Speeding fines drop in s.a

[sudszy]

Originally Posted by flappist

Because too many are becoming conditioned to "speeding is baaaad m'kay" and this is just like re-arranging the deck chairs on the titanic. Sometime speeding is DANGEROUS other time not so much but the solution of choice for all situations is "let them commit the offence and then fine them".

My favorite speeding offense is "speeding in a school zone".

If you take away the whole wowserism aspect and assume that the people who are exceeding the limit in a school zone are doing due to extraneous circumstances and not purposely endangering children then a VERY frightening aspect appears.

The police set up their LIDAR/RADAR at the end of the school zones to catch persons speeding. In order for them to achieve this the must purposely endanger children rather than stand at the incoming end and actually slow the potential speeding drivers down.

The wowsers will cry "but they will learn a lesson and not do it again" basing their sage wisdom on the assuption that the driver regularly drives on that road and purposely endangers the children. The drivers are not the ones using children as bait in a trap.

We have a large crocodile in the Mary River here at the moment that is proving to be rather hard to catch and relocate.
If we put some school kids into the river as bait that may draw out the croc so it would be easier to catch after all catching the croc is more improtant than the kids lives........isn't it?

Would a child accidentally eaten by the croc be a greater tragedy than one killed in a traffic accident in front of a school while there was a speed trap operating?

so you have 1st hand knowledge of how things work in SA with crossing speed detections or you are just using this thread to peddle your own agenda.

Regardless: monitoring the speed of cars anywhere on a 40km/h limit is is not putting the lives of children at any more risk . No the police are not putting up go faster signs to lure the public into speeding and endangering the children, your baiting the crocs comparison is ludicrous.

The idea is that we want motorists to go through crossing zones at <40km/h all the time, not just when they see a police car ahead, hopefully you appreciate the numerical logistical impossibility of putting police cars in the front of all crossings in this country

Long term behaviour modification is the key, we simply havent got enough police to be visible to make everyone do the right thing all the time, punters that speed through enough crossing will eventually get enough speeding tickets that either they will lose their licence or modify their behaviour if there is a chance of being done anywhere anytime.

[pottery beige]

Originally Posted by BHDOGS

even after all this im still voting labour we might get a decent opposition one day

good for you..

[Bud Bud]

Originally Posted by sudszy

so you have 1st hand knowledge of how things work in SA

Originally Posted by sudszy

monitoring the speed of cars anywhere on a 40km/h limit is is not putting the lives of children at any more risk.

Actually the limit is 25kph at school crossings here in S.A.

I think speed cameras must be working well and are an important key to balancing the Gov.'s books but I am not sure if they help save accidents though. I was unfortunately involved in my first accident in over 30 years driving the Monday before Easter this year. The poor lad (P plater) who ran up my rear while I was stationary in a queue at some traffic lights hit me at about 40kph without even braking. I think he was staring at his speedo but he definitely was not speeding thank god. Plenty of damage but no speed.

I can't see how making you lose your licence sooner for fewer fines incurred for smaller indiscretions will be good for the Gov.'s financers either. I would have thought that not losing any demerit points but doubling the fines would have been far more beneficial for the Gov.'s fund raising efforts because if you incur a smaller fine but suffer a more rapid loss of licence then how will they make any money from you? After all, if it costs you less money than the current system to lose your licence and then once you are banned, you are off the road for an extended period of time where you can’t get caught speeding, they can't issue further fines for minor indiscretions that you make can they! Remember, we are talking minor indiscretions (the S.A. Gov.'s words not mine) like 45 in a 40 for example.

Consider this for a traffic infringement of 45kph in a 40kph
Current system-
1 demerit point + $250 fine (per offence)
x 12 = 12 demerit points (loss of licence) and a whopping $3,000 in fines

New system- (same offence)
2 demerit points +$150 fine (per offence)
X 6 = 12 demerit points (loss of licence) and only $900 in fines

This is a lose lose situation for all parties concerned imho.

Bud Bud

[BHDOGS]

Originally Posted by pottery beige

good for you..

Thanks bout time i got some applause

[sudszy]

Originally Posted by Bud Bud

Actually the limit is 25kph at school crossings here in S.A.

