Motor Magazine Aug 2009 - Features F6

[GTP owner]

The list is not in any particular order people! The one with the best photo gets the best spot - hence why the f6 was number 1. It does not imply that it is better than the rest. The list is just to stimulate discussion at the pub, not be a definitive statement.
If it was my list it would be
1. xa gtho ph4 coupe
2. xa gtho ph4 sedan
3. xa gt rpo coupe
4. xa gt rpo sedan
5. xa gt coupe
6. xa gt sedan
7. xa 250 2v
8. xa gs
9. any regular xa.
10. xb gt

[SpoolMan]

Originally Posted by flappist

Don't feel bad, most V8 enthusiests don't....

The line is getting shorter, ask (Jeff) XA Coupe....lol.. :

[Iggypoppin']

I just can't believe people think the F6, with 310 kw factory is not muscle. Nowhere does motor say that only old cars are muscle cars. Everyone just remember, just because the F6 is new, doesn't mean it won't go down in history. Maybe not yet!!! But I hardly bet the GTHO when it was released was known to eventually become worth what it is...

[GK]

Originally Posted by flappist

The world does not stand still and what was once the leader is now just a part of history.

Just like the Roman Empire, the Supermarine Spitfire, the Tyranosaurus Rex or Michael Jackson, being at the top is a very transitory thing.

The Supermarine Spitfire was displaced very quickly once they put the Merlin engine into the P51 Mustang.

But again you are correct. Times change and things keep rolling on.

I'm thankful that the Ford is top of the list.

GK

[platinumXR]

Originally Posted by GTP owner

1. xa gtho ph4 coupe
2. xa gtho ph4 sedan
3. xa gt rpo coupe
4. xa gt rpo sedan
5. xa gt coupe
6. xa gt sedan
7. xa 250 2v
8. xa gs
9. any regular xa.
10. xb gt

:

[bingoTE50]

Originally Posted by Dave_au

Bingo on that front too.

What..

I am on no front.....lol :

Maybe they should have said performance cars , not muscle cars....

No one agrees on the term "muscle cars"..

Vehicles for which at least some models in some years of manufacture could be classed as muscle cars. This does not mean that all examples of the cars named were muscle cars, since in many cases the attributes of a muscle car were optional extras (large engine, heavy-duty suspension, etc) or came only on a specific sub-model.

Wikimedia Commons has media related to: Muscle cars

Hmm straightforward really ... :

[smciner1]

Originally Posted by flappist

It is always amusing to read all the arcing up when a list is made and someones's "precious" does not win.

Did you use your best Golum Voice for saying it?

[SSbaby]

Originally Posted by Corzza

Great article on page 44

F6 vs BMW 335i vs Audi S4

Wont give anything away but the F6 holds its own

Article on page 108

Without giving anything away... any performance times?

[GTP-03]

How the hell does the A9X beat the GTHO? Sure it was a weapon in group C guise, but so was the 1977 XC Moffat coupes, shouldnt they be in the list then? I think the A9X race cars some how got blurred with the road going models, does anyone else think the ROAD going A9Xs are overated?

[Wally]

I'm sure the out of the showroom, carbed big block guys would argue none of them are muscle cars anyway. Some may be pony cars, but that's as close as they get.

Let's face it the only cars that you could mention across all age groups at a party and rightly or wrongly get almost universal recognition as beasts are the Falcon GT, Torana, Charger and HSV. Joe public doesn't really know or care about R8, F6, etc.

[Road_Warrior]

From Wikipedia on 'muscle cars'

The Australian muscle car era is considered to have ended with the release of the Australian Design Rule regarding emissions in ADR27a in 1976. An exception to this rule was the small number of factory-built Bathurst 1000 homologation specials that were constructed after 1976: they are considered to be musclecars. Examples of these homologation specials include the Torana A9X and the Bathurst Cobras.

Anyone care to enlighten us great unwashed with what ADR27a is all about?

[Iggypoppin']

emissions or fuel consumption figures?? That'd be my guess

[Falc'man]

Originally Posted by Corzza

Great article on page 44

F6 vs BMW 335i vs Audi S4

Wont give anything away but the F6 holds its own



Article on page 108

TOP 10 AUSSIE MUSCLE CARS


10 - '72 VH Charger E49

9 - '08 HSV W427 :

8 - '72 Torana GTR XU-1

7 - '69 Holden HT Monaro 350

6 - '88 HSV VL Group A

5 - '67 Ford XR Falcon GT

4 - '71 XY Falcon GT HO :sm_headba

3 - '85 HDT VK SS Group A

2 - '77 Holden Torana A9X

1 - '08 FPV F6 WINNER :evilsasmo

There is no way Motor are getting another dime out of me...
/I might have to go "help" with the shopping at Woolies this weekend.


The F6. Is it a muscle car, high performance sedan, grand tourer, (add other description)? Who cares? It's a ripper.

[prydey]

everyone else must be reading a different magazine to the one i bought. mine has a list of 10 muscle cars. sure they are numbered 1-10 but nowhere is there any mention of any order. all 10 cars have a brief speil, but nothing comparing them to the previous or next. to me its just a compilation of 10 cars the journo thinks are the best 10. settle down.

i can't believe the hideous walkinshaw vl made it in the list, but its just one persons opinion.

[prydey]

Originally Posted by SSbaby

Without giving anything away... any performance times?

an interesting thing to note is the 0-170 times between all 3. f6 seems to be really starting to pull away. then when you look at the 1/4 mile times the f6 does 13.3 @179.9. given it does 0-170 in 11.7 i thought there must be a gear change in there but when you look at the graph down the bottom, the f6 does 186 in 3rd. quite a big gap between 170 and 180 compared to the very linear acceleration for the previous 10km/h increments.

very impressive 80-120.

