Reminder-Victorian State Elections TODAY - Page 2

snortycorty · 25-11-2006, 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Full Noise

We can still live in hope. If Bracks loses, I will personally offer my services to clean his office out and help the new bloke shift in.

I'll help too! (and he'll be leaving with a nice big footprint on the behind of his pants *cackles*)

Outbackjack · 25-11-2006, 06:48 PM

Hi all, although this peice is has naothing to do with the Vic election, I thought that it was a brilliant comentary on some of the personalities in Australian politics..... The original was anonymous.......

An Analysis of the Report of the NT Road Safety Taskforce 2006: On the Culture of Bureaucracy
The culture of bureaucracy is one of standardisation. It is also one of restriction and control. All must bow to the uniformity decreed in a bureaucratic dictatorship. All must follow the same rules. This need for control over other people is found in politicians, bureaucrats and other ‘interfering’ type personalities. Make no mistake - this excessive need for control and restriction for its own sake is a pathological condition and outside the sphere of a normal personality.

There needs to be a change of culture within public office, away from the ‘I know best’ paternalism left over from the ‘aboriginal protection’ days, to one of serving the people, rather than being their master.

Many aspects of the Report of the NT Road Safety Taskforce are underlined by this pathology. We will see how circular logic and reasoning is used to bolster a belief system which takes little consideration of a reality which refuses to conform to its assumptions.

Anyone see any parallels here???

XA-Coupe · 25-11-2006, 06:55 PM

it is an interesting question.. what if there is no one you want to vote for ?? If you make a valid vote it is a donkey vote, if it is invalid it's informal ... but why should we be forced to vote for someone we don't want ?? I fail to see how that is democratic. Voting for anyone other than the major parties means nothing as they just hand out their preferences as they see fit, not necessarily as you would want them
The yank system is open to abuse ( buying votes ) but at least you vote only if you feel strongly enough to want someone to have your vote.
I think I need a beer after all that thought ....

AU2PWR · 25-11-2006, 07:11 PM

Seconded

MITCHAY · 25-11-2006, 07:32 PM

Hope you guys can kick that Bracks ******** out!

XA-Coupe · 25-11-2006, 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MITCHAY

Hope you guys can kick that Bracks ******** out!

well, the dice is cast now, though I don't think bracks is going anywhere.

MITCHAY · 25-11-2006, 07:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XA-Coupe

well, the dice is cast now, though I don't think bracks is going anywhere.

Bet there will be a huge celebration among our forums if he did get kicked out! Fingers crossed for you guys.

pecker73 · 25-11-2006, 08:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MITCHAY

Bet there will be a huge celebration among our forums if he did get kicked out! Fingers crossed for you guys.

:

:

I don't think so....

Bearman · 25-11-2006, 08:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XA-Coupe

well, the dice is cast now, though I don't think bracks is going anywhere.

Looks like that's the case!! Now, can I make a post without the swearword blocker going mad????

FUKKIT!!!! Four more years of Bracks shyte. Who the ***** votes for this idiot??? And if Labour retains my local seat (lineball at the moment) I'll really spit the dummy.

This is very bad news for Victoria, especially motorists.

MITCHAY · 25-11-2006, 08:55 PM

Maybe he will cut the 3kms to 1.5kms tolerance because it's too dangerous to do that much over the limit. Bad luck guys!

The average person has no idea about politics so it is little wonder why you end up with an unfavourable premier!

Move to ACT. 10% tolerance + 3kms I think it is!

Outbackjack · 25-11-2006, 09:19 PM

Vote with your feet guys.... There is HEAPS of high paying jobs in the NT. And we can at least do 130k legally....... Only one more month of our beloved (//) roads. But 130 is better than any other place in Australia..... Good luck with the thief Bracks guys, who the hell voted for him anyway?

I have some land in Vic that he has been punishing me for owning by making me pay tax on something that is mine and has NOTHING to do with the vic government... Well its going on the market now. I will be 100% free from Victorian taxes..... It really p1sses me off to pay tax to a government that I have no say/vote....

