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11-01-2014, 09:27 AM | #31 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 11,325
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I wonder if the Ford brand is now more of a sales impediment than a benefit....
Mazda seems to have really taken off since it's dissociation with Ford..... Just sayin' the problem might not be the vehicles but the brand itself and if so, could the same thing be about to inflict Holden... Australians are ditching luxury Ford and Holden models and in 2013 buyers moved to purchasing more imported luxury models You can get an Audi for $26,000 now so some are becoming more affordable, Germans now do good smaller SUVs so there's a real alternative to Asian and local models, the cultural cringe is now upon cars..... |
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11-01-2014, 10:18 AM | #32 | ||
_Oo===oO_
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Australia
Posts: 3,305
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In Australia, yes the Ford brand seems to be an impediment. Not so much anywhere else in the world.
I'm not sure how you can link Fomoco disassociating itself with Mazda to the Mazda brand going gangbusters (in Australia?) Holden's issue is that they towed the Made in Australia line so hard, it's going to be an 'interesting' transition into being import only. |
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11-01-2014, 12:49 PM | #33 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Karuah Valley
Posts: 984
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Mazda brand.
When I was a boy the mazda brand was an oddity sold by family business car dealers that did so as a sideline. My family members had them with plastic on the door and sunvisors. it wasn't that the escort was bad--plenty running around today- the original ford laser introduced the mazda brand to Australian families that would not buy Japanese. The jap crap crowd. by the time you get to KE normal buyers would be happy to drive into the mazda dealer. the holden dealer I did my trade at is now a mazda dealer..thats what most of the forum punters don't get. the local ford dealers got rebranded and the winning dealers sold out and retired to money investment companies. take the brand decades to come back. now today generation would prefer to buy direct from the source so rebadging will never be the draw card it once was.. laser sold great trouble free and did the job. my neighbours have mostly purchased mazda. work has purchased ford because its fleet--what does that say-lots of cheep fords in used car lots.
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11-01-2014, 09:56 PM | #34 | |||
Peter Car
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: geelong
Posts: 23,145
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It's like ripping a Band-Aid off, do you want to do it slowly or quickly? People can sook about redundancy payments all they want, with the poor me I lost my job and got stuff all, but the reality is the government is going to put money into retraining all these workers because there is so many of them. If 3 guys lost their job at one place who cares bar those 3 guys and their families, if 3000 guys lose their jobs at one place then a hell of a lot more people need to worry cause it is a massive problem. It sucks for the 3 guys as much as the 3000 but the reality is the loss of 3000 jobs has the potential for big social and un-employment problems, the jobs of the other 3 doesn't. That's why the government will step in when a big company goes, and not when a little one does. If the guys that lose their jobs at a little company are going to sook about it then maybe they should look for work at a bigger company. |
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12-01-2014, 12:44 AM | #35 | ||
Banned
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 3,290
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An excellent argument as to why the gov shouldn't give the industry anything *** everyone long as I'm good hey
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12-01-2014, 01:38 AM | #36 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
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12-01-2014, 09:24 AM | #37 | ||
_Oo===oO_
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13-01-2014, 04:31 AM | #38 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Jan 2005
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No matter where its built or what plant. And not every Ford car built is top of its class. |
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13-01-2014, 07:05 PM | #39 | ||
Regular Member
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 206
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Branding works like this
80% of the info your Brain processes is Visual For you to make a "Brand Choice" they mix the "rational" with "the irrational" Consumers and humans do not act rationally they do not make purchases based on purely rational decisions You are "manipulated" every day. People who understand branding and Ford and Gm both do understand the brand is meant to make "your choice" of product or "service" easy You will assume you are getting a "certain thing" with "certain values" sometime you do some time "you don't" unfortunately The Australian people have been conned and are being conned and will continue to be conned by the Manufacturers and the Various GVTs Bob Katter (who I consider to be moderate) is the only person who understands the "strategic importance" of "manufacturing" in.... Australia His policy of making government agencies purchase Australian made was quite sound You reap what you sow and with out nurturing manufacturing it dies as it is now It is the dumbing down of the Australian Economy that is the most alarming bit of the equation |
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13-01-2014, 07:11 PM | #40 | ||
Regular Member
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Posts: 206
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"GM is completely committed to the Holden brand," Mr Svigos said.