[Bent8]

Originally Posted by prydey

an interesting thing to note is the 0-170 times between all 3. f6 seems to be really starting to pull away. then when you look at the 1/4 mile times the f6 does 13.3 @179.9. given it does 0-170 in 11.7 i thought there must be a gear change in there but when you look at the graph down the bottom, the f6 does 186 in 3rd. quite a big gap between 170 and 180 compared to the very linear acceleration for the previous 10km/h increments.

very impressive 80-120.

Keep in mind getting from 170-180kph in 1.6sec is pretty fast for an 1800kg sedan with rather long gearing.

Looking at the chart above, I'd say the F6 should reach 200 clicks in around 15-16 seconds, which is up there with the expensive euros (M5, E63 etc)

Also the reason for the excellent 80-120 time is because the F6 can do it in 2nd without going into 3rd while the others require a gear change. (I'm assuming this is a manual F6?)

Top marks for the F6 here, as they say, torque talks!

[Rev28K]

Originally Posted by Bent8

(I'm assuming this is a manual F6?)

Nope! Both the 335i and the F6 were ZF autos with the same gearing. They made comments about the gap in gearing between 2nd & 3rd. Exaggerated by the F6's taller diff ratio.

[1TUFFUTE]

what an aaaawwwesome car

[4Vman]

Im really impressed with the Audi range now.

[smciner1]

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

From Wikipedia on 'muscle cars'



Anyone care to enlighten us great unwashed with what ADR27a is all about?

ADR 27 and ADR 27A were Emissions Rules. 27 wasn't much, but 27A really killed performance. Strangly enough, going by road tests of the day, it also made fuel consumption worse.

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by smciner1

ADR 27 and ADR 27A were Emissions Rules. 27 wasn't much, but 27A really killed performance. Strangly enough, going by road tests of the day, it also made fuel consumption worse.

Yep, although i tend to think ADR27 was the last nail in the musclecar coffin...

27A was the dirt in the hole...

[prydey]

Originally Posted by 4Vman

Im really impressed with the Audi range now.

agree! they have an awesome lineup at the moment. great engines, great looks etc. they've really joined bmw and merc as a german powerhouse. once upon a time the m3 was untouchable. now merc and audi both have products that can run with it and arguably better it.

i haven't actually read the article. i just posted up the times as requested. numbers in a straight line are all that matter, right?

[SSbaby]

Originally Posted by prydey

an interesting thing to note is the 0-170 times between all 3. f6 seems to be really starting to pull away. then when you look at the 1/4 mile times the f6 does 13.3 @179.9. given it does 0-170 in 11.7 i thought there must be a gear change in there but when you look at the graph down the bottom, the f6 does 186 in 3rd. quite a big gap between 170 and 180 compared to the very linear acceleration for the previous 10km/h increments.

very impressive 80-120.

Thanks prydey.

For me, the F6 wins hands down, no matter how much better the BMW and Audi may be in the wash up. Few cars can offer the same amount of thrill and bang for the money.

[Walt Kowalski]

They are just journalists

Humans who have applied themselves to reporting/writing

It does not mean their opinions are the same as anyone else or gospel

My experience with the media is that most have a predetermined bias.

Conclusion: There is no need to take their opinions too seriously......

.....

Unless of course they agree with you and then you quote them left right and centre

[Road_Warrior]

Originally Posted by Falc'man

The F6. Is it a muscle car, high performance sedan, grand tourer, (add other description)? Who cares? It's a ripper.

Exactly.

Originally Posted by smciner1

ADR 27 and ADR 27A were Emissions Rules. 27 wasn't much, but 27A really killed performance. Strangly enough, going by road tests of the day, it also made fuel consumption worse.

So I take it that this was the catalyst (no pun intended hurrr hurrr) for the addition of those stupid little black hoses that are everywhere under the bonnets of cars from that era, as well as EGR valves and thermactor pumps?

[Wally]

Originally Posted by Road_Warrior

From Wikipedia on 'muscle cars'



Anyone care to enlighten us great unwashed with what ADR27a is all about?

Just things like EGR, PCV. EECS. The EGR was the thing that caused a drop in power, but Ford just put the crossflow on it's 250 and a 4 barrel on it's 302 to compenesate. It was Holden who suffered AFAIK

[mcnews]

It is a fair enough list but it is only a persons opinion. I laugh at the old Holdens, they were so slow standard it is not funny. In all the old tests with stock cars the E49 was more than a second quicker than the Phase Three HO to 100mph and could get to 100mph and stop again before the 350 Monaro could get to 100mph. The Holdens standard had no performance, for god sake 245 Hemi Pacers could accelerate quicker than any Holden muscle car let alone anything with Webers hanging off the side.

[SpoolMan]

Performance v price.

Audi S4 = $140,000
BMW 335i $112,000
FG F6 = $68,000

No wonder Top Gear's Jeremy Clarkson named the FPV F6 the ‘’best sports sedan under $100,000 Can't get as much car anywhere else for less than $100,000''

[flappist]

Originally Posted by SpoolMan

Performance v price.

Audi S4 = $140,000
BMW 335i $112,000
FG F6 = $68,000

No wonder Top Gear's Jeremy Clarkson named the FPV F6 the ‘’best sports sedan under $100,000 Can't get as much car anywhere else for less than $100,000''

Be fair Mark, the F6 as tested was $80,000

I looked at buying a 335i about a year ago and $112k was a povvo ex demo last years plate ugly colour, every one I would have boutght was $130k++

[ClevlndStemer]

Originally Posted by SpoolMan

No wonder Top Gear's Jeremy Clarkson named the FPV F6 the ‘’best sports sedan under $100,000 Can't get as much car anywhere else for less than $100,000''

Where did he say that? I am not doubting you I wasn't aware he tested a F6.