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24-10-2020, 05:39 PM | #7201 | |||
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If that is the case then Chairman Dan should have been serious with the BLM protest march to set a proper example.. |
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24-10-2020, 05:47 PM | #7202 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
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It "seems" like they want the gov to open right up (something that other states have still yet fully done), or just vent their personal issues at someone else. IMHO, a cautious approach to opening up now will mean we can reap some big rewards in the next 6 months. Open up too quick and we might end up having some of those events with zero crowd. |
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24-10-2020, 07:48 PM | #7203 | |||
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I don't agree with the protests but can certainly understand the public frustration. |
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24-10-2020, 08:20 PM | #7204 | |||
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24-10-2020, 09:49 PM | #7205 | ||
Rob
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Woodcroft S.A.
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another common phrase....
if you look at just about every other country with cities with serious outbreaks, the methods are the same or worse. its just easy to criticise from the cheap seats but how many people would be willing to sign their name on some of the decisions that need to be made by a government?
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24-10-2020, 10:02 PM | #7206 | |||
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Quote:
The difficulty, as I see it, is that freedom of expression means that any sub-normal person (by which I mean anyone, who by their position clearly does not comprehend how this virus could decimate both our population and economy in that order) can have their say, even if that means that a totally unreasonable course of activity is encouraged. I'll take this opportunity to commend the moderators and chairman for their forbearance in allowing a wide range of opinion to be seen - even if many of them are beyond the pale. A couple of calculations: At the moment about 8.5 million citizens/residents of the USA have been tested as positive of Covid 19. That is 1 in about 50 people who are living there. Since there are many more infected that are not detected the actual figure is lower than 1 in 50. Similar calculations can be done for many "western" countries in Europe with figures that are not quite so bad. In Australia the same calculation provides a figure of 1 in 900 or thereabouts. In Victoria the figure is 1 in 320 or thereabouts. That means that, right now, any individual living in Victoria has something more than 6 times less chance of contracting the virus that would be the case if living in the USA The USA has not seen anything like the restrictions that we have "endured". Now the question I ask is " how many of the nay-sayers would have preferred to be living in the USA over the previous 7 months?(and if they would then:Why don't you move there?) Or do you prefer to live in Australia - and particularly in Victoria, where we are dealing with the potential for an outbreak that could see our state figure rise?" My position is that the Victorian Government, in the face of opportunistic private enterprise companies accepting contracts that were clearly beyond their capabilities, have (almost) gotten us to a position where we ALL may be able to enjoy a greater degree of "normality" except for the problem of people who put their personal enjoyment in front of the welfare of the greater community. I do not know how the current Victorian opposition might have reacted, but the attacks by Mr O'Brien, assisted by various members of the federal government do not give me any kind of feeling that they might have done better. Cheers
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25-10-2020, 02:47 AM | #7207 | ||
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Let's put this another way.