Work Horse · 25-11-2006, 09:52 PM

Bailleiu has conceded stating it's been a great few weeks for democracy.

Lib's had no chance and it's hard to see them getting up next time after this. It appears Labor have increased their majority.

This is not good for democracy.

ltd · 25-11-2006, 11:11 PM

Sorry to hear guys, Bracks only lost about 2 seats.
That bodes awfully for NSW (No Services or Water) in 2007, looks like we'll be stuck with Iemma the member for Lakemba, and all of his dope smoking, proclivity loving buddies.
Note to self, watch speedo when going over the border, crash and then file suit against bracks for making me drive with my attention off the road.

On a sidenote, what slogan did they use this time? Bracks LOVES Tax?

Hawk · 25-11-2006, 11:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XA-Coupe

it is an interesting question.. what if there is no one you want to vote for ?? If you make a valid vote it is a donkey vote, if it is invalid it's informal ... but why should we be forced to vote for someone we don't want ?? I fail to see how that is democratic. Voting for anyone other than the major parties means nothing as they just hand out their preferences as they see fit, not necessarily as you would want them
The yank system is open to abuse ( buying votes ) but at least you vote only if you feel strongly enough to want someone to have your vote.
I think I need a beer after all that thought ....

You could always form a party.......I can see the billboards now:

Are you balding? Do you like fast *cough* looking cars? Do you feel you have the right to take pot shots at your neighbour's cat with your shotty? Want the freedom to invite thousands of car fans to your house for Bathurst celebrations?

Introducing Jeff's Avengers - bringing the party back into political party.

Jeff is the name of our leader and is not in alignment with Jeff Kennett

Authorised and fully backed by Carlton & United Brewery

Hmmm....catchy

T_Terror · 25-11-2006, 11:43 PM

**** me this makes me angry.

I really thought that the tide had turned and people had realised how inept Bracks was.

But from the last 2 weeks i could see that Labour was going to win, the stupidity of people got the better of them. The most annoying thing was the main reason most people i met voted.
They follow the ridiculous belief that labour looks out for the little people and that liberals only helps big business. MAYBE BACK IN THE INDUSTRIAL REVOLUTION OF 1800s!

Then the retarded belief that the state government somehow has a say in the industrial reforms. OMG if Ted gets in then we'll all be destroyed by Workchoices. As if Steve can do anything to change them. I love how he has setup a hotline for people who feel they have been screwed by the new laws. Do they employ people to sit on teh phones and dole out pity, cause theres not much else they can do.

I really consider moving overseas/interstate with this crap...

Hawk · 25-11-2006, 11:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by T_Terror

**** me this makes me angry.

I really thought that the tide had turned and people had realised how inept Bracks was.

But from the last 2 weeks i could see that Labour was going to win, the stupidity of people got the better of them. The most annoying thing was the main reason most people i met voted.
They follow the ridiculous belief that labour looks out for the little people and that liberals only helps big business. MAYBE BACK IN THE INDUSTRIAL REVOLUTION OF 1800s!

The thing that really seemed to hurt the Libs was that Ted wasn't in power long enough. Doyle was in for way too long and it meant that Baillieu's run was left too late - meaning he couldn't truly convince people over a period of, say, a year and a half. That would have been an ideal lead-up, he wouldn't have had to rush and deal with the lingering Robert Doyle death cloud.

Outbackjack · 26-11-2006, 12:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by T_Terror

**** me this makes me angry.

I really consider moving overseas/interstate with this crap...

As I said earlier, there are plenty of well paid jobs up here in the north. Only problem we still have Clare to deal with..... But at least Jodeen Carney is shaping up as a viable alternative.....

It would seem that Victoria has lots of people that deserve a Bracks Government running their lives.. :yeees:

Full Spectrum · 26-11-2006, 01:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Full Noise

We can still live in hope. If Bracks loses, I will personally offer my services to clean his office out and help the new bloke shift in.

