Toyota in 2012 was the global #1 vehicle manufacturer

[SumoDog68]

[WIKI][/WIKI]

Originally Posted by wrongwaynorris

To all you keen Toyota buyers I am starting an online cardigan , sandals and walking socks shop , hope to see yo all there real soon . Can someone who owns a Toyota tell me if the total situational unawarness courses are included in the price of the car . Boring bland cars for boring bland vehicle steerers . Do you want to marry the goer in short skirts , stockings , suspenders and heels or the frump in a track suit who can cook , iron , run the household budget and gives you ZERO excitment ?

From memory you do own a Toyota ?

[ryeman]

Audi in the 70-80s were sued to the extent of withdrawing fm the US.
Civil court cases that were successfully brought by 'victims' etc as a result of claims that the cars would, inexplicably, accelerate through the garage door/gates incl running over others.

Decades later, it was quietly concluded that driver became confused between th go and the woa pedals cos they were both aligned at the same height above floor. We take that for granted but Americans find that strange. Their go pedals were much further from the brake, which required you to lift your leg completely of the floor to brake. You couldn't just swivel like we do.
'Victims' made literally millions each, never repaid.
Runaway cc is another US phenomena not to mention floor mats! and other natural disasters that seem to beset yanks.
Forgetting to put air in the tyres of Explorers resulted in OEM Firestones to de-laminate causing rollovers/death/injury (freedom to NOT wear belts) forced Bridgestone takeover but once again courts awarded millions to the stupid.
One could go on about the stupid US drivers and the equally stupid civil courts.

Am still waiting for a 60min/4 corners expose, don't hold yr breath yanks never admit to mistakes. Foreign companies however BP HSBC Honda Toyota ...one could go on.....

[Nikked]

I love how people bag out toyota on the "boring and bland" basis as if its a bad thing...toyota didnt get to where they are by building cars for a minority if fans...they build cars that people want...

[Franco Cozzo]

People say Landcruisers, especially the older ones like 60 series (1980s) are bullet proof and can go anywhere.

Well we bogged our 60 series Troopy this weekend gone on our bush bashing trip into the wombat state forest, twice.

We also managed to push the rear wheels and diff to the right of the car some how, so the rear left wheel is inside the guard close to the chassis rail and the rear right wheel is now sticking out past the guard.

We had one of the last of the Rodeo 4x4s out with us as well, turbo diesel, manual, and it got further easier and had to recover the troopy those two times. It sustained only minor damage from tree branches scratching it up.

The Rodeo is standard, has an LSD from factory, other than the bigger mud tyres, its factory. The troopy has much higher ground clearance and front/rear LSD, but it didn't help all that much.

Everything that is mass produced has its faults, you might be unlucky and get the dodgy one, doesn't matter if its Toyota or Daewoo, or you might be lucky and get the one without any faults and seems to be put together perfectly.

I've seen plenty of Toyotas come and go in the other workshop I did some time in for experience.

With my experience with Ford:

My Focus has had some problems:

- Split the injector seal on injector no. 3
- Killed a battery at around 14,000km mark
- Burst the injector return line
- Dash rattles at idle loudly
- Fabric on the rear seat in the boot is peeling off
- Runs like crap in weather above 25 degrees
- Killed the front OEM tyres at around 25,000km (I've since replaced with other tyres and they're above 50%, so no change in driving style)

and a few other small problems here and there, but others on this very forum with the same series Focus have had no such problems, maybe I just got the one built on Friday arvo.

My Fiesta on the other hand, is perfect, it has an odd glitch with the stereo every now and again, other than that, no problem what so ever, but some people here have given them lots of grief.

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by wrongwaynorris

" Beats having a manufacturer who admits no fault and when you bring your car in for a fault they say "it's normal, they all do it". Not having recalls does not mean they don't have issues which should be recalled but they don't. "

Would that be like Toyota immediately recalling millions of cars they knew to be KILLING their owners ? Oh sorry they were dragged screaming and kicking by the U.S. Congress to do that werent they after years and years of lies .

Not to mention they recieved a record fine from the NHTSA? or whatever the US Government's road safety department is called for not disclosing the problem, which they knew about but tried to hide.

Yep, Toyota have higher morals than all the others

Toyotas are not bulletproof either, they have problems like all other manufacturers do. My dad's Prado is only 18 months old and its already had the leather rub through on the steering wheel in 3 places, which was replaced, there's a very loud rattle coming from the B pillar, the rear bench seats rattle over bumps and the stereo magically decides it wants to scan for radio stations at random intervals all by itself. If I can remember correctly the diff seal had to be replaced too.