"We intend to continue with the Holden brand for many, many years to come." of course they are that name and badging is worth more than all their plant put together they are going to milk that puppy dry they will talk about their on shore design team - till the cows come home they will put everything AUS on all their advertising merchandise and christ nows what else - it will be crass and sickening but what ever they do they will "fool the punters" one way or another |
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13-01-2014, 07:57 PM | #41 | ||
_Oo===oO_
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Location: Australia
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13-01-2014, 08:25 PM | #42 | ||
Same ****-Different Day
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Northern Vic
Posts: 1,287
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Does that include the festiva that was built by kia or the econovan that was made by mazda? Even the build plates said," Mazda motor co-ford econovan" and" Kia motor co-ford festiva"
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14-01-2014, 11:42 AM | #43 | ||
Peter Car
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14-01-2014, 11:55 AM | #44 | |||
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Quote:
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14-01-2014, 11:58 AM | #45 | ||
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You'll only remember one way in twenty years time . The other won't register in your long term trauma. I'd rather not have the memory.
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14-01-2014, 12:32 PM | #47 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Adelaide
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all this talk of whether Holden or Ford brand names have value or not post local manufacture is rubbish.Car buyers will shop across a car category and not stop with one brand only, its no longer 1960.If a buyer goes into a holden dealer in 2018 to look at a car they perceive to be inferior, they will buy another brand that joins the dots for them. Hyundai and Kia are laughing all the way to the bank globally, i have family and colleagues who have been long time ford and holden (even european) fans who are now H/K devotees because the products are solid and now even desirable.Look in my driveway
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14-01-2014, 01:33 PM | #48 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
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14-01-2014, 02:08 PM | #49 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
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As good as they are compared to what they were, Hyundai and Kia cars still feel like tin. I just took mum out to buy a new car and shopped across all brands. When you get into a Focus/ Megane/ Golf/ Corolla they feel like they are solid. They feel like they are a quality car. You get into a Hyundai/ Kia/ and straight away you feel they are built to a price. My mum is not a car person and they were her words not mine. They are an appliance built to do a job and nothing more.
They've improved, but they have a way to go. Toyota will continue to thump them here as their cars are miles better quality, getting more of a fun factor put into them as they're updated. That's how you get brand value, selling quality cars people actually want at a price they're willing to pay. Fwiw mums choice ran down to the Focus and Golf, in the end the Focus won out as she loved the look and feel of it, she felt it was easier to drive and as for value for money the Focus thumped it. |
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14-01-2014, 07:17 PM | #50 | ||
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14-01-2014, 07:43 PM | #51 | |||
Oo\===/oO
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Quote:
You're just as stuck there with your suspicions of any other countries besides Australia and Italy making quality cars...
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14-01-2014, 07:52 PM | #52 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
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14-01-2014, 08:25 PM | #53 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
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Location: Hallam
Posts: 1,897
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Back on topic leave your digs at each other for else where
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14-01-2014, 09:49 PM | #54 | ||
Regular Member
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 206
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all this talk of whether Holden or Ford brand names have value or not post local manufacture is rubbish.Car buyers will shop across a car category and not stop with one brand only, its no longer 1960.
kind of beg to differ you try this go out to yer vehicle and you get that screw driver out and yet flick the badging off it? dare you what ever make you got flick the badges off it and go for a drive without them see how it looks and how you feel TYPOGRAPHY is Black GOLD brother when i was a little boy in we would go to the wreckers and get badges that there is the coolest part of the car Ferrari make more money outta the Brand than they do the Cars now yeah mate it is not the 1960's but holy I love this site Posters badges ads typography http://www.cartype.com/ Check it out read it and weep http://www.cartype.com/pages/425/holden_related_emblems http://www.cartype.com/pages/1230/ford Typography is part art and part engineering science and its practice requires as much if not more skill and precision than any other part of the vehicle any grease monkey can change a radiator but you try craft type an imagery like those It is important it has value ole Henry he knew that in 1903 he wasn't going to but any chicken sh8t type on his vehicles was he The spend good money on this stuff always have and always will http://www.cartype.com/pages/1230/ford 1903 - Letters and logos. The script lettering was first used on company communications in 1903 but the first production car, the Model A, received special treatment. Ford produced the first logo for the car, complete with an art nouveau border, very fashionable at the time. When they leave they may ramp up the "Aussie ness" of everything they do Who knows |
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14-01-2014, 10:14 PM | #55 | ||
Regular Member
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 206
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I don't think people understand the 21st century economy.