Why? He probably owns a company that will do it:P

Sounds like a bunch of wingers in here lol:P.
Maybe people vote labour based on other things and not just because we got caught speeding and got fined for it.
revenues from the people all government do it all governments have it.
Like i said once before all everyone ever does is ***** about speed cameras, What about gambling? That kills family's that ends lives that's a real reason too *****.
What do i care about speed cameras for i haven't been booked speeding if i did it's my fault, Got a red light fine 3 weeks ago my fault do i blame bracks? Some would but i blame me because it wasn't too smart on my behalf.
We should be thinking about more important things.
How do we save water, And make it last so our kids don't have restrictors placed on there taps once they hit an amount of water per day. It's happen before my mother recalls it
Lower wage people working 2 jobs how do we support them and there family's better so they all get a fare go.
Look into alternative fuels so we can still drive our cars in 30 years time and still get a bloody speeding fine and not get one because we ride push bikes and did nothing about it 30 years earlier.
Do the things that makes us the greatest city in the world, Hold the sporting events that brings people from all over the world too our city.
Upgrade or hospitals and cut waiting time almost too nothing have a doctor that there job is too diagnosed people when they come in so if it's minor they can fix them and send them away and other who are serious move them too the wards or emergency's departments, Just don't leave them sitting and waiting.
Schools more needs too be done there cuts class sizes so teachers can work with smaller number and not let some kids be ignored. When i was in school we had class sizes of 30+.
But when it comes too water things should have been done years ago, If we started 4-5 years ago today our water might not be half as bad too slow now it's catch up.

Think people forget the way we are taxed thanks too the federal government.
Can't even **** on my plants without that being taxed because of the water or drink i drank being taxed.
Can't even enjoy a nice drive without being taxed for it, Can't smell the air because the hey fever medicine i took it's taxed. Can't eat a nice meal without it being taxed.
Can't sit in this chair right now without something being revenue generated.

Problem with speed limits is people will always travel at the speed they can get away with, If the speed limit was 65 and you get booked doing 68 they will do 67. What ever you get booked with is what there limit will be. if you can do 110 in a 100 zone and not be booked for it think how many will do it.

**Falcon Coupe** · 26-11-2006, 01:19 AM

Bracks has had 7 years to tackle these problems, if people vote for him, it's thier funeral.

Full Spectrum · 26-11-2006, 01:22 AM

Half these could have been fixed many more years ago also;).
These problems are getting better but still not fast enough.
I doubt very much a change of government would speed things up.

**Falcon Coupe** · 26-11-2006, 01:23 AM

It did from Kirner to kennet, we went from red to black.

pauljh74 · 26-11-2006, 01:25 AM

How can women find pollies sexy? They only get an election once every few years. ;)

Really, at the moment, Victorian politics is pretty poor - the guy that got voted in has benefited from the previous government's management and done little since. According to the people, he's the better choice. We're still seriously short of police, hospitals and education are under-funded, major promises they were elected on broken and others are delivered very late and well over budget. Not to mention he can't get anything done without employing an army of consultants. Now he promises to fix it all up magically. I think that the bullsh!t meter has just shot off the scale - even considering it is politics.

brenx · 26-11-2006, 01:31 AM

The only reason I can see people not voting Liberal is IR laws. It's the majority that get affected and the majority who get whomever they want in.

MethodX · 26-11-2006, 05:09 AM

Lack of policy too

A good result, me happy.

Casper · 26-11-2006, 08:40 AM

The sheople have voted (baaaa).. I'm over it, I'm going racing before Bracks fits speed camera's the the 1/4 mile tracks. :jab:

Jeeepers · 26-11-2006, 08:51 AM

Interesting responses and opinions. I voted and lost. I do find it interesting though, that if one never registers as a voter, one never has to. And once registered you can be fined for not voting. Where is our right not to vote? Surely this is unconstitutional, to fine registered voters, and let those who don't register go unchallenged? Something I have pondered on for many years. Oh, and the only way off the register is death, or migration.