If you are an adult living in the USA you have a 10.9 in 10,000 chance of dying from COVID19. On the face of it, they aren't bad odds and they are better than Belgium (11.4/10,000) and Peru (13.4/10,000) but worse than Italy (10/10,000), the UK (8.6/10,000) and even India 1.1/10,000). However, in Australia those odds are far better again at 0.5/10,000 which makes the USA 20x worse than Australia. Indeed, before the Victorian second wave mess, we were about line-ball with New Zealand where your chance of dying is 0.07/10,000 which is 7x better than where we are now but also 160x better than the USA. Victoria hasn't fared as well as the rest of the country with the odds of dying here (counting adults only) 1.66/10,000 which is 3.3x the National average and both the infection rate per 100k (413) and the CMR (4.02%) are worse than the National average of 152 and 3.3% respectively - bearing in mind that the National average is being dragged down by the Victorian numbers anyway. Even then, your chance of dying from COVID19 in the USA is 6.6x greater than Victoria. That got me thinking about the rest of Australia and the numbers are surprising. Victoria has had 74% of all Australian cases and 90.3% of all Australian deaths which shows just how much impact this 2nd wave has really had. Looking at the remainder of the country in isolation (pun not intended) the figures are much happier: 7,148 cases or 54.4 cases per 100k adults (NZ is 52.44); 88 deaths or 0.673 deaths per 100k adults (NZ is 0.682); and a CMR of 1.231% - even better than the 1.3% for New Zealand. Let's pause a moment to compare those case numbers with a few other countries: The USA has 4,184 cases per 100k which is 27x more than the Australian average, 10x more than Victoria and 76x more than the rest of Australia! The UK has 1,598 cases per 100k which is 10.4x more than the Australian average, 3.8x more than Victoria and 29x more than the rest of Australia. While we could argue that identified case numbers depend on the volume of testing, the number of deaths is a (largely) inescapable fact so if we look at deaths per 100k of total population we see that: Australia has 3.55 per 100k; Italy 61.29 (17.3x); Argentina 62.70 (17.6x); UK 65.65 (18.5x); Mexico 68.17 (19.2x); USA 69.26 (19.5x); Ecuador 71.0 (20x); Chile 72.42 (20.4x); Brazil 73.64 (20.7x); Spain 74.32 (20.9x) Bolivia 75.53 (21.3x); Belgium 91.35 (25.7x); and Peru 103.21 (29x). There are some (non-African) countries doing better than our 3.55: British Virgin island (N America) 3.308; Iceland (Europe) 3.224; Antigua (N America) 3.08; Pakistan (Asia) 3.04; Nepal (Asia) 2.845; Venezuela (S America) 2.669; Latvia (Europe) 2.651; Slovakia (Europe) 2.454; Barbados (N America) 2.436; Nicaragua (N America) 2.340; Cyprus (Europe) 2.071; Haiti (N America) 2.016; Yemen (Asia) 2.008; Myanmar (Asia) 1.908; Uzbekistan (Asia) 1.629; Uruguay (S America) 1.526; Syria (Asia) 1.509; Hong Kong (Asia) 1.401; Japan (Asia) 1.339; Cuba (N America) 1.130; S Korea (Asia) 0.887; Brunei (Asia) 0.864; Tajikistan (Asia) 0.849; Malaysia (Asia) 0.661; Curaçao (S America) 0.609; New Zealand (Oceania) 0.518; and Singapore (Asia) 0.479. .... although not many better than the 'rest of Australia excluding Victoria' 0.461) Fiji (Oceania) 0.223; Thailand (Asia) 0.085; PNG (Oceania) 0.082; Sri Lanka (Asia) 0.065; Vietnam (Asia) 0.036; and Taiwan (Asia) 0.029.
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25-10-2020, 06:30 AM | #7208 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
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Quote:
He is so desperate to be elected and so desperate to make Andrews & Co look bad he will say anything, anything for a headline grab. He reminds me of the Opposition Leader in NZ who tried the same attack on Adern and look at how well that went for her People want to see bipartisanship in times like this, not attack dogs, but it seems that attack is all that side of politics can do and it seems to be worldwide
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25-10-2020, 06:36 AM | #7209 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
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25-10-2020, 06:38 AM | #7210 | ||||
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Quote:
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25-10-2020, 06:40 AM | #7211 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
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I reckon this is the most accurate
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25-10-2020, 09:00 AM | #7212 | |||
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If any of the nasty "opportunistic private enterprises" out in the mainstream contracted out with your level of due diligence, workplace safety comes knocking on the door with jail terms when clearly foreseeable eventualities result.
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25-10-2020, 09:11 AM | #7213 | |||
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25-10-2020, 11:17 AM | #7214 | ||
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25-10-2020, 12:11 PM | #7215 | ||
WT GT
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Melbourne coronavirus restrictions announcement delayed by Victorian Premier Daniel Andrews after COVID-19 outbreak
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-10-...steps/12811116 |
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25-10-2020, 12:12 PM | #7216 | |||
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The same "journalist" who had before asked Andrews why he could not change the date of the Road Map to an earlier date, today asks why Andrews could not stick to the original date of the Road Map?
