VE Commodore Front Structure

[Citroënbender]

I think the pseudo-long weekend is bringing a bout of “tomorrowitis” for many. Waiting to hear back from several privateers to lock in sales, after an initial good response. Not achieving much on the job card, doesn’t sit well with my expectations of self.

[Interceptor]

What long weekend?

[Citroënbender]

Tuesday being Anzac Day, a lot of people seem to be having Monday off.

What do Holden people typically call this part? Knowing the most favoured description will help me bargain hunt.

[prktkljokr]

like this for $50
https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/25467245...evt=1&mkcid=28

[Citroënbender]

Yes, I was hoping to find a consistent “everyday” name so I didn’t look like a complete bunny. Like, it might be known as a resonator hose, or intake trunking, or a throttle body hose.

There’s several versions, it seems the 3.6 is consistently using one of them but I might need the old unit to compare numbers.

[Citroënbender]

And a stray punchline, partway through.

Old mate, at seven this morning: “Would this be a good opportunity to do the timing chains?”

So, yeah, LLT donk. What kit is best value/most suited for a 265K motor, two senior owners, that’s missed the last three or four oil changes?

[cs123]

This guy did a video on front end collision repair on a VY. Might be worth a watch. There are 3 videos he made.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y92ZnSjaON0

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by Citroënbender

And a stray punchline, partway through.

Old mate, at seven this morning: “Would this be a good opportunity to do the timing chains?”

So, yeah, LLT donk. What kit is best value/most suited for a 265K motor, two senior owners, that’s missed the last three or four oil changes?

The genuine GM kit

[Citroënbender]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

The genuine GM kit

Do you know which US GM kits it crosses to?

I provided mileage and service history as some kits mention oil pump guides, others sprockets, some add a water pump.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by Citroënbender

Do you know which US GM kits it crosses to?

I provided mileage and service history as some kits mention oil pump guides, others sprockets, some add a water pump.

The only kit they have in stock is the 'timing gear set' at the bottom, but they don't actually say what the kit includes when you go into 'more details' - I've just used 09-2011 LLT SV6 Commodore as the guide for this.

Typical bull**** half *** cataloguing, lets ice all our skilled parts guys and go to electronic cataloging but do it half assed so everyone has to call anyway.

[Citroënbender]

The only timing kit part number I could find was 92282427 and I couldn’t get clarity on what was in it.

Was talking to a wrecker today called Tyson (no, he didn’t chew my ear! ) and he indicated that a genuine kit with heaps of redundant bits (at least how they used it…) was the go.

Now have replacement intake trunking, decent used (genuine) radiator and picking up tomorrow arvo genuine used S1 projector headlights in allegedly good condition. I’m $239 in after that, including 250ml of Red Passion basecoat (@vgautopaints) for edging up.

Now I know the visible differences between S1 and S2 lights it’s given me confidence to say they were the first type.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by Citroënbender

The only timing kit part number I could find was 92282427 and I couldn’t get clarity on what was in it.

Was talking to a wrecker today called Tyson (no, he didn’t chew my ear! ) and he indicated that a genuine kit with heaps of redundant bits (at least how they used it…) was the go.

Now have replacement intake trunking, decent used (genuine) radiator and picking up tomorrow arvo genuine used S1 projector headlights in allegedly good condition. I’m $239 in after that, including 250ml of Red Passion basecoat (@vgautopaints) for edging up.

Now I know the visible differences between S1 and S2 lights it’s given me confidence to say they were the first type.

Any of that real important stuff like timing hardware and engine sensors - genuine is best.

All the new aftermarket MAF sensors being sold through the parts resellers for the AU wheezer Falcons are causing issues at the moment, they're not the right one for the car and its causing them to run massively rich.

[Citroënbender]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

The only kit they have in stock is the 'timing gear set' at the bottom, but they don't actually say what the kit includes when you go into 'more details' - I've just used 09-2011 LLT SV6 Commodore as the guide for this.

I’ve been scraping up images with Google, the timing gear set is four variator sprockets with centre bolts, two intermediate (transfer) sprockets with bolts, and crank sprocket with new washer.

The chain kit is epic, it’s gaskets, seals, bolts, yada yada.

Image credit: Australian Online Car Parts (also hyperlinked from image)



Image credit: Oz Car Parts (although via eBay)

I’d like to know what the sensible criteria is for replacing or not replacing the gears.

[Franco Cozzo]

Chain kit is showing no stock at my local dealership and no stock at their VIC DC either which is a concern

[Citroënbender]

The breakdown list I cribbed, would probably help cross to a US kit. I haven’t joined any Commodore forums yet but that could be a source of such information.

Honestly though, at this point - I’m thinking it might be “tidier” to get the bodywork across the line and see if the tensioner screens are just a little crudded-up via a few flushes and changes. $2K in parts plus whatever labour on top is a fair whack in light of the present situation.

[commodorenutt]

The timing chains are so much easier with the front off the car. You can’t really pull it all off a again later, without having to degas and regas the AC again, so you’re better off doing it now. You’ll curse yourself if you have to do them later when it’s all back together……

[Citroënbender]

I totally get that, it’s the curse of many jobs.

https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo...11432929&jsn=3

The bones of a genuine kit, not sure if the cover gaskets are LLT or LFX though. I’d still have to scare up guides, and nobody has been able to say what conditions predicate sprocket replacement, or the oil pump (whether it’s genuinely common or uncommon to need them).