I am not saying I wouldn't, or don't want to vote. Just that it's an interesting system we have.

ltd · 26-11-2006, 09:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slick_Aussie

Why? He probably owns a company that will do it:P

Sounds like a bunch of wingers in here lol:P.
Maybe people vote labour based on other things and not just because we got caught speeding and got fined for it.
revenues from the people all government do it all governments have it.
Like i said once before all everyone ever does is ***** about speed cameras, What about gambling? That kills family's that ends lives that's a real reason too *****.
What do i care about speed cameras for i haven't been booked speeding if i did it's my fault, Got a red light fine 3 weeks ago my fault do i blame bracks? Some would but i blame me because it wasn't too smart on my behalf.
We should be thinking about more important things.
How do we save water, And make it last so our kids don't have restrictors placed on there taps once they hit an amount of water per day. It's happen before my mother recalls it
Lower wage people working 2 jobs how do we support them and there family's better so they all get a fare go.
Look into alternative fuels so we can still drive our cars in 30 years time and still get a bloody speeding fine and not get one because we ride push bikes and did nothing about it 30 years earlier.
Do the things that makes us the greatest city in the world, Hold the sporting events that brings people from all over the world too our city.
Upgrade or hospitals and cut waiting time almost too nothing have a doctor that there job is too diagnosed people when they come in so if it's minor they can fix them and send them away and other who are serious move them too the wards or emergency's departments, Just don't leave them sitting and waiting.
Schools more needs too be done there cuts class sizes so teachers can work with smaller number and not let some kids be ignored. When i was in school we had class sizes of 30+.
But when it comes too water things should have been done years ago, If we started 4-5 years ago today our water might not be half as bad too slow now it's catch up.

Think people forget the way we are taxed thanks too the federal government.
Can't even **** on my plants without that being taxed because of the water or drink i drank being taxed.
Can't even enjoy a nice drive without being taxed for it, Can't smell the air because the hey fever medicine i took it's taxed. Can't eat a nice meal without it being taxed.
Can't sit in this chair right now without something being revenue generated.

Problem with speed limits is people will always travel at the speed they can get away with, If the speed limit was 65 and you get booked doing 68 they will do 67. What ever you get booked with is what there limit will be. if you can do 110 in a 100 zone and not be booked for it think how many will do it.

Slick, you've touched on a lot of points here mate but I can tell you from a manufacturing perspective that there is a few things you should consider.
Up until June 2000, any manufactured good had sales tax of 22% on it.
Once the GST came in, our prices went down, as we no longer needed to charge customers that 22%.
There was also a raft of different taxes such as 12% and 16% on various goods; but nothing in Australia was not taxed at one level or the other.
Furthermore, in trying to keep their power base, state governments have the portfolios of water and if vic is anything like NSW, then we should all be very worried. We had outbreaks of ghiardia and crypto-spiridium in Sydneys catchment twice, and we were all told to boil our water. Why, because NSW had been ripping dividends out of Sydney water since coming to power; money otherwise spent on maintenance.
For your perusal I have outlined the basic responsibilities of both state and federal, at the moment we have some states (NSW) going backwards due to frittered away monies and years of neglect.

STATE
Roads
Hospitals
Water
Psychiatric care
Education
Police
Public Transport
Energy
Gaming (Gambling)
Revenue Cameras
Land Tax,Stamp Duties, vendor tax, FID, Water usage Tax etc.
Work cover (biggest rort of all time - if you have an accident at work, claim 150 grand then you get your payout, the employers premium goes up 50 grand each year for 3 years to recover the money. How is this insurance)?
State Economy (like when Vic does better than NSW in trade and jobless etc)
REVENUES - From GST (all is divided amongst the states), state taxes and levies, payroll tax.

FEDERAL
Industrial Relations
Tourism
Trade
Environment
Federal Roads
Australian Economy
PBS
Health allocates money to the states - albeit not a good idea in NSW
Education again allocates money to the states, how it is spent/mis-spent is not in the federal governments direct control
REVENUES - Collects GST but does not keep it, income tax, LCT, company tax etc.
Essentially, the states have most jurasdiction over their own borders and the federal government can't do things like say "we want a new dam here".
The states have to agree, concessions have to be made and as such we often have things like funding for the pacific highway waiting as the states have to match the federal input dollar for dollar - as stipulated in their agreement, which has now been overturned as NSW has no money to spend, and the federal government doesn't want to be seen to do nothing.

