All things Solar (merged threads)

[poppa smurf]

system sales haven't backed off here.......the potential partial loss of the rebate is having very little impact

I was speaking to a few install teams ( I sharpen their gear) they all said they are still flat out....most solar sales companies are honouring their current prices after the june cutoff or dropping the equivalent amount off the purchase price of the system

the system cost, in a lot of cases, has dropped well below the withdrawn rebate subsidy level

in my case I'm producing twice as much power as I use even during winter which finds me using the reverse cycle heater more often than ever simply because of the over production

we are looking at upgrading to ducted reverse cycle aircon next year simply to use up the excess because if I claim the amount owed to me by the power retailer I have to pay tax on it as income.....I'd rather use it myself

systems will possibly get cheaper over the long term, same as anything else, supply and demand will apply but then power costs will continue to rise as greedy conglomerates buy and sell to keep the profit wheel turning

AGL has just sold off a large wind farm to the japanese for $200 million

so what the market will do in five years time given all the unknown factors is anybody guess......everyone that I speak to comments on my system and have plans on installing their own so I cant see the market slowing down that much so prices may reflect that.....who knows???

[DJL351]

Originally Posted by LOCO XP

At this stage it's gonna be difficult to finance solar, no doubt it will help cut usage down, I just need to crunch some numbers and work out where my dollars make the most impact.

Solar doesn't really cut usage down, that part falls back to you and the family. It cuts down on the amount paid to the company but if you use 20 units during the day now, add solar tomorrow, you are still using 20 units; however, you might be able to use 10-20 units from the solar/sun instead of the grid.
(does that make sense?)

Originally Posted by LOCO XP

Just don't know which way to hedge my bets, it has seriously got me stumped. Weighing up the fact that ridiculous power bills are hindering progress on the mortgage, and that paying off a system will add additional costs to our household budget....even though in the end it will pay itself off and offset the rising costs.... but what will interest rates do over the next 5-10 years, and that my intention at this stage is to knock as much off debt and not ad more debt before the going gets tough....

Completely understand, we were in the same boat.

I was paying between $250 & $450 each bill, since the solar I've had credits varying from a few to almost $100, thats a massive weight off the monthly budget, but obviously there is the outlay for the system in the first place.

The numbers I'm using for my estimations is $300 a quater/bill. So, $300 x 4 gives me a $1200 saving a year. The system cost almost $10,000 (typical WA!). So the ROI (return on investment) is just over 8 years.
The flip side is that the 'spare' 1200 is going straight in to the homeloan, so it is helping there too. (again if that makes any sense)

Originally Posted by LOCO XP

The number crunching, power saving and meter watching continues....

And it will continue; for all of us. Power charges are only ever going to rise. :(

[poppa smurf]

it's a funny thing about consumption figures involving solar.....my usage dropped by an average of 4 kilowatts per day as the array fed directly into the house taking care of all the low power usage items

I have checked on this many times and can prove it...... things like "standby" items and lights can be run directly off the array.....small savings add up

I watch my inverter very closely and quite often the little "gateway" to the grid is open which shows direct feed into the house

this 4 kilowatts equates to a saving of 0.92c per day.......see told you I'm gonna be rich!!

[ute83]

Originally Posted by LOCO XP

With regard to the feed in tariffs, if you got in early, do you still get paid the 66c, or does everybody now get the 25c? I wouldn't say I really needed to be in last year, in simple terms my finances couldn't afford it, my usage would have made the exercise somewhat futile, but yes the 66c tariffs would have certainly expediated the pay-off time. ....

Yes, I got in before the cutoff date and am guaranteed the 66c until year 2024, although i suspect that by year 2024 power prices may have surpassed the 66 cents. This is for Vic users like myself.

[LOCO XP]

Originally Posted by DJL351

Solar doesn't really cut usage down, that part falls back to you and the family. It cuts down on the amount paid to the company but if you use 20 units during the day now, add solar tomorrow, you are still using 20 units; however, you might be able to use 10-20 units from the solar/sun instead of the grid.
(does that make sense?)


:(

Yup for sure, probably more referring to that it would cut the costs of usage or negate/offset the current usage. Gotcha

[LOCO XP]

Had a good chat to my provider today, they basically gave me 20% off without a fuss, but I think I'll forego the discount and fix the rate for 24 months which is at a similar charge to what I'm currently paying. That will give me some breathing space to really hone down our usage without fretting about the carbon scam, I mean carbon tax, and weigh up a system suited to our use, shop around and then go for it. Worked out how to read the power meter, so I can really study usage for the first time and know exactly where I'm at

[XDV800]

Thought i'd share my experience so far leading up to locking in a solar installer in Brisbane

Consumption is about 12 kw per day , power bills never been over $250 a qtr for 3 years, latest was closer to $300.
So decided to find a system, had 10k on the house redraw to cover the cost.