I think speed cameras must be working well and are an important key to balancing the Gov.'s books but I am not sure if they help save accidents though. I was unfortunately involved in my first accident in over 30 years driving the Monday before Easter this year. The poor lad (P plater) who ran up my rear while I was stationary in a queue at some traffic lights hit me at about 40kph without even braking. I think he was staring at his speedo but he definitely was not speeding thank god. Plenty of damage but no speed.

I can't see how making you lose your licence sooner for fewer fines incurred for smaller indiscretions will be good for the Gov.'s financers either. I would have thought that not losing any demerit points but doubling the fines would have been far more beneficial for the Gov.'s fund raising efforts because if you incur a smaller fine but suffer a more rapid loss of licence then how will they make any money from you? After all, if it costs you less money than the current system to lose your licence and then once you are banned, you are off the road for an extended period of time where you can’t get caught speeding, they can't issue further fines for minor indiscretions that you make can they! Remember, we are talking minor indiscretions (the S.A. Gov.'s words not mine) like 45 in a 40 for example.

Consider this for a traffic infringement of 45kph in a 40kph
Current system-
1 demerit point + $250 fine (per offence)
x 12 = 12 demerit points (loss of licence) and a whopping $3,000 in fines

New system- (same offence)
2 demerit points +$150 fine (per offence)
X 6 = 12 demerit points (loss of licence) and only $900 in fines

This is a lose lose situation for all parties concerned imho.

Bud Bud

you are dismissing cameras as ineffective solely because you got rearended by a P plater whom you reckon was looking at the speedo?

Originally Posted by Bud Bud

This is a lose lose situation for all parties concerned imho.

Bud Bud

Are you upset that SA Govco may not make as much money and have to raise the taxes from other sources?

isnt it a winner that we'll get people off the road that simply disobey or dont have the necessary skills to comply with basic road rules even faster?

[chevypower]

Originally Posted by sudszy

you are dismissing cameras as ineffective solely because you got rearended by a P plater whom you reckon was looking at the speedo?



Are you upset that SA Govco may not make as much money and have to raise the taxes from other sources?

isnt it a winner that we'll get people off the road that simply disobey or dont have the necessary skills to comply with basic road rules even faster?

Has your one-man crusade paid dividends yet? Do you have any gullible followers?

[Bud Bud]

Originally Posted by sudszy

you are dismissing cameras as ineffective solely because you got rearended by a P plater whom you reckon was looking at the speedo??

No, the exact opposite! The very idea that a camera could have been in the vicinity actually worked a treat because he was not speeding. I am comfortable with that because if he was it would have been a lot worse. The fact that he still hit me without using his brakes because his attention was diverted to making sure he was not speeding obviously has different consequences, but I fail to see how the Gov. can prosper from this episode though. They will just have to find another way to balance their books.

Originally Posted by sudszy

Are you upset that SA Govco may not make as much money and have to raise the taxes from other sources?

We should always be concerned when any Gov. strive to seek (invent) new opportunities to raise revenue, otherwise we will just be going to work to pay our taxes and that is it. Motorists (the rolling public) have always been easy cash cows to constantly raise funds, but it is a pity that they are beginning to apply the same principles to water in S.A. as well.

Originally Posted by sudszy

isnt it a winner that we'll get people off the road that simply disobey or dont have the necessary skills to comply with basic road rules even faster?

Yes point taken, but are you referring to habitual Hoons that continue to drive at any speed any where without any due care for anybody else, or are you talking Mr and Mrs average that go about their daily business in a respectable manor that might get caught up in a speeding net of 5 or so Ks over the limit, or do you put them all in the same basket? Because not even the Gov. does that.

The Gov takes less revenue for each disqualified licence but increases other charges such as water etc. to compensate, you the driver has less shots to maintain you licence especially at the lower end of the speeding scale. Lose lose all the way.

Bud Bud

[prydey]

Originally Posted by chevypower

Has your one-man crusade paid dividends yet? Do you have any gullible followers?

haha, so obvious even those on the other side of the globe can see it

[jpd80]

The fine for speeding less than 10km/h over the limit will fall from $260 to $150, but demerit points will double from one to two, as part of changes to expiation notices from September 1.