Whilst I just put my flame suit on, I'll leave you with this parting thought.
Predominantly the liberals come from the private sector, business background which makes them good economic managers, and Labour come from Unionist, public service backgrounds and therefore tend not to be the smartest and ergo good economic managers at all - especially with all the states running deficit budgets now. This has been our history where labour gets in for years, mucks the joint up in their quest to get votes and then the libs have to go in to fix it. BTW, in NSW we have just had an additional charge on our greenslips of $50.00 that is supposed to help at fault victims of accidents. Unfortunately, as we have seen in the past with workers comp being 3 billion in the red (don't ask me how as they get every cent spent on claims back), we can be sure they will louse this one up and I predict within 2 years we'll be paying approximately $100.00 each. The money involved actually goes back to consolidated revenue. Nice huh?

brenx · 26-11-2006, 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ORSM T

Interesting responses and opinions. I voted and lost. I do find it interesting though, that if one never registers as a voter, one never has to. And once registered you can be fined for not voting. Where is our right not to vote? Surely this is unconstitutional, to fine registered voters, and let those who don't register go unchallenged? Something I have pondered on for many years. Oh, and the only way off the register is death, or migration.

I am not saying I wouldn't, or don't want to vote. Just that it's an interesting system we have.

So much for democracy ey? In the US and England they have a democracy but voting isn't compulsory.

Don't know about others but I'd feel better that if I didn't vote and someone I didn't want in Gov got in? Thats my fault for not voting. Rather than vote and the Gov you don't want getting in anyway.

Lagom · 26-11-2006, 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ltd

Whilst I just put my flame suit on, I'll leave you with this parting thought.
Predominantly the liberals come from the private sector, business background which makes them good economic managers, and Labour come from Unionist, public service backgrounds and therefore tend not to be the smartest and ergo good economic managers at all - especially with all the states running deficit budgets now. This has been our history where labour gets in for years, mucks the joint up in their quest to get votes and then the libs have to go in to fix it.

Aah, there are more states than New South Wales

QLD is forecasting a $245.0 million surplus - http://www.budget.qld.gov.au/snapshot/index.html.

VIC is forecasting a $418.6 million surplus - http://www.dtf.vic.gov.au/

WA is forecasting a $1,275 million surplus - http://www.dtf.wa.gov.au/cms/uploade...ASTRUCT%85.pdf

SA is forecasting a $91 million surplus - http://www.treasury.sa.gov.au/public...t.jsp?xcid=984

TAS & NSW are the only ALP states forecasting operating deficits for 2006-07.

pecker73 · 26-11-2006, 01:49 PM

[QUOTE=Quote:
Originally Posted by ltd
Whilst I just put my flame suit on, I'll leave you with this parting thought.
Predominantly the liberals come from the private sector, business background which makes them good economic managers, and Labour come from Unionist, public service backgrounds and therefore tend not to be the smartest and ergo good economic managers at all - especially with all the states running deficit budgets now. This has been our history where labour gets in for years, mucks the joint up in their quest to get votes and then the libs have to go in to fix it. [/QUOTE]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lagom

Aah, there are more states than New South Wales

QLD is forecasting a $245.0 million surplus - http://www.budget.qld.gov.au/snapshot/index.html.

VIC is forecasting a $418.6 million surplus - http://www.dtf.vic.gov.au/

WA is forecasting a $1,275 million surplus - http://www.dtf.wa.gov.au/cms/uploade...ASTRUCT%85.pdf

SA is forecasting a $91 million surplus - http://www.treasury.sa.gov.au/public...t.jsp?xcid=984

TAS & NSW are the only ALP states forecasting operating deficits for 2006-07.

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