTT, especially if it did not out perform the smaller Euro 6's. Turbo versions would sell there (G6ET, F6) but only smaller numbers.

Pommy buyers of the "Vauxhall" VXR obviously didn't think it had enough power so now they got Walky to throw a supercharger at it and increase its output by more than 100kW to 419kW leaving it swifter than the 427 available here......shame that Bathurst VXR isn't coming out here....but it will probably be a very small slice of the market.

Franky, my 2 V8's and G6 are a waste of space here....if I take them back to the UK, I might actually be able to enjoy driving them!!

[banarcus]

Originally Posted by 4Vman

The UK is the home of the small 4cyl buzz box.... to them a "musclecar" is a fwd 4cyl turbo i doubt a big thirsty RWD sedan would be received all that well, especially when an entry level 5 or E series would probably be cheaper...
Export is NOT always the best way forward or the solution, just ask holden....

Having lived there for 2 years, I totally agree with 4Vman. If it is diesel or a 4cyl, then happy days.

[Kieron]

Originally Posted by RAREV8

Correct....they weren't in competition with the Mercs, Beemers etc but that was down to brand perception.

Agreed, and this is precisely why a Ford G6ET won't be able to compete.

I have to disagree with you on pricing and availibility of the bigger Euro marques - mercs, beemers etc are very commonplace indeed- I am not from a wealthy family at all but all of our cars have been nice Euro cars. They are quite often bought by average Joes as they are not as expensive there as they are here.

I think it's been mentioned before in this topic, but the Euro stuff is often now purchased by fleets do to superior resale values bringing the TOC (total ownership cost) down, for instance my cousin had a E46 turbo diesel BMW at 27 years old for his company car (he now lives in Aus and can only afford a Focus).
On top of this, MOT after 3 years of age brings a big reduction in value of a car, especially large engined luxo cars, putting them within the reach of 'the working class', 'Chavs' etc - the BMW is also known as 'Black Mans Wheels' due to this.

Please note i'm just saying how it is in the UK, i'm not racist or class conscious etc

Sure, they all have high end models that are beyond the financial reach of most of us but their core competency vehicles are designed for the mass market.......Spain, Germany and many other Euro countries use vast fleets of Mercedes as taxis......can't get much more humble than that!
I'm not sure I understand what you mean by a "market purchaser".....whilst big Jags and similar cars were not exactly cheap, there is no denying that there are a hell of a lot of them around London...irrespective of whose driving them.

Apologies, I meant upmarket purchasers and i'm referring to new. I used to live in Stepney Green (perceived lower class, East London) for a while and I agree there where many Jags and large BMW's around, but they where invariably quite old models. I could take you to 2nd hand luxo car dealers in London or Birmingham where you could pick up big Jags for a thousand pounds or less, the buy price is low, running costs fairly high but it's balanced out vs buying say a new Focus to a degree

Its a funny place, I think you said you lived there for a while so you'll know- sure, lots of smaller cars around, not due to preference but oil prices put paid to many larger cars years ago and still does but whatever you do drive, at least you can drive them at a decent speed and around (mostly) reasonably competent drivers. (Sydney driving!!)

Agreed, drivers over there in general are far better than here, dunno if' i'd get my XR8 out of 3rd gear around London etc much though , best you could do is go out for a spin off peak around that orbital carpark (M25) hehe

3 litres is about the biggest "common" engine size- would buyers consider a 4l six? Don't know...on paper, it may seem to be a little OTT, especially if it did not out perform the smaller Euro 6's. Turbo versions would sell there (G6ET, F6) but only smaller numbers.

Pommy buyers of the "Vauxhall" VXR obviously didn't think it had enough power so now they got Walky to throw a supercharger at it and increase its output by more than 100kW to 419kW leaving it swifter than the 427 available here......shame that Bathurst VXR isn't coming out here....but it will probably be a very small slice of the market.

Franky, my 2 V8's and G6 are a waste of space here....if I take them back to the UK, I might actually be able to enjoy driving them!!

Common engine size there is more like 1.6l, 2 litres as I mentioned is considered big and I think you'd be hard pressed to find anything much more than 2.6L in the bread n butter brands there (Ford, Vauxhall, VW etc).

[Wally]

Maybe Ford can piggyback Holden into the UK...

http://www.themotorreport.com.au/295...-holdens-book/

With Holden sure to suffer lost revenue as a result of Pontiac’s demise, the Aussie manufacturer may also be tapped to provide the UK market with the Commodore sedan and Sportwagon, already available in HSV guise as the Vauxhall Monaro VXR, along with the Statesman and Caprice models to the luxury end of the brand.