Vfacts september 2022 - Page 3

Franco Cozzo · 08-10-2022, 10:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

Sure do. I'm not against electric vehicles. Just commenting on the picture as a whole. Around 1million vehicles are sold each year. How many are electric?

The other side of that coin is that you don't really have many options for EVs compared to ICE in our market either.

Hyundai, Kia, Nissan, Tesla and MG offer a limited range of choice for EV.

prydey · 08-10-2022, 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

The other side of that coin is that you don't really have many options for EVs compared to ICE in our market either.

Hyundai, Kia, Nissan, Tesla and MG offer a limited range of choice for EV.

I'm not saying the segment won't grow.

The infrastructure needs to grow a lot more first.

I reckon most of the people buying the Korean and low end versions of EV's still think they are helping to save the planet.

PooDog · 08-10-2022, 10:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

Sure do. I'm not against electric vehicles. Just commenting on the picture as a whole. Around 1million vehicles are sold each year. How many are electric?

EV,s on average are hit a lot worse with supply issues.......it would be interesting to see how much volume EV,s would be if it weren't for the supply issues.....I think you would be surprised

The Outlander were waiting for the top spec one is losing some of its features to conserve the use of chips .......things aren't improving ......might be interesting when BYD arrives over there in force ?

**kypez** · 08-10-2022, 11:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

Sure do. I'm not against electric vehicles. Just commenting on the picture as a whole. Around 1million vehicles are sold each year. How many are electric?

I know you aren't which is what surprised me with your comment. The ramp up only just happened in July. When the highest selling car is 7-8% of the market, a 4-6% market share is fantastic. We are still in the infancy of EVs but one thing is clear, people with the money to afford an EV have voted to buy one. Compared to Mercedes, BMW, VWs, or even Mazdas and other similarly priced cars, nothing is close for the month of September. Heck, the king of the mid size SUV in RAV4 is so far away from the Y.

You are right about infrastructure and I've commented on this before. If you plan to drive outside of the Metros, you'd be mad to buy anything other than a Tesla as the infrastructure isn't there to support other brands. Now for Teslas, there is enough and more infrastructure to travel north to south of the East Coast and into rural NSW and Victoria today!

**kypez** · 08-10-2022, 11:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

I reckon most of the people buying the Korean and low end versions of EV's still think they are helping to save the planet.

What do you mean low end buyers?!

90% of people I come across think they're saving the planet buying an EV. I'd suggest, bar the Taycan buyer and the Base Model 3 buyer who is trying to avoid the cost of petrol, the rest feel like Captain Planet behind the wheel of their cars. If you see a Tesla Model 3, white and black interior with hubcaps, rest assured they're loving EVs for the fuel savings!

jpd80 · 08-10-2022, 11:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

I'm not saying the segment won't grow.

The infrastructure needs to grow a lot more first.

I reckon most of the people buying the Korean and low end versions of EV's still think they are helping to save the planet.

The whole situation is changing now that Tesla is able to supply the Y in good quantities
and as others have said, battery electric vehicles have jumped to over 7% but that still
a small amount compared to the 93% ICE powered vehicle sales.

Interestingly, it looks like the Korean EVs are suffering a bit here and overseas as those
buyers seem more affected by the current economic climate, Tesla buyers not so much…

Indeed, infrastructure will grow as more EVs come onto our roads but home charging overnight
is still a good option for lots of those buyers with occasional top up at public charging when needed..
Rising petrol and diesel prices are going to push buyers to the limit, what price do they start to
consider alternatives, $2.50/litre? $3.00/ litre? Your guess is as good as mine…..

prydey · 08-10-2022, 11:35 AM

Electricity prices are also rising, not to mention the strain on the grid.

jpd80 · 08-10-2022, 11:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

Electricity prices are also rising, not to mention the strain on the grid.

Power utilities and distributors are sitting on a virtual gold mine,
all they need to do is invest or watch others take their place…

Certain oil companies are already investing in power generation and distribution overseas,
it won’t take long to realise that Australia is a juicy plum, especially as manufacturing declines.

**kypez** · 08-10-2022, 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpd80

Power utilities and distributors are sitting on a virtual gold mine,

all they need to do is invest or watch others take their place…

Certain oil companies are already investing in power generation and distribution overseas,

it won’t take long to realise that Australia is a juicy plum, especially as manufacturing declines.