< The Chinese do Read the full article http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/83...l#.UtUaYCiTQ5s China's armed forces have been told to choose domestic brand cars when procuring military vehicles, according to a circular published on Monday. < Who and what is the Aus Gvt going to buy???? What was the reason they came here in the first place??? Used to be a lot of weaponry "made in aus" as well touchy subject but the deliberate destruction and dismantling of Aus manufacturing has IMHO an Ulterior Motive It has been allowed by Traitors and their reasoning is flawed Holden and Ford should go and a real Australian brand should form |
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14-01-2014, 10:43 PM | #56 | |||
335 - STILL THE BOSS ...
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Melb East
Posts: 11,421
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Quote:
Branding is huge and means more to many whether they believe it or not. BMW, Audi & Merc are just going along in leaps and bounds because of the badge and badge alone. It goes for both Holden and Ford and every other brand that have worked very hard to build credibility towards their branding. Subconsciously most will think they are buying because other reasons but when it boils down to it, they buy because of what their experienced previously with that brand, how others perceive that brand, a high expectation of that brand and will pay extra for that brand. I could have bought an F6 10k cheaper than a GT ....... but apart from the fact it isnt a V8 ...... the F6 doesn't say GT! Not the absolute deciding factor but held alot of weight in the decision made. Most Mercs in my opinion are overpriced ugly cars ....... never been a fan but appreciate what they offer and how much they can charge for what is, to me, an overrated brand. Thing is though ..... if someone says they drive a Merc, you want to know which one! If someone says they drive a Kia ..... there is an awkward silence ...... chirping crickets Mrs wanted a BMW! Why? "Because I like BMW's". When I asked which one would you like, she said a White one. (And if I made her drive another Ford she will run me down!) SO ...... just saying ..... would be blown away if Holden change their name. To many years in promoting the image. Cannot see it going away. There will always be the white goods buyers. Toyota, Kia, Hyundai etc know this and have capitilised on it very successfully BUT brand snobbery is ripe whether intentional or subconsciously.
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14-01-2014, 11:02 PM | #57 | ||
Now Fordless
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Fremantle, WA
Posts: 3,611
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Thats why Ford is suffering. Its not a brand people aspire to own like a Euro and its not a cheap value packed white good. Its stuck in no mans land.
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14-01-2014, 11:08 PM | #58 | |||
335 - STILL THE BOSS ...
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Melb East
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Quote:
Cost of Euro's are decreasing and the qty of models is increasing. Those who aspired to own a Beemer or the like might find themselves in a position to buy one come 2017 or earlier.
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'73 Landau - 10.82 @ 131mph '11 FG GT335 - 12.43 @ 116mph '95 XG ute - 3 minutes, 21.14 @ 64mph 101,436 MEMBERS ......... 101,436 OPINIONS ..... What could possibly go wrong! Clevo Mafia [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] |
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15-01-2014, 12:04 AM | #59 | ||||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
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Quote:
I could have explained better, i meant people claiming that no longer being able to buy an aussie made car from holden or ford meaning those names have no meaning, the brand will only be as good as the quality of the offer, no matter where its built. Prestige brands are falling over themselves to move downmarket to pick up huge volumes, Merc-New A Class- see how desirable this new model can be when they no longer make it a euro focussed tall boy people mover wannabe. BMW has the MINI brand, 1 series and i series comming, these are the segments you need to be in to continue selling around the world with strict emission standards. Quote:
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15-01-2014, 10:26 AM | #60 | ||
Au Falcon = Mr Reliable
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: North West Slopes & Plains NSW
Posts: 4,076
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Holdens lineup & price points will be key no doubt about it, how they change market perceptions & what "incentives" they offer (to change any negative perception about them) will be interesting to watch in the next couple of years.
cheers, Maka
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