[ryeman]

[QUOTE=Bossxr8......for not disclosing the problem, which they knew about but tried to hide. ....[/QUOTE]

Does any know what exactly were these problems?

[Bossxr8]

Carpet mats jamming under the throttle pedals.

[ryeman]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Carpet mats jamming under the throttle pedals.

Yes God help us only in America, Tokyo didn't realise how stupid some could be, but then on second thoughts American factories probably insisted on putting the accelerator well below the brake pedal, as I have already said in this post, thus causing the problem and using Toyota as a scapegoat.
I'm pretty sure other manufacturers had this ' problem ' .
Some recall!

[mik]

Originally Posted by wrongwaynorris

To all you keen Toyota buyers I am starting an online cardigan , sandals and walking socks shop , hope to see yo all there real soon . Can someone who owns a Toyota tell me if the total situational unawarness courses are included in the price of the car . Boring bland cars for boring bland vehicle steerers . Do you want to marry the goer in short skirts , stockings , suspenders and heels or the frump in a track suit who can cook , iron , run the household budget and gives you ZERO excitment ?

you forgot the cushions on the rear parcel shelf .

[wrongwaynorris]

Originally Posted by SumoDog68

[WIKI][/WIKI]

From memory you do own a Toyota ?

My wife owns a Lexus

[wrongwaynorris]

Originally Posted by ryeman

Audi in the 70-80s were sued to the extent of withdrawing fm the US.
Civil court cases that were successfully brought by 'victims' etc as a result of claims that the cars would, inexplicably, accelerate through the garage door/gates incl running over others.

Decades later, it was quietly concluded that driver became confused between th go and the woa pedals cos they were both aligned at the same height above floor. We take that for granted but Americans find that strange. Their go pedals were much further from the brake, which required you to lift your leg completely of the floor to brake. You couldn't just swivel like we do.
'Victims' made literally millions each, never repaid.
Runaway cc is another US phenomena not to mention floor mats! and other natural disasters that seem to beset yanks.
Forgetting to put air in the tyres of Explorers resulted in OEM Firestones to de-laminate causing rollovers/death/injury (freedom to NOT wear belts) forced Bridgestone takeover but once again courts awarded millions to the stupid.
One could go on about the stupid US drivers and the equally stupid civil courts.

Am still waiting for a 60min/4 corners expose, don't hold yr breath yanks never admit to mistakes. Foreign companies however BP HSBC Honda Toyota ...one could go on.....

Did Audi , Firestone and others openly boast in internal emails about how many hundreds of millions of dollars they saved by not recalling cars ? And just remember that Toyotas global head office Tokyo did NOT respond order Toyota US to recall any cars until the whole thing was exposed but instead congratulated them .

[The Snout]

Doesn't look like the recalls have hurt them much.

[jamies]

I work for Toyota but own a Fpv pursuit ute, I'm lucky enough to have a SR5 2012 drive car. The diffrence between the two in quality is poles a part I hate to say it but The Fpv is very poorly put together. I love the ute and will never sell it. But I had to fix a few things that are common parts that come loose.. Jacking point cover fell off, Fog lamp sorrounds loose. Side skirts loose. just minor stuff. I used to work for ford as a parts rep and loved these utes as soon as I saw them. The Hilux is a solid ute and not to many things go wrong with them.. but servicing issues are the most costly especially in Turbo Diesel. I've been in parts over 20 years and have worked with Holden,Ford and now Toyota.. I love the falcons and the Fpv's.. but as an every day family car toyota's do build a good product with good finance and a large range of vehicles to suit all different people.. Mazda and alot of the other manufacturers are making ground that Ford and Holden once held strong 15 years ago. Over the years Ford and Holden have dropped the baton and lost ground..

[302 XC]

Originally Posted by wrongwaynorris

To all you keen Toyota buyers I am starting an online cardigan , sandals and walking socks shop , hope to see yo all there real soon . Can someone who owns a Toyota tell me if the total situational unawarness courses are included in the price of the car . Boring bland cars for boring bland vehicle steerers . Do you want to marry the goer in short skirts , stockings , suspenders and heels or the frump in a track suit who can cook , iron , run the household budget and gives you ZERO excitment ?