So a P plater who is caught twice in 12 months exceeding the speed limit by less than 10 kph loses his license..

Does that seem fair?

[sudszy]

Originally Posted by Bud Bud

The fact that he still hit me without using his brakes because his attention was diverted to making sure he was not speeding obviously has different consequences,

so you believe all his faculties and skills were diverted into making sure he wasnt exceeding 40km/h and the occasional glimpse at the road didnt occur to him?

Did he admit as much?......perhaps another explanation was he was txting at the time, playing with the radio which I doubt you'll get a confession to either.

Originally Posted by Bud Bud

, or are you talking Mr and Mrs average that go about their daily business in a respectable manor that might get caught up in a speeding net of 5 or so Ks over the limit, or do you put them all in the same basket? Because not even the Gov. does that.

The penalties for <10km/h over fines or demerit points aren't as high, so no they aren't all in the same basket.
But consistently 5km/h over, that's flaunting the law and hardly respectable given it will basically double the chance of that person being involved in an incident and harming others than at 60km/h

[prydey]

Originally Posted by sudszy

But consistently 5km/h over, that's flaunting the law and hardly respectable given it will basically double the chance of that person being involved in an incident and harming others than at 60km/h

see, this right here is the tripe that you and govco continue to push and is one of the reasons all credibility goes out the window.

for arguments sake, lets say its true that the chances of an accident is double, instead of speaking in percentages to make it sound good (50% is a nice big number), what is the actual chance of an incident at 60 and what does that figure become by increasing your speed by 5km/h?? you and i both know the actual number is very small.

what would be the number if i drive at 100??

so if i drive in a 70 zone, i'm about 8 times more likely to have a crash than when i drive in a 60 zone?

what if the same road was zoned a 60 one week and then the next week its changed to a 70? do the signs on the side of the road really have special powers?? wow.

there is zero proof that nudging over the limit has any bearing on the likelihood of a crash. it is also impossible to tell the speed of a car prior to an impact.

[prydey]

Originally Posted by sudszy

but isnt everyone on this site now quoting the authorities when they say speed is only a factor in 3% or so of accidents? oh but you are saying that is nonsense because its impossible to determine

speed is a factor. if the car isn't mobile, its a bit difficult to bump into something

seriously its about time govco and people like you starting treating people with respect and not twisting statistics to suit agenda's.

speed gets listed as a contributing factor on nearly every accident. don't confuse speed with excess speed or speeding.


you live in some bubble where you honestly believe that if there was total obedience to every speed zone, there would be less fatalities. THIS is scary! THIS is also a contributing factor to the appalling behaviour on the roads as the govt is now a one trick pony. the only law policed is speed compliance. it is also grossly negligent because it trains and convinces people to think that if they drive to the limit they are safe drivers.

[BA GT-HO]

Originally Posted by prydey

speed is a factor. if the car isn't mobile, its a bit difficult to bump into something

seriously its about time govco and people like you starting treating people with respect and not twisting statistics to suit agenda's.

speed gets listed as a contributing factor on nearly every accident. don't confuse speed with excess speed or speeding.


you live in some bubble where you honestly believe that if there was total obedience to every speed zone, there would be less fatalities. THIS is scary! THIS is also a contributing factor to the appalling behaviour on the roads as the govt is now a one trick pony. the only law policed is speed compliance. it is also grossly negligent because it trains and convinces people to think that if they drive to the limit they are safe drivers.

I agree, it is people like that who have ruined this country with over the top OHS, nanny rules and trying to wrap everything and everyone in cotton wool. Now we are turning into a nation of sooks and softies. PEOPLE WILL CONTINUE TO GET KILLED ON THE ROAD! It happens!

[MattSAU2XR8]

I think the police should start fining people for crashing instead of fine tuning fines relating to speeding. I'm convinced that crashing is more dangerous than speeding, and people who crash more than once every decade are probably going to keep doing it. So perhaps $500 and six demerit points if you drive into the back of another person's car, or run off the road and damage a lamp pole or a fence or a tree or whatever. Easy to prosecute as well - a bad driver might be able to argue that the radar was wrong or not calibrated or whatever, but they can hardly deny driving into someone else's car when it's all busted up :-)