As soon as i decided to start looking, managed to pick up a SMA SB3800 inverter for peanuts BNIB. So now just looking for panels, and install. Easy i thought.

Trawled the net for about a week or 2 while at work and got a dozen or more quotes, all ranging from $11000 to 6700 for just panels and install
Some said i would not be able to fit the 4kw worth of panelks on my north facing, so would need landscaping, multiple strings, some on the shed some on the house, yada yada yada. Extra charges for tile kits, smart meter, isolators, hadron colliders, meter box upgrades...

Amongst all that i wittled away options for the best brand/buck panel to go with, and in the end i have set my sights on LG MonoX 250watters, because they are midrange pretty much in efficiency, well designed, black framed, drainage outlets, not made in china, WARRANTY BACKED BY A WELL KNOWN PROMINENT AUSTRALIAN RETAILER WITH AN AUSTRALIAN OFFICE.
That last point was the biggest consideration for me as i wouldn't trust 99% of installers/retailers to be around in the future to help out with warranty, Lucky Goldstar will be!!!

Also wanted the racking to be of a brand name with 10 year warranty, a lot of the offers were for back yard racking systems made by fred the fabricator out of tinfoil probably.

So i finally decided on an installer, one that popped up from a solarchoices. Spoke to a number of times, and arranged for him to come round, inspect my home and sign up yesterday. I had to get on a plane for work at 3pm, i stressed this to him a week earlier, but did he show up? Nope. Bad luck buddy.

Luckily during the day i decided to just check out 2 other companies promoting lg panels, first company to painful to deal with.

Then i spoke to Ian at Solaris Solar, more than helpful and professional to deal with over the phone, and lucky for him i was over the whole idea by this stage. His quote was cheapest too at just $7000 for the whole shebang, and installation promised in 2 weeks time.

He did mention that the fast turnaround is because he uses multiple contractors to do the installs, not their own inhouse team like EVERY other mob said they would use (yeah right), so hope we get a decent one, but they warrant the install for 10 years.

So i have the paperwork in hand and ready to sign up, fingers crossed



TL;DR

-4kw worth of 16 LG 250w panels, direct north facing
-Bluesun racking
-hopefully not dodgey wiring
-SMA SB3800 inverter
-52c FIT from AGL as we are current customers
-30% more kw than we use back to the grid during the day
-???
-PROFIT?

[LOCO XP]

thats some good info there to yzf, I'd be in a similar situation, probably need to set up on the shed when I come to do it, cos no position on my roof would be ideal, essentially theres no north facing roof, only south and west.... the shed also isn't northfacing, but with racks it should be right. I'd agree with going with a reputable brand thats hopefully gonna be around in the expected lifespan of the panels, likewise a company that gives a crap about their customers. I'm sure there is plenty of rogues out there capitalising on peoples desperation, as I mentioned earlier about gas installations, there is some serious hacks in the game, I guarantee this is no different. Lots of money involved, do it right, do it once

[LOCO XP]

What about these smart meters, spoke to some blokes at the car club grumbling about having to replace smart meters at their own expense (one bloke twice @$1200 a throw??? surely not....) and not getting any feed-in tarriff in the period taken to rectify it.... They were otherwise loving their solar (no debt per se so they went MEGA!) so were raking in serious coin (when the meters let them anyway)....

[poppa smurf]

smart meters with multiple readout capability cost roughly $350 installed in south australia, shouldn't be much different in Vic......instalation must be done by your energy supplier (our case E.T.S.A.)

your distribution box will also need to be able to accept extra circuit breakers

if you construct the array on your shed then the distribution board in your shed will also need to be able to accept extra breakers and everything be up to scratch

you wont get any F.I.T. whilst your array is in operation but without the smart meter, however your meter will slow down and if your array can overpower your usage then the meter will turn backward

if you have racks installed just be aware that this will certainly double your purchase cost of the system

yzfr......keep us up to date on your install!