Shell locally bought Powershop recently. They know electricity is where it will be at in the future.

Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk

**kypez** · 08-10-2022, 12:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

Electricity prices are also rising, not to mention the strain on the grid.

They're rising but not even close to petrol prices per 100 kms traveled. $1.05 is now $1.50 with the 40% increase per 100 kms.

Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk

PooDog · 08-10-2022, 12:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

Electricity prices are also rising, not to mention the strain on the grid.

Everything is rising

Franco Cozzo · 08-10-2022, 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PooDog

Everything is rising

Except wages

PooDog · 08-10-2022, 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kypez

They're rising but not even close to petrol prices per 100 kms traveled. $1.05 is now $1.50 with the 40% increase per 100 kms.

Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk

Diesel has had an approximate 120% price rise in the last 6-8 months over this side that's what's crippling economies petrol in comparison 20-30 % yet all the media talk about is petrol prices ??

Dr Smith · 09-10-2022, 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PooDog

Diesel has had an approximate 120% price rise in the last 6-8 months over this side that's what's crippling economies petrol in comparison 20-30 % yet all the media talk about is petrol prices ??

Exactly...just food for thought I send a pallet Melb to Brisbane every 2 months and the fuel surcharge levy (fsl) on that pallet was $35 for a full pallet in May 2021....last month Sept 2022 the identical shipment had a fsl of $148...that's on top of the base freight rate...or in total terms the same pallet door to door went from $375 to $547...just think of everything moving on any truck today could be costing 45% more than what it did last year...

Sprintey · 09-10-2022, 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DFB FGXR6

Ford Numbers -

Ford EcoSport – 0
Ford Endura – 0
Ford Escape – 231
Ford Everest – 801
Ford Fiesta – 7
Ford Focus – 3
Ford Mondeo – 0
Ford Mustang – 237
Ford Puma – 132
Ford Ranger 4x2 – 509
Ford Ranger 4x4 – 4381
Ford Transit Bus – 0
Ford Transit Custom – 322
Ford Transit Heavy – 12
Ford Total – 6635

That's absolutely crazy, imagine if they didn't have the Ranger platform.
(Of course, they do. Btw, instances of when Ford timed the market perfectly: Territory and the bigger Aussie developed Ranger)

Sprintey · 09-10-2022, 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DFB FGXR6

These numbers break my heart, these cars are far better than that -

Jaguar
Jaguar E-Pace 23
Jaguar F-Pace 27
Jaguar F-Type 6
Jaguar I-Pace 0
Jaguar XE 1
Jaguar XF 1
Jaguar XJ Series 0
Jaguar Total 58

Totally, DFB. XE is tempting now depreciation has them in the 30s. Whole range is all alloy, won't rust out; handles, so nice styling. Inline 6 petrol Ingeniums on offer in some new models... Anyway, they are coming back all-electric in a couple of years. Maybe I'll yoink one of the last petrol ones at some stage. I'm finding it very hard to get enthusiastic about any new car purchases in my price range.

Sprintey · 09-10-2022, 05:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

Yep - and hopefully the ones like LDV/Nissan aren't using resistive heating elements for in cabin HVAC otherwise you use the heater and you'll kill a ****load of juice just keeping the cabin warm.

I think Tesla has moved to reverse cycle for heating in their cars, much more efficient way of cabin climate control.

But at 2300kg, imagine if they convert some matter into energy, could power them indefinitely if we nuke them.

Sprintey · 09-10-2022, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

Electricity prices are also rising, not to mention the strain on the grid.

Electricity seems to be set off gas price and on the East coast, much of the gas is tied up in export contracts - havoc has been created in pricing this year.

Any of you follow the gas debacle?

(West coast gas pricing is fine, has a reservation)

jpd80 · 09-10-2022, 06:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sprintey

That's absolutely crazy, imagine if they didn't have the Ranger platform.
(Of course, they do. Btw, instances of when Ford timed the market perfectly: Territory and the bigger Aussie developed Ranger)

We used to have a guy on here that would taunt good news in Ford sales by saying,
“If we ignore Ranger /Falcon and Colorado/Commodore sales, Holden wins…”
His point being that there was safety in numbers and Holden was in a safer place than Ford…

Well congratulations Holden, you won another Bathurst from the grave….