This bitch fight led by the PM against Andrews is a real comedy show. It's hilarious even. Divide and conquer tactics starting to work against the PM's mob. It's certainly working for me. And I never voted for Andrews to be Premier. But I will 100% vote for him if he runs against Morrison for PM! edit: I have, and urge anyone who would like, to please sign the petition below by the Australian Parliament. The media needs to be held to account. Quote:
Last edited by Tickford.; 25-10-2020 at 12:27 PM. |
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25-10-2020, 01:30 PM | #7217 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
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Interesting all the Right politicians, business leaders, industry leaders and some media demanding the reopening of Victoria. Will they put their hands up to take responsibility if Andrews opens early and we get a 3rd wave - HELL NO!!! they will run for cover. They just need to shut the **** up
Andrews did comment this morning about all these 'health experts' making comment - he said 'they are outside the tent', they have no idea what is going on inside the tent" or words to that effect - so he is also saying that they should shut the **** up
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25-10-2020, 02:09 PM | #7218 | |||
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25-10-2020, 02:18 PM | #7219 | |||
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Quote:
Meanwhile, here's Andrews' own Kevin Rudd/Tony Abbott Jenny Mikakos accuses Daniel Andrews of 'paralysis' as Melbourne's coronavirus reopening announcement is postponed https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-10-...tions/12811188 |
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25-10-2020, 02:43 PM | #7220 | ||
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Data valid as at 23:59 GMT October 24th, 2020.
Note: As not all Australian States report at the same time, the data below is based on the previous full day reporting except for the Victorian 14 day moving averages. 15 new cases for Australia and no deaths so the CMR drops to 3.291% while active cases rise to 1,413. NSW recorded 5 cases, WA 4 with the balance in Victoria. The Victorian State 14 day moving average is down to 5.21 with metro falling to 4.6 (9 unknown) and regional still at 0.2 with no unknown cases (including today). Victoria reported 7 new cases for the last 24 hours. 11 new cases and no deaths for NZ so CMR is 1.293% and active cases rise to 74. The UK had a higher 23,012 new cases yesterday. We know they are now not counting their mortalities by the WHO guidelines so we are going to ignore the CMR but even using their method they recorded 174 deaths. Just under 83k new cases in the USA yesterday and 903 deaths sees CMR drop to 2.621% and active cases up to 32.2% with the raw numbers rising and now over 2.8M. Note that the USA is actually minus one day due to time differences. Other notable points: It's the weekend so case numbers should be down a bit today - Global deaths pass 1.15M with the last 50k taking 9 days; Global cases set a new daily high of 490,737 (23/10); North America set a new daily case high of 94,682 (23/10); Colombia passes 1M cases; The USA completes 132M, India 102M, Turkey 13M, and Czechia 2M tests; Latvia (259) Lithuania (474) Serbia (757) - 31% up on the high yesterday North Macedonia (647) Luxembourg (862) - 30% up on the previous high Greece (945) Malaysia (1,228) - 41% up on the previous high Bosnia (1,265) - now 5 days in a row Georgia (1,941) - now 5 days in a row Slovenia (1,961) Croatia (2,242) - 33% up on the high yesterday Austria (3,614) - 41% up on the high yesterday Slovakia (2,890) Portugal (3,669) Belgium (17,568) Italy (19,644); and France (45,422) all recorded new daily highs; those in blue for the second consecutive day and those in red for a third or more consecutive days.