So the kit above would be at least a week away, no idea on other parts. I’ve got that E46 screaming for attention and a bunch of other jobs as well.

It’s a pet hate at work of people launching into a job without confirming everything likely needed or the source/price. And then when they get a bill that includes $140 (supply, ex labour) for drop links that should have been $55 because we didn’t look hard enough - it can erode customer confidence.

[Citroënbender]

Returning to the guts of this thread, can/do you mount the headlights on the radiator support before fitting it up?

I have headlights now, there’s a wide range of interpretation between peoples’ ideas about “good condition”, “complete” and “no broken tabs”.

[prktkljokr]

Nope, rad support on first then headlights.

[Citroënbender]

Thanks - was hoping it could be pre-assembled.

[Citroënbender]

How tolerant is the Alloytec to running without coolant? Can you go 250, 500m or not ideal?

Forgot to add my thanks for diagnosis of prior non-running condition. Replacement inlet trunking fixed it perfectly.

[commodorenutt]

It’s a lottery. I know of one that had a leaky water pump, and it went from Penrith to Wetherill Park, with the owner ignoring the temp gauge (which ended up reading “normal” after the coolant level dropped below the sensor). It swallowed 8L of water before it was back to “normal” and he repeated the process several times until he got a new water pump. It’s still doing fine. No warping, no cracking.

But I know of others that were overheated just once, and needed intake gaskets. One needed a head gasket.

If you’re only moving it down the road, and it doesn’t get a chance to warm up, then it will be fine. If you’re worried about it, take the belt off, plug the bottom hose, and fill the block with water. You’ll get 3-4 minutes before it gets warm, but the water will keep the heat even, unlike empty coolant passages.

[Citroënbender]

It’s probably 2km, so that would be four or five “instalments” of driving and waiting. Starts to stretch out the time a bit. I’ve just got to flush the ATF lines in the donor radiator and it can go in - think that’s a job for early tomorrow.

Having “not fun” with backyard wreckers ghosting me.

22 April 2023
G’day, chasing pretty much this for a friend who shunted someone on Thursday with his VE Calais. Do you still have it, and is it free of damage including washer reservoir?
Thanks
5:06 pm
Read

Hi mate 8:18 pm

Still have it 8:18 pm

No damage 8:18 pm

Complete 8:18 pm

23 April 2023
Cheers,
I’ve got some issue with Dumbtree not actually showing my messages the last two weeks just the notifications, it’s a pain.
Happy to see you today, from 11AM onward.
It’s a rush course in Commodores, I’ve had Fords for years. Also looking for the trunking between throttle body and airbox as it got crunched.
Anyhow you’ve got my number from the first message.
Cheers
9:32 am
Read

Hey mate sure I’ll buzz yo soon 2:01 pm

Cheers. Messages are showing again, hopefully will stay visible.
4:45 pm
Read

26 April 2023
Do you still want to sell this? Have ute, cash ready to go.
8:56 am
Read

Hey mate 5:48 pm

Yes still have it 5:48 pm

Great, tell me where and when we can deal. 5:51 pm

Also, I watched a YT video from “Go Tech” that made a simple exposition of changing the timing chains, guides, oil pump, crank sprocket and intermediate idlers. The presenter didn’t replace the cam sprockets perhaps because they aren’t supplied by Mellings - who were sponsoring the video - or perhaps because they felt it wasn’t necessary.

I’ve seen a lot of timing belts changed by age, not mileage, and a complete kit used when a belt alone would have sufficed, hence my questioning of the actual means for determining when to replace.

[Interceptor]

Originally Posted by Citroënbender

I’ve seen a lot of timing belts changed by age, not mileage, and a complete kit used when a belt alone would have sufficed, hence my questioning of the actual means for determining when to replace.

When it comes to tensioners & idler pulleys/bearings, I regard them as something I'd rather replace while I'm in there instead of coming back in 6 months time to re-do the job all over again.

[Citroënbender]

“Kind of” urgent…

Does anyone reading here have a contact who can interrogate the following VIN for colour, please? The basic online decoders are sending it back as white - it’s definitely a red of some sort.

6G1EK55B49L161336

[commodorenutt]

There is a metal tag on the LH strut tower. It will have the correct body paint code on it.

[Citroënbender]

Yes, that’s where I got the damaged vehicle’s paint code of 352N from. But I’m eyeing up a bonnet 30km away (the cited VIN) and don’t want to commit if it’s not right after all.

[Interceptor]

Colour code is GIC/352n and its official name is "Red Passion"

[Citroënbender]

Of that VIN? You’re awesome!

[commodorenutt]

Originally Posted by Citroënbender

Yes, that’s where I got the damaged vehicle’s paint code of 352N from. But I’m eyeing up a bonnet 30km away (the cited VIN) and don’t want to commit if it’s not right after all.

Assuming the seller can’t tell you the code from the tag anymore……

If it’s from a VE1, and it’s a metallic red, then it’s highly likely to be red passion - assuming the colour shade looks close in a picture. Red passion was a colour used from launch, so you’ve got a good spread of years for possible parts.

There are some other metallic reds that came later in VE updates/VE2, like sizzle, that you may not be able to tell apart on a phone or computer screen, but it’s more orange in real life.