Seriously,you have a minimal idea ....
Toyota even in the 70s had cars far more advanced for the time than those offered here from our local brands
2 barrell carbs on 4 cylinders, wow and we all go all gaga over 2V 250s ....
"Its a factory hottie that 2 barrell carbed 250 "
Clutch fans on even the povo packs, over head cams,on even the basic corollas
Reliability,that was one reason when younger corollas were common for me, 3K,4K engines that you just couldnt destroy for any amount of neglect ....
We can bag the brand all we like, truth is bland,boring or not, they are a better brand than most and sales, resale prove that point time and time again
No 1 car manufacturer last year,you dont get that buy selling minority sales

[ryeman]

Only in America do cars fail spectacularly ..... There's a constant there somewhere .....let me see .....what could it be....?

[302 XC]

Originally Posted by Big Damo

People say Landcruisers, especially the older ones like 60 series (1980s) are bullet proof and can go anywhere.

Well we bogged our 60 series Troopy this weekend gone on our bush bashing trip into the wombat state forest, twice.

We also managed to push the rear wheels and diff to the right of the car some how, so the rear left wheel is inside the guard close to the chassis rail and the rear right wheel is now sticking out past the guard.

We had one of the last of the Rodeo 4x4s out with us as well, turbo diesel, manual, and it got further easier and had to recover the troopy those two times. It sustained only minor damage from tree branches scratching it up.

The Rodeo is standard, has an LSD from factory, other than the bigger mud tyres, its factory. The troopy has much higher ground clearance and front/rear LSD, but it didn't help all that much.

Depending on the actual situation, experience can play a huge part in wether a car can get stuck regardless of what lockers,tyres it has
IF your pushed the diff to the side, youve pushed the car to hard ,or it wasnt safe to begin with
Leaf spring rear and sideways movement enuf to put tyres near rails, ,spring bushes are stuffed, spring mounts are stuffed or broken,these things dont happen on cars very easily
Thats not the 30 odd year old cars fault, id throw that in drivers fault basket

[DanielXR8]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Not to mention they recieved a record fine from the NHTSA? or whatever the US Government's road safety department is called for not disclosing the problem, which they knew about but tried to hide.

Yep, Toyota have higher morals than all the others

Toyotas are not bulletproof either, they have problems like all other manufacturers do. My dad's Prado is only 18 months old and its already had the leather rub through on the steering wheel in 3 places, which was replaced, there's a very loud rattle coming from the B pillar, the rear bench seats rattle over bumps and the stereo magically decides it wants to scan for radio stations at random intervals all by itself. If I can remember correctly the diff seal had to be replaced too.

Toyota was fined for delaying the reporting of defects.

How do you think Ford Australia would go if held to the same accountability by our Government?

[Joe5619]

Originally Posted by DanielXR8

Toyota was fined for delaying the reporting of defects.

How do you think Ford Australia would go if held to the same accountability by our Government?

And what makes you think Australia doesn't have the same kind of laws to protect Australian consumers??

[mik]

yeah they where`nt and are`nt all like that though 302 XC, let us not make them out to be perfect, the old celica`s noisey timing chains where common, the little corollas in standard form where as gutless as sin, mates and i used to joke about the gauge of metal they where made out of, we used to call them kero tins,
other models had head gasget issues just like other cars, ever driven an early lite ace...what a ---- ---, early tarago`s it was said in crash tests the occupants feet added considerable structural integrity to the front end in the event of a head on, hence they ended up building the y chassis, major diesel problems have been reported on some early land cruisers, and let us not forget the gold cost of parts when that time comes, i could go on.

[wrongwaynorris]

Originally Posted by 302 XC

Seriously,you have a minimal idea ....
Toyota even in the 70s had cars far more advanced for the time than those offered here from our local brands
2 barrell carbs on 4 cylinders, wow and we all go all gaga over 2V 250s ....
"Its a factory hottie that 2 barrell carbed 250 "
Clutch fans on even the povo packs, over head cams,on even the basic corollas
Reliability,that was one reason when younger corollas were common for me, 3K,4K engines that you just couldnt destroy for any amount of neglect ....
We can bag the brand all we like, truth is bland,boring or not, they are a better brand than most and sales, resale prove that point time and time again
No 1 car manufacturer last year,you dont get that buy selling minority sales

Seriously some of you people never actually bloody read what I write . Where have I ever said in this thread or others they were not well built ? My constant complaint is they are the ultimate incarnation of white goods on wheels deliberately made to appeal to people who have NO idea about cars , people to whom driving is a chore not something to be enjoyed . People who drive because they have to not drive for the sheer pleasure of it , people who if they could get away with it would simply push a button and let the car do 100% of everything for them . People who want ridiculously over assisted power steering so as to give zero feedback ( even at low speeds ) as to what the front tyres are doing , people who want such ridiculously over assisted brakes that an ant breathing on the pedal will throw you through the windscreen , people who want such ponderous suspension that if you push the car with the windows down you will get gravel rash on your elbows . Sadly or should I say gladly I demand a lot more from a car than a Toyota can ever deliver .