[davenl5l]

Originally Posted by LOCO XP

What about these smart meters, spoke to some blokes at the car club grumbling about having to replace smart meters at their own expense (one bloke twice @$1200 a throw??? surely not....) and not getting any feed-in tarriff in the period taken to rectify it.... They were otherwise loving their solar (no debt per se so they went MEGA!) so were raking in serious coin (when the meters let them anyway)....

etsa just re programed my digital meter took 60 seconds cost $88 eurosolar doing install of system 1 to 2 weeks cant wait

[xisled]

Originally Posted by LOCO XP

What about these smart meters, spoke to some blokes at the car club grumbling about having to replace smart meters at their own expense (one bloke twice @$1200 a throw??? surely not....) and not getting any feed-in tarriff in the period taken to rectify it.... They were otherwise loving their solar (no debt per se so they went MEGA!) so were raking in serious coin (when the meters let them anyway)....

I have never seen the cost of a solar meter at that price. Most I have seen was around $350 or so. I work in the industry and see the cost of the install everyday. A solar meter is not a smart meter, it is a biodirectional meter. (Similar to a smart meter but works different, can see import and export power into the grid . Even looks like a smart meter)

If they installed the wrong meter the Distributor would cover the cost of the meter. It may of been the invertor that had to be replaced. Costing sounds about right.

Basically the reason for the dealy is the Distributor needs the paper work from your solar company once the panels are installed. Once the paper work is submited it will be around 20 working days for the meter to be installed.

[poppa smurf]

yes the energy supplier needs your "PVSEG" number from your solar supplier before they do an install

what annoys me is that I bought the meter and paid to have it installed at a cost of $350.......it has "property of E.T.S.A." stamped on it??????

[xisled]

Originally Posted by poppa smurf

yes the energy supplier needs your "PVSEG" number from your solar supplier before they do an install

what annoys me is that I bought the meter and paid to have it installed at a cost of $350.......it has "property of E.T.S.A." stamped on it??????

Yer you do not own the meter, you paid for the labour of the truck and crew to come to your house.

[LOCO XP]

[QUOTE=xisled]I have never seen the cost of a solar meter at that price. Most I have seen was around $350 or so. I work in the industry and see the cost of the install everyday. A solar meter is not a smart meter, it is a biodirectional meter. (Similar to a smart meter but works different, can see import and export power into the grid . Even looks like a smart meter)

QUOTE]

Cool, didn't think $1200 each time sounded right, the guy telling the story doesn't let the truth get in the way of a good story, serial P.I.T.A and tool indeed.

[LOCO XP]

Originally Posted by poppa smurf

if you have racks installed just be aware that this will certainly double your purchase cost of the system

yzfr......keep us up to date on your install!

purchase cost or install cost? if we're talking double the cost of the sytem, think I'd be getting plans for a rack and making my own!

[XDV800]

Originally Posted by poppa smurf

you wont get any F.I.T. whilst your array is in operation but without the smart meter

if you have racks installed just be aware that this will certainly double your purchase cost of the system

yzfr......keep us up to date on your install!

Yeah poppa, none of this makes a great deal of sense to me.
I am getting a smart meter and energex hook up at no extra cost so ive been told. Although ive only gotten a form to go back to energex which my missus got to print, fiill, and return. Was that the F.I.T. permission form?

Racking is a necessity to mount panels on your roof? I dont follow

[XDV800]

Actually just checked the form in my email and yeah we have the qld solar bonus scheme ticked.

Is it the way to go or is anyone gone with gross or net generation agreements?

[xisled]

Originally Posted by yzfr101

Actually just checked the form in my email and yeah we have the qld solar bonus scheme ticked.

Is it the way to go or is anyone gone with gross or net generation agreements?

Racking is the fram and stand the panels sit on.

The QLD bonus is 44 cents per KWH it is the way to go.

[poppa smurf]

Originally Posted by LOCO XP

purchase cost or install cost? if we're talking double the cost of the sytem, think I'd be getting plans for a rack and making my own!

the angle of your roof determines whether or not you need racks

on a roof of around 32 degs racking is not necessary but if your roof is flat or a long way off this angle the racks are needed to bring the array into correct position

the racks can also be employed on ground installations as well

the usual cost of these racks is equivalent to the number of panels employed

I.E. 5 panels = 5 racks thereby effectively doubling the cost of the system

the need for these racks is usually decided at the time of initial purchase and thereby is a purchase price

I cant see any reason why you couldn't make the racks yourself.....however having said this the industry or council would have a thousand reasons why you couldnt

[poppa smurf]

Originally Posted by yzfr101

Yeah poppa, none of this makes a great deal of sense to me.
I am getting a smart meter and energex hook up at no extra cost so ive been told. Although ive only gotten a form to go back to energex which my missus got to print, fiill, and return. Was that the F.I.T. permission form?


it's okay mate.....the whole process is designed to confuse.....I just hope those that place posts in here keep this in mind and be as helpful as possible, which thankfully has been happening