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25-10-2020, 03:01 PM | #7221 | |||
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The reality is that we are actually a society where public opinion (and thus votes) are driven in whatever direction the relatively narrow media ownership chooses to drive it. It's been getting progressively worse these last two decades and I'm not all that sure that we are that far removed from the 'only tell what we want you to know' mantra of State owned media organisations with the only obvious differences being that (1) we don't actually always know who is pulling the strings and what their agenda is; and (2) the fringe elements are still allowed their say even if it to a tiny percentage of the population who are possibly certifiable anyway. Watch the 5 main news channels in Victoria tonight (7,9,10, ABC, SBS) and see what their slant will be on the Andrews postponement decision. In most cases their bias will be in the wording or the screen caption supporting the story. It's easy to do like this: Supportive (of which I don't reckon you'll hear much): "Andrew's puts health concerns above politics to defer announcement" Mildly supportive or uncertain: "Andrew's bold move to defer announcement" (replace bold with surprising etc.) - you could easily make it negative by changing bold to something less flattering. Mildly against: "No relief for Victorians as Andrew's defers announcement" Strongly against:"Victorians remain in lockdown as Andrew's defers announcement"
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Last edited by russellw; 25-10-2020 at 03:13 PM. |
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25-10-2020, 03:23 PM | #7222 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
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Interesting presser this morning. I don't think a 24hr wait is really that much of a problem after so many months of lock down. Apparently some business leaders are reporting that that every day of lock down results in "thousands of jobs" being lost, is there actually any evidence of this? Are businesses laying off thousands of staff every single day?
I feel he needs to at least give up something even if the results aren't flash. Possibly remove the 25km restriction, and allow small retailers, not seated in malls like Chaddy, to reopen with a covid safe plan. Otherwise.... I don't even want to think about what would happen if the northern suburbs come back with results showing clusters from 3 or 4 different sources......we might be in for an interesting week. Interesting sledge from Jenny Mikakos - "paralysis in decision-making". This coming from someone who said the Cedars meat outbreak was "handled perfectly". . She was the weakest link...goodbye. Who wants to make a bet she will appear on Sky News for an interview very soon? |
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25-10-2020, 03:44 PM | #7223 | |||
Cabover nut
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I think he is handling these journo's rather well and answered the same stupid question several times over particularly from the idiot Rachel Baxeldale (from The Australian) who keeps banging on about the 25km travel limit that she is forced to endure.
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25-10-2020, 03:59 PM | #7224 | ||
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https://ourworldindata.org/excess-mortality-covid
Some interesting figures here on "excess mortality" (comparing total deaths to see if more people are actually dying) UK is interesting, I thought the new interpretation of a covid death was the reason for their massive shift in the death rate. In the first wave death form all causes was up over 100% (doubled), yet now with well over double the cases over a long period of time the overall death rate is only up 3%. Something doesn't stack up, these sort of numbers point to something massively different in the outcome of contracting the virus, why is the medical fraternity mute on this? Are they holding back to protect us again? Just like "masks don't help", are they worried that the population wont take the virus as seriously if the mention these figures? I think looking at these we can see the different way of counting deaths in the UK is not the reason for the massively lower numbers. It is just nowhere near as many people are dying from it.
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25-10-2020, 04:08 PM | #7225 | |||
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Quote:
This study indicates we were ranked 3rd in Newspaper ownership in 2011, with a relatively high HHI trend increasing. https://www.theguardian.com/news/dat...dustry-squeeze |
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25-10-2020, 04:41 PM | #7226 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
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Quote:
But I honestly believe the biggest contributing factor is that the virus has mutated, as most viruses do. It has become more infections but less potent. Virus wants to spread, not kill. It can't spread if it kills the host. But who wants to take the gamble and let it rip? |
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25-10-2020, 05:16 PM | #7227 | |||
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In capitals too! https://www.skynews.com.au/details/_6204444355001 |
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25-10-2020, 05:39 PM | #7228 | |||
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Add corrupt - hideous, and the fury is multiplied. |
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25-10-2020, 06:24 PM | #7229 | |||
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25-10-2020, 06:30 PM | #7230 | |||
DIY Tragic
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This photo is begging for the slightest of photoshopping. :-)
Quote:
In contrast to how the nation is staring down coronavirus, it’s interesting to note the Government is OK with an aged care (in-home care) shortfall of sixteen thousand allocations. I’d like to see/hear them say it’s just fine to be 16K beds short of readiness for an epidemic. |
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