[ryeman]

Beats me, in greater Melbourne how can you find 100 metres of empty road (other than 2-4 in the early hours) to have a fang, disregarding police (that's when they're out).
Plod aside, the country is the last bastion of motoring freedom......nobody dies out there too....

[DJM83]

We have had 2 new Toyotas join our family in the last 6 weeks. My partner purchased a Corolla Ascent sport and my mum a Build 1 Rukus.
Both fantastic cars in my eyes.

[Poetic Justice]

Originally Posted by wrongwaynorris

Seriously some of you people never actually bloody read what I write . Where have I ever said in this thread or others they were not well built ? My constant complaint is they are the ultimate incarnation of white goods on wheels deliberately made to appeal to people who have NO idea about cars , people to whom driving is a chore not something to be enjoyed . People who drive because they have to not drive for the sheer pleasure of it , people who if they could get away with it would simply push a button and let the car do 100% of everything for them . People who want ridiculously over assisted power steering so as to give zero feedback ( even at low speeds ) as to what the front tyres are doing , people who want such ridiculously over assisted brakes that an ant breathing on the pedal will throw you through the windscreen , people who want such ponderous suspension that if you push the car with the windows down you will get gravel rash on your elbows . Sadly or should I say gladly I demand a lot more from a car than a Toyota can ever deliver .

Just for arguments sake, can you give me an example of 3 Toyota models where this is the case that does not include the Camry or Aurion? Camry and Aurion are the easy whipping boys as throughout their entire history they've been labelled as granny cars - so I ask you to bring up some other Toyotas given you're so generalising in your assesment of the Toyota brand.

When I started working for Toyota in 2005 they had the blandest cars I'd ever seen, fact.

These days however it is a completely different story. The Camry and Aurion are awesome cars - they have great fit and finish. They have a fantastic, user involved interior that is comfortably and very functional, good steering wheels, all the things you expect from climate control and reverse cameras etc.

List your reasons for saying they are bland and comparing a same level/same equipped model of a different marque that outdoes it, I'll be willing to bet that you can't do it easily.

[wrongwaynorris]

"Just for arguments sake, can you give me an example of 3 Toyota models where this is the case that does not include the Camry or Aurion? Camry and Aurion are the easy whipping boys as throughout their entire history they've been labelled as granny cars - so I ask you to bring up some other Toyotas given you're so generalising in your assesment of the Toyota brand."

Corolla , Corona , Crown .

" When I started working for Toyota in 2005 they had the blandest cars I'd ever seen, fact. "

And just what has changed between 2005 and now ?

" These days however it is a completely different story. The Camry and Aurion are awesome cars "

You and I have a radically different idea of Awesome .

" they have great fit and finish. "

Again read what I wrote , never said they didn't .

" They have a fantastic, user involved interior that is comfortably and very functional, good steering wheels, all the things you expect from climate control and reverse cameras etc.'"

Again you're just NOT reading what I am saying , all the things you mention have NOTHING to do with vehicle dynamics . If you regard the interior as " User Involved " you are very easily pleased .

" List your reasons for saying they are bland and comparing a same level/same equipped model of a different marque that outdoes it, I'll be willing to bet that you can't do it easily. "

Again you're just not reading what I am saying , you're obsessed with baubles and beads and trinkets NOT vehicle dynamics .

Mazda 6's & Mondeo's craps allover Camry / Aurion , Mazda 3's and Focus's craps all over Corolla , Mazda 2 and Fiesta crap all over Yaris just to mention a few that took me all of 2 nano seconds to come up with .

[Poetic Justice]

But you're telling me they crap all over Toyotas without presenting any facts to back up your argument?

Listing 20 year old models (Crown) as characterising the Toyota brand as boring has no relevance to the topic at hand - that being that Toyota was the global #1 manufacturer in 2012. Therefore, I assume that we are all discussing the current models available from the brand at present. Just because a Crown, which mind you hasn't been sold in Australia for how long now, was a boring/bland car does not mean you are therefore able to suggest that all Toyota products must be the same.