I have heard of others getting their smart meter installed for nix as a part of an upgrade scheme, I cant comment on this as I have no first hand experience with it only to state that I have heard of some not paying for it.......I just advise that I paid $350 for mine and if you or someone else gets it for nothing then great

without seeing your form I can only hazard a guess that it would have been your P.V.S.E.G. (photo voltaic small energy generator) form which would be forwarded to your energy supplier in order to upgrade your meter for feed in consideration


Racking is a necessity to mount panels on your roof? I dont follow

sorry to throw another piece of confusion into the mix.......to try and explain racking I'll put it like this.....

ideally your roof that you are planning to place your panels on should be as close as possible to 32 degs in order to gain the most from your panels

if your roof is flat or even facing the opposite direction then a set of racks (a frame designed to hold the panel to the correct angle and orientation) will be employed

the usual construction is of aluminium and one set of racks per panel.........I have however started to see steel racks being employed that can hold two or more but as the racks get bigger they are harder for the installers to handle

most standard houses do not need racks as the angle is acceptable

[XDV800]

Originally Posted by poppa smurf

sorry to throw another piece of confusion into the mix.......to try and explain racking I'll put it like this.....

ideally your roof that you are planning to place your panels on should be as close as possible to 32 degs in order to gain the most from your panels

if your roof is flat or even facing the opposite direction then a set of racks (a frame designed to hold the panel to the correct angle and orientation) will be employed

the usual construction is of aluminium and one set of racks per panel.........I have however started to see steel racks being employed that can hold two or more but as the racks get bigger they are harder for the installers to handle

most standard houses do not need racks as the angle is acceptable

Ok i thought you were reffering to landscaping or angling of panels.
My roof is an optimal slope tile roof but there is still racks involved to mount the panels to. In this day and age there should be no one installing without as the kits are actually very cheap $12000 on average or a quarter the price of panels installed.
Tilting and landscaping arrays im sure would at the most double the price.

[buggerlugs]

Just got my quarterly "bill" today. $186.90 in credit for the last 3 months. Certainly beats paying $770 a quarter...........

[poppa smurf]

Originally Posted by yzfr101

Ok i thought you were reffering to landscaping or angling of panels.
My roof is an optimal slope tile roof but there is still racks involved to mount the panels to. In this day and age there should be no one installing without as the kits are actually very cheap $12000 on average or a quarter the price of panels installed.
Tilting and landscaping arrays im sure would at the most double the price.

you will have a set of "frames" to which they attach the array to that sit basically flat, or at the same angle to your roofline but the racks usually angle the panels to a far greater degree than the standard

hence the greater cost

[poppa smurf]

Originally Posted by buggerlugs

Just got my quarterly "bill" today. $186.90 in credit for the last 3 months. Certainly beats paying $770 a quarter...........

great news.......gotta be happy with that result!.....well done!

[XDV800]

Originally Posted by yzfr101

Ok i thought you were reffering to landscaping or angling of panels.
My roof is an optimal slope tile roof but there is still racks involved to mount the panels to. In this day and age there should be no one installing without as the kits are actually very cheap $12000 on average or a quarter the price of panels installed.
Tilting and landscaping arrays im sure would at the most double the price.

I actually should have typed "$1200" there, not "12000"

[Winter XR8]

Originally Posted by buggerlugs

Just got my quarterly "bill" today. $186.90 in credit for the last 3 months. Certainly beats paying $770 a quarter...........

WOW, that makes it worthwile. How many kw is your system?

[buggerlugs]

5kw.........Read the bill wrong. It's actually $245.10 credit........even better !!!!

[Franco Cozzo]

Thought you guys might be interested in something I came across, I bought some Cappa seats for my EL Fairmont Ghia not long after I bought it on Ebay, arranged a pickup from Bendigo.

I rock up to the house, its the guy's fathers house, he had a home made wind generator which the base is a tall garden shed, the blades on the turbine are ex army helicopter blades he got cheap, because they had to get rid of them anyway, and he gave me a bit of an explanation about it, he's an electrician.

He was looking at selling it on the market, mentioned something about $10-$15,000 it would cost for him to do it, but it had a better power output than the same money in solar panels.

I can try chase it up for you guys if you want? I'll try contact him via email. Might be able to coax him onto the forum.

Though I know my local council recently outlawed wind turbines for some unknown reason, probably one of the best areas for it too.

[bartaxr8]

Getting my system installed today, althoughh it is meant to bucket down rain all day, so it might not happen. Can anyone tell tell me the process of what happens after the system is installed? I think the next step is inspection and then they hook it up to the meter?