Franco Cozzo · 09-10-2022, 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpd80

We used to have a guy on here that would taunt good news in Ford sales by saying,
“If we ignore Ranger /Falcon and Colorado/Commodore sales, Holden wins…”

Well congratulations Holden, you won another Bathurst from the grave….

Looking forward to seeing Ranger as the Ford entrant to the super taxis, they should its way more appropriate for their brand

Sprintey · 09-10-2022, 06:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpd80

We used to have a guy on here that would taunt good news in Ford sales by saying,
“If we ignore Ranger /Falcon and Colorado/Commodore sales, Holden wins…”

Well congratulations Holden, you won another Bathurst from the grave….

I actually saw some places in regional SA recently that still had the Holden dealership signs up!

Hoping the F150 sells and sells and sets Ford up to expand on the strong Ranger base.

Sprintey · 09-10-2022, 06:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

Looking forward to seeing Ranger as the Ford entrant to the super taxis, they should its way more appropriate for their brand

Should absolutely destroy them as it's got a Watts link.

jpd80 · 09-10-2022, 06:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

Looking forward to seeing Ranger as the Ford entrant to the super taxis, they should its way more appropriate for their brand

Next year becomes Mustang vs Camaro, another GM vehicle not long for the world…

78xcgxl · 09-10-2022, 07:12 PM

Amazing how much choice of cars Australians have now. Even with the ranger 4890 sales only makes for 58,680 cars a year. Far cry from the days Ford Broadmeadows was pumping 100k Falcons out the door with half the Australian population. No wonder Australian auto manufacturing stands no chance with such low volumes and too many options.

jpd80 · 10-10-2022, 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 78xcgxl

Amazing how much choice of cars Australians have now. Even with the ranger 4890 sales only makes for 58,680 cars a year. Far cry from the days Ford Broadmeadows was pumping 100k Falcons out the door with half the Australian population. No wonder Australian auto manufacturing stands no chance with such low volumes and too many options.

One thing you notice is how quickly sales numbers drop after the first three, and outside the top ten sales the numbers really drop……

So that variety comes at a price of lots of minor sales but was it ever any different in our tiny market dominated by two or three brands…,

Bossxr8 · 11-10-2022, 11:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpd80

One thing you notice is how quickly sales numbers drop after the first three, and outside the top ten sales the numbers really drop……

So that variety comes at a price of lots of minor sales but was it ever any different in our tiny market dominated by two or three brands…,

It really amazes me that we have one of the most competitive markets in the world, with a ridiculous number of manufacturers selling here, many in tiny numbers.

I don't know how some brands can justify selling a couple of hundred cars a month.

Sprintey · 11-10-2022, 02:23 PM

Let alone 7!

Smoke Pursuit · 11-10-2022, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

It really amazes me that we have one of the most competitive markets in the world, with a ridiculous number of manufacturers selling here, many in tiny numbers.

I don't know how some brands can justify selling a couple of hundred cars a month.

Blows my mind too.

jpd80 · 11-10-2022, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

It really amazes me that we have one of the most competitive markets in the world, with a ridiculous number of manufacturers selling here, many in tiny numbers.

I don't know how some brands can justify selling a couple of hundred cars a month.

It’s a lot easier proposition to throw a few vehicles on a ship and get dealers in a multi-franchise network to sell them. It’s vastly different than being Ford or GM where they’re not interested in competing for sales down to the last dollar.

Ranger, Everest and Mustang are low hanging fruit, the profit on those are impressive no matter how much Ford says they’re not, the trim mix says otherwise……..and that goes double for Hilux & Prado.

Bossxr8 · 11-10-2022, 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpd80

It’s a lot easier proposition to throw a few vehicles on a ship and get dealers in a multi-franchise network to sell them. It’s vastly different than being Ford or GM where they’re not interested in competing for sales down to the last dollar.

Ranger, Everest and Mustang are low hanging fruit, the profit on those are impressive no matter how much Ford says they’re not, the trim mix says otherwise……..and that goes double for Hilux & Prado.

Think about everything they have to spend to sell cars here. Spare parts, advertising, rent, electricity/gas, salesmen, backroom employees etc etc etc.

And then they might only make a few thousand dollars on a sale.

The 107 sales of one of the french brands mentioned earlier. How is that even feasible to sustain? Even spreading costs across a few brands, it's not much to work with.

Even if they are making 5k profit per sale (highly unlikely with those cars) that's only $500,000 a month. How can you run a business on that?