Jump in a 2005 Camry and a 2012 Camry and you won't need me to explain how they've improved in that time.

[wrongwaynorris]

" Jump in a 2005 Camry and a 2012 Camry and you won't need me to explain how they've improved in that time. "

I do on a regular basis and there is absolutely bugger all to differentiate the two .

You are still totally missing the point and NOT reading my posts , it is not baubles and beads I am worried about but the dynamics of the cars and there is bugger all difference . If anything they are worse by putting 200 kW into a chassis manifoldly incapable of harnessing it .

[Poetic Justice]

Under what basis do you say that though?

Your opinion or some sort of fact?

If you can't see the difference in presentation, feel and functionality between an 06 and 12 Camry then I don't think I ought to listen to a further word you are saying. This comparison can be made of any 06-12 vehicles basically.

[302 XC]

Originally Posted by wrongwaynorris

Seriously some of you people never actually bloody read what I write . Where have I ever said in this thread or others they were not well built ? My constant complaint is they are the ultimate incarnation of white goods on wheels deliberately made to appeal to people who have NO idea about cars , people to whom driving is a chore not something to be enjoyed . People who drive because they have to not drive for the sheer pleasure of it , people who if they could get away with it would simply push a button and let the car do 100% of everything for them . People who want ridiculously over assisted power steering so as to give zero feedback ( even at low speeds ) as to what the front tyres are doing , people who want such ridiculously over assisted brakes that an ant breathing on the pedal will throw you through the windscreen , people who want such ponderous suspension that if you push the car with the windows down you will get gravel rash on your elbows . Sadly or should I say gladly I demand a lot more from a car than a Toyota can ever deliver .

Its regardless of toyota boringness, the lack of this or that
They sell cars , regardless of how bland many think they are
Its all about selling cars, maybe if ford and holden realise that the majority of brain dead drivers dont need 400,500 KW V8s to do the daily commute,cars that dont need to do 11 sec 1/4 mile, they mite do what toyota do , sell bloody cars

Look at previous years sales figures, toyota are top of their game, over and over,year after year
If makin boring white appliances means sales,then make boring white appliances ....
Not only do they make white appliances, but those white appliances have better resale than the equivelant ford or holden
Theres no need to tell tall stories, the sales, the reputation,the resale does all the talking
Yes there are dud models ,or dud issues ,you get that in every field of any manufacturing,dud models here and there,dud issues here and there , they all have them, but doesnt change the fact toyota are on top of the hill leading the sales race

[jpblue1000]

I'm not a Toyota Fan...I base this on asking myself what Toyota would I drive, I don't compare them against anything else in this equation, and I come up with very few of their cars that Suit my desires. Supra Turbo, Celica AWD, AE86, BRZ-86 thing or Landcruiser (should I ever want to play in the mud) But that's It (yes I have driven all of them except the new 86). In the history of Cars though those mentioned are pretty damn good, rarely described as boring Dynamically, and all generally are considered reliable and well built. While as mentioned Im not a prospective Purchaser, I sure can see why they do so well. Not the best cars in any way but good enough in enough ways to sell well, combined with production of cars in most genres, there is a Toyota for everyone and for every need
Toyota as most manufacturers are running a business, a very large business, they are there to make money and keep making money for shareholders and staff. They have identified a market and targeted it, similar story to VW. very good business acumen. I am sure if they discovered their customers ideas changed about what they wanted/needed Toyota would be there fulfilling that need. look at the 86 as an example.
There are a few other manufacturers who could learn a lot from them.
JP

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by 302 XC

Depending on the actual situation, experience can play a huge part in wether a car can get stuck regardless of what lockers,tyres it has
IF your pushed the diff to the side, youve pushed the car to hard ,or it wasnt safe to begin with
Leaf spring rear and sideways movement enuf to put tyres near rails, ,spring bushes are stuffed, spring mounts are stuffed or broken,these things dont happen on cars very easily
Thats not the 30 odd year old cars fault, id throw that in drivers fault basket

Absolutely true about the experience part, but people make these things out to be bullet proof no matter who is behind the wheel and that they don't break.

Everything breaks.

We've damaged one of the leaf springs too, one of the leafs is sitting out sideways instead of straight.

Lets face it, something from the 1980s which has been off road all its life is going to need some TLC.

Something positive I noticed about a new RAV4 we were fitting orange beacons to today is that the engine bay is nice and roomy around its 4 cylinder engine and the alternator is in a very easy to get to position so when it needs to be replaced